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[OSL] Ro16 Day 4 - Page 39

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
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epi
Profile Joined January 2010
Canada115 Posts
July 22 2011 11:52 GMT
#761
On July 22 2011 20:45 Special Tactics wrote:
THat was a terrible game. Protoss seems to have played fine. Was is the map? Flash could seige in 1 position hitting 2 bases. that was silly


2 gate expand is a fairly slow expand PvT, and additionally it's pretty weak on two-player maps where the Terran can scout it reliably and react properly. His dragoon pressure inflicted next to no damage as well. Compounding this, his relatively fast transition to carriers off three bases robbed him of the resources to get the speed zealots he would need to beat a vultureless push.
moopie
Profile Joined July 2009
12605 Posts
July 22 2011 11:52 GMT
#762
On July 22 2011 20:51 Sawamura wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 20:50 revy wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:45 Special Tactics wrote:
THat was a terrible game. Protoss seems to have played fine. Was is the map? Flash could seige in 1 position hitting 2 bases. that was silly


Stork didn't really play fine. It made it look like T is OP but that is what happens about 90% of the time someone goes carriers vs Flash. During the carrier transition Flash knows his opponent will be light on units until critical mass of carriers so he splits up his forces and takes down all the expos he can to starve out his opponent.

I feel the biggest hole in Flash's TvP currently is against heavy ground play.


Link me some games where flash falter to heavy ground units play @@

only one i can think of offhand was the game he dropped to shuttle, where he made no vultures and tried to grab that fast 3rd.
I'm going to sleep, let me get some of that carpet.
J1.au
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Australia3596 Posts
July 22 2011 11:53 GMT
#763
On July 22 2011 20:52 kuroshiroi wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 20:51 Sawamura wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:50 revy wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:45 Special Tactics wrote:
THat was a terrible game. Protoss seems to have played fine. Was is the map? Flash could seige in 1 position hitting 2 bases. that was silly


Stork didn't really play fine. It made it look like T is OP but that is what happens about 90% of the time someone goes carriers vs Flash. During the carrier transition Flash knows his opponent will be light on units until critical mass of carriers so he splits up his forces and takes down all the expos he can to starve out his opponent.

I feel the biggest hole in Flash's TvP currently is against heavy ground play.


Link me some games where flash falter to heavy ground units play @@

Recent games against Shuttle, Best and M18M, for instance.

Much, not M18M!
Evs
Profile Joined December 2008
Philippines330 Posts
July 22 2011 11:53 GMT
#764
Jangbi needs to advance...will be sad if a Khan protoss can't get another silver...
Shurayuki
Profile Joined April 2010
Germany2665 Posts
July 22 2011 11:53 GMT
#765
On July 22 2011 20:53 J1.au wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 20:52 kuroshiroi wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:51 Sawamura wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:50 revy wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:45 Special Tactics wrote:
THat was a terrible game. Protoss seems to have played fine. Was is the map? Flash could seige in 1 position hitting 2 bases. that was silly


Stork didn't really play fine. It made it look like T is OP but that is what happens about 90% of the time someone goes carriers vs Flash. During the carrier transition Flash knows his opponent will be light on units until critical mass of carriers so he splits up his forces and takes down all the expos he can to starve out his opponent.

I feel the biggest hole in Flash's TvP currently is against heavy ground play.


Link me some games where flash falter to heavy ground units play @@

Recent games against Shuttle, Best and M18M, for instance.

Much, not M18M!


wasn't that carriers? different game?
なまいきになんなよ~ Don't be too stakka~ ☆ SKT Harlequin ☆ n.Die_soO Hoppin You ♪ 愛 am BeSt ♪ ワイフ♥小早川りんこ
kuroshiroi
Profile Joined November 2010
3149 Posts
July 22 2011 11:54 GMT
#766
On July 22 2011 20:53 J1.au wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 20:52 kuroshiroi wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:51 Sawamura wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:50 revy wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:45 Special Tactics wrote:
THat was a terrible game. Protoss seems to have played fine. Was is the map? Flash could seige in 1 position hitting 2 bases. that was silly


Stork didn't really play fine. It made it look like T is OP but that is what happens about 90% of the time someone goes carriers vs Flash. During the carrier transition Flash knows his opponent will be light on units until critical mass of carriers so he splits up his forces and takes down all the expos he can to starve out his opponent.

I feel the biggest hole in Flash's TvP currently is against heavy ground play.


Link me some games where flash falter to heavy ground units play @@

Recent games against Shuttle, Best and M18M, for instance.

Much, not M18M!

Eh, sorry :| The other Ace toss :D (sorry rock)
Fly Jaedong, fly!
BLinD-RawR
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
ALLEYCAT BLUES51094 Posts
July 22 2011 11:54 GMT
#767
+ Show Spoiler +
&#91;image loading&#93;

for you killer fans
Brood War EICWoo Jung Ho, never forget.| Twitter: @BLinDRawR
kuroshiroi
Profile Joined November 2010
3149 Posts
July 22 2011 11:55 GMT
#768
On July 22 2011 20:53 Shurayuki wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 20:53 J1.au wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:52 kuroshiroi wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:51 Sawamura wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:50 revy wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:45 Special Tactics wrote:
THat was a terrible game. Protoss seems to have played fine. Was is the map? Flash could seige in 1 position hitting 2 bases. that was silly


Stork didn't really play fine. It made it look like T is OP but that is what happens about 90% of the time someone goes carriers vs Flash. During the carrier transition Flash knows his opponent will be light on units until critical mass of carriers so he splits up his forces and takes down all the expos he can to starve out his opponent.

I feel the biggest hole in Flash's TvP currently is against heavy ground play.


Link me some games where flash falter to heavy ground units play @@

Recent games against Shuttle, Best and M18M, for instance.

Much, not M18M!


wasn't that carriers? different game?

Nope, just a ground attack that killed Flash when he tried to over-expand.
Fly Jaedong, fly!
hitthat
Profile Joined January 2010
Poland2347 Posts
July 22 2011 11:56 GMT
#769
Ok Jangbi, do not fail this time. You are the last hope of Jeffs Protoss.
Shameless BroodWar separatistic, elitist, fanaticaly devoted puritan fanboy.
KTF_CloaK
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Netherlands1338 Posts
July 22 2011 11:56 GMT
#770
On July 22 2011 20:53 Shurayuki wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 20:53 J1.au wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:52 kuroshiroi wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:51 Sawamura wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:50 revy wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:45 Special Tactics wrote:
THat was a terrible game. Protoss seems to have played fine. Was is the map? Flash could seige in 1 position hitting 2 bases. that was silly


Stork didn't really play fine. It made it look like T is OP but that is what happens about 90% of the time someone goes carriers vs Flash. During the carrier transition Flash knows his opponent will be light on units until critical mass of carriers so he splits up his forces and takes down all the expos he can to starve out his opponent.

I feel the biggest hole in Flash's TvP currently is against heavy ground play.


Link me some games where flash falter to heavy ground units play @@

Recent games against Shuttle, Best and M18M, for instance.

Much, not M18M!


wasn't that carriers? different game?


No, the game vs much was not a faltering against a huge ground army, Flash pushed idicilously early with like 3 tanks and marines and some vults and it failed so it was gg right there because he failed to take out Much's third and losed soon afterwards to much's 10 gate macro on 3 bases while FlaSh had 2.
KT Rolster for the win!! Lee-Young-Ho hwaiting!!
Special Tactics
Profile Joined July 2011
Ukraine233 Posts
July 22 2011 11:56 GMT
#771
I think that was it. Someone said. I realize now. going carriers leaves toss fewer units, so Flash was able to harass expo's. But the siege of 2 expos at once is plain ridiculous haha
revy
Profile Joined September 2009
United States1524 Posts
July 22 2011 11:56 GMT
#772
On July 22 2011 20:51 Sawamura wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 20:50 revy wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:45 Special Tactics wrote:
THat was a terrible game. Protoss seems to have played fine. Was is the map? Flash could seige in 1 position hitting 2 bases. that was silly


Stork didn't really play fine. It made it look like T is OP but that is what happens about 90% of the time someone goes carriers vs Flash. During the carrier transition Flash knows his opponent will be light on units until critical mass of carriers so he splits up his forces and takes down all the expos he can to starve out his opponent.

I feel the biggest hole in Flash's TvP currently is against heavy ground play.


Link me some games where flash falter to heavy ground units play @@


Others have answered. All I'm trying to say is that I can remember a lot more times recently that he lost on the ground as opposed to lost to carriers. I'm sure Flash will have a TvP BO5 eventually and then he'll shoot up to 85% in the MU again for 8 months.
Kirb
Profile Joined April 2010
Germany900 Posts
July 22 2011 11:57 GMT
#773
I really hope Killer makes it deep this time.
sixfour
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
England11062 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-22 11:57:49
July 22 2011 11:57 GMT
#774
jangbi at 8
killer at 12
map is that silly one with bases in the middle

killer scouting correctly
p: stats, horang2, free, jangbi z: soulkey, zero, shine, hydra t: leta, hiya, sea
Elyvilon
Profile Joined August 2008
United States13143 Posts
July 22 2011 11:57 GMT
#775
On July 22 2011 20:56 revy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 20:51 Sawamura wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:50 revy wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:45 Special Tactics wrote:
THat was a terrible game. Protoss seems to have played fine. Was is the map? Flash could seige in 1 position hitting 2 bases. that was silly


Stork didn't really play fine. It made it look like T is OP but that is what happens about 90% of the time someone goes carriers vs Flash. During the carrier transition Flash knows his opponent will be light on units until critical mass of carriers so he splits up his forces and takes down all the expos he can to starve out his opponent.

I feel the biggest hole in Flash's TvP currently is against heavy ground play.


Link me some games where flash falter to heavy ground units play @@


Others have answered. All I'm trying to say is that I can remember a lot more times recently that he lost on the ground as opposed to lost to carriers. I'm sure Flash will have a TvP BO5 eventually and then he'll shoot up to 85% in the MU again for 8 months.

For that to happen, protosses actually need to make it to the later stages of leagues.
Liquipedia
kuroshiroi
Profile Joined November 2010
3149 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-07-22 11:58:44
July 22 2011 11:57 GMT
#776
On July 22 2011 20:56 KTF_CloaK wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 20:53 Shurayuki wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:53 J1.au wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:52 kuroshiroi wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:51 Sawamura wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:50 revy wrote:
On July 22 2011 20:45 Special Tactics wrote:
THat was a terrible game. Protoss seems to have played fine. Was is the map? Flash could seige in 1 position hitting 2 bases. that was silly


Stork didn't really play fine. It made it look like T is OP but that is what happens about 90% of the time someone goes carriers vs Flash. During the carrier transition Flash knows his opponent will be light on units until critical mass of carriers so he splits up his forces and takes down all the expos he can to starve out his opponent.

I feel the biggest hole in Flash's TvP currently is against heavy ground play.


Link me some games where flash falter to heavy ground units play @@

Recent games against Shuttle, Best and M18M, for instance.

Much, not M18M!


wasn't that carriers? different game?


No, the game vs much was not a faltering against a huge ground army, Flash pushed idicilously early with like 3 tanks and marines and some vults and it failed so it was gg right there because he failed to take out Much's third and losed soon afterwards to much's 10 gate macro on 3 bases while FlaSh had 2.

It's the general idea, mostly:

Huge ground army against Flash works better than carriers, definitely.
Fly Jaedong, fly!
Hyde
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
Australia14568 Posts
July 22 2011 11:58 GMT
#777
Are the commentators wearing JinAir colours?

3rd match now underway!
Map is Pathfinder

Jangbi in green at 8 o'clock
Killer in yellow at 12 o'clock

Overlord headed straight for JB territory
Because when you left, Brood War was all spotlights and titans. Now, with the death of the big leagues, Brood War has moved to the basements and carparks. Now, Brood War is unlicensed brawls, lost teeth, and bloody fights for fistfulls of money - SirJolt
hypercube
Profile Joined April 2010
Hungary2735 Posts
July 22 2011 11:58 GMT
#778
On July 22 2011 20:50 revy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 22 2011 20:45 Special Tactics wrote:
THat was a terrible game. Protoss seems to have played fine. Was is the map? Flash could seige in 1 position hitting 2 bases. that was silly


Stork didn't really play fine. It made it look like T is OP but that is what happens about 90% of the time someone goes carriers vs Flash. During the carrier transition Flash knows his opponent will be light on units until critical mass of carriers so he splits up his forces and takes down all the expos he can to starve out his opponent.

I feel the biggest hole in Flash's TvP currently is against heavy ground play.


It's not just strategies, Flash's execution was plain better. Stork could have used that 10 goons that got trapped at 12 o'clock in his final attack. And he should have done better with what he had anyway.
"Sending people in rockets to other planets is a waste of money better spent on sending rockets into people on this planet."
sixfour
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
England11062 Posts
July 22 2011 11:58 GMT
#779
confused what killer is doing with his ovie
p: stats, horang2, free, jangbi z: soulkey, zero, shine, hydra t: leta, hiya, sea
HighTemper
Profile Joined April 2011
Canada3867 Posts
July 22 2011 11:58 GMT
#780
Shit... Path%&%^*&^%finder.

10-4 ZvP...
"Issue the orders Sir [JangBi], and I will storm Hell." - Anthony Wayne
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