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On November 15 2007 16:47 lastshadow wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2007 05:03 himurakenshin wrote:
I read that most progamers memorize builds into almost 100 supply, so I think it is great that he wrote down the build like this. Of course you should have an understanding of what to do in case your build gets messed up, or you have to adjust your build based on your opponent's build. Thats funny, since a study shows (XellOs 2004), ProGamers don't memorize food or money, they play completly on instinct and feeling, as typing is to a typist. So either the person you read was an amateur trying to go pro, in which he would need to memorize things, or your just completly pulling this out of your ass. Seeing how you said Pro, I'm assuming your lying.
o_O
I seriously doubt that they learn up to 100 supply BO too. But wtf with lies he may have read it he didn't say it is official source or anything. -_-
I feel like it's like people thinking that chess players study each possibility 10/12/15 strokes in advance.
I am quite a noob but apart from 5 first minutes were you could be facing cheese and need to execute everything the fastest way possible, adapting to the other strat >> following anything strictly.
I liked the topic anyway, still interesting.
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On November 06 2007 05:10 YinYang69 wrote:
Progamers memorize builds up to 100? I find that hard to believe with all the variables that can pop up in a game.
up to 100 is too much. but the way bisu makes his final moves is incredible.
to say the least it requires A LOT of practice to know when and especifically how to do it(in the right moment).
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On November 15 2007 16:47 lastshadow wrote:Show nested quote +On November 06 2007 05:03 himurakenshin wrote:
I read that most progamers memorize builds into almost 100 supply, so I think it is great that he wrote down the build like this. Of course you should have an understanding of what to do in case your build gets messed up, or you have to adjust your build based on your opponent's build. Thats funny, since a study shows (XellOs 2004), ProGamers don't memorize food or money, they play completly on instinct and feeling, as typing is to a typist. So either the person you read was an amateur trying to go pro, in which he would need to memorize things, or your just completly pulling this out of your ass. Seeing how you said Pro, I'm assuming your lying.
Actually that "study" said that progamers use the part of the brain that handles instincts more than the "reasoning" part. You decided to draw the conclusion that they lie COMPLETELY on instict and feeling.
No, they don't. Proof? Nada, Hwasin, Midas, any many others: players who just choked at one point or another. Nada was completely unable to adapt to Savior's style for example. I remember the matches on Luna where Nada was running around like an idiot with his m&m force unable to kill any of the expansions that savior had (mains). He was just too used to his style and offensive lurkers that Savior just blew him away. Same goes for Midas, choke artist. Or Hwasin's extremely straight forward, very slightly flexible play style. Yes, it works, but it's way more practice than instinct. Players like Boxer, Ra, Reach, Bisu, Savior and many many others have a creative side to them that you HAVE to turn over to instincts. But saying that they rely completely on that is stupid. Then what the hell is all the training for?
You just like to boss people around don't you? The guy said he 'read somewhere', you're saying he pulled it out of his ass. I remember an article about oov where someone was saying that he has the 2 expo, fast limit strategy planned down to the smallest detail. (The one with no pushes, just minor vulture harass until he reaches limit (somewhere around 12-13 minutes into the game) and then pushes out tornado style).
Either way, I think you're acting like you're above everyone else here, that's why you get flamed a lot. Just try not to insult people with your posts please.
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I like it, good job. Supported with pictures, it looks almost like a scientific research
Even though some argue that the exact-case is vague, you may find reasoning behind.
For example when you play, this reminds you at some point in the game that bisu was making cannon... so you might do it as well saving yourself from early ling defeat for example.
Exact timing knowledge is very important in PvZ since if your probe dies, you are out of opponent info until sair, or even further.
Imo scouting probe alive keeping is still a gamble, you may never tell if you succeed, good ling control and it is over...
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so if the first base you scout isn't zergs should you still go ahead with nexus first or should you forge first for 9pool?
and if you do scout zerg first and he didn't FE should you go forge first?
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Forge first if you expect some lings, and prepare to use your probes in defense.
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On December 07 2007 16:48 caution.slip wrote:
so if the first base you scout isn't zergs should you still go ahead with nexus first or should you forge first for 9pool?
and if you do scout zerg first and he didn't FE should you go forge first?
If you don't scout the Zerg out on the first try you should opt for the Forge. At this point usually it's safer to make the Forge first and put up a Cannon before expanding because of the possibility of a 9 Pool.
If you scout first you see what's he's going for; if you see a Spawning Pool in its 400s or so then build a Forge. If he makes a Hatchery at his natural you build the Nexus right after your first Pylon.
edit: Building Nexus first if you don't scout him first is pretty gutsy but doable if the distance between bases is large.
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EPT
