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I always liked the shroud.
It provides a really nice contrast - especially for drops - because it makes it more noticeable when it comes into view. Like, 'HEY, THERE'S A SHUTTLE COMING TO OUR BASE!' And I always liked that because it came OUT OF THE FUCKING BLACKNESS.
I think the doom of new maps isn't necessarily the shroud, it's that players never need to play on them. WCG time - ppl prepping = 0 time for new maps. Plus they want to improve on the ones competed on year round so they just never wanted to play new maps. I don't really think the shroud effects that much seeing as there is a map preview beforehand, and while basic, should tell you more than enough on how to start your first game. (although that was probably never fixed right? So you still have to rejoin after downloading etc?)
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I guess there could be a feature to turn it off, its probably better to have it off when you finally learn the map since you would be able to see shuttles coming into your base like you said, but it would also allow people new to the map to learn it easier
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On January 03 2009 13:51 Loanshark wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2009 13:14 raiame wrote:On January 03 2009 13:13 Loanshark wrote:
Wouldn't this cause some balance issues because of worker drilling into someone's main, using the minerals? No, otherwise you could just drill them after you already scouted someone even if you didn't have vision of their base. It'd be a lot harder to keep scouts out. Yeah, but that's assuming you can get in the base to see the mins first. If the shroud is lifted, then worker drilling will probably have to be fixed, otherwise there's no way to keep scouts out of your base until you have enough units to kill the scout before it gets in. The success rate of any build that relies on the enemy not scouting it beforehand will be reduced drastically because any early scout will just get in.
If you don't have direct vision of his mins, you can't drill in. If you've only scouted his minerals but don't have current vision of them, you can't drill in.
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It's all about preference, it's not necessarily bad. The option to put it on or take it off should be provided. It's useful to remember where you scanned and stuff, and, I know players who press tab to have all terrain view removed, so they only see unit dots. Even some pros do, like Sync.
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i cant imagine playing sc with the map explored. I have to agree with Testie's drop comment though it is easier for me to spot the red dot carrying doom into my base.
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They don't have it in SC2. If you watched the battle reports, the guy was explaining the thing about destructables in game and he was pointing to the place without it even being explored yet.
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On January 03 2009 14:54 RamenStyle wrote:
It's all about preference, it's not necessarily bad. The option to put it on or take it off should be provided. It's useful to remember where you scanned and stuff, and, I know players who press tab to have all terrain view removed, so they only see unit dots. Even some pros do, like Sync.
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They could just get rid of it with triggers I bet. I think it should be gone also. If you want to watch for drops, what's wrong with tabbing the terrain off?
On the other hand, I don't think it matters all that much, and I play different maps even with the shroud. It's fun to learn a new map, and there's a sense of completeness as I learn more maps.
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Fog of war is still on (lol fail if it wasn't).
Shroud is already off in all the builds I've seen, and WC3 had it off. I see no reason why it will/should be on.
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Note this is in the BW section, not SC2. The op's contention is that shroud should be off, that is all. No one is saying that fog should be off, or that shroud will be on in SC2, we know it won't be.
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It tells me where I have been and where I haven't
I like it
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I think that muslim women should be allowed to wear whatever they want to.
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On January 03 2009 16:32 .risingdragoon wrote:
It tells me where I have been and where I haven't
I like it
At least in WarCraft III, there are four possible levels of vision. Visible, "shroud" "fog where you haven't explored" and "fog where you have explored." It's easy to tell the difference between the latter two, one being dark fog the other being light fog. They both are the same as far as being able to see resources, buildings etc. however they were when you last saw them (in the case of dark fog you can't see any of your enemies starting buildings obviously), but one is dark and one is light, and mean you have never explored the area and have explored the area respectively.
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On January 03 2009 16:42 Ancestral wrote:Show nested quote +On January 03 2009 16:32 .risingdragoon wrote:
It tells me where I have been and where I haven't
I like it At least in WarCraft III, there are four possible levels of vision. Visible, "shroud" "fog where you haven't explored" and "fog where you have explored." It's easy to tell the difference between the latter two, one being dark fog the other being light fog. They both are the same as far as being able to see resources, buildings etc. however they were when you last saw them (in the case of dark fog you can't see any of your enemies starting buildings obviously), but one is dark and one is light, and mean you have never explored the area and have explored the area respectively.
For anyone who might still be confused, I've created some visual aides using the SC2 Battle Report!
The current (or at least recent) incarnation of the SC2 minimap and the types of fog on it.
Unexplored vs Explored vs Visible
So you can clearly still see where you've been/scanned before, but like explored terrain in SC, it may be harder to notice incoming dots on the map (though you'll probably still be able to to turn off terrain if its that important).
As for my opinion on its use in SC, I'd be in favor of removing shroud, replacing it with a dark fog like SC2 / WC3 builds. I think the benefits of being able to see the map far outweigh the benefits of a black map, particularly if terrain can be turned off.
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Yea sorry I didn't realise sc2 already had the option. Maybe in next bw patch they might include a feature to set shroud off.
Im pretty sure if they do, most games would be played with it off.
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I like how people are saying drone drill will be overpowered in SC2. IT WONT EXIST IN SC2 ITS A BUG
Or were they just talking about if the shroud of blackness was out of SC1?
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On January 03 2009 17:30 Ideas wrote:
I like how people are saying drone drill will be overpowered in SC2. IT WONT EXIST IN SC2 ITS A BUG
Or were they just talking about if the shroud of blackness was out of SC1?
No it will not be deleted, what they're talking about is clicking a mineral patch with a worker and as a result it will go through anything, now if you don't have vision of the patch you can't obviously click it but if you do have then there you go..
If Blizzard were to delete the ability for workers to go through others mineral lines would be such a hassle with everyone trying to dodge others.
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thanks for the pics geno
i think blizzard is on the right track there with their current system
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On January 03 2009 13:16 rushz0rz wrote:
I think the shroud of darkness taken out would encourage players to try new maps and I wouldn't see every game on iccup being played on Python.
Man, Python is played a lot because everyone loves it.
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You can remove most of the shroud of darkness now by using triggers, but it's mainly up to the map makers choice and the people that play on it
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