EPT![[image loading]](https://i.ibb.co/5xKPM7NT/score.png)
first try did it windowed tho
StarCraft player reflex TE scores - Page 2
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XenOsky
Chile2356 Posts
first try did it windowed tho | ||
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iopq
United States1068 Posts
On February 04 2026 02:03 evilfatsh1t wrote: the amount of times pros complain that they fumbled keyboard inputs, made misclicks or failed to react quick enough to something is off the charts. its not even a debate that their apm is less efficient and that their mechanics are worse. youre confusing better decision making with improved physical ability, which is just false. the reality is if the pros could go back to their late teens we would have been blessed with another level of starcraft that we will never ever see now so the claim is that pros used to be to be better at clicking are people better at me at starcraft because they are faster? Nobody so far posted better scores than me | ||
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WGT-Baal
France3466 Posts
On February 06 2026 23:30 iopq wrote: https://tl.net/forum/brood-war/643348-can-someone-share-very-abbreviated-bw-cliffnotes?page=2 so the claim is that pros used to be to be better at clicking are people better at me at starcraft because they are faster? Nobody so far posted better scores than me Faster and more accurate are different for keyboard input. And reaction time includes situation analysis too. I don't think pros ever claimed being purely faster was that important. But also I heard FBH I think mention that in team houses they d do the same build a million times in a row and so they wouldn't fumble as much just due to the nature of the practice regimen. Of course there is also age. But if you play a build intensively you also less likely to have to think too much about it live after a while and you d misclick less. Supposedly | ||
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8842 Posts
On February 06 2026 23:30 iopq wrote: https://tl.net/forum/brood-war/643348-can-someone-share-very-abbreviated-bw-cliffnotes?page=2 so the claim is that pros used to be to be better at clicking are people better at me at starcraft because they are faster? Nobody so far posted better scores than me what exactly are you suggesting? and what exactly do you think i was saying in that post? because i definitely wasnt saying that the pros are better than you because they could click faster than you and how is your score in the test you chose in any way relevant or transferrable to mechanical skill in a game like starcraft? | ||
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iopq
United States1068 Posts
On February 07 2026 03:13 evilfatsh1t wrote: and how is your score in the test you chose in any way relevant or transferrable to mechanical skill in a game like starcraft? if you can click on a circle you can click on a unit in starcraft is that not a mechanical skill? my new high score: ![[image loading]](https://i.ibb.co/xttc6PPT/Screenshot-20260207-172817-1.png) If I can get better at clicking, is it not true pros can get better at clicking at their age too? Either: 1. Misclicks in StarCraft are not the key issue in mechanics OR 2. The pros would smash my score anyway and as teens could get MUCH higher so they perform worse now | ||
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8842 Posts
the circles in the test are completely random and you click on it once with no purpose behind it. the size of the circles at their largest point are so large that they dont require any meaningful amount of precision to be clicked. its not comparable to selecting units or buildings in starcraft and issuing a variety of commands with extreme precision in real time. i would say its extremely doubtful that this test score would have any meaningful correlation to mechanical ability in starcraft. however, if there was any correlation, then yes your 2nd point would probably be correct. also i never said misclicks in starcraft are a key issue in mechanics, whatever that means. i said pros misclick more now than they did when they were young. the more misclicks you make, the more clicks required to rectify the command. apm count may not have reduced much but we used to have "eapm" stats before. assuming those stats were correct, it would be fair to say that the eapm of pros have dropped since their kespa days. | ||
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iopq
United States1068 Posts
So mass clicking 9 barracks and making one marine would require very similar mechanics as clicking on 9 circles, except you also have to hit the keyboard at the same time I'm specifically posting my scores now because when I was a teen I averaged much lower than I do now. I am more accurate with my clicks than at any point before. So either mouse accuracy doesn't drop off as much as you think or when I was young I had potential to have even better accuracy and speed than I do now. I think if we had more data points from actually good players seriously attempting this we could draw better conclusions. | ||
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8842 Posts
On February 03 2026 01:37 evilfatsh1t wrote: ... the only gamers that could claim their mechanics got better with age are people who were low skill to begin with and their skill increased at a faster rate than their mechanics could deteriorate. your personal experience can probably be explained by this. i specifically said any gamer that has played at a high level for a long period of time will have seen their mechanics deteriorate over said time. so someone who hit their peak in their early years. either way i dont agree that your test is in any way transferrable to starcraft, or any other competitive non fps pc game for that matter. if you honestly think that high level micro/macro in games like starcraft/dota/lol etc could be somewhat measured by that test performance then you dont know what youre talking about anyway. your best case scenario is saying the test performance is relevant to fps gamers, and even then id bet money on 18 yr old shroud doing better on that test than todays shroud | ||
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iopq
United States1068 Posts
How is mouse accuracy not in ANY way transferable to StarCraft? | ||
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RJBTVYOUTUBE
Netherlands1200 Posts
On February 08 2026 19:53 iopq wrote: When you split workers you need to accurately click four different minerals and select three different workers in under a second How is mouse accuracy not in ANY way transferable to StarCraft? You definitely need mouse accuracy and speed. But mouse accuracy and speed are not the determining factors in most situations in starcraft. But it is a base required "component" to being good. | ||
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iopq
United States1068 Posts
On February 08 2026 22:12 RJBTVYOUTUBE wrote: You definitely need mouse accuracy and speed. But mouse accuracy and speed are not the determining factors in most situations in starcraft. But it is a base required "component" to being good. My question is: how much? Are top foreigners faster at clicking than I am so that they are better, or did I basically "max out" this stat and other things are holding me back? | ||
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RJBTVYOUTUBE
Netherlands1200 Posts
On February 11 2026 20:11 iopq wrote: My question is: how much? Are top foreigners faster at clicking than I am so that they are better, or did I basically "max out" this stat and other things are holding me back? Some examples: Bonyth is on the low end of the aceptable apm range for high level starcraft. I often see him go all the way down to 200-230. Fengzgi also plays at this apm range. There are some korean pros with apm in this range. TheRock, Iris, and Movie for example. Now out of these three only Movie is still good enough to compete with low/mid tier pros. Dewalt and Xiaoshuai are also on the low to mid range for apm, 230-290 average. Koreans who fall in this Category: Ggaemo, Byul, Stork, Mind, Multi, Tyson, Dasu, SnOw(sometimes 300+), YSC, Shuttle, Best. Some of these names have reached or won ASL finals, so 230-290 is good enough to be a top top pro. I think it is really about the ability to task switch with the least amount of time inbetween, and to know ahead of time all the actions you are going to make for the next few seconds without having to first think about which actions you are going to have to make. If you first have to think half a second or a full second or more about which action you are going to make next, at any point in the game, you are losing out on time you could have been doing something effective. Also seeing what your opponent is doing and immediately knowing what you have to do in response is much more important. For example if you watch povs of the top pros who play at like 260-330 apm, you will often see them looking at the enemy units, buildings, etc for information. They will in early and mid often click on enemy units to see their health to guide their target selection. etc. But about clicking fast, yes you need some speed. | ||
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iopq
United States1068 Posts
APM freaks like Hyuk can pound the keyboard every so often to always make units, but that tells us nothing of his mouse speed or accuracy | ||
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RJBTVYOUTUBE
Netherlands1200 Posts
On February 11 2026 21:36 iopq wrote: APM doesn't correlate much with clicking ability. Bonyth is known for his crazy control, which usually decreases your APM while you babysit a few units. APM freaks like Hyuk can pound the keyboard every so often to always make units, but that tells us nothing of his mouse speed or accuracy Hyuk's mouse speed and accuracy are both insane. He is really just a bad decision maker. Speed also has crazy mouse speed and accuracy, amazing micro, and keeps his apm at 400+. Mini is another example of a very micro centric playstyle, and he's 380+ apm almost always. good micro =/= lower apm, and high apm =/= good micro. Micro skills is somewhat unrelated to APM all together. It is largely about timing and accuracy. You can be both slow and accurate or fast and accurate, as long as your timing is correct. | ||
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iopq
United States1068 Posts
Soulkey sometimes doesn't have 300 APM during his game, but he dodges storms and picks off templars. I mean 300 is not slow, but other Zergs are sometimes at 400+ | ||
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iFU.pauline
France1693 Posts
I would emphasizes that speed helps you mostly in multitasking, SK is a good example because he is pretty slow compared to others like JD and effort, and there are multitasking feats he simply can't do such as microing zerglings with 2 ctrl groups inside protoss's main while defending an attack. Or large scale engagement while managing 4 bases. Therefore, he prioritizes his actions, and often will straight up avoid this kind of situation by taking a more defensive posture, especially as the game drags on. It's important to adjust your play with what you can do, SK is the perfect example for that. | ||
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RJBTVYOUTUBE
Netherlands1200 Posts
On February 14 2026 20:22 iFU.pauline wrote: Yeah but Hyuk has bad hotkeys, he uses '3' for main hatchery, hence he uses 3 ctrl groups only when he is forced to and rebind hatchery right after that. And that my friend, is very shitty for I played this way more than 20 years and saw an instant increase in skill once I decided to change that die hard habit. sAviOr was also playing like this. I would emphasizes that speed helps you mostly in multitasking, SK is a good example because he is pretty slow compared to others like JD and effort, and there are multitasking feats he simply can't do such as microing zerglings with 2 ctrl groups inside protoss's main while defending an attack. Or large scale engagement while managing 4 bases. Therefore, he prioritizes his actions, and often will straight up avoid this kind of situation by taking a more defensive posture, especially as the game drags on. It's important to adjust your play with what you can do, SK is the perfect example for that. Hyuk's hotkey use in ZvT: + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/rRuRyQM.png) Note 1: 3+ is indeed his hatcheries and does not change.. 1 and 2 is units. Note 2: He probably does not use shift+ assigning much, but instead ctrl+ assigns. Soulkey's hotkey use in ZvP: + Show Spoiler + ![[image loading]](https://i.imgur.com/4RkiIMv.png) For soulkey we see 4 is hatchery. 1, 2, and 3 are units. note1 : Soulkey uses a lot of shift+ assigning. | ||
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