EPTI remember seeing a FPvod of someone showing how to properly group units at your rally point but I can't find it anywhere and I can't remember the name.
Does anyone have any good tips or know which FPvod I am talking about?
[H] Hotkeying a bunch of units quickly.
| Forum Index > Brood War Strategy |
|
Noah
Norway164 Posts
I remember seeing a FPvod of someone showing how to properly group units at your rally point but I can't find it anywhere and I can't remember the name. Does anyone have any good tips or know which FPvod I am talking about? | ||
|
Necosarius
Sweden4042 Posts
| ||
|
Amber[LighT]
United States5078 Posts
This might help even if it's not what you're looking for: <actually after watching this video this may not be helpful at all..> Hotkeying is all about practice. There aren't any real tips other than making sure your hotkeys feel comfortable to you. For instance if you're Terran (I'm assuming this bc of your icon) you would probably want your factory always hotkeyed at 5... so 5t isn't too much of a strain. Not a Terran expert so I can't really give you advice without risking scrutiny 5 posts later  | ||
|
Noah
Norway164 Posts
Amber I'm not talking about hotkeying factories, as I said my macro is actually quite decent for my level. The problem comes when I have to hotkey the units at my rally point quickly when I have tons of units sitting there. My TvP games usually ends up in mid/late game as I've learned how to micro to survive most of what my P friend throws at me while taking my natural. I try to push out at 2/1 or if I see him doing a quick expansion. | ||
|
MorroW
Sweden3522 Posts
no but really i dont see what ur asking for, to fill up groups or to create new ones or what? whats ur real problem | ||
|
Nogardeci89
United States113 Posts
On January 12 2010 00:14 MorroW wrote: start play toss, then u can recall ur units from the actual rally point without even selecting ur units! no but really i dont see what ur asking for, to fill up groups or to create new ones or what? whats ur real problem Its always fun to hate protoss. But seriously, ur not going to want to hear this but it just takes practice to get faster. | ||
|
Scorch
Austria3371 Posts
Select an existing group by pressing the hotkey Add reinforcement units with shift + (ctrl+click or doubleclick or drawing a frame with the mouse) Ctrl+# to assign the new hotkey Send the units away/forward so they aren't selected twice Repeat for the next control group I'm a 60-70 apm D player though, so make of that what you will. | ||
|
Noah
Norway164 Posts
MorroW my main problem is dealing with a huge group of units sitting in my natural. I've focused on macro all the while practicing so far, so I'm sorta producing more units than I can handle in the mid-game so I get masses of units sitting at my rally point. I think my P friend knows about this so he usually attacks when he see me starting to move around single control groups so I can group up the rest. | ||
|
Necosarius
Sweden4042 Posts
On January 12 2010 00:11 Noah wrote: Necosarius I know how to hotkey units, I'm just not doing it fast enough and it feels like I'm not using the right technique because I haven't really improved in it. Amber I'm not talking about hotkeying factories, as I said my macro is actually quite decent for my level. The problem comes when I have to hotkey the units at my rally point quickly when I have tons of units sitting there. My TvP games usually ends up in mid/late game as I've learned how to micro to survive most of what my P friend throws at me while taking my natural. I try to push out at 2/1 or if I see him doing a quick expansion. If you know your hotkeys and how to hotkey new units, what are you asking for? How to hotkey faster? Well, just pracitce... Edit: Oh so that's your problem... well hotkey your units before you have a huge group in your nat? Seems like your problem is that you aren't fast enough. | ||
|
ProoM
Lithuania1741 Posts
Move my screen so I only can see like Quater of my army, and ctrl click and move them out of the stack . Well, that's atleast what I do :} | ||
|
r.Evo
Germany14080 Posts
On January 11 2010 23:57 Necosarius wrote: Select a bunch of units and click shift+# and they will be added to the group. For example, you've got 4 marines on hotkey 1, you select 8 (or more) marines and press shift+1 and 8 marines will be added to group 1. I never knew that this works this way around. Personally I'd do the above with pressing 1, shift, doubleclick rines at rally point, ctrl 1. | ||
|
Rainbow
United States249 Posts
You just need to select from the side instead of CTRL+click or double click. Also, using the SHIFT key works really good. Also try separating them in small groups, do something while they move and then come back to hotkey. | ||
|
Gustav_Wind
United States646 Posts
On January 12 2010 00:25 Noah wrote: The way I'm doing it now is that I have to make one control group, and then send them off screen so I can ctrl select a new one and hotkey them. If someone knows which video I'm talking about then that will be all the help I need really. . Yeah the sending them off the screen bit seems like it would slow down the process by a lot, as well as create vulnerability. Have you tried making boxes over smaller sections of like units, i.e. try to box 4-6 tanks at a time, and using shift to fill up the rest of the control group? So you would box a couple, then shift and box a couple at a time (or click on them individually if they are spread out) until the 12 is filled up. | ||
|
meteorskunk
Canada546 Posts
From my experience (d+ level mechanics buff) the shift key is a good buddy to you. Your first group you make of a certain type of unit from teh clump you will obv use ctrl click and then ctrl + # and then move them out of the way. From that point on just hold shift and box around stuff. And then if you assign it a number before its reached 12 units u can use the above technique shift + #. I think the key is keeping organized and grabbing stuff before on the way to the rally. | ||
|
2on2
United States142 Posts
vultures 1 (move them away) tanks 3 vultures 2 which this method, when u hotkey your 1st set of units and move them away, you select another type of unit so that the already assigned units dont get selected. Then assign the rest of your vults and move them away. I found this method really useful when using bio aswell | ||
|
jimminy_kriket
Canada5500 Posts
| ||
|
cafaro
Netherlands32 Posts
especially tvz when you have a bunch of m&m and you want to move out you can't just ctrl-click ctrl+1 and ctrl-click ctrl+2 for marines, because you will end up having marines in multiple groups and some marines not grouped at all... so you have to carefully shift-box/select all units to make groups and that takes a while, especially with a big army i think it requires a lot of practice in order to get really fast at it, or is there a more efficient way? | ||
|
Noah
Norway164 Posts
On January 12 2010 01:33 cafaro wrote: I think i have the same problem and it's really annoying especially tvz when you have a bunch of m&m and you want to move out you can't just ctrl-click ctrl+1 and ctrl-click ctrl+2 for marines, because you will end up having marines in multiple groups and some marines not grouped at all... so you have to carefully shift-box/select all units to make groups and that takes a while, especially with a big army i think it requires a lot of practice in order to get really fast at it, or is there a more efficient way? Yes exactly. I think it's harder with a mech army than a bionic army though, the smaller units makes them easier to divide into small neat groups. When I do this with large units like tanks I have to send them further away which can make them vulnerable to attack. I'm going to edit a map to have a tons of hostile sunkens in an area, and then put on the build speed cheat and money cheat and just macro up 5-6 groups, hotkey them and then just suicide them over and over. It's just so frustrating to advance in every other aspect of Starcraft skillwise but I just can't seem to improve at this at the same rate. Losing because of the same thing over and over becomes demoralizing. | ||
|
PH
United States6173 Posts
There is no easy solution...you just have to work on being more efficient as you play more and more games. | ||
|
yoden
United States64 Posts
They're all spread out, so you can easily add to correct groups. You will immediately reinforce your army this way; make your macro look like BeSt  | ||
|
Grobyc
Canada18410 Posts
| ||
|
love1another
United States1844 Posts
Most people decry this as a bug, but let's say you've got marines 1 to 3 and medics 4. Shift add to 1 until it's full then 2 and 3. Very minimal on the keystroke side. | ||
|
MorroW
Sweden3522 Posts
and when i move on to goli i can simply hotkey them with ctrl also cause i have under 12 of them and vultures i usually have spread out on many locations where ive put antirecall in not sure how i do with bio tho. i usually hotkey medics tanks and vessel first then move that stuff away some so i just have marines. then i manual select 12 rines on the right side and hotkey them plus move. then i have a halfmoon of rines left where i hotkey rine from left side. then i have a few leftover rines that i can simply manual select. however hotkeying this stuff is all situational and sometimes the units doesnt move like u want then u gotta shift add 1 by 1 unit and etc. just play alot and be fast with ur mouse then ull do this without thinking of how u do it | ||
|
skypig
United States237 Posts
Personally, I recommend positioning your rally points so that they're spread out from one another so you end up getting little "clumps" of units that can be easily box-selected by the mouse and then grouped. Also, NEVER do all your hotkeys "at once" before an attack; hotkeying should be a continual process, starting with the very first group of units that you build; i.e. your first group of tanks/vultures should be hotkeyed as soon as they're out. Then you just keep adding groups as they're produced, and once you're ready to attack (or are attacked), you already have your groups set and ready to go. This is also advantageous because, if you're attacked unexpectedly, you've already been assigning groups and can thus control whatever you do have when you're attacked with those hotkeys. Again, just to re-emphasize, hotkeying is something that takes practice. Develop a consistent method that makes sense and stick to it. I really recommend making it a continual process as I described above, rather than a "hotkey-all-at-once-before-I-attack" process; it's much safer to build up your unit hotkey groups continually. Plus it'll keep your mind at least partially focused on the task of assigning hotkeys since you'll be doing it continually rather than just once before a big attack, which will make it easier for you to keep track of your hotkeyed groups in general. | ||
|
hyst.eric.al
United States2332 Posts
ex: if you have 6raxes pumping mnm, set 3 separate rally points between the 3. your mnm will accumulate in different spots and selecting a group of 12 will be alot easier. same goes for TvP and TvT; the units will accumulate in smaller balls (tanks, goliaths, vults, etc) and you can select a group of twelve without having them overlap. | ||
|
coltrane
Chile988 Posts
When i am meching terran: I use 1 and 2 for vultures, 3 for tanks and from then just mixed units. What i do is that i have my leftover vults after a fight in ctrl1, they dont have mines. In 2 i use new vults, full of mines, 3 for siege 12 tanks, then 4a5a6a and start manually controlling them, adding them to groups with shift select, etc, then back to macro, back to rally and back to the push. | ||
|
love1another
United States1844 Posts
On January 12 2010 04:05 MorroW wrote: when im about to hotkey my mech army before i move out i just ctrl click tank siege mode then i can ctrl click rest of the tanks and when i move on to goli i can simply hotkey them with ctrl also cause i have under 12 of them and vultures i usually have spread out on many locations where ive put antirecall in not sure how i do with bio tho. i usually hotkey medics tanks and vessel first then move that stuff away some so i just have marines. then i manual select 12 rines on the right side and hotkey them plus move. then i have a halfmoon of rines left where i hotkey rine from left side. then i have a few leftover rines that i can simply manual select. however hotkeying this stuff is all situational and sometimes the units doesnt move like u want then u gotta shift add 1 by 1 unit and etc. just play alot and be fast with ur mouse then ull do this without thinking of how u do it Alternatively, you could think of how you do it and thus improve faster when you play! <3 On January 12 2010 04:08 skypig wrote: As everyone else has been saying, there's no "magic trick" to hotkeying units perfectly and easily the whole time. StarCraft is a game where you're constantly switching between different tasks, and you'll have to learn to find time to assign unit groups while managing everything else. Personally, I recommend positioning your rally points so that they're spread out from one another so you end up getting little "clumps" of units that can be easily box-selected by the mouse and then grouped. Also, NEVER do all your hotkeys "at once" before an attack; hotkeying should be a continual process, starting with the very first group of units that you build; i.e. your first group of tanks/vultures should be hotkeyed as soon as they're out. Then you just keep adding groups as they're produced, and once you're ready to attack (or are attacked), you already have your groups set and ready to go. This is also advantageous because, if you're attacked unexpectedly, you've already been assigning groups and can thus control whatever you do have when you're attacked with those hotkeys. Again, just to re-emphasize, hotkeying is something that takes practice. Develop a consistent method that makes sense and stick to it. I really recommend making it a continual process as I described above, rather than a "hotkey-all-at-once-before-I-attack" process; it's much safer to build up your unit hotkey groups continually. Plus it'll keep your mind at least partially focused on the task of assigning hotkeys since you'll be doing it continually rather than just once before a big attack, which will make it easier for you to keep track of your hotkeyed groups in general. Obviously, I resent that. I offered a magic trick and it should be used! >  | ||
|
BraveNewWorld
United States229 Posts
in mid-late game u use the F-# keys to quickly rotate through each base, it's much more effective this way i generally reserve #4-9 as hotkeys for my raxes/facts 1-3 either for comsats or important units in mid-late game hotkeying units bcomes much more tedious due to your eventual macroed army, so you will have to use the spacebar much more often it takes a while to get used to using hotkeys but once u use them u cant play w/o | ||
|
Mastermind
Canada7096 Posts
On January 12 2010 00:49 r.Evo wrote: I never knew that this works this way around. Personally I'd do the above with pressing 1, shift, doubleclick rines at rally point, ctrl 1. Your way is less efficient because it requires more button pressing. | ||
|
Sharp-eYe
Canada642 Posts
Now you might want to dedicate, lets say, 1, for ONLY vultures, because they are pretty are to ctrl click during battle. This way you can pull back your vultures slightly with 1, macro with 567 (just assuming here) and if you feel the need to recall anything else, then assign them a group. This analysis comes from analysing numerous FPVODS and charts of pros. I was reading the list for "4" in bwchart for some Bisu rep against hyuk (found on TL), and he put only 1 high templar in 4. Why would you want to put ONLY 1 unit when you can put 12? what if he doesnt feel the need to? Maybe your slow at hotkeying because your conscious doesnt feel the need to hotkey them. Jaedong uses 1-7 only, and most of those are hatches, and that guy has some amazing micro (no kidding, hes a golden mouse winner!). Savior only used 1-4, NaDa doesnt use all of them either. I hope I gave you another perspective on this. EDIT: lol I forgot to mention this is from personal experience as well | ||
|
Malongo
Chile3472 Posts
| ||
|
kineSiS-
Korea (South)1068 Posts
On January 12 2010 03:40 yoden wrote: Hotkey your units as they come out of production buildings. They're all spread out, so you can easily add to correct groups. You will immediately reinforce your army this way; make your macro look like BeSt Nono Yoden, you got this all wrong. Make your macro look like the baby of Best and Iloveoov. | ||
|
Metaspace
Austria670 Posts
On January 12 2010 04:05 love1another wrote: Use the "shift" key if you don't care if a marine leaks over to the medics or if a zealot leaks over to the dragoons. (when you add zealots to a full control group they leak over to the next control group. i.e. full 1 adds to 2) Most people decry this as a bug, but let's say you've got marines 1 to 3 and medics 4. Shift add to 1 until it's full then 2 and 3. Very minimal on the keystroke side. Wow I have been playing for 10 years and never knew that. | ||
|
Noah
Norway164 Posts
I edited a random map to have lots of sunkens instead of an enemy and played it as UMS. With all the cheats on I made 8 factories and made like 3 groups of both tanks and vultures. I then practiced switching the hotkeys around, like adding all the vults to 1, 2 and 3, and then adding all the tanks to 4, 5 and 6. I then hotkeyed the vults to 7, 8, and 9, moved tanks to 1, 2, 3 and then I put the vults on 4, 5 and 6. I did this over and over untill it started to go automatic (I think it took 5 minutes of non stop practicing). This will make it easy to organize my control groups from now on as I macro out more and more control groups of different units, and also see which groups isn't full yet. If a group fills up I can quickly put it in the next control group using this technique. I then practiced putting the F2 view on my macro area and F3 and rally point, while I selected each factory, pressed f3 and right clicked, and then pressed F2 again to repeat the cycle through all 8 factories (you've heard this before). This also started to feel smooth after a few minutes of nonstop practicing. So now I'll also have good control over where I rally my units, where to find reinforcements. Combined these two lets me hotkey and macro immensely much better. I decided to post this because I know there are tons of newbies out there like me who is having problem, and I feel this helped for me ALOT. This gave huge results in a short period as it helped me understand HOW this is done. Going to keep doing each "practice" once per day untill it is automatic between playing games on ICCup. I also want to thank everyone on ICCup for their great help! | ||
|
synapse
China13814 Posts
1 shift+lasso ctrl+1 | ||
|
Eiii
United States2566 Posts
On January 12 2010 04:05 love1another wrote: Use the "shift" key if you don't care if a marine leaks over to the medics or if a zealot leaks over to the dragoons. (when you add zealots to a full control group they leak over to the next control group. i.e. full 1 adds to 2) Most people decry this as a bug, but let's say you've got marines 1 to 3 and medics 4. Shift add to 1 until it's full then 2 and 3. Very minimal on the keystroke side. Just tested this, and unless I'm seriously misunderstanding what the poster means it's entirely false. >.> | ||
|
benutbutter
United States66 Posts
| ||
|
LF9
United States537 Posts
| ||
|
Noah
Norway164 Posts
On January 17 2010 15:22 benutbutter wrote: Personally after each round of production, I use shift-select on the units headed to the really or the units at the really to add the new units to a control group. If I fill up a control group I start a new one, etc, etc. Yeah same here, I am actually managing to have ALL my units in control groups now. I did this another round today, and it pretty easy to set 12 rally point with this technique. I even spread the rally points out so my units had space to maneuver out of my rally point quickly. I can put siege tanks to the left of the screen, vults in center and goliaths far right. Before I did this yesterday I used to click each factory, click R and the semi blindly clicking the minimap offering me no control at all. Also with the groups organized and being able to move control groups around quickly it's actually quite easy to reinforce your army and bolster your control groups. When my hangover fades of I'm going to ICCup to I drop! Hopefully I can focus more on micro and learn how to do that properly from on! | ||
|
celeste
England45 Posts
On January 11 2010 23:57 Necosarius wrote: Select a bunch of units and click shift+# and they will be added to the group. For example, you've got 4 marines on hotkey 1, you select 8 (or more) marines and press shift+1 and 8 marines will be added to group 1. wow can't believe I didn't know this | ||
|
Silentness
United States2821 Posts
it's just one step less than shift click -> ctrl + # | ||
| ||
