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On August 11 2011 13:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2011 13:32 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 13:19 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 13:06 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 12:58 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 12:44 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 12:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:
Protoss have an in-game map editor that takes much more micro from the other 2 races to prevent, while taking minimal micro to use from the Protoss. Early game relies on this simplistic spell. By midgame your prime aim is to mass up units and do a timing push (f click f click f click a click). Otherwise you expand and build up a deathball, which varies from (aclick fclick) to (aclick fclick tclick).
Protoss takes minimal micro, has the easiest and a forgiving macro mechanic, and has the entire strategy revolve around making a big ball of units, because they are the most efficient in the game.
In before some ignorant platinum league fuck tells me "if u turtle and make a ball u lose". Turtling and making a ball is agreed upon by the pros to be the best way to play. Look at Huk's PvZ, it's either timing pushes or getting a shitload of units and aclicking with them. And no, blink stalkers are not hard to micro.
You do realise that the entire protoss army is weak and relies on perfect ffs to be some-what effective. Tell me, how are ffs gonna save you from 3-pronged mm drops? Did you not see my (fclick fclick fclick). Perfect forcefields are fucking simple. Fclick in the middle of his unit ball and you're safe. For 3 pronged MMM drops you simply position your army well, make some cannons, and use something called "the warp in" function. I heard it's pretty good. On August 11 2011 12:44 Flameling wrote:On August 11 2011 12:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:
Protoss have an in-game map editor that takes much more micro from the other 2 races to prevent, while taking minimal micro to use from the Protoss. Early game relies on this simplistic spell. By midgame your prime aim is to mass up units and do a timing push (f click f click f click a click). Otherwise you expand and build up a deathball, which varies from (aclick fclick) to (aclick fclick tclick).
Protoss takes minimal micro, has the easiest and a forgiving macro mechanic, and has the entire strategy revolve around making a big ball of units, because they are the most efficient in the game.
In before some ignorant platinum league fuck tells me "if u turtle and make a ball u lose". Turtling and making a ball is agreed upon by the pros to be the best way to play. Look at Huk's PvZ, it's either timing pushes or getting a shitload of units and aclicking with them. And no, blink stalkers are not hard to micro.
What would you call "hard" micro? I don't find any other micro intensive unit in Terran and Zerg that's harder than blink micro. Something that can actually cost you the game if you make a mistake. Tanks being unsieged, marines not being spread well enough, getting trapped behind forcefields, Mutalisks not magic boxing, banelings inefficiently detonating, Infestors getting into range and dying instantly. I'm not talking about early game, any race apart from Terran have it hell early game (although fclicking is still pretty easy). but in the midgame to lategame there's nothing Protoss can do that can cost them the game instantly. Miss some forcefields? By this point you have about full energy 10+ sentries so you shouldn't be worried. And pressing B continuously, believe it or not, will not cost you the game if you don't do it fast enough (which is still easy as fuck). This is why Protoss is the relaxing race, and why it's considered the "casual" race. Like i said before, the protoss race is balanced on the assumption of perfect ffs, 1 missed ff and u lose. If godly perfect ffs are so easy and so overpowered how come protoss isn't dominating? Thats exactly of an example of a simple mistake that will cost you the game. 1 missed storm and you will lose the game. While only 1 emp that you did not dodge will make you unable to place down your 'perfect ffs' or storm, causing you to lose the game. And do you really think that sentries and hts have infinite range? They are even worse than the infestor to use. If you have 10 sentries means you don't have as much other gas-intensive units that u absolutely need in your army usch as collosus and hts. And a few emps will make your 1000 gas of sentries useless. So please tell me, whats so unforgiving about engaging as terran in tvp? difficulty =/= balance Perfect forcefields are easy, but they don't win you the game. Other races know how to deal with them (eg. on close position shattered temple zvp end the game before protoss has 5 sentries or using medivacs to lift units). As for your other complaints, 1 missed ff does not mean a loss. Please stop saying this bullshit. 1 missed storm also does not mean a loss, it simply means the engagement will be less effective for you. There's a difference between your losing half your MMM ball or you entire flock of mutas, compared to "losing a storm". Meanwhile if you think one EMP ends the game for you, well I heard spreading your units is pretty good. Although I'm sure that pre positioning before a battle might take a bit too much micro for the typical protoss. As for sentries cutting into your gas units... really? Have you never seen a typical 3gate sentry expand in ZvP? A shitload amount of sentries is not hard to get. Tier 1 Units don't take much of a commitment believe it or not! In fact it's completely standard to have so many sentries. Finally, one of your other ignorant statements is the range of forcefields and storms: Fungal Growth is 7 range for a full fungal. Force Fields and Storms are both 9 range. Oh and before I have to cringe again at one of these posts and actually wonder why I'm bothering to even argue... difficulty =/= balance Your ignorant if you think that missing a FF will never lose a protoss a game. And yes, a bad storm can also lose you a game. And man toss have it easy mode, they only need a perfect spread on their army so that single emp will not annihilate you. I'm talking about high-level protoss, where spreading is a must, and happens every fucking engagement. And if you don't sperad sufficiently, or have a slightly bad concave, you will lose the game to the a-moving mm ball after you've been emped by the multiple ghosts. Also of course you need fuckin sentries, I have no clue what your on about. Like I've been saying many times, they are the clutch behind the toss army without them we would have a 0% win ratio. Due to lack of reading comphrension from you, I'll speak in a simpler way. Missing ff in early game, bad Missing ff in mid to late game, doesn't matter (you have a shitload of sentries, 1 forcefield won't make a difference) spread casters away from each other in deathball, easy But what really got me pissed is that last sentence. When the fuck did I say you should stop using sentries? It's you who is the fucking retard that said you don't have 10+ sentries because of "gas intensive units" As for concaves, Protoss has it by far the easiest. Why's that? Your units don't take serious splash damage from anything Colossus have 9 Range Do I have to go on are you going to keep trying to state your opinion against actual facts? Just look at what I said against why storms don't make a difference compared to micro errors from other races. Seriously, read my post again. Fucking retards like you make me so frustrated.
You want facts? Ok i'll give you facts. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=252090
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On August 11 2011 05:14 HentaiPrime wrote:![[image loading]](http://www.fohguild.org/forums/attachments/starcraft-ii/171927d1305652662-protoss-strategies-replays-protosskeyboardsmul4.jpg) and ![[image loading]](http://www.fohguild.org/forums/attachments/starcraft-ii/171928d1305652662-protoss-strategies-replays-forcefield.jpg) now you're set! optional: ![[image loading]](http://www.toyday.co.uk/shop/images/uploads/maracas1.jpg) for after you 1a, hands off keyboard and celebrate! that's why i play protoss, zerg is way too hard and u can't 1a seige tanks
This post wins the whole thread.
And personally, i don't think protoss is necessary the easiest, it's just most of the people find it the easiest race, some people actually find zerg and terran easier etc.
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On August 11 2011 13:38 KingFranX wrote:
Honestly I play all 3 races, I can say Protoss is the easiest. Lets look at an engagement PvZ and TvZ..
Scenario: Zerg has banelings. lings, mutas
Terran: Make sure tanks always sieged, focus fire banelings, spread marines
Protoss: Blink stalkers away, cast forceshields. If you're using collosi + sentries basically all u do is spam f and a attack
Which sounds harder?
You forgot about the mass overlords with banelings inside them... and that stalkers do really terrible damage to the overlords that are barreling down on them and the expensive toss tech units. Forcefields will help keep the ground army back, but the 15 overlords loaded to the brim with banes definitely get their drop off.
Protoss is easier to pick up because they can reinforce anywhere with gateway units... which can often help stop an opponent from barreling in on you after a narrow army clash/exchange... but make no mistake, gateway units do not win the game anywhere past the early-mid game.
All three races have benefits and drawbacks... that's why there are three races. Each race has things that appear "easy" to others, but each race is darn near impossible to master. Protoss are getting absolutely smashed at the highest levels right now... but this may signal the need for a protoss renaissance.... I'm just curious what it will entail. The warpgate nerf may need to be overturned to help agains the 1-1-1 all in from terran... but I'm not quite sure about that one just yet. There will be some innovation, I'd just like to see what that may be. Carriers seem non-viable despite their on-paper stats... the mothership isn't very useful.... and warp prism harass is essentially a suicide mission so it gets awfully expensive. Maybe cannons out on the map might come into play... treating pylon power like creep tumours... hard to say. The pros will figure something out I'm sure though!
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Zerg requires the most macro (i.e., queens)
Terran requires the most micro (i.e., multi drops)
Protoss is in the middle
The thing with Z is, if you screw up your micro with your army...at lower levels, it doesn't necessarily mean GG. You can macro up another army very fast (doesn't mean you'll always live)
With T, you have to be in several places at once when doing most strats. Yes most units are very strong, but a lot of them can die fairly easy.
Protoss, blink micro CAN be hard...but it is far from being the hardest. You know what's hard? Doing 2 drops then doing a marine split with your main army and then macroing up another army.
You know what's also hard? Macroing a lot of larve injects and keeping your eye on your mutas (harass/run).
You know what's easy? Being down 50 food to a Z then throwing down 5 storms and then 1a win or hiding DT/Void Ray tech.
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On August 11 2011 13:42 sickle wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2011 13:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 13:32 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 13:19 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 13:06 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 12:58 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 12:44 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 12:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:
Protoss have an in-game map editor that takes much more micro from the other 2 races to prevent, while taking minimal micro to use from the Protoss. Early game relies on this simplistic spell. By midgame your prime aim is to mass up units and do a timing push (f click f click f click a click). Otherwise you expand and build up a deathball, which varies from (aclick fclick) to (aclick fclick tclick).
Protoss takes minimal micro, has the easiest and a forgiving macro mechanic, and has the entire strategy revolve around making a big ball of units, because they are the most efficient in the game.
In before some ignorant platinum league fuck tells me "if u turtle and make a ball u lose". Turtling and making a ball is agreed upon by the pros to be the best way to play. Look at Huk's PvZ, it's either timing pushes or getting a shitload of units and aclicking with them. And no, blink stalkers are not hard to micro.
You do realise that the entire protoss army is weak and relies on perfect ffs to be some-what effective. Tell me, how are ffs gonna save you from 3-pronged mm drops? Did you not see my (fclick fclick fclick). Perfect forcefields are fucking simple. Fclick in the middle of his unit ball and you're safe. For 3 pronged MMM drops you simply position your army well, make some cannons, and use something called "the warp in" function. I heard it's pretty good. On August 11 2011 12:44 Flameling wrote:On August 11 2011 12:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:
Protoss have an in-game map editor that takes much more micro from the other 2 races to prevent, while taking minimal micro to use from the Protoss. Early game relies on this simplistic spell. By midgame your prime aim is to mass up units and do a timing push (f click f click f click a click). Otherwise you expand and build up a deathball, which varies from (aclick fclick) to (aclick fclick tclick).
Protoss takes minimal micro, has the easiest and a forgiving macro mechanic, and has the entire strategy revolve around making a big ball of units, because they are the most efficient in the game.
In before some ignorant platinum league fuck tells me "if u turtle and make a ball u lose". Turtling and making a ball is agreed upon by the pros to be the best way to play. Look at Huk's PvZ, it's either timing pushes or getting a shitload of units and aclicking with them. And no, blink stalkers are not hard to micro.
What would you call "hard" micro? I don't find any other micro intensive unit in Terran and Zerg that's harder than blink micro. Something that can actually cost you the game if you make a mistake. Tanks being unsieged, marines not being spread well enough, getting trapped behind forcefields, Mutalisks not magic boxing, banelings inefficiently detonating, Infestors getting into range and dying instantly. I'm not talking about early game, any race apart from Terran have it hell early game (although fclicking is still pretty easy). but in the midgame to lategame there's nothing Protoss can do that can cost them the game instantly. Miss some forcefields? By this point you have about full energy 10+ sentries so you shouldn't be worried. And pressing B continuously, believe it or not, will not cost you the game if you don't do it fast enough (which is still easy as fuck). This is why Protoss is the relaxing race, and why it's considered the "casual" race. Like i said before, the protoss race is balanced on the assumption of perfect ffs, 1 missed ff and u lose. If godly perfect ffs are so easy and so overpowered how come protoss isn't dominating? Thats exactly of an example of a simple mistake that will cost you the game. 1 missed storm and you will lose the game. While only 1 emp that you did not dodge will make you unable to place down your 'perfect ffs' or storm, causing you to lose the game. And do you really think that sentries and hts have infinite range? They are even worse than the infestor to use. If you have 10 sentries means you don't have as much other gas-intensive units that u absolutely need in your army usch as collosus and hts. And a few emps will make your 1000 gas of sentries useless. So please tell me, whats so unforgiving about engaging as terran in tvp? difficulty =/= balance Perfect forcefields are easy, but they don't win you the game. Other races know how to deal with them (eg. on close position shattered temple zvp end the game before protoss has 5 sentries or using medivacs to lift units). As for your other complaints, 1 missed ff does not mean a loss. Please stop saying this bullshit. 1 missed storm also does not mean a loss, it simply means the engagement will be less effective for you. There's a difference between your losing half your MMM ball or you entire flock of mutas, compared to "losing a storm". Meanwhile if you think one EMP ends the game for you, well I heard spreading your units is pretty good. Although I'm sure that pre positioning before a battle might take a bit too much micro for the typical protoss. As for sentries cutting into your gas units... really? Have you never seen a typical 3gate sentry expand in ZvP? A shitload amount of sentries is not hard to get. Tier 1 Units don't take much of a commitment believe it or not! In fact it's completely standard to have so many sentries. Finally, one of your other ignorant statements is the range of forcefields and storms: Fungal Growth is 7 range for a full fungal. Force Fields and Storms are both 9 range. Oh and before I have to cringe again at one of these posts and actually wonder why I'm bothering to even argue... difficulty =/= balance Your ignorant if you think that missing a FF will never lose a protoss a game. And yes, a bad storm can also lose you a game. And man toss have it easy mode, they only need a perfect spread on their army so that single emp will not annihilate you. I'm talking about high-level protoss, where spreading is a must, and happens every fucking engagement. And if you don't sperad sufficiently, or have a slightly bad concave, you will lose the game to the a-moving mm ball after you've been emped by the multiple ghosts. Also of course you need fuckin sentries, I have no clue what your on about. Like I've been saying many times, they are the clutch behind the toss army without them we would have a 0% win ratio. Due to lack of reading comphrension from you, I'll speak in a simpler way. Missing ff in early game, bad Missing ff in mid to late game, doesn't matter (you have a shitload of sentries, 1 forcefield won't make a difference) spread casters away from each other in deathball, easy But what really got me pissed is that last sentence. When the fuck did I say you should stop using sentries? It's you who is the fucking retard that said you don't have 10+ sentries because of "gas intensive units" As for concaves, Protoss has it by far the easiest. Why's that? Your units don't take serious splash damage from anything Colossus have 9 Range Do I have to go on are you going to keep trying to state your opinion against actual facts? Just look at what I said against why storms don't make a difference compared to micro errors from other races. Seriously, read my post again. Fucking retards like you make me so frustrated. You want facts? Ok i'll give you facts. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=252090
DIFFICULTY =/= BALANCE
how many fucking times do I have to repeat myself? Mods please permanently ban me so I don't have to fucking deal with this stupid bullshit anymore.
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On August 11 2011 13:44 RedMorning wrote:
Zerg requires the most macro (i.e., queens)
Terran requires the most micro (i.e., multi drops)
Protoss is in the middle
The thing with Z is, if you screw up your micro with your army...at lower levels, it doesn't necessarily mean GG. You can macro up another army very fast (doesn't mean you'll always live)
With T, you have to be in several places at once when doing most strats. Yes most units are very strong, but a lot of them can die fairly easy.
Protoss, blink micro CAN be hard...but it is far from being the hardest. You know what's hard? Doing 2 drops then doing a marine split with your main army and then macroing up another army.
You know what's also hard? Macroing a lot of larve injects and keeping your eye on your mutas (harass/run).
You know what's easy? Being down 50 food to a Z then throwing down 5 storms and then 1a win or hiding DT/Void Ray tech.
lol
+ Show Spoiler +PLEASE CLOSE THIS THREAD.
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On August 11 2011 13:45 Joey Wheeler wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2011 13:42 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 13:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 13:32 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 13:19 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 13:06 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 12:58 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 12:44 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 12:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:
Protoss have an in-game map editor that takes much more micro from the other 2 races to prevent, while taking minimal micro to use from the Protoss. Early game relies on this simplistic spell. By midgame your prime aim is to mass up units and do a timing push (f click f click f click a click). Otherwise you expand and build up a deathball, which varies from (aclick fclick) to (aclick fclick tclick).
Protoss takes minimal micro, has the easiest and a forgiving macro mechanic, and has the entire strategy revolve around making a big ball of units, because they are the most efficient in the game.
In before some ignorant platinum league fuck tells me "if u turtle and make a ball u lose". Turtling and making a ball is agreed upon by the pros to be the best way to play. Look at Huk's PvZ, it's either timing pushes or getting a shitload of units and aclicking with them. And no, blink stalkers are not hard to micro.
You do realise that the entire protoss army is weak and relies on perfect ffs to be some-what effective. Tell me, how are ffs gonna save you from 3-pronged mm drops? Did you not see my (fclick fclick fclick). Perfect forcefields are fucking simple. Fclick in the middle of his unit ball and you're safe. For 3 pronged MMM drops you simply position your army well, make some cannons, and use something called "the warp in" function. I heard it's pretty good. On August 11 2011 12:44 Flameling wrote:On August 11 2011 12:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:
Protoss have an in-game map editor that takes much more micro from the other 2 races to prevent, while taking minimal micro to use from the Protoss. Early game relies on this simplistic spell. By midgame your prime aim is to mass up units and do a timing push (f click f click f click a click). Otherwise you expand and build up a deathball, which varies from (aclick fclick) to (aclick fclick tclick).
Protoss takes minimal micro, has the easiest and a forgiving macro mechanic, and has the entire strategy revolve around making a big ball of units, because they are the most efficient in the game.
In before some ignorant platinum league fuck tells me "if u turtle and make a ball u lose". Turtling and making a ball is agreed upon by the pros to be the best way to play. Look at Huk's PvZ, it's either timing pushes or getting a shitload of units and aclicking with them. And no, blink stalkers are not hard to micro.
What would you call "hard" micro? I don't find any other micro intensive unit in Terran and Zerg that's harder than blink micro. Something that can actually cost you the game if you make a mistake. Tanks being unsieged, marines not being spread well enough, getting trapped behind forcefields, Mutalisks not magic boxing, banelings inefficiently detonating, Infestors getting into range and dying instantly. I'm not talking about early game, any race apart from Terran have it hell early game (although fclicking is still pretty easy). but in the midgame to lategame there's nothing Protoss can do that can cost them the game instantly. Miss some forcefields? By this point you have about full energy 10+ sentries so you shouldn't be worried. And pressing B continuously, believe it or not, will not cost you the game if you don't do it fast enough (which is still easy as fuck). This is why Protoss is the relaxing race, and why it's considered the "casual" race. Like i said before, the protoss race is balanced on the assumption of perfect ffs, 1 missed ff and u lose. If godly perfect ffs are so easy and so overpowered how come protoss isn't dominating? Thats exactly of an example of a simple mistake that will cost you the game. 1 missed storm and you will lose the game. While only 1 emp that you did not dodge will make you unable to place down your 'perfect ffs' or storm, causing you to lose the game. And do you really think that sentries and hts have infinite range? They are even worse than the infestor to use. If you have 10 sentries means you don't have as much other gas-intensive units that u absolutely need in your army usch as collosus and hts. And a few emps will make your 1000 gas of sentries useless. So please tell me, whats so unforgiving about engaging as terran in tvp? difficulty =/= balance Perfect forcefields are easy, but they don't win you the game. Other races know how to deal with them (eg. on close position shattered temple zvp end the game before protoss has 5 sentries or using medivacs to lift units). As for your other complaints, 1 missed ff does not mean a loss. Please stop saying this bullshit. 1 missed storm also does not mean a loss, it simply means the engagement will be less effective for you. There's a difference between your losing half your MMM ball or you entire flock of mutas, compared to "losing a storm". Meanwhile if you think one EMP ends the game for you, well I heard spreading your units is pretty good. Although I'm sure that pre positioning before a battle might take a bit too much micro for the typical protoss. As for sentries cutting into your gas units... really? Have you never seen a typical 3gate sentry expand in ZvP? A shitload amount of sentries is not hard to get. Tier 1 Units don't take much of a commitment believe it or not! In fact it's completely standard to have so many sentries. Finally, one of your other ignorant statements is the range of forcefields and storms: Fungal Growth is 7 range for a full fungal. Force Fields and Storms are both 9 range. Oh and before I have to cringe again at one of these posts and actually wonder why I'm bothering to even argue... difficulty =/= balance Your ignorant if you think that missing a FF will never lose a protoss a game. And yes, a bad storm can also lose you a game. And man toss have it easy mode, they only need a perfect spread on their army so that single emp will not annihilate you. I'm talking about high-level protoss, where spreading is a must, and happens every fucking engagement. And if you don't sperad sufficiently, or have a slightly bad concave, you will lose the game to the a-moving mm ball after you've been emped by the multiple ghosts. Also of course you need fuckin sentries, I have no clue what your on about. Like I've been saying many times, they are the clutch behind the toss army without them we would have a 0% win ratio. Due to lack of reading comphrension from you, I'll speak in a simpler way. Missing ff in early game, bad Missing ff in mid to late game, doesn't matter (you have a shitload of sentries, 1 forcefield won't make a difference) spread casters away from each other in deathball, easy But what really got me pissed is that last sentence. When the fuck did I say you should stop using sentries? It's you who is the fucking retard that said you don't have 10+ sentries because of "gas intensive units" As for concaves, Protoss has it by far the easiest. Why's that? Your units don't take serious splash damage from anything Colossus have 9 Range Do I have to go on are you going to keep trying to state your opinion against actual facts? Just look at what I said against why storms don't make a difference compared to micro errors from other races. Seriously, read my post again. Fucking retards like you make me so frustrated. You want facts? Ok i'll give you facts. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=252090 DIFFICULTY =/= BALANCE how many fucking times do I have to repeat myself? Mods please permanently ban me so I don't have to fucking deal with this stupid bullshit anymore.
Speaking of stupid bullshit, weren't you the one that said that sieging tanks is "hard micro"?
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On August 11 2011 13:44 RedMorning wrote:
Protoss, blink micro CAN be hard...but it is far from being the hardest. You know what's hard? Doing 2 drops then doing a marine split with your main army and then macroing up another army.
You know whats harder? Somehow defending against 2 drops, then dancing your army keeping a perfect spread, then perfect ffs, perfect storms, perfect blinks, while macroing up another army
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On August 11 2011 13:38 KingFranX wrote:
Honestly I play all 3 races, I can say Protoss is the easiest. Lets look at an engagement PvZ and TvZ..
Scenario: Zerg has banelings. lings, mutas
Terran: Make sure tanks always sieged, focus fire banelings, spread marines
Protoss: Blink stalkers away, cast forceshields. If you're using collosi + sentries basically all u do is spam f and a attack
Which sounds harder?
Wow that was an incredible analysis. I think you probably have cleared up the subject and convinced everyone how easy Protoss is.
But seriously. You actually make Protoss sound the hardest.
"Zerg has X, Y, Z" is your description of their engagement.
Like, wait, what is your retarded point again? Because if you didn't preface it with Protoss sounds the easiest, I'm pretty sure just making 3 types of units and then proceeding to do absolutely nothing with them sounds the easiest.
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On August 11 2011 13:45 Joey Wheeler wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2011 13:42 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 13:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 13:32 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 13:19 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 13:06 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 12:58 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 12:44 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 12:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:
Protoss have an in-game map editor that takes much more micro from the other 2 races to prevent, while taking minimal micro to use from the Protoss. Early game relies on this simplistic spell. By midgame your prime aim is to mass up units and do a timing push (f click f click f click a click). Otherwise you expand and build up a deathball, which varies from (aclick fclick) to (aclick fclick tclick).
Protoss takes minimal micro, has the easiest and a forgiving macro mechanic, and has the entire strategy revolve around making a big ball of units, because they are the most efficient in the game.
In before some ignorant platinum league fuck tells me "if u turtle and make a ball u lose". Turtling and making a ball is agreed upon by the pros to be the best way to play. Look at Huk's PvZ, it's either timing pushes or getting a shitload of units and aclicking with them. And no, blink stalkers are not hard to micro.
You do realise that the entire protoss army is weak and relies on perfect ffs to be some-what effective. Tell me, how are ffs gonna save you from 3-pronged mm drops? Did you not see my (fclick fclick fclick). Perfect forcefields are fucking simple. Fclick in the middle of his unit ball and you're safe. For 3 pronged MMM drops you simply position your army well, make some cannons, and use something called "the warp in" function. I heard it's pretty good. On August 11 2011 12:44 Flameling wrote:On August 11 2011 12:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:
Protoss have an in-game map editor that takes much more micro from the other 2 races to prevent, while taking minimal micro to use from the Protoss. Early game relies on this simplistic spell. By midgame your prime aim is to mass up units and do a timing push (f click f click f click a click). Otherwise you expand and build up a deathball, which varies from (aclick fclick) to (aclick fclick tclick).
Protoss takes minimal micro, has the easiest and a forgiving macro mechanic, and has the entire strategy revolve around making a big ball of units, because they are the most efficient in the game.
In before some ignorant platinum league fuck tells me "if u turtle and make a ball u lose". Turtling and making a ball is agreed upon by the pros to be the best way to play. Look at Huk's PvZ, it's either timing pushes or getting a shitload of units and aclicking with them. And no, blink stalkers are not hard to micro.
What would you call "hard" micro? I don't find any other micro intensive unit in Terran and Zerg that's harder than blink micro. Something that can actually cost you the game if you make a mistake. Tanks being unsieged, marines not being spread well enough, getting trapped behind forcefields, Mutalisks not magic boxing, banelings inefficiently detonating, Infestors getting into range and dying instantly. I'm not talking about early game, any race apart from Terran have it hell early game (although fclicking is still pretty easy). but in the midgame to lategame there's nothing Protoss can do that can cost them the game instantly. Miss some forcefields? By this point you have about full energy 10+ sentries so you shouldn't be worried. And pressing B continuously, believe it or not, will not cost you the game if you don't do it fast enough (which is still easy as fuck). This is why Protoss is the relaxing race, and why it's considered the "casual" race. Like i said before, the protoss race is balanced on the assumption of perfect ffs, 1 missed ff and u lose. If godly perfect ffs are so easy and so overpowered how come protoss isn't dominating? Thats exactly of an example of a simple mistake that will cost you the game. 1 missed storm and you will lose the game. While only 1 emp that you did not dodge will make you unable to place down your 'perfect ffs' or storm, causing you to lose the game. And do you really think that sentries and hts have infinite range? They are even worse than the infestor to use. If you have 10 sentries means you don't have as much other gas-intensive units that u absolutely need in your army usch as collosus and hts. And a few emps will make your 1000 gas of sentries useless. So please tell me, whats so unforgiving about engaging as terran in tvp? difficulty =/= balance Perfect forcefields are easy, but they don't win you the game. Other races know how to deal with them (eg. on close position shattered temple zvp end the game before protoss has 5 sentries or using medivacs to lift units). As for your other complaints, 1 missed ff does not mean a loss. Please stop saying this bullshit. 1 missed storm also does not mean a loss, it simply means the engagement will be less effective for you. There's a difference between your losing half your MMM ball or you entire flock of mutas, compared to "losing a storm". Meanwhile if you think one EMP ends the game for you, well I heard spreading your units is pretty good. Although I'm sure that pre positioning before a battle might take a bit too much micro for the typical protoss. As for sentries cutting into your gas units... really? Have you never seen a typical 3gate sentry expand in ZvP? A shitload amount of sentries is not hard to get. Tier 1 Units don't take much of a commitment believe it or not! In fact it's completely standard to have so many sentries. Finally, one of your other ignorant statements is the range of forcefields and storms: Fungal Growth is 7 range for a full fungal. Force Fields and Storms are both 9 range. Oh and before I have to cringe again at one of these posts and actually wonder why I'm bothering to even argue... difficulty =/= balance Your ignorant if you think that missing a FF will never lose a protoss a game. And yes, a bad storm can also lose you a game. And man toss have it easy mode, they only need a perfect spread on their army so that single emp will not annihilate you. I'm talking about high-level protoss, where spreading is a must, and happens every fucking engagement. And if you don't sperad sufficiently, or have a slightly bad concave, you will lose the game to the a-moving mm ball after you've been emped by the multiple ghosts. Also of course you need fuckin sentries, I have no clue what your on about. Like I've been saying many times, they are the clutch behind the toss army without them we would have a 0% win ratio. Due to lack of reading comphrension from you, I'll speak in a simpler way. Missing ff in early game, bad Missing ff in mid to late game, doesn't matter (you have a shitload of sentries, 1 forcefield won't make a difference) spread casters away from each other in deathball, easy But what really got me pissed is that last sentence. When the fuck did I say you should stop using sentries? It's you who is the fucking retard that said you don't have 10+ sentries because of "gas intensive units" As for concaves, Protoss has it by far the easiest. Why's that? Your units don't take serious splash damage from anything Colossus have 9 Range Do I have to go on are you going to keep trying to state your opinion against actual facts? Just look at what I said against why storms don't make a difference compared to micro errors from other races. Seriously, read my post again. Fucking retards like you make me so frustrated. You want facts? Ok i'll give you facts. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=252090 DIFFICULTY =/= BALANCE how many fucking times do I have to repeat myself? Mods please permanently ban me so I don't have to fucking deal with this stupid bullshit anymore.
Good to know that protoss is balanced to lose.
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On August 11 2011 13:46 Applesmack wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2011 13:45 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 13:42 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 13:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 13:32 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 13:19 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 13:06 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 12:58 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 12:44 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 12:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:
Protoss have an in-game map editor that takes much more micro from the other 2 races to prevent, while taking minimal micro to use from the Protoss. Early game relies on this simplistic spell. By midgame your prime aim is to mass up units and do a timing push (f click f click f click a click). Otherwise you expand and build up a deathball, which varies from (aclick fclick) to (aclick fclick tclick).
Protoss takes minimal micro, has the easiest and a forgiving macro mechanic, and has the entire strategy revolve around making a big ball of units, because they are the most efficient in the game.
In before some ignorant platinum league fuck tells me "if u turtle and make a ball u lose". Turtling and making a ball is agreed upon by the pros to be the best way to play. Look at Huk's PvZ, it's either timing pushes or getting a shitload of units and aclicking with them. And no, blink stalkers are not hard to micro.
You do realise that the entire protoss army is weak and relies on perfect ffs to be some-what effective. Tell me, how are ffs gonna save you from 3-pronged mm drops? Did you not see my (fclick fclick fclick). Perfect forcefields are fucking simple. Fclick in the middle of his unit ball and you're safe. For 3 pronged MMM drops you simply position your army well, make some cannons, and use something called "the warp in" function. I heard it's pretty good. On August 11 2011 12:44 Flameling wrote:On August 11 2011 12:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:
Protoss have an in-game map editor that takes much more micro from the other 2 races to prevent, while taking minimal micro to use from the Protoss. Early game relies on this simplistic spell. By midgame your prime aim is to mass up units and do a timing push (f click f click f click a click). Otherwise you expand and build up a deathball, which varies from (aclick fclick) to (aclick fclick tclick).
Protoss takes minimal micro, has the easiest and a forgiving macro mechanic, and has the entire strategy revolve around making a big ball of units, because they are the most efficient in the game.
In before some ignorant platinum league fuck tells me "if u turtle and make a ball u lose". Turtling and making a ball is agreed upon by the pros to be the best way to play. Look at Huk's PvZ, it's either timing pushes or getting a shitload of units and aclicking with them. And no, blink stalkers are not hard to micro.
What would you call "hard" micro? I don't find any other micro intensive unit in Terran and Zerg that's harder than blink micro. Something that can actually cost you the game if you make a mistake. Tanks being unsieged, marines not being spread well enough, getting trapped behind forcefields, Mutalisks not magic boxing, banelings inefficiently detonating, Infestors getting into range and dying instantly. I'm not talking about early game, any race apart from Terran have it hell early game (although fclicking is still pretty easy). but in the midgame to lategame there's nothing Protoss can do that can cost them the game instantly. Miss some forcefields? By this point you have about full energy 10+ sentries so you shouldn't be worried. And pressing B continuously, believe it or not, will not cost you the game if you don't do it fast enough (which is still easy as fuck). This is why Protoss is the relaxing race, and why it's considered the "casual" race. Like i said before, the protoss race is balanced on the assumption of perfect ffs, 1 missed ff and u lose. If godly perfect ffs are so easy and so overpowered how come protoss isn't dominating? Thats exactly of an example of a simple mistake that will cost you the game. 1 missed storm and you will lose the game. While only 1 emp that you did not dodge will make you unable to place down your 'perfect ffs' or storm, causing you to lose the game. And do you really think that sentries and hts have infinite range? They are even worse than the infestor to use. If you have 10 sentries means you don't have as much other gas-intensive units that u absolutely need in your army usch as collosus and hts. And a few emps will make your 1000 gas of sentries useless. So please tell me, whats so unforgiving about engaging as terran in tvp? difficulty =/= balance Perfect forcefields are easy, but they don't win you the game. Other races know how to deal with them (eg. on close position shattered temple zvp end the game before protoss has 5 sentries or using medivacs to lift units). As for your other complaints, 1 missed ff does not mean a loss. Please stop saying this bullshit. 1 missed storm also does not mean a loss, it simply means the engagement will be less effective for you. There's a difference between your losing half your MMM ball or you entire flock of mutas, compared to "losing a storm". Meanwhile if you think one EMP ends the game for you, well I heard spreading your units is pretty good. Although I'm sure that pre positioning before a battle might take a bit too much micro for the typical protoss. As for sentries cutting into your gas units... really? Have you never seen a typical 3gate sentry expand in ZvP? A shitload amount of sentries is not hard to get. Tier 1 Units don't take much of a commitment believe it or not! In fact it's completely standard to have so many sentries. Finally, one of your other ignorant statements is the range of forcefields and storms: Fungal Growth is 7 range for a full fungal. Force Fields and Storms are both 9 range. Oh and before I have to cringe again at one of these posts and actually wonder why I'm bothering to even argue... difficulty =/= balance Your ignorant if you think that missing a FF will never lose a protoss a game. And yes, a bad storm can also lose you a game. And man toss have it easy mode, they only need a perfect spread on their army so that single emp will not annihilate you. I'm talking about high-level protoss, where spreading is a must, and happens every fucking engagement. And if you don't sperad sufficiently, or have a slightly bad concave, you will lose the game to the a-moving mm ball after you've been emped by the multiple ghosts. Also of course you need fuckin sentries, I have no clue what your on about. Like I've been saying many times, they are the clutch behind the toss army without them we would have a 0% win ratio. Due to lack of reading comphrension from you, I'll speak in a simpler way. Missing ff in early game, bad Missing ff in mid to late game, doesn't matter (you have a shitload of sentries, 1 forcefield won't make a difference) spread casters away from each other in deathball, easy But what really got me pissed is that last sentence. When the fuck did I say you should stop using sentries? It's you who is the fucking retard that said you don't have 10+ sentries because of "gas intensive units" As for concaves, Protoss has it by far the easiest. Why's that? Your units don't take serious splash damage from anything Colossus have 9 Range Do I have to go on are you going to keep trying to state your opinion against actual facts? Just look at what I said against why storms don't make a difference compared to micro errors from other races. Seriously, read my post again. Fucking retards like you make me so frustrated. You want facts? Ok i'll give you facts. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=252090 DIFFICULTY =/= BALANCE how many fucking times do I have to repeat myself? Mods please permanently ban me so I don't have to fucking deal with this stupid bullshit anymore. Speaking of stupid bullshit, weren't you the one that said that sieging tanks is "hard micro"?
Yes, I'm sure any Zerg player will let you waltz right in, also giving you enough time to spread and siege tanks any time you want right outside his natural.
Missing a siege costs you the game, missing a forcefield doesn't.
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On August 11 2011 13:46 fadestep wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2011 13:38 KingFranX wrote:
Honestly I play all 3 races, I can say Protoss is the easiest. Lets look at an engagement PvZ and TvZ..
Scenario: Zerg has banelings. lings, mutas
Terran: Make sure tanks always sieged, focus fire banelings, spread marines
Protoss: Blink stalkers away, cast forceshields. If you're using collosi + sentries basically all u do is spam f and a attack
Which sounds harder? Wow that was an incredible analysis. I think you probably have cleared up the subject and convinced everyone how easy Protoss is. But seriously. You actually make Protoss sound the hardest. "Zerg has X, Y, Z" is your description of their engagement. Like, wait, what is your retarded point again? Because if you didn't preface it with Protoss sounds the easiest, I'm pretty sure just making 3 types of units and then proceeding to do absolutely nothing with them sounds the easiest.
I have no idea what you're trying to argue.. just missed the point. Also stop being so mad why do you care what I think
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On August 11 2011 13:38 KingFranX wrote:
Honestly I play all 3 races, I can say Protoss is the easiest. Lets look at an engagement PvZ and TvZ..
Scenario: Zerg has banelings. lings, mutas
Terran: Make sure tanks always sieged, focus fire banelings, spread marines
Protoss: Blink stalkers away, cast forceshields. If you're using collosi + sentries basically all u do is spam f and a attack
Which sounds harder?
People need to stop overusing the "I play all 3 races, Protoss is the easiest" argument. If you're playing the 3 races at the same time, you don't have enough in-depth knowledge of the races to judge. If you play random, assuming you don't cheese/metagame your way through the ladder, you're generally just bad (look at the ratio of random players per leagues on the ladder).
Further proof that you don't know what you're talking about, nobody decent plays ZvP with ling/baneling/mutas without overlords to drop the banelings. Why, you may ask? Because as you pointed out, it's quite easy for protoss to engage that.
Now, drop the banelings with overlords and add in infestors. Did you try to micro a "protoss ball" against that? That maybe the most intense micro in the game.
So don't spread your goldish knowledge of the game to make protoss players look bad, please.
Edit: That's just funny how there's at the same time this thread where everybody says Protoss is "EZ bro 1A move", the thread about July's winrates where Protoss is stomped to the ground by the other races, and GSL Code A Ro16 where we might see the Code A's last 2 protosses be eliminated.
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On August 11 2011 13:26 akalarry wrote:
the only thing easier is protoss's macro.
units are more expensive in general, so it's easier to spend your money. also since 1 probe can build everything, it's easier to shift queue buildings.
toss requires good unit control and micro though. every unit counts since they are so expensive. the big old death ball 1a does not happen at very high levels.
a lot of zerg players say how their race requires most skill, but honestly it's just game sense and keeping up with their injects. because they have so many units, most zergs i see 1a a shit ton more than toss players. totally different playstyle imo.
not really, we zerg only 1A when we see an opening because one mistake, you could rape our units and just proceed to walk over our army.
we also need to creep spread and overlord placements too.
I feel terran is the hardest to play, not only do they need to do double prone drops, they need to spread marines.
zerg's micro-ing while keeping up injection is really hard as well, especially when doing muta, ling banelings and the hardest part is if we lose out injection, it is similar to losing x amount of gateway/robo or watever production facilities.
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On August 11 2011 13:45 Joey Wheeler wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2011 13:42 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 13:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 13:32 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 13:19 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 13:06 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 12:58 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 12:44 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 12:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:
Protoss have an in-game map editor that takes much more micro from the other 2 races to prevent, while taking minimal micro to use from the Protoss. Early game relies on this simplistic spell. By midgame your prime aim is to mass up units and do a timing push (f click f click f click a click). Otherwise you expand and build up a deathball, which varies from (aclick fclick) to (aclick fclick tclick).
Protoss takes minimal micro, has the easiest and a forgiving macro mechanic, and has the entire strategy revolve around making a big ball of units, because they are the most efficient in the game.
In before some ignorant platinum league fuck tells me "if u turtle and make a ball u lose". Turtling and making a ball is agreed upon by the pros to be the best way to play. Look at Huk's PvZ, it's either timing pushes or getting a shitload of units and aclicking with them. And no, blink stalkers are not hard to micro.
You do realise that the entire protoss army is weak and relies on perfect ffs to be some-what effective. Tell me, how are ffs gonna save you from 3-pronged mm drops? Did you not see my (fclick fclick fclick). Perfect forcefields are fucking simple. Fclick in the middle of his unit ball and you're safe. For 3 pronged MMM drops you simply position your army well, make some cannons, and use something called "the warp in" function. I heard it's pretty good. On August 11 2011 12:44 Flameling wrote:On August 11 2011 12:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:
Protoss have an in-game map editor that takes much more micro from the other 2 races to prevent, while taking minimal micro to use from the Protoss. Early game relies on this simplistic spell. By midgame your prime aim is to mass up units and do a timing push (f click f click f click a click). Otherwise you expand and build up a deathball, which varies from (aclick fclick) to (aclick fclick tclick).
Protoss takes minimal micro, has the easiest and a forgiving macro mechanic, and has the entire strategy revolve around making a big ball of units, because they are the most efficient in the game.
In before some ignorant platinum league fuck tells me "if u turtle and make a ball u lose". Turtling and making a ball is agreed upon by the pros to be the best way to play. Look at Huk's PvZ, it's either timing pushes or getting a shitload of units and aclicking with them. And no, blink stalkers are not hard to micro.
What would you call "hard" micro? I don't find any other micro intensive unit in Terran and Zerg that's harder than blink micro. Something that can actually cost you the game if you make a mistake. Tanks being unsieged, marines not being spread well enough, getting trapped behind forcefields, Mutalisks not magic boxing, banelings inefficiently detonating, Infestors getting into range and dying instantly. I'm not talking about early game, any race apart from Terran have it hell early game (although fclicking is still pretty easy). but in the midgame to lategame there's nothing Protoss can do that can cost them the game instantly. Miss some forcefields? By this point you have about full energy 10+ sentries so you shouldn't be worried. And pressing B continuously, believe it or not, will not cost you the game if you don't do it fast enough (which is still easy as fuck). This is why Protoss is the relaxing race, and why it's considered the "casual" race. Like i said before, the protoss race is balanced on the assumption of perfect ffs, 1 missed ff and u lose. If godly perfect ffs are so easy and so overpowered how come protoss isn't dominating? Thats exactly of an example of a simple mistake that will cost you the game. 1 missed storm and you will lose the game. While only 1 emp that you did not dodge will make you unable to place down your 'perfect ffs' or storm, causing you to lose the game. And do you really think that sentries and hts have infinite range? They are even worse than the infestor to use. If you have 10 sentries means you don't have as much other gas-intensive units that u absolutely need in your army usch as collosus and hts. And a few emps will make your 1000 gas of sentries useless. So please tell me, whats so unforgiving about engaging as terran in tvp? difficulty =/= balance Perfect forcefields are easy, but they don't win you the game. Other races know how to deal with them (eg. on close position shattered temple zvp end the game before protoss has 5 sentries or using medivacs to lift units). As for your other complaints, 1 missed ff does not mean a loss. Please stop saying this bullshit. 1 missed storm also does not mean a loss, it simply means the engagement will be less effective for you. There's a difference between your losing half your MMM ball or you entire flock of mutas, compared to "losing a storm". Meanwhile if you think one EMP ends the game for you, well I heard spreading your units is pretty good. Although I'm sure that pre positioning before a battle might take a bit too much micro for the typical protoss. As for sentries cutting into your gas units... really? Have you never seen a typical 3gate sentry expand in ZvP? A shitload amount of sentries is not hard to get. Tier 1 Units don't take much of a commitment believe it or not! In fact it's completely standard to have so many sentries. Finally, one of your other ignorant statements is the range of forcefields and storms: Fungal Growth is 7 range for a full fungal. Force Fields and Storms are both 9 range. Oh and before I have to cringe again at one of these posts and actually wonder why I'm bothering to even argue... difficulty =/= balance Your ignorant if you think that missing a FF will never lose a protoss a game. And yes, a bad storm can also lose you a game. And man toss have it easy mode, they only need a perfect spread on their army so that single emp will not annihilate you. I'm talking about high-level protoss, where spreading is a must, and happens every fucking engagement. And if you don't sperad sufficiently, or have a slightly bad concave, you will lose the game to the a-moving mm ball after you've been emped by the multiple ghosts. Also of course you need fuckin sentries, I have no clue what your on about. Like I've been saying many times, they are the clutch behind the toss army without them we would have a 0% win ratio. Due to lack of reading comphrension from you, I'll speak in a simpler way. Missing ff in early game, bad Missing ff in mid to late game, doesn't matter (you have a shitload of sentries, 1 forcefield won't make a difference) spread casters away from each other in deathball, easy But what really got me pissed is that last sentence. When the fuck did I say you should stop using sentries? It's you who is the fucking retard that said you don't have 10+ sentries because of "gas intensive units" As for concaves, Protoss has it by far the easiest. Why's that? Your units don't take serious splash damage from anything Colossus have 9 Range Do I have to go on are you going to keep trying to state your opinion against actual facts? Just look at what I said against why storms don't make a difference compared to micro errors from other races. Seriously, read my post again. Fucking retards like you make me so frustrated. You want facts? Ok i'll give you facts. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=252090 DIFFICULTY =/= BALANCE how many fucking times do I have to repeat myself? Mods please permanently ban me so I don't have to fucking deal with this stupid bullshit anymore.
I support your decision bud. You seem like a pretty horrific poster.
Bah. This thread needs a lock and pad on it and a trip down south.
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On August 11 2011 13:48 Joey Wheeler wrote:Show nested quote +On August 11 2011 13:46 Applesmack wrote:On August 11 2011 13:45 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 13:42 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 13:39 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 13:32 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 13:19 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 13:06 sickle wrote:On August 11 2011 12:58 Joey Wheeler wrote:On August 11 2011 12:44 sickle wrote:
[quote]
You do realise that the entire protoss army is weak and relies on perfect ffs to be some-what effective. Tell me, how are ffs gonna save you from 3-pronged mm drops?
Did you not see my (fclick fclick fclick). Perfect forcefields are fucking simple. Fclick in the middle of his unit ball and you're safe. For 3 pronged MMM drops you simply position your army well, make some cannons, and use something called "the warp in" function. I heard it's pretty good. On August 11 2011 12:44 Flameling wrote:
[quote]
What would you call "hard" micro? I don't find any other micro intensive unit in Terran and Zerg that's harder than blink micro.
Something that can actually cost you the game if you make a mistake. Tanks being unsieged, marines not being spread well enough, getting trapped behind forcefields, Mutalisks not magic boxing, banelings inefficiently detonating, Infestors getting into range and dying instantly. I'm not talking about early game, any race apart from Terran have it hell early game (although fclicking is still pretty easy). but in the midgame to lategame there's nothing Protoss can do that can cost them the game instantly. Miss some forcefields? By this point you have about full energy 10+ sentries so you shouldn't be worried. And pressing B continuously, believe it or not, will not cost you the game if you don't do it fast enough (which is still easy as fuck). This is why Protoss is the relaxing race, and why it's considered the "casual" race. Like i said before, the protoss race is balanced on the assumption of perfect ffs, 1 missed ff and u lose. If godly perfect ffs are so easy and so overpowered how come protoss isn't dominating? Thats exactly of an example of a simple mistake that will cost you the game. 1 missed storm and you will lose the game. While only 1 emp that you did not dodge will make you unable to place down your 'perfect ffs' or storm, causing you to lose the game. And do you really think that sentries and hts have infinite range? They are even worse than the infestor to use. If you have 10 sentries means you don't have as much other gas-intensive units that u absolutely need in your army usch as collosus and hts. And a few emps will make your 1000 gas of sentries useless. So please tell me, whats so unforgiving about engaging as terran in tvp? difficulty =/= balance Perfect forcefields are easy, but they don't win you the game. Other races know how to deal with them (eg. on close position shattered temple zvp end the game before protoss has 5 sentries or using medivacs to lift units). As for your other complaints, 1 missed ff does not mean a loss. Please stop saying this bullshit. 1 missed storm also does not mean a loss, it simply means the engagement will be less effective for you. There's a difference between your losing half your MMM ball or you entire flock of mutas, compared to "losing a storm". Meanwhile if you think one EMP ends the game for you, well I heard spreading your units is pretty good. Although I'm sure that pre positioning before a battle might take a bit too much micro for the typical protoss. As for sentries cutting into your gas units... really? Have you never seen a typical 3gate sentry expand in ZvP? A shitload amount of sentries is not hard to get. Tier 1 Units don't take much of a commitment believe it or not! In fact it's completely standard to have so many sentries. Finally, one of your other ignorant statements is the range of forcefields and storms: Fungal Growth is 7 range for a full fungal. Force Fields and Storms are both 9 range. Oh and before I have to cringe again at one of these posts and actually wonder why I'm bothering to even argue... difficulty =/= balance Your ignorant if you think that missing a FF will never lose a protoss a game. And yes, a bad storm can also lose you a game. And man toss have it easy mode, they only need a perfect spread on their army so that single emp will not annihilate you. I'm talking about high-level protoss, where spreading is a must, and happens every fucking engagement. And if you don't sperad sufficiently, or have a slightly bad concave, you will lose the game to the a-moving mm ball after you've been emped by the multiple ghosts. Also of course you need fuckin sentries, I have no clue what your on about. Like I've been saying many times, they are the clutch behind the toss army without them we would have a 0% win ratio. Due to lack of reading comphrension from you, I'll speak in a simpler way. Missing ff in early game, bad Missing ff in mid to late game, doesn't matter (you have a shitload of sentries, 1 forcefield won't make a difference) spread casters away from each other in deathball, easy But what really got me pissed is that last sentence. When the fuck did I say you should stop using sentries? It's you who is the fucking retard that said you don't have 10+ sentries because of "gas intensive units" As for concaves, Protoss has it by far the easiest. Why's that? Your units don't take serious splash damage from anything Colossus have 9 Range Do I have to go on are you going to keep trying to state your opinion against actual facts? Just look at what I said against why storms don't make a difference compared to micro errors from other races. Seriously, read my post again. Fucking retards like you make me so frustrated. You want facts? Ok i'll give you facts. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=252090 DIFFICULTY =/= BALANCE how many fucking times do I have to repeat myself? Mods please permanently ban me so I don't have to fucking deal with this stupid bullshit anymore. Speaking of stupid bullshit, weren't you the one that said that sieging tanks is "hard micro"? Yes, I'm sure any Zerg player will let you waltz right in, also giving you enough time to spread and siege tanks any time you want right outside his natural. Missing a siege costs you the game, missing a forcefield doesn't.
Thats why you leapfrog your tanks or have spotters before you do an unsiege to keep tabs on the zerg army....Its not at all difficult to do at all. Calling sieging tanks "hard micro" is laughable.
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Really? I never thought Protoss as the easier race. I always thought Terran has the simplest learning curve. Hmm.
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The macro tends to be a bit easier as protoss. When you are in lower leagues, small macro improvements causes great (comparatively) improvements overall. It doesn't really matter that your army is less efficient if you don't get perfect forcefields if you have one collosi for every one of their zerglings...
Basically, in silver, protoss is a race where being slightly less bad makes you OP. If somebody is raging at for playing an ez race, just remember - they are probably just as bad as you  . In higher leagues, I wouldn't say any race is that much harder than any other (overall - I agree that protoss need better micro compared to say zerg, which might need better scouting ect).
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fadestep United States. August 11 2011 13:31. Posts 558
PM Profile Blog Quote #
Protoss players take this personally because its fucking insulting and we get it ALL THE TIME.
Nobody likes to catch shit 24/7 on ladder and on forums for the race they play. Especially when its mostly inane ramblings from people who play this game at such a sub optimal fucking level that any actual differences in balance or difficulty in play aren't even being approached
Hmm i deleted my post because it realy doesnt bother me at all though i still stand by what i said
The shit you talking about every player gets
i think terrans get it the most (beeing called imba or what not) and zerg probably the least
Then the rambles from noobs who play the game at diamond league or lower: (or maybe you are diamond and for you the border is plat, whatever)
this tread is asking peoples opinnions about why see toss as easy
whats wrong with lower league players telling what and why they find this race easy and that race not?
this is not a discussion to find the "truth" about who is the strongest race lol
i bet justin bowder could not even say wich one that would be (is he even in masters?)
this is just asking people opinnion and everyone high and low level saying what they find easy and difficult in each race
all thoose posts made this tread worth reading and interesting for me
Not all the bashing on noobs and going into extremely lengthy discussions if one mechanic is stronger then the other -.-
i do agree though that it did bother me a little also at one point when people called terran the easy and imba race everytime i played someone on bnet, so i can understand your frustration also
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Why is any race considered easier to play than another? Because people like to complain and blame losses on things other than their ability (or lack thereof).
Each has it's own unique mechanics that require long hours of practice to master, and I don't believe any one person deserves the right to even claim one race has easier mechanics than another. All I've seen listed in this thread are a bunch of mistakes, made by the player, attributed to the races.
Micro arches over all the races, no army compositions or strategies are unbeatable,.. this discussion is pointless. D;
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EPT
