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On March 04 2009 11:24 redtooth wrote:
The Forseeable Downfalls
- The Zerg player can not perfectly predict when the Terran will scan.
- If the Terran sees Zerglings near your Spire (or a lack of Zerglings directly outside his natural) he may know what's up (only if this becomes prominent... I may be getting ahead of myself here).
Hide the zerglings under an overlord and the terran might not notice it. However, if you attacking the spire during the scan, the terran may still hear the attacking sound effects and be suspicious of whats happening.
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i wonder if redtooth is secretly a terran player who wishes his iccup zerg opponents start killing the spire (or at least damage it) for him.
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Great, original, and hilarious idea. Can't wait to see some replays of people trying this.
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Netherlands6142 Posts
When I first read it I went "yeah and what if he scans seeing your lings attack the spire?" He might figure out what you're up to and you'll have a damaged spire and in some builds this might well trigger a sunken bust into spire snipe. But you say 6 lings get it down to 200 in 3 seconds so I imagine 12 lings will get it down in 1,5 (though Chill mentioned he only has 6 lings) which makes it so completely viable. I've read all the comments and love the enthusiasm. I can also imagine that IF this takes off and Terran players do get turrets up earlier because of this then, if you position your lings around the spire and he scans early a cancel and going fast lurker instead becomes even more viable. On the other hand, I JUST figured out how to time turrets depending on scanned-spire hp so I'm not happy with this at all t.t Anyway, this requires replays (preferably IdrA vs F91).
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Hong Kong20321 Posts
hahaha om gthis is best idea EVERRRRRR
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This is very clever and original and I appreciate the effort you put into the OP.
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maybe you could get a win due his falling off his chair after scaning your base only to see zerglings attacking their own spire.
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useless strategy 'cause good terrans always scan and start turret when spire is ended up...
I explain it better... if terran scouts 2 hatch well, his scan timing is at about 5 min so he will scan at about 5:30 min when spire is over... same thing if terran scouts 3 hatch... his scan build timing would be at about 6 min and his scan at (always about) 6:30 min... never seen a good terran scans and starts turret when spire is half or 3/4 done...
just look at some good TvZ replay for check the timing of T's first scan and when he starts turrets...
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Netherlands6142 Posts
On March 04 2009 19:20 NrG.Vincent wrote:
useless strategy 'cause good terrans always scan and start turret when spire is ended not when it is 1/2 or 3/4 done
But that's the thing isn't it. When they scan and see it's at, say, 390 of 700 hp they know that it will be finished in ~40 seconds (13 seconds per 100 hp Spire) and put turrets up then. Now, if the spire has been REDTOOTHED this will throw their timing off. + Show Spoiler +God why am I even replying... GO READ THE OP YOU SCRUB
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On March 04 2009 12:15 SpiritoftheTunA wrote:Show nested quote +On March 04 2009 11:43 Raithed wrote:
your post rocks but honestly, just, honestly. i dont think its worth it. HOWEVER, if you just play with the same person, do the same fucking build over and over AND THEN change it up, then yes, you can add in the surprise factor and buttfuck him, but of course, this depends on his scouting and whatnot. raithed said it was bad, it must be good i'll try this out sometime~
lololol
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On March 04 2009 19:23 Pholon wrote:Show nested quote +On March 04 2009 19:20 NrG.Vincent wrote:
useless strategy 'cause good terrans always scan and start turret when spire is ended not when it is 1/2 or 3/4 done But that's the thing isn't it. When they scan and see it's at, say, 390 of 700 hp they know that it will be finished in ~40 seconds (13 seconds per 100 hp Spire) and put turrets up then. Now, if the spire has been REDTOOTHED this will throw their timing off. + Show Spoiler +God why am I even replying... GO READ THE OP YOU SCRUB
rotfl wtf are you saying? terran starts build turrets 1:20 min before mutas come? did you know that mutas requires 40 seconds for spawn from eggs?
come on guys this strategy is nice but useless... terran scans when spire is OVER and the picture shows a spire and not a "blob"... just watch at some Flash's TvZ and his scan timing...
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This is a great Idea. Yet one more thing to mix in to try and fool the terran.
A tip for the terrans who would face anything like this is, you don't actually only look at the spire while scanning the zerg. Check for the larvas. If his spire is far from done and he has saved 3 larvas from each hatchery than something is up.
When i play nowadays i mostly look at the larvas to find out the timing of his mutalisks.
However I'm sure this will work alot until people know it exists.
Vincent. While often its true that terran scans when spire is finnished there are many games where the scan will be too early depending on lots of different things, such as denied scouting etc.
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Netherlands6142 Posts
On March 04 2009 19:47 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
However I'm sure this will work alot until people know it exists.
And after that it will leave people guessing (depending on larva-respawn timing I guess)
On March 04 2009 19:30 NrG.Vincent wrote:Show nested quote +On March 04 2009 19:23 Pholon wrote:On March 04 2009 19:20 NrG.Vincent wrote:
useless strategy 'cause good terrans always scan and start turret when spire is ended not when it is 1/2 or 3/4 done But that's the thing isn't it. When they scan and see it's at, say, 390 of 700 hp they know that it will be finished in ~40 seconds (13 seconds per 100 hp Spire) and put turrets up then. Now, if the spire has been REDTOOTHED this will throw their timing off. + Show Spoiler +God why am I even replying... GO READ THE OP YOU SCRUB rotfl wtf are you saying? terran starts build turrets 1:20 min before mutas come? did you know that mutas requires 40 seconds for spawn from eggs?
No that's not what I am saying and yes I do know that. Please think about it for a while before posting kthx.
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On March 04 2009 19:47 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
This is a great Idea. Yet one more thing to mix in to try and fool the terran.
A tip for the terrans who would face anything like this is, you don't actually only look at the spire while scanning the zerg. Check for the larvas. If his spire is far from done and he has saved 3 larvas from each hatchery than something is up.
When i play nowadays i mostly look at the larvas to find out the timing of his mutalisks.
However I'm sure this will work alot until people know it exists.
Vincent. While often its true that terran scans when spire is finnished there are many games where the scan will be too early depending on lots of different things, such as denied scouting etc.
yes its true but as you said a good terran doesnt check only the spire's hp but the saved larvas amount too 'cause of the fake spire->lurker start or something like this... well this is 'cause this strat is useless... a good timing terran finish his turret 5 seconds before mutas comes not when spire is 2/3 completed...
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On March 04 2009 19:58 Pholon wrote:Show nested quote +On March 04 2009 19:47 AnOth3rDAy wrote:
However I'm sure this will work alot until people know it exists. And after that it will leave people guessing (depending on larva-respawn timing I guess) Show nested quote +On March 04 2009 19:30 NrG.Vincent wrote:On March 04 2009 19:23 Pholon wrote:On March 04 2009 19:20 NrG.Vincent wrote:
useless strategy 'cause good terrans always scan and start turret when spire is ended not when it is 1/2 or 3/4 done But that's the thing isn't it. When they scan and see it's at, say, 390 of 700 hp they know that it will be finished in ~40 seconds (13 seconds per 100 hp Spire) and put turrets up then. Now, if the spire has been REDTOOTHED this will throw their timing off. + Show Spoiler +God why am I even replying... GO READ THE OP YOU SCRUB rotfl wtf are you saying? terran starts build turrets 1:20 min before mutas come? did you know that mutas requires 40 seconds for spawn from eggs? No that's not what I am saying and yes I do know that. Please think about it for a while before posting kthx.
sorry guy you dont understand nothing of TvZ timing... stop talking about something unknown to you then, tnx
you will see that every c/c+ or more ranked terran will agree with me
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Wow great idea i still dont get it why ppl think this is only usefull in zvt i think zvp timings would be much more usefull then zvt.
Toss scouts you with sair and see spire half done and doing some harras and out of nowhere 8 muta 1 scourge pop out while he still think he is safe with no cannons in base
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United States7166 Posts
On March 04 2009 11:45 AttackZerg wrote:
Wow.
I am not lying when I say that this is 100% going to be used by me sometimes for the rest of my broodwar career.
I had no idea!
wow!
SEEEEEEERIOUSLY how the hell has this remained unknown? SO GOOD OMG
i cannot wait till i see the first time its used in a pro game
hopefully saved for use by savior or jaedong in a final series!
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Belgium9947 Posts
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Insane that new strategies are still made up, but I think progamers have thought of this. The reason why it's not used is that good terran players have the right timing when they scan so that the scan hits almost exactly when the spire finishes. It will only work at low levels.
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What if you use this along with something like a 12gas timing for super fast mutas, but fake that the spire is out at a standard timing? ^_^
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EPT
