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[OSL] Korean Air OSL - Ro36 - Group A - Page 8

Forum Index > Brood War Tournaments
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Gustav_Wind
Profile Joined July 2008
United States646 Posts
February 10 2010 10:45 GMT
#141
And I was really hoping to see the Deep Six from MVP, since he was setting up the turret ring and everything...

but it never got to that point ><
JohnColtrane
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Australia4813 Posts
February 10 2010 10:46 GMT
#142
On February 10 2010 19:45 Shikyo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 10 2010 19:41 SuperArc wrote:
On February 10 2010 19:40 Aiden wrote:
Game 2 (P)Kal v (T)MVP:

+ Show Spoiler +

Why doesn't (T)IdrA stop whining about 14 Nexus. With he's acclaimed skill, and the practice schedule of a progamer he should be able to rally 3 marines, 4 SCVs and the First Vulture to take it out. It doesn't require (T)Flash Micro.


because Kal was ahead even after the nexus died.

Really would like to know why. MVP lost no SCVs and had his 2nd CC up before Kal's, in addition to having mines accross the map meaning that he could safely build a bit less units to get his infrastructure up earlier, having the knowledge Kal would need to go for range in order to clear the bunker and hence had almost a legal maphack, in addition to this Kal's supply wasn't as much above MVP's as it would be in standard play, not to mention the fact that Kal wouldn't be able to put any pressure on MVP for the early game, and that his potential DTs or Robo units would be too late to do anything.

Anything specific?


protoss
HEY MEYT
SkytoM
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Austria1137 Posts
February 10 2010 10:47 GMT
#143
can anyone give the name of the song with "dont loose your templars so quickly?" thx
Bisu... ;-(
Crunchums
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States11144 Posts
February 10 2010 10:48 GMT
#144
On February 10 2010 19:45 Shikyo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 10 2010 19:41 SuperArc wrote:
On February 10 2010 19:40 Aiden wrote:
Game 2 (P)Kal v (T)MVP:

+ Show Spoiler +

Why doesn't (T)IdrA stop whining about 14 Nexus. With he's acclaimed skill, and the practice schedule of a progamer he should be able to rally 3 marines, 4 SCVs and the First Vulture to take it out. It doesn't require (T)Flash Micro.


because Kal was ahead even after the nexus died.

Really would like to know why. MVP lost no SCVs and had his 2nd CC up before Kal's, in addition to having mines accross the map meaning that he could safely build a bit less units to get his infrastructure up earlier, having the knowledge Kal would need to go for range in order to clear the bunker and hence had almost a legal maphack, in addition to this Kal's supply wasn't as much above MVP's as it would be in standard play, not to mention the fact that Kal wouldn't be able to put any pressure on MVP for the early game, and that his potential DTs or Robo units would be too late to do anything.

Anything specific?

terran loses tons of mining time from his scvs and protoss gets a higher worker count
brood war for life, brood war forever
Shikyo
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Finland33997 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-02-10 10:50:29
February 10 2010 10:48 GMT
#145
On February 10 2010 19:46 JohnColtrane wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 10 2010 19:45 Shikyo wrote:
On February 10 2010 19:41 SuperArc wrote:
On February 10 2010 19:40 Aiden wrote:
Game 2 (P)Kal v (T)MVP:

+ Show Spoiler +

Why doesn't (T)IdrA stop whining about 14 Nexus. With he's acclaimed skill, and the practice schedule of a progamer he should be able to rally 3 marines, 4 SCVs and the First Vulture to take it out. It doesn't require (T)Flash Micro.


because Kal was ahead even after the nexus died.

Really would like to know why. MVP lost no SCVs and had his 2nd CC up before Kal's, in addition to having mines accross the map meaning that he could safely build a bit less units to get his infrastructure up earlier, having the knowledge Kal would need to go for range in order to clear the bunker and hence had almost a legal maphack, in addition to this Kal's supply wasn't as much above MVP's as it would be in standard play, not to mention the fact that Kal wouldn't be able to put any pressure on MVP for the early game, and that his potential DTs or Robo units would be too late to do anything.

Anything specific?


protoss

I think the behind-if-bunker-rush holds true if you bring like 12 SCVs and keep them there the whole time, but here MVP brought only 6 and sent 4 back home before the nex had even died. Kal needs to get range finished before he can put his expansion down, and even after that MVP has 6 mines between their bases and will have siege and tank in time. I really don't believe that he was ahead after that.

On February 10 2010 19:48 Crunchums wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 10 2010 19:45 Shikyo wrote:
On February 10 2010 19:41 SuperArc wrote:
On February 10 2010 19:40 Aiden wrote:
Game 2 (P)Kal v (T)MVP:

+ Show Spoiler +

Why doesn't (T)IdrA stop whining about 14 Nexus. With he's acclaimed skill, and the practice schedule of a progamer he should be able to rally 3 marines, 4 SCVs and the First Vulture to take it out. It doesn't require (T)Flash Micro.


because Kal was ahead even after the nexus died.

Really would like to know why. MVP lost no SCVs and had his 2nd CC up before Kal's, in addition to having mines accross the map meaning that he could safely build a bit less units to get his infrastructure up earlier, having the knowledge Kal would need to go for range in order to clear the bunker and hence had almost a legal maphack, in addition to this Kal's supply wasn't as much above MVP's as it would be in standard play, not to mention the fact that Kal wouldn't be able to put any pressure on MVP for the early game, and that his potential DTs or Robo units would be too late to do anything.

Anything specific?

terran loses tons of mining time from his scvs and protoss gets a higher worker count

I definitely would trade being momentarily 3-4 workers behind in order to get a way earlier CC, free scouting information, complete map control, safety against cheesy drop play, your opponent having no way to scout you, and 6 mines in front of their natural. You wouldn't? Do you skip the comsat stations in TvZ if you expect mutas because 3 SCVs > scouting?
League of Legends EU West, Platinum III | Yousei Teikoku is the best thing that has ever happened to music.
Crunchums
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States11144 Posts
February 10 2010 10:48 GMT
#146
not that I know enough to judge who comes out ahead in those sorts of scenarios but those are the things working against the terran that you are not accounting for
brood war for life, brood war forever
lazz
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Australia3119 Posts
February 10 2010 10:49 GMT
#147
On February 10 2010 19:45 Shikyo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 10 2010 19:41 SuperArc wrote:
On February 10 2010 19:40 Aiden wrote:
Game 2 (P)Kal v (T)MVP:

+ Show Spoiler +

Why doesn't (T)IdrA stop whining about 14 Nexus. With he's acclaimed skill, and the practice schedule of a progamer he should be able to rally 3 marines, 4 SCVs and the First Vulture to take it out. It doesn't require (T)Flash Micro.


because Kal was ahead even after the nexus died.

Really would like to know why. MVP lost no SCVs and had his 2nd CC up before Kal's, in addition to having mines accross the map meaning that he could safely build a bit less units to get his infrastructure up earlier, having the knowledge Kal would need to go for range in order to clear the bunker and hence had almost a legal maphack, in addition to this Kal's supply wasn't as much above MVP's as it would be in standard play, not to mention the fact that Kal wouldn't be able to put any pressure on MVP for the early game, and that his potential DTs or Robo units would be too late to do anything.

Anything specific?

the lead from 12 nex getting bunker rushed isnt anything huge. probably something like a couple extra probes. plus when obs come out you have huge map control, terran is pretty muchforced to go defensive with siege mode and turrets, which means toss is free to do what he likes without having to worry about any cheesey early game all-ins like 2 fac which they usually have to worry about when taking their expo.
IceCube
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Croatia1403 Posts
February 10 2010 10:49 GMT
#148
Yup I think they were even after that 12nex failed.
Forever Vulture.. :(
FaCE_1
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
Canada6185 Posts
February 10 2010 10:51 GMT
#149
dam I was scare that Kal would lose to MVP

Hope to see him go far
n_n
Shikyo
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Finland33997 Posts
February 10 2010 10:52 GMT
#150
On February 10 2010 19:49 lazz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 10 2010 19:45 Shikyo wrote:
On February 10 2010 19:41 SuperArc wrote:
On February 10 2010 19:40 Aiden wrote:
Game 2 (P)Kal v (T)MVP:

+ Show Spoiler +

Why doesn't (T)IdrA stop whining about 14 Nexus. With he's acclaimed skill, and the practice schedule of a progamer he should be able to rally 3 marines, 4 SCVs and the First Vulture to take it out. It doesn't require (T)Flash Micro.


because Kal was ahead even after the nexus died.

Really would like to know why. MVP lost no SCVs and had his 2nd CC up before Kal's, in addition to having mines accross the map meaning that he could safely build a bit less units to get his infrastructure up earlier, having the knowledge Kal would need to go for range in order to clear the bunker and hence had almost a legal maphack, in addition to this Kal's supply wasn't as much above MVP's as it would be in standard play, not to mention the fact that Kal wouldn't be able to put any pressure on MVP for the early game, and that his potential DTs or Robo units would be too late to do anything.

Anything specific?

the lead from 12 nex getting bunker rushed isnt anything huge. probably something like a couple extra probes. plus when obs come out you have huge map control, terran is pretty muchforced to go defensive with siege mode and turrets, which means toss is free to do what he likes without having to worry about any cheesey early game all-ins like 2 fac which they usually have to worry about when taking their expo.

In other words, after-I-do-2-gate-range-nex-robo-obs I have map control. Well nice, but normally P has map control from the start, here he gets it way later. And this means he's ahead? OK
League of Legends EU West, Platinum III | Yousei Teikoku is the best thing that has ever happened to music.
Sinedd
Profile Joined July 2008
Poland7052 Posts
February 10 2010 10:52 GMT
#151
cmon KaL only 1 to go

btw what do you guys think about this "new" map ? cuz its pretty much elnino in new tileset to me ... ;/
T H C makes ppl happy
Shikyo
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Finland33997 Posts
February 10 2010 10:53 GMT
#152
On February 10 2010 19:52 Sinedd wrote:
cmon KaL only 1 to go

btw what do you guys think about this "new" map ? cuz its pretty much elnino in new tileset to me ... ;/

It is el nino in a new tileset exactly, except for having like 400 more minerals.
League of Legends EU West, Platinum III | Yousei Teikoku is the best thing that has ever happened to music.
dibban
Profile Joined July 2008
Sweden1279 Posts
February 10 2010 10:53 GMT
#153
Kal vs type-b should be a decent series if the latter doesn't suck too much!
이제동 - 이영호 since '07.
Crunchums
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
United States11144 Posts
February 10 2010 10:54 GMT
#154
On February 10 2010 19:48 Shikyo wrote:
I definitely would trade being momentarily 3-4 workers behind in order to get a way earlier CC, free scouting information, complete map control, safety against cheesy drop play, your opponent having no way to scout you, and 6 mines in front of their natural. You wouldn't? Do you skip the comsat stations in TvZ if you expect mutas because 3 SCVs > scouting?

like I said I have no idea, was just trying to answer your question. I do think you are underestimating how much money pulling 6 scvs for that long translates to.
brood war for life, brood war forever
ejac
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States1195 Posts
February 10 2010 10:55 GMT
#155
On February 10 2010 19:53 Shikyo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 10 2010 19:52 Sinedd wrote:
cmon KaL only 1 to go

btw what do you guys think about this "new" map ? cuz its pretty much elnino in new tileset to me ... ;/

It is el nino in a new tileset exactly, except for having like 400 more minerals.

It also has unbuildable areas right around the bridges.
esq>n
Gregsen
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
Germany667 Posts
February 10 2010 10:57 GMT
#156
That intro is pretty badass!
Boycott Activision whenever, wherever you can.
FastEddieV
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
United States614 Posts
February 10 2010 10:58 GMT
#157
It must be reiterated that this opening is pretty sweet. Flash has two OSL wins I just realized, so he'll be playing for the Golden Mouse (assuming he makes it to the finals.)

Kal fighting!
platinum? more like leaf
Hyde
Profile Blog Joined November 2007
Australia14568 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-02-10 10:59:35
February 10 2010 10:59 GMT
#158
On February 10 2010 19:54 Crunchums wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 10 2010 19:48 Shikyo wrote:
I definitely would trade being momentarily 3-4 workers behind in order to get a way earlier CC, free scouting information, complete map control, safety against cheesy drop play, your opponent having no way to scout you, and 6 mines in front of their natural. You wouldn't? Do you skip the comsat stations in TvZ if you expect mutas because 3 SCVs > scouting?

like I said I have no idea, was just trying to answer your question. I do think you are underestimating how much money pulling 6 scvs for that long translates to.

I think so too, not to mention the 100 mins spent on the bunker and the three or four extra probes Kal got out of the second nex. I also don't think Kal waited for his range to kick in before dismantling the bunker so he got his second nex down again pretty quickly.

Also go Kal, destroy Type B!
Because when you left, Brood War was all spotlights and titans. Now, with the death of the big leagues, Brood War has moved to the basements and carparks. Now, Brood War is unlicensed brawls, lost teeth, and bloody fights for fistfulls of money - SirJolt
Shikyo
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Finland33997 Posts
February 10 2010 10:59 GMT
#159
On February 10 2010 19:54 Crunchums wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 10 2010 19:48 Shikyo wrote:
I definitely would trade being momentarily 3-4 workers behind in order to get a way earlier CC, free scouting information, complete map control, safety against cheesy drop play, your opponent having no way to scout you, and 6 mines in front of their natural. You wouldn't? Do you skip the comsat stations in TvZ if you expect mutas because 3 SCVs > scouting?

like I said I have no idea, was just trying to answer your question. I do think you are underestimating how much money pulling 6 scvs for that long translates to.

Don't think so, since you will be making SCVs the whole time and will get a CC up early, as well as the mine upgrade and a second vulture just in time. You're not trying to build up money in the bank. Definitely don't mind pulling 6 SCVs off minerals in order to force P to do exactly one kind of a build to have any chance, in addition to mining up the front of their natural in any other map, delaying their third base greatly, too. Oh not to mention the fact that you actually are still going to be mining gas, which is the resource that matters for tank count, not minerals.
League of Legends EU West, Platinum III | Yousei Teikoku is the best thing that has ever happened to music.
lazz
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
Australia3119 Posts
February 10 2010 10:59 GMT
#160
On February 10 2010 19:52 Shikyo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 10 2010 19:49 lazz wrote:
On February 10 2010 19:45 Shikyo wrote:
On February 10 2010 19:41 SuperArc wrote:
On February 10 2010 19:40 Aiden wrote:
Game 2 (P)Kal v (T)MVP:

+ Show Spoiler +

Why doesn't (T)IdrA stop whining about 14 Nexus. With he's acclaimed skill, and the practice schedule of a progamer he should be able to rally 3 marines, 4 SCVs and the First Vulture to take it out. It doesn't require (T)Flash Micro.


because Kal was ahead even after the nexus died.

Really would like to know why. MVP lost no SCVs and had his 2nd CC up before Kal's, in addition to having mines accross the map meaning that he could safely build a bit less units to get his infrastructure up earlier, having the knowledge Kal would need to go for range in order to clear the bunker and hence had almost a legal maphack, in addition to this Kal's supply wasn't as much above MVP's as it would be in standard play, not to mention the fact that Kal wouldn't be able to put any pressure on MVP for the early game, and that his potential DTs or Robo units would be too late to do anything.

Anything specific?

the lead from 12 nex getting bunker rushed isnt anything huge. probably something like a couple extra probes. plus when obs come out you have huge map control, terran is pretty muchforced to go defensive with siege mode and turrets, which means toss is free to do what he likes without having to worry about any cheesey early game all-ins like 2 fac which they usually have to worry about when taking their expo.

In other words, after-I-do-2-gate-range-nex-robo-obs I have map control. Well nice, but normally P has map control from the start, here he gets it way later. And this means he's ahead? OK

let me put it this way, if i toss go 2 gate robotics observer like you said, and my opponent goes siege expand, the toss is behind. the price i pay for the map control(robotics) is bad economy( because my nex is delayed. after bunker rush i dont have to decide between economy (fast nex) or map control(fast robo), i get both!
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