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Since this whole topic degenerated into the usual balance flamefest where every topic ends up if unmoderated it's time for it to clean up. Locking this down for a while. Any posts made after my post [page 233] not addressing the changes in this patch directly and containting flames or general balance whine will get banned for at least a week. ~Nyovne
There is way too much flaming in this thread right now. Calm down before you post! (Page 271) ~iamke55 |
On September 15 2011 16:20 Trealador wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2011 16:00 hobosrus wrote:
huh so many people think that pvz is in favor of protoss. That may be true in gold league but in the pro scene ive seen great tosses lose to okayish zergs so often. even the overall tournament win rate is in favor of zerg...so many people who thnk that they know what they are talkng about. why dont you just let pros decide balance, they know best. We are talking about future metagame with the NP nerf and protoss buffs, I understand PvZ is in favor slightly for the Zerg at the moment. Please try to grasp simple concepts in a thread designated for the past patches and tournaments. Oh wait. And Artosis is probably one of the most knowledgeable people in SC. Just because he spends his time casting instead of playing, doesn't make his knowledge of the game less valid. And since he is somewhat of an expert on the races he has played. Oh yeah, Zerg and Protoss. And he didn't say it was super imba, he just said he would like to see how it would effect the PvZ matchup because Stalkers are far too versatile like the infestor which is getting...buffed?
He said that when Blink stalker were all the rage in Korea, but a LOT has changed since then, especially since people found out that Ling/Infestor straight up hard counters the Blink Stalker builds he was talking about. If you listened to his recent opinions on ZvP he has said the match up is really hard for Protoss
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Aa a terran player I say Zergs will lose ZvTs horribly if the patch goes live in its current state.
I love the idea of the NP change but zerg will need something else to deal with thors/collosi. I guess this is a necessary step for blizz to fix the ZvP MU. Crazy infestor buffs was not the right way to do it.
I still don't get why they let infested terrans go unchanged -__-
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Haven't been keeping up with the thread
Why not make there a limit to the number of massive units that can be NP'ed at any given time. Someone has probably mentioned this though
Anywhere between 1 to 3 sounds fine
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On September 15 2011 20:52 DisaFear wrote:
Haven't been keeping up with the thread
Why not make there a limit to the number of massive units that can be NP'ed at any given time. Someone has probably mentioned this though
Anywhere between 1 to 3 sounds fine
How would this make sense? Three infestors use their parasites, the others all forget how? Not intuitive. Also doesn't change the Mothership NP weakness, which is possibly what they're targeting here.
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I dont see why the infestor nerf , honestly
In pro tournaments terran just dominates , the tvp matches are less than 35% now and zerg getting near 60% winrate for terrans
Does anyone have a doubht that a terran player will win the dreamhack , mlg and the upcoming gsl?
I can bet you right now that if any descent terran is into code a will prolly win that too
Yet the terran nerfs are mldly to zero , the 5 sec bunker rush is a joke and the helion nerf only affects early tvt.
Gimping infestors beyone belief and the ration in tvz will start be more than 60% for terrans while the protoss " buffs" will do nothing vs 1-1-1 or the late 10 barracs + ghosts push
It might help pvz - prolly a lot so zerg will be even less representantive than toss sooner after this joke of a patch comes out - but it wont do nothing to stop terran domination
If blizzard care for the game and not their fanbase it would have nerfed the mules and emp long ago , i guess they dont
its not suprising why lol finals have 1 million viewers , it feels much more competitive and balance
ps its obviously that forgetting counters to infestors only proves bias or too many golden leagues or cheesers here
Emp totally destroys infestors since its instah and has more range + stealth . I havent seen the best terran players for some months now loosing to any zerg actually they can win pretty easy in macro games as well and spare me its not because they have more skill
As for toss theres this ability called feedback ,
Recently the only stream i watch is liquidhero's one - which i think its by far the most promising toss player now - and owns zerg with feedback + collosus archons set up.
No doubt protoss needs buffs but nerfing zerg only makes terrans stronger
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i read your entire post, but feel it is illogical to say that nerfing zergs make terran stronger
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On September 15 2011 21:32 Bill Murray wrote:
i read your entire post, but feel it is illogical to say that nerfing zergs make terran stronger
Nerfing the already inferior race - zerg compare to T least stats wise - what the superior race will be ?
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On September 15 2011 21:32 Bill Murray wrote:
i read your entire post, but feel it is illogical to say that nerfing zergs make terran stronger
I haven't read the post and I'm not really qualified to contribute to the discussion, but obviously nerfing one Race makes the other races (relatively speaking) stronger (strength is a relative term in Starcraft 2)
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might as well change neural parasite so that it only works on immortals...
and then make immortals massive in the next patch.
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1. Curroptors are too too terrible!
2. Infestors are too too good!!
Solution:
Give NP to the Corruptors!!!
Problem solved... right??? =D
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United Kingdom14464 Posts
On September 15 2011 22:09 mibuokami wrote:
1. Curroptors are too too terrible!
2. Infestors are too too good!!
Solution:
Give NP to the Corruptors!!!
Problem solved... right??? =D
Sounds good! 
In all seriousness, corruptors just need an effective anti ground spell so when they are still useful when they have swept all the colossus.
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On September 15 2011 21:03 Harrow wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2011 20:52 DisaFear wrote:
Haven't been keeping up with the thread
Why not make there a limit to the number of massive units that can be NP'ed at any given time. Someone has probably mentioned this though
Anywhere between 1 to 3 sounds fine How would this make sense? Three infestors use their parasites, the others all forget how? Not intuitive
Yes this shouldn't be implemented, it's not realistic. When I look out of my window, I always see people running about in despair because 7'0 zealots and mechanical spiders are chasing them, and when I turn on the tv, all I see are Ultralisks trampling towns.
If only my car was massive; I hate having it picked up by those pesky airplanes.
+ Show Spoiler +A balance change doesn't -have- to make sense, we are playing a videogame here, not trying to emulate a real-world environment
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The Infestor is a good and interesting unit and makes PvZ much more exciting. Grubby destroyed Destiny with his HT micro. I really love the idea that a weaker player like Grubby is able to beat Infestors while "good" player like HUK and Puzzle are losing. The ability to micro should be rewarded in this game. And now Blizzard is destroying this interesting matchup before it was able to shine.
If they would increase the Feedback range even bad player could handle Infestors. It would also help versus Ghosts. They should buff Toss. A Zerg nerf is just wrong.
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On September 15 2011 22:30 MCDayC wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2011 22:09 mibuokami wrote:
1. Curroptors are too too terrible!
2. Infestors are too too good!!
Solution:
Give NP to the Corruptors!!!
Problem solved... right??? =D Sounds good! In all seriousness, corruptors just need an effective anti ground spell so when they are still useful when they have swept all the colossus.
I know, it sounds great doesn't it? They should definitely get NP. I mean they're called Corruptors! Neural Parasite 'corrupts' the mind or something and make good guys do bad thingy!
Oh gosh they can even rename NP to make is more corrupy... maybe they can call the skill Corruption or something.... Neural Corruption!!!
Come on man! They already have the per-requisite tentacles! Do it Blizz, Corruptors needs love too!
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On September 15 2011 22:34 RainF4ll wrote:
The Infestor is a good and interesting unit and makes PvZ much more exciting. Grubby destroyed Destiny with his HT micro. I really love the idea that a weaker player like Grubby is able to beat Infestors while "good" player like HUK and Puzzle are losing. The ability to micro should be rewarded in this game. And now Blizzard is destroying this interesting matchup before it was able to shine.
If they would increase the Feedback range even bad player could handle Infestors. It would also help versus Ghosts. They should buff Toss. A Zerg nerf is just wrong.
A toss buff is also ridiculous. Terran needs to be nerfed while Zerg needs to be buffed, if these are done right, the game will see balance. Protoss is the middleground that needs to be reached with the other two.
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On September 15 2011 22:40 ABagOfFritos wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2011 22:34 RainF4ll wrote:
The Infestor is a good and interesting unit and makes PvZ much more exciting. Grubby destroyed Destiny with his HT micro. I really love the idea that a weaker player like Grubby is able to beat Infestors while "good" player like HUK and Puzzle are losing. The ability to micro should be rewarded in this game. And now Blizzard is destroying this interesting matchup before it was able to shine.
If they would increase the Feedback range even bad player could handle Infestors. It would also help versus Ghosts. They should buff Toss. A Zerg nerf is just wrong.
A toss buff is also ridiculous. Terran needs to be nerfed while Zerg needs to be buffed, if these are done right, the game will see balance. Protoss is the middleground that needs to be reached with the other two.
I'd rather they make P & Z more like T =(
More options = better game to watch.
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Among the non-balance changes i found
"SCVs can no longer repair themselves while inside a Bunker or Medivac."
This is acutally quite a big nerf when it comes to bunker rushes - I've had my scv self-heal inside bunkers plenty of times.
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On September 15 2011 22:42 mibuokami wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2011 22:40 ABagOfFritos wrote:On September 15 2011 22:34 RainF4ll wrote:
The Infestor is a good and interesting unit and makes PvZ much more exciting. Grubby destroyed Destiny with his HT micro. I really love the idea that a weaker player like Grubby is able to beat Infestors while "good" player like HUK and Puzzle are losing. The ability to micro should be rewarded in this game. And now Blizzard is destroying this interesting matchup before it was able to shine.
If they would increase the Feedback range even bad player could handle Infestors. It would also help versus Ghosts. They should buff Toss. A Zerg nerf is just wrong.
A toss buff is also ridiculous. Terran needs to be nerfed while Zerg needs to be buffed, if these are done right, the game will see balance. Protoss is the middleground that needs to be reached with the other two. I'd rather they make P & Z more like T =( More options = better game to watch.
Options are different than balance, and will likely come with the expansions. For now it is more important to focus on the balance, so that when these expansions do arrive and more imbalances emerge, they are easier to work with.
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Russian Federation473 Posts
On September 15 2011 22:42 Cibron wrote:
Among the non-balance changes i found
"SCVs can no longer repair themselves while inside a Bunker or Medivac."
This is acutally quite a big nerf when it comes to bunker rushes - I've had my scv self-heal inside bunkers plenty of times.
that will also ruin thorzain's scv-viking dropplay =(
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EPT
