On May 28 2017 09:27 BisuDagger wrote: Regarding Bisu afk moment, did anyone see him fall asleep during shine's pregame interview. He looked out of it. My wife believes he was hung over lol. Obviously being sick or hung over aren't valid excuses, but he certainly looked off from start to finish. Shine sure has done a number on him.
people who root against Shine in the final because they're Bisu fans are dumb you better root for the one who beat your boy in the final so he can go down as losing to the eventual champion, not losing to another loser
I remember shine saying that in this format where you play more than 1 game he will surprise everyone, so far he ain't lying. Every single game has been different so far and it's amazing to watch, imagine how carefully he crafted these because all his "surprise transitions have been timed beautifully. He's lost to FlaSh and Effort in a Bo1 earlier, so there's that.
Bisu's PvZ is always a pleasure to watch because of his sublime mechanics and multitasking but despite his uncharacteristically bad corsair control in these games, the series was hugely entertaining because Shine is the Santa Claus of Zerg with his bottomless bag of builds--a gift of guardians for Mong and yet another lump of coal for Bisu.
I also agree that the balance whining has no place here. Only thing imba in BW is Flash. If Shine is the Santa Claus of BW, then Flash is going to show him the true meaning of Christmas next Sunday.
On May 28 2017 10:43 Terrorbladder wrote: people who root against Shine in the final because they're Bisu fans are dumb you better root for the one who beat your boy in the final so he can go down as losing to the eventual champion, not losing to another loser
The more salty they are, the more delicious their tears become.
2009/2010 marketing has been so effective within the BW scene. Bisu has been fluking wins here and there since 2010 and people think he can keep up with everyone else, while his PvT was always poor and his PvZ wins revolved around getting lucky with DTs.
Plus, Shine was having a hell of a climb in 2010, arguably the year when BW pro skill was at it's highest. At the time the undisputed top Zerg was EffOrt, with soulkey coming into his own and showing heaps of potential, and Shine being on his tail. JD was completely out of the picture, the games he was winning was purely on intimidation. OZ was pushing Killer at the time to replace him, and Type-b had a lot of potential (and a lot in common with Shine), but he had his career cut short by outside pressure into match-fixing, so who even knows how many of his latest losses were legitimate.
On May 28 2017 13:54 r33k wrote: 2009/2010 marketing has been so effective within the BW scene. Bisu has been fluking wins here and there since 2010 and people think he can keep up with everyone else, while his PvT was always poor and his PvZ wins revolved around getting lucky with DTs.
Plus, Shine was having a hell of a climb in 2010, arguably the year when BW pro skill was at it's highest. At the time the undisputed top Zerg was EffOrt, with soulkey coming into his own and showing heaps of potential, and Shine being on his tail. JD was completely out of the picture, the games he was winning was purely on intimidation. OZ was pushing Killer at the time to replace him, and Type-b had a lot of potential (and a lot in common with Shine), but he had his career cut short by outside pressure into match-fixing, so who even knows how many of his latest losses were legitimate.
He looked really good after he defeated Savior and i enjoy watching Bisu play but this series was depressing it was like he uh trying to lose basically tbh
also request the Jaedong Bisu chat about the average protoss can beat Shine pic
On May 28 2017 13:54 r33k wrote: 2009/2010 marketing has been so effective within the BW scene. Bisu has been fluking wins here and there since 2010 and people think he can keep up with everyone else, while his PvT was always poor and his PvZ wins revolved around getting lucky with DTs.
Plus, Shine was having a hell of a climb in 2010, arguably the year when BW pro skill was at it's highest. At the time the undisputed top Zerg was EffOrt, with soulkey coming into his own and showing heaps of potential, and Shine being on his tail. JD was completely out of the picture, the games he was winning was purely on intimidation. OZ was pushing Killer at the time to replace him, and Type-b had a lot of potential (and a lot in common with Shine), but he had his career cut short by outside pressure into match-fixing, so who even knows how many of his latest losses were legitimate.
EffOrt 2010
Proleague 36W 27L 57.1% Winner: 2010 Korean Air OnGameNet Starleague Season 1
Jaedong 2010
Proleague 52W 21L 71.2% Winner: 2010 WCG Korea Finals Runner-Up: 2010 Korean Air OnGameNet Starleague Season 2 Runner-Up: 2010 Bigfile MBCGame StarCraft League Runner-Up: 2010 Hana Daetoo Securities MBCGame StarCraft League Winner: 2009-2010 NATE MBCGame StarCraft League
All I can say is Shine has been really entertaining to watch and has injected some great "new" blood into this tournament. It's exactly what this scene needs.
On May 28 2017 13:54 r33k wrote: 2009/2010 marketing has been so effective within the BW scene. Bisu has been fluking wins here and there since 2010 and people think he can keep up with everyone else, while his PvT was always poor and his PvZ wins revolved around getting lucky with DTs.
Plus, Shine was having a hell of a climb in 2010, arguably the year when BW pro skill was at it's highest. At the time the undisputed top Zerg was EffOrt, with soulkey coming into his own and showing heaps of potential, and Shine being on his tail. JD was completely out of the picture, the games he was winning was purely on intimidation. OZ was pushing Killer at the time to replace him, and Type-b had a lot of potential (and a lot in common with Shine), but he had his career cut short by outside pressure into match-fixing, so who even knows how many of his latest losses were legitimate.
Wow, I must have been watching an alternative broodwar scene! Where Jeadong was still owning everyone in 2010, and Zero was no.2 Zerg, with Hydra on the raise. In my universe Shina was only known for strong ZvP and in particular for knocking out Bisu. And in broodwar scene that I followed, Bisu was undeniably considered the best PvZ'er, was rarely using DTs in 2009-2010, and instead he pushing meta with early zealot pushes.
On May 28 2017 06:37 _Animus_ wrote: oh no, Shine screwed up so hard in G1, why push all your units towards the protoss main while corsair have vision? That like "bisu im gonna drop you, you better build some defences" He shouldve just send the corsair away with hydras then drop...
Bisu played D- second game, quallity of play really droped out after the end of progame era. Runing corsairs over hydras, no bother to pull out corsairs that are targeted by hydras, wasting units everywhere. I mean come on i do better with corsairs than this :D Bisu looks crushed after game 2 i guess this series is done.
Game 3. Did Bisu just go afk at random moments?
Game 4. Bisu couldve gotten significant advantage if not won the game, if just pulled back 2 of his zealots to the side, after the rush finished, since he have enough to hold his ramp. How can he be so uncreative with such a common stuff. If he run pass the sunken, after lings go to his main with the 2 zealots, drones are out of the main.
Seems like Bisu was not here today, its like Shine has some dark power that negates Bisu multitasking skill.
And have really to say Shine outshines everybody in this tournament so far, brilliant performance and execution overall.
Regarding Bisu afk moment, did anyone see him fall asleep during shine's pregame interview. He looked out of it. My wife believes he was hung over lol. Obviously being sick or hung over aren't valid excuses, but he certainly looked off from start to finish. Shine sure has done a number on him.
I believe someone else has already posted this. Bisu was apparently 'sick' on the day of the game. Doesn't excuse his poor performance, but I'm sure it would've affected his play to some degree.
Want to know what the most interesting thing is? Shine isn't even in the building in the opening ASL3 intro video. FlaSh is there at the end facing all the players who fans think have a shot at beating him. Nowhere is Shine to be seen, though. I think the one thing Shine has going for him this tournament is that he is the dark horse. No one expects him to win. No one expects him to go far. No one knows what he's got in his bag o' builds. No one knows where all the confidence he's got comes from. I'd wager Shine is the opponent FlaSh is least prepared for considering how little they've played online if at all. I hope when he defeats FlaSh they have a special ending where Shine tears off the roof of the building and devours everyone.
But really, though, If he does manage to win the ASL, then I would say he's the modern-day sAviOr, and I mean that in the most positive sense. This guy has brought nothing but ingenious, refreshing, and entertaining StarCraft to the fans. The fact that he's a massive underdog (a dad with two kids and having difficulty finding practice partners) against the current top players just makes me root for him even more.
While I feel like Shine got in Bisu's head at some point in the match, I do feel like Bisu was off his game. As people said earlier, he looked like crap during the interview at the beginning with Stargirl, and it felt like an iCCup player was controlling his corsairs in games 2 and 3. It didn't seem like he had a cold or flu to me. He didn't even blow his nose once or have a tissue box or have one of those white face masks. To me it just looked like he got no sleep.
On a more sour note, I really didn't like Rapid's casting. He gave shout-outs to the panda bear on Andromeda three times, he had too much high-pitched laughing, he talked about pursuit curves and calculus which have zero relevance in a match (not the first time he's done this), he delivered Tasteless's closing line with more cheese than a cheese pizza (speaking of which, I wish they'd quit saying, "we love you!"--always makes me cringe), he clashed with Artosis in humor (rather than going along with that brilliant observer joke and laughing, he tried to shut it down and one-up him). I think Artosis did a great job, though. I wish someone from the community, like TechnicS or Bakuryu, could get up there with him when Tasteless isn't around.
On May 28 2017 06:37 _Animus_ wrote: oh no, Shine screwed up so hard in G1, why push all your units towards the protoss main while corsair have vision? That like "bisu im gonna drop you, you better build some defences" He shouldve just send the corsair away with hydras then drop...
Bisu played D- second game, quallity of play really droped out after the end of progame era. Runing corsairs over hydras, no bother to pull out corsairs that are targeted by hydras, wasting units everywhere. I mean come on i do better with corsairs than this :D Bisu looks crushed after game 2 i guess this series is done.
Game 3. Did Bisu just go afk at random moments?
Game 4. Bisu couldve gotten significant advantage if not won the game, if just pulled back 2 of his zealots to the side, after the rush finished, since he have enough to hold his ramp. How can he be so uncreative with such a common stuff. If he run pass the sunken, after lings go to his main with the 2 zealots, drones are out of the main.
Seems like Bisu was not here today, its like Shine has some dark power that negates Bisu multitasking skill.
And have really to say Shine outshines everybody in this tournament so far, brilliant performance and execution overall.
Regarding Bisu afk moment, did anyone see him fall asleep during shine's pregame interview. He looked out of it. My wife believes he was hung over lol. Obviously being sick or hung over aren't valid excuses, but he certainly looked off from start to finish. Shine sure has done a number on him.
I believe someone else has already posted this. Bisu was apparently 'sick' on the day of the game. Doesn't excuse his poor performance, but I'm sure it would've affected his play to some degree.
Yes, he said he went to outdoor for relax&fresh air at midnight, after long time pvz exercise. Unfortunately he caught a bit cold (roughly translated according to his interview before match).
Let's also not forget it was one series, 4 games in total. No matter how skilled a player is, on the balance of probabilities they can't win 100% of their games, and 4 games is simply not a large enough sample size to conclusively say one player is better than another. Throw in the fact that Bisu was sick and it is pretty fair to say he was simply shit out of luck. Even Flash doesn't have a perfect winrate, so why do we expect as much from Bisu?
Treat this as what it is, a single datapoint against Bisu and in favour of Shine. If there are more datapoints then we can make some conclusion. Until then we can simply say it was an unlucky loss for Bisu in conjunction with a strong performance by Shine. No need to read more into what was only a single series between these two players.
On May 28 2017 16:07 Shalashaska_123 wrote: Hello, Teamliquid.
Want to know what the most interesting thing is? Shine isn't even in the building in the opening ASL3 intro video. FlaSh is there at the end facing all the players who fans think have a shot at beating him. Nowhere is Shine to be seen, though. I think the one thing Shine has going for him this tournament is that he is the dark horse. No one expects him to win. No one expects him to go far. No one knows what he's got in his bag o' builds. No one knows where all the confidence he's got comes from. I'd wager Shine is the opponent FlaSh is least prepared for considering how little they've played online if at all. I hope when he defeats FlaSh they have a special ending where Shine tears off the roof of the building and devours everyone.
But really, though, If he does manage to win the ASL, then I would say he's the modern-day sAviOr, and I mean that in the most positive sense. This guy has brought nothing but ingenious, refreshing, and entertaining StarCraft to the fans. The fact that he's a massive underdog (a dad with two kids and having difficulty finding practice partners) against the current top players just makes me root for him even more.
While I feel like Shine got in Bisu's head at some point in the match, I do feel like Bisu was off his game. As people said earlier, he looked like crap during the interview at the beginning with Stargirl, and it felt like an iCCup player was controlling his corsairs in games 2 and 3. It didn't seem like he had a cold or flu to me. He didn't even blow his nose once or have a tissue box or have one of those white face masks. To me it just looked like he got no sleep.
On a more sour note, I really didn't like Rapid's casting. He gave shout-outs to the panda bear on Andromeda three times, he had too much high-pitched laughing, he talked about pursuit curves and calculus which have zero relevance in a match (not the first time he's done this), he delivered Tasteless's closing line with more cheese than a cheese pizza (speaking of which, I wish they'd quit saying, "we love you!"--always makes me cringe), he clashed with Artosis in humor (rather than going along with that brilliant observer joke and laughing, he tried to shut it down and one-up him). I think Artosis did a great job, though. I wish someone from the community, like TechnicS or Bakuryu, could get up there with him when Tasteless isn't around.
Just my random thoughts.
Sincerely, Shalashaska_123
No i didnt enjoy Rapid either, wasnt sure what he meant by temples in Outsider that kinda confused me but Artosis never said anything about it so i dunno.
I do hope Shine wins in a way even though I play Terran, but i think thats cause i love a good under-dog story
On May 28 2017 16:44 XenoX101 wrote: Let's also not forget it was one series, 4 games in total. No matter how skilled a player is, on the balance of probabilities they can't win 100% of their games, and 4 games is simply not a large enough sample size to conclusively say one player is better than another. Throw in the fact that Bisu was sick and it is pretty fair to say he was simply shit out of luck. Even Flash doesn't have a perfect winrate, so why do we expect as much from Bisu?
Treat this as what it is, a single datapoint against Bisu and in favour of Shine. If there are more datapoints then we can make some conclusion. Until then we can simply say it was an unlucky loss for Bisu in conjunction with a strong performance by Shine. No need to read more into what was only a single series between these two players.
I think this is the 3rd series Shine has destroyed Bisu in though 3-0/2-0? in the other two i think
EPT
