EPTPatch 1.4 PTR Notes (updated 9/8) - Page 330
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Since this whole topic degenerated into the usual balance flamefest where every topic ends up if unmoderated it's time for it to clean up. Locking this down for a while. Any posts made after my post [page 233] not addressing the changes in this patch directly and containting flames or general balance whine will get banned for at least a week. ~Nyovne There is way too much flaming in this thread right now. Calm down before you post! (Page 271) ~iamke55 | ||
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Rinnegan5
Netherlands319 Posts
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cOoLiD
Canada168 Posts
On September 10 2011 02:18 Whitewing wrote: Do you realize how long it takes to make that many thors off 2 bases? You could have 5 bases and brood lords out and sieging their base before they hit 200/200 in thors. Its possible; but as terran if you scout that all you have to do is a move with scv support to destroy zerg... | ||
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Ownos
United States2147 Posts
On the other hand, it's probably a move to make zerg make corruptors and also to make archons more viable. Why make corruptors when you can spam infestors and they can do the anti-colossus/carrier/BC AND nullify your massed units AND do harassment. Still, if such a change has to go through, NP and FG need to be swapped so FG requires research. NP's purpose is TOO NICHE to require research. NP will need a bit more adjustment to compensate for it's greatly reduced use and power. | ||
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EliteReplay
Dominican Republic913 Posts
to be honest, infestor is the best Caster in the entire game, why? infestor come with the best abilities in the entire game.. 1- fungal stop units, do massive damage and reveal cloaked units. (no need of overseer) 2- Free burrow which lead the abuse of lack of detection. 3- neural parasite. after fungaling an army u just need to NP key units. (no need of mutas or corruptors to stop collosus or anything. 4- infested marines, insane DPS for no Supply and Cost. im glad with the direction blizzard is taking with zerg, they used to only make two units in the game and still win which is pretty much ridiculous ease to do. blizzard want Zerg players to incorporate corruptors and at the same time the infestor is taking his role back in the Zerg army as A CASTER NOT A CORE UNIT, is not all that surprising to see a Zerg army with 12+ infestors lol. if a protoss players makes 12HT, he wont win the game with just Zealot and HT. Zerg can win games with just massing cracklings and infestors. | ||
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Shade_FR
France378 Posts
On September 10 2011 02:18 NineteenSC2 wrote: I think zerg is just mad they won't have it ez mode now. Zergs say toss should scout yet some of them sit on 2 bases and tech to infestors blindly because they're simply good against EVERYTHING. What are Zerg options in Tier 2 ? - Infestor (all right) - Mutalisks (not worth it against a smart Protoss, I don't mention deatly timing pushes) - Hydralisk (LOL in ZvT, LOL in ZvP when Colossi/Templar are on the field) Infestor is a smart choice for now, because it allows you to *maybe* transitionning to higher Tech units (Ultralisks/Broodlords) instead of dying to timing pushes. It's not "going blind infestor", there are not much choices... | ||
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NineteenSC2
Canada117 Posts
Good for attacking Good for defending Good for harrassing Good against zealot, sentry, stalker, archons, immortals, carriers, voidrays, mothership, pheonix, observers, dts, collosi, probes and (debatable) high templars. So good in every situation and against every unit. The change is perfect. | ||
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Erasme
Bahamas15899 Posts
On September 10 2011 02:08 ToastieNL wrote: Point is; Protoss relies on High HP Gateway units to guard the High Damage units (Collosus, Archon). Infestor counters the following units; Zealots, Sentry, Stalker, Dark Templar, (softcounters) High Templar, Voidray, (softcounter) Phoenix, Archon, (softcounters) Warpprism, Carrier, Collosus, Immortal, Mothership. With the NP nerf, at least the Collosus and Carrier (and Mothership, which was a joke to be NPable) can be used to respectively deal AoE or force Zerg to her weaker AA side of the spectrum. You won't be able to np archons either ^^ If this go through, we will have to np voidrayyyyyys! | ||
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babylon
8765 Posts
On September 10 2011 02:19 Rinnegan5 wrote: I allready thought about quiting sc2..but this nerf for NP is the icing on the cake..Heavy mech is gonna dominate now..as if Terran wasnt the strongest race allready. And Colossus deathball gets a revamp..TY BLIZZARD!.. Switch to Terran! :D (Or random. If you switch to random, everything is a buff in one way or another.) | ||
Whitewing
United States7483 Posts
On September 10 2011 02:20 DFDream wrote: Its possible; but as terran if you scout that all you have to do is a move with scv support to destroy zerg... Said terran is turtling super hard. The moment he moves out, zerg should see it and respond with a massive influx of units. Fungal those scvs and laugh. BTW, thors suck horribly against mass infested terran spam. | ||
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Doodsmack
United States7224 Posts
On September 10 2011 02:14 Shade_CsT wrote: To me, you look like "LOOOOOOOL This nerf is stupid and I'm gonna freewin with Attack-move Colossi Deathballs or Heavy Mech army !!! " You are not looking for game balance, you are looking for easy-win. It really shows how stupid this nerf is. It makes the game imbalanced (worst than the current state). Good thing it won't go live (as it is in PTR)  It takes quite a leap to go from his statement to "You are not looking for game balance, you are looking for easy-win." There is absolutely no reason to assume he means that as opposed to "looking for game balance." Wouldn't it be nice if we could always change what someone said for the purpose of easily rebutting them? | ||
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bucckevin
858 Posts
On September 09 2011 18:44 anarkandi wrote: There's a stupidity in how you treat the matchup, for example the infestors ability to neural the colossus. With this patch, blizzard might aswell had removed neural parasite all together because it just won't be worthwhile in PvZ anymore. Archons or colossus would hardcounter it. But I guess it did make you cry to see your whole army get mind controlled. But there's an easy answer to that. Positioning. Letting the neurals fungal you off a cliff? Dumb. Sending two colossus from behind to rape the infestors during the engagement works. Having HT feedback works. It just takes micro, and positioning. In the end the player with the better mechanics win. ROFL are you serious? OK Lets send these huge vulnerable units around to the back and flank a zerg army! | ||
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SafeAsCheese
United States4924 Posts
On September 10 2011 02:21 NineteenSC2 wrote: The infestor: Good for attacking Good for defending Good for harrassing Good against zealot, sentry, stalker, archons, immortals, carriers, voidrays, mothership, pheonix, observers, dts, collosi, probes and (debatable) high templars. So good in every situation and against every unit. The change is perfect. HT/Ghost - good for attacking - good for defending - good for harassing Let's make storm and EMP not hit massive, 'kay? | ||
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Bowzer
Canada214 Posts
On September 10 2011 02:18 NineteenSC2 wrote: I think zerg is just mad they won't have it ez mode now. Zergs say toss should scout yet some of them sit on 2 bases and tech to infestors blindly because they're simply good against EVERYTHING. That sounds like just about every Protoss players strategy since the history of SC2, make a bunch of stuff, add a couple upgrades, A-Move, Win. Teching to infestors is/was the best strat vs toss because what other options do we have? Mass roach with ling counter attacks? | ||
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NineteenSC2
Canada117 Posts
On September 10 2011 02:22 SafeAsCheese wrote: HT/Ghost - good for attacking - good for defending - good for harassing Let's make storm and EMP not hit massive, 'kay? Except they dont counter every single unit. The infestor: Good for attacking Good for defending Good for harrassing Good against zealot, sentry, stalker, archons, immortals, carriers, voidrays, mothership, pheonix, observers, dts, collosi, probes and (debatable) high templars. So good in every situation and against every unit. The change is perfect. The infestor is a tier 2 unit, and blizzard is putting it where it belongs. | ||
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Plansix
United States60190 Posts
On September 10 2011 02:17 Shade_CsT wrote: I think players are starting to learn to play against Infestor, and I love to see that as a Zerg player. Terran are experimenting a ton with the ghost. Protoss players make more templar, some of them are using phoenix to Graviton the Neural Parasite-Infestor to cover the rest of the army. Yes, Neural is balanced as it is to me. The counter agument would be that a lot of players have tried that and it hasn't worked very well. Still you will just say they were doing it wrong and the infestor is fine. So the end of the story is: You want your powerful unit to stay powerful. We think it is to powerful and want it to be scaled back it some way. No real starcraft player wants the easy win, I wish people would stopt throwing that around. | ||
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IPA
United States3206 Posts
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cOoLiD
Canada168 Posts
On September 10 2011 02:21 Whitewing wrote: Said terran is turtling super hard. The moment he moves out, zerg should see it and respond with a massive influx of units. Fungal those scvs and laugh. BTW, thors suck horribly against mass infested terran spam. So for example on shakuras close by air you want me to have 5 bases, brood lords out, and enough infestors out to deal with 200/200 supply thors AND make copious amounts of units when he pushes out? Just to deal with it? | ||
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NineteenSC2
Canada117 Posts
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RavenLoud
Canada1100 Posts
On September 10 2011 02:22 SafeAsCheese wrote: HT/Ghost - good for attacking - good for defending - good for harassing Let's make storm and EMP not hit massive, 'kay? Kneejerk comments like this do not help your argument nor does it show that you understand the game. Anyway, I think NP need a duration buff to offset this. If it last about 5-10 sec longer then this change could go through. | ||
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EphialtesRONIN
United States34 Posts
On September 10 2011 02:12 iPAndi wrote: Agree, but having ur expensive archons/collosus (100/300 and 300/200) units neuraled hurts more ur army (as opposed to siege tanks 150/125), plus its much more common for Z's to use neural on P armies than Z's using neural on T army since Siege tanks have 13 range, so its fuckin hard to get as close. Collosus have a range of 6(+3) :/ Infestors have a range of 14 btw I am sorry, but that 14 range is only after the initial snaring. It is done so that a snared unit trying to run away can still be caught. The casting range is only 9, the same range an upgraded colossi has and at the same time this means that the infestor had to leap to the front of the zerg army or flank you with bad positioning. Therefore, range is not the issue you are having with neural parasite, but I would rather guess you are having issues with your positioning or focusing down of the infestors. You may also want to double check the Liquipedia page and read a little more carefully. Now if they were worried about neural parasite on the mothership, I do understand that is a bit on the excessive side, but at the same time I feel they could take a better approach and give the mothership something similar to the ultralisk's frenzy and then there wouldn't be an issue while at the same time "nerfing" neural parasite more appropriately. Reference : http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Infestor | ||
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