Am I one of the few that actually read the damn OP?

First of all, nothing is certain. They are thinking about changing it.
Secondly, it is too early to tell if there will be imbalances. And probably there won't.
Third, they are going to change to RESEARCH time of warp gates.

you could delete 75% of the post made before this due to utter failure.

DannyJ

United States5110 Posts

April 22 2011 08:58 GMT

#42

Everyone will be super happy that 4 gate is gone, then just realize the mass collosus drudgery is still there.

KobraKay

Portugal4396 Posts

April 22 2011 08:58 GMT

#43

On April 22 2011 17:42 MethodSC wrote:
inb4 2 gate cheese every game.

Sadly this. 4gate rush is so commum that it hurts anyone trying to ladder from below plat (and so do other rushes because thats all there is) but if you go down enough in short rush distance map Ps will often 2gate rush you. Most times its easy to defend with some micro but with Zlots arriving even faster?

Poor people :p oh and poor 2v2 games with a P.

arew

Lithuania1861 Posts

April 22 2011 08:59 GMT

#44

On April 22 2011 17:55 Zzoram wrote:
why not just make warpgate require a twilight council?

While reducing its build time, it seems to be a cool idea, IMO

anyway, happy that Blizzard is trying to do something!

Whiplash

United States2929 Posts

April 22 2011 08:59 GMT

#45

I think the best way to fix this is just make it so your opponent can't warp in on your opponent's pylon power radius, that way a bit of sim city could counter 4 warp gate.

AndAgain

United States2621 Posts

April 22 2011 08:59 GMT

#46

On April 22 2011 17:56 Gorg wrote:
the only thing i fear is pvp becomes once again a single colossus arms race.

Yeah, 4 gates is probably a lesser evil because at least it's over after about 7 minutes. Life too short for playing colossi arms race games.

vectorix108

United States4633 Posts

April 22 2011 09:00 GMT

#47

Hmm. Im glad they're actually trying to implement different changes. Hopefully what they do won't change the other matchups too much.

blade55555

United States17423 Posts

April 22 2011 09:01 GMT

#48

Hmm thats kind of cool, wonder what how the toss players will react who only do 4 gate. Should be interesting

Mastermind

Canada7096 Posts

April 22 2011 09:01 GMT

#49

I dont even mind pvp anymore. I learned to deal with the 4gate and move the game into the mid game. Faster unit build time would make the noobs happy that have trouble with 6/7 pools, and I think it could bring back 2gate against zerg. zealot build time was decreased because of issues vs zerg, so we may just go back to the problems that existed last fall. This could also lead to switching between warpgates and gateways for optimal efficiency. I would be interested in trying out whatever Blizzard thinks up.

Treadmill

Canada2833 Posts

April 22 2011 09:01 GMT

#50

On April 22 2011 17:45 dacthehork wrote:
The concept of early game warp technology was a flawed one

1. Warp Tech is required and happens at the beginning of the game
2. Warp Tech removes defenders advantage in terms of production timing / walk distance.

Who could have foreseen that Warp Gate would create rush imbalances

Warp Tech as a lategame upgrade just makes far more sense and fosters macro / skilled games (can't have that). Instead of moving warp gate to a much higher tier instead they have spent the last year balancing around having protoss able to eliminate map distance/size.

Interesting point about warp gate being a "late game" upgrade. I wonder if they considered moving warp gates to a later tech building, twilight council maybe. Just straight up eliminating early-game warpgates. Though that is a bit of a crazy change for so late after release. It might bring warpgates more in line with their original vision (or at least what their PR made their vision sound like).

Welmu

Finland3295 Posts

April 22 2011 09:02 GMT

#51

Would be awesome if they manage to find way to tech safely without scare of 4gate... Can be hard task to find a way though :/

Dezire

Netherlands640 Posts

April 22 2011 09:02 GMT

#52

YEAHHHHHHHHHHH please fix pvp, its the only matchup i get on ladder and costs me so much points

SinCitta

Germany2127 Posts

April 22 2011 09:02 GMT

#53

On April 22 2011 17:52 Luoson wrote:
Wow this is pretty easy to solve, I'm really surprised Blizzard hasnt caught onto something so basic. Stop units being abled to be warped up past a forcefielded ramp. Problem solved.

That seems to be the most obvious one, but I think they don't want to change all the vision mechanics involved with this.

I don't think they will change Zealot build time again, they will probably decrease Sentry and Stalker build time a little.

I was always wondering why warp-in cooldown was smaller than Gateway build time. There is even a "Transform back to Gateway"-button which never makes sense to do in a real game.

MapleLeafSirup

Germany950 Posts

April 22 2011 09:02 GMT

#54

@ all people complaining:

How the hell do YOU want to know how the game will change after such a change ?
After EVERY patch people complain and go like
"oh no now this game will be this and that way"
"oh no this matchup will be broken"
"oh no blizzard doesn't know what they're doing"

In fact they know a lot more than you and your theorycrafting based on far too little knowledge won't be as near the truth as the deep researches of blizzard who created the most balanced RTS ever (BroodWar) and have gotten SC2 more and more balanced with the time

Remember when the roach range was buffed from 3 to 4? There were hundreds of pages people complaining about how the game will be broken and super-overpowered mass roaches will dominate every matchup... and now imagine roaches would still have a range of 3...
Just give it some time! I don't mean you should not theorycraft and make some assumptions but you should not just insta-critisize zhr new patch before it has even be released

Apolo

Portugal1259 Posts

April 22 2011 09:02 GMT

#55

I actually would like to see gateways being used apart from 2gate mass zealot rush, and have the warpgate feel like a real upgrade. As it is now, we can't give it any "ooo" factor like when stim finishes because so many times, warpgates are used just after that one gate produced two units and that's it.

AGIANTSMURF

United States1232 Posts

April 22 2011 09:03 GMT

#56

I think people are getting a bit Overzealous with their concern for 2 gate rushes (See what I did there?)

We must have faith in blizzard, they were already aware of and nerfed the 2 gate proxy (though still effective) I am sure they are working on a legitimate fix without undoing things that have already been done.

As far as the PvP meta-game, I feel like they will be just cutting a huge Portion of the matchup out as we will be able to see a bit more teching earlier in the game without the risk of getting crushed by early 4wg pushes.......

Im excited to see whats its going to be like when we have the complete rock paper scissors (robo stargate twilight) instead of the oh so common rock and scissors which sometimes beats rock if you have the proper timing and control.

LoLAdriankat

United States4307 Posts

April 22 2011 09:03 GMT

#57

It looks like it's going to fix problems but also create new ones.

Imo, Protoss needs a huge redesign (particularly with the warp-in mechanic) if we want to get rid of any shenanigans. As others have pointed out, proxies will get stronger if this change goes through. Hopefully they can figure out how to make a failing proxy gate more punishing to the Toss than it is right now.

entocheets

Australia367 Posts

April 22 2011 09:03 GMT

#58

Ahh, remember when warp gate research time was half the time it was now, back in early beta...

anyway, I'm wondering if Blizz are thinking of doing a trade-off between warps and normal gates. Faster unit production time if a normal gateway vs longer cooldown time of a warpgate BUT has additional advantage of warping in units anywhere on the map.

TheSilverfox

Sweden1928 Posts

April 22 2011 09:03 GMT

#59

I kind of approve this just because it will change the PvP matchup a lot.

If they decrease zealot/stalker/sentry build time from normal Gateways a lot of Protoss will be happy about this and can more easily defend against super-early rushes from Terran and Zerg. It won't change the matchups from 5 minutes and so on but it will indeed be a Protoss buff really early game.

For example: 6pool against protoss will become much harder.

Leeoku

1617 Posts

April 22 2011 09:03 GMT

#60

it would make sense simply because of how strong warpgates are. normal build time should be a tad bit faster than warp in simply because of the strength that warping anywhere on the map provides. this also provides a defenders advantage in the pvp matchup