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Ferneu
Profile Joined June 2018
11 Posts
May 23 2024 20:14 GMT
#1
Can anyone of you awesome people please explain to me why Terran pulled back his SCVs? That pylon was almost gone. Clearly I'm no expert, so please tell me what I am missing here.

Mutaller
Profile Blog Joined July 2013
United States1051 Posts
Last Edited: 2024-05-23 20:40:23
May 23 2024 20:37 GMT
#2
@11:21 certainly looks like a win condition before he pulls back. I can only assume that he is thinking his opponent has been making workers and teching rather than following up with cannons. I do think he sends SCVs back to get his eco moving again, and he's afraid his damaged 5 marines will be lost to zealots alone
"To practice isn't for you to get better now in the present. Practice will never betray you and will always come back for you in the future." -Jaedong
FlaShFTW
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
United States10315 Posts
May 24 2024 01:48 GMT
#3
Yeah not sure why he would've pulled back. I think killing the pylon powering the 2 gates even if 2 zealots were to have popped once he killed the initial wave would've allowed him easily enough time to stabilize (plus protoss might have an eco advantage IF they had been making more probes, but they would've also had to remake their entire infrastructure plus the factory was started without any gas from protoss too.
Writer#1 KT and FlaSh Fanboy || Woo Jung Ho Never Forget || Teamliquid Political Decision Desk
TL+ Member
castleeMg
Profile Blog Joined January 2013
Canada785 Posts
May 24 2024 02:18 GMT
#4
On May 24 2024 05:37 Mutaller wrote:
@11:21 certainly looks like a win condition before he pulls back. I can only assume that he is thinking his opponent has been making workers and teching rather than following up with cannons. I do think he sends SCVs back to get his eco moving again, and he's afraid his damaged 5 marines will be lost to zealots alone


Basically this, he read his opponent horribly wrong. For some reason he was convinced it was either tech or an expand, he had no scout to confirm his opponents main. It’s pretty hard to believe as a pro gamer he let his opponent kill him with the same rush that he completely shutdown.
AKA: castle[eMg]@USEast/ iCCup
bovienchien
Profile Joined March 2014
Vietnam1152 Posts
Last Edited: 2024-05-24 07:16:02
May 24 2024 07:11 GMT
#5
If you are gosu, you will know why he did it.

I am the one of the best players in Vietnam, I can explain and tell something for you.

Terran only destroys Gates, Pylons in inside or near his main when Gates have not completed yet. So when he saw 2 the Gates were completed, he pulled scv came back the Mineral line was right 100%.

Of course you can ask me, the game would be good for Terran if the Pylon was killed. No, Protoss just needed to build 2 Pylons to buy Zealots non stop. And then Terran would die sooner than the game you watched.

Something I tell you

1. If Protoss are discovered the strategy of Proxy like that. The game looks like balance at that time even Protoss can't kill any units of Terran, Protoss just starts game normal with advantage from economic. Terran still will die but slower.

2. Proxy Pylon should be ban in the professional leagues. Proxy Pylon always bring advantage for Protoss too much. This's why no one Terran wants to play TvP in 2 players maps.

3. The Namja Iyagi map is one of the best map in history of StarCraft. if it's no Namja Iyagi we also have no Chupung-Ryeong, Harmony, Return of the King... maps.

4. I wish we will have some nice maps like Namja Iyagi in 2024.
https://www.facebook.com/StarcraftRemasteredVN/
Jealous
Profile Blog Joined December 2011
10282 Posts
May 24 2024 07:28 GMT
#6
On May 24 2024 16:11 bovienchien wrote:
If you are gosu, you will know why he did it.

I am the one of the best players in Vietnam, I can explain and tell something for you.

Terran only destroys Gates, Pylons in inside or near his main when Gates have not completed yet. So when he saw 2 the Gates were completed, he pulled scv came back the Mineral line was right 100%.

Of course you can ask me, the game would be good for Terran if the Pylon was killed. No, Protoss just needed to build 2 Pylons to buy Zealots non stop. And then Terran would die sooner than the game you watched.

Something I tell you

1. If Protoss are discovered the strategy of Proxy like that. The game looks like balance at that time even Protoss can't kill any units of Terran, Protoss just starts game normal with advantage from economic. Terran still will die but slower.

2. Proxy Pylon should be ban in the professional leagues. Proxy Pylon always bring advantage for Protoss too much. This's why no one Terran wants to play TvP in 2 players maps.

3. The Namja Iyagi map is one of the best map in history of StarCraft. if it's no Namja Iyagi we also have no Chupung-Ryeong, Harmony, Return of the King... maps.

4. I wish we will have some nice maps like Namja Iyagi in 2024.

Gotta love the self-awareness here <3
"The right to vote is only the oar of the slaveship, I wanna be free." -- бум бум сучка!
iPlaY.NettleS
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Australia4384 Posts
May 24 2024 08:13 GMT
#7
'why did this guy make a mistake 20 years ago' ?
wasn't the issue pulling the marines instead of pulling the scvs, why he didn't kill the pylon with the marines is a mystery.Tank would have safely exited if the pylon was destroyed.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7PvoI6gvQs
XenOsky
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Chile2316 Posts
Last Edited: 2024-05-24 11:03:05
May 24 2024 10:34 GMT
#8
cause 04 terrans were bad as fuck

+ Show Spoiler +
obv not talking bout nada boxer oov kind of terrans... im talking Silent_control, Sync, Chrh, Lee, kind of terrans
StarCraft & Audax Italiano.
Evilbringer
Profile Joined April 2010
Czech Republic84 Posts
May 24 2024 11:18 GMT
#9
Short answer: because even pros making mistakes.
All creatures from my hell are going for You!
Piste
Profile Blog Joined July 2006
6183 Posts
May 24 2024 13:40 GMT
#10
The first mistake was to attack the pylon in the first place as bovienchien said. I strongly disagree with his points 1 to 4 though. You want to kill the gateway instead, but he was too late to do that either.
The second mistake Terran did was his bunker placement.
CHEONSOYUN
Profile Joined August 2017
565 Posts
May 24 2024 15:47 GMT
#11
you have to be killing the gateways vs an in base 2 gate.

the probe will just make another pylon and repower the gateways.

if the first zealot is able to come out vs a committed scv pull on the gateways it's almost always a loss; sometimes it is better to not pull and maximize mineral mining if the pull will come too late to prevent a zealot popping out.
JAEDONG...!!! EFFORT IS ANGRY. ZERG...?!
BulgarianToss
Profile Joined May 2011
Bulgaria490 Posts
May 24 2024 17:04 GMT
#12
The probe being alive at that moment makes that move not worth it since the toss would build another pylon in case he sees the one powering the gates is going down. But then again terran with scvs and marines should be able to overpower this rush, maybe a second barracks will have been enough instead of going for such a late factory. The terran player panicked imo, televised game and all that.
music is the best thing in the world
RJBTVYOUTUBE
Profile Joined December 2023
Netherlands1119 Posts
May 24 2024 17:42 GMT
#13
He saw the proxy too late. Mistake was pulling his scv off minerals. instead stop mining gas. get south of cc bunker. get 2nd rack. 2 rack production defense around bunker. get acad and resume gas get range.
JDON MY SOUL!
Ferneu
Profile Joined June 2018
11 Posts
Last Edited: 2024-05-24 21:23:41
May 24 2024 21:21 GMT
#14
Thanks for all the answers. You guys are awesome!

I can totally see Silent_Control, (terran) having simply made a mistake. If we were talking about humans here. Those Korean robots do not make mistakes. They may throw a game here and there because of betting, but they do not make mistakes!

Joking aside, the reason I found that move so odd was because, that early in the game, when he saw that Zeus (protoss) had built two gateways there, one would assume protoss had committed everything he had in that move, so the moment that pylon was destroyed, he would be done. And even if the probe tried to build another one, Silent_Control would have all the time in the world to destroy the new one too before it could power-up those Gateways.

And Zeus seems to have thought the same. We can even see him reacting when then SCVs start attacking the pylon near the 9:30 mark. When one of those Korean machines express any sort of emotion during those stupid close-ups they love so much to make, you know things are bad,

A couple of you said he should have gone for the gateways instead of the pylon. Not sure I agree with that. Wouldn't that take way longer than simply removing their power supply? By the time one of those gateways was destroyed the base would be full of zealots. I think. Then again, what do I know.

For now I'm sticking to the "he made a mistake" theory.

PS: terran is OP. There. I said it.


bovienchien
Profile Joined March 2014
Vietnam1152 Posts
May 24 2024 22:48 GMT
#15
Let's look at I vs the best player of Vietnam all time (aka proA.ThuocLao). You will see right actions

https://www.facebook.com/StarcraftRemasteredVN/
jinjin5000
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1476 Posts
May 25 2024 19:40 GMT
#16
On May 24 2024 16:11 bovienchien wrote:
If you are gosu, you will know why he did it.

I am the one of the best players in Vietnam, I can explain and tell something for you.

Terran only destroys Gates, Pylons in inside or near his main when Gates have not completed yet. So when he saw 2 the Gates were completed, he pulled scv came back the Mineral line was right 100%.

Of course you can ask me, the game would be good for Terran if the Pylon was killed. No, Protoss just needed to build 2 Pylons to buy Zealots non stop. And then Terran would die sooner than the game you watched.

Something I tell you

1. If Protoss are discovered the strategy of Proxy like that. The game looks like balance at that time even Protoss can't kill any units of Terran, Protoss just starts game normal with advantage from economic. Terran still will die but slower.

2. Proxy Pylon should be ban in the professional leagues. Proxy Pylon always bring advantage for Protoss too much. This's why no one Terran wants to play TvP in 2 players maps.

3. The Namja Iyagi map is one of the best map in history of StarCraft. if it's no Namja Iyagi we also have no Chupung-Ryeong, Harmony, Return of the King... maps.

4. I wish we will have some nice maps like Namja Iyagi in 2024.


you are fucking D rank man.
Sva3
Profile Joined December 2020
19 Posts
May 25 2024 19:47 GMT
#17
On May 26 2024 04:40 jinjin5000 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 24 2024 16:11 bovienchien wrote:
If you are gosu, you will know why he did it.

I am the one of the best players in Vietnam, I can explain and tell something for you.

Terran only destroys Gates, Pylons in inside or near his main when Gates have not completed yet. So when he saw 2 the Gates were completed, he pulled scv came back the Mineral line was right 100%.

Of course you can ask me, the game would be good for Terran if the Pylon was killed. No, Protoss just needed to build 2 Pylons to buy Zealots non stop. And then Terran would die sooner than the game you watched.

Something I tell you

1. If Protoss are discovered the strategy of Proxy like that. The game looks like balance at that time even Protoss can't kill any units of Terran, Protoss just starts game normal with advantage from economic. Terran still will die but slower.

2. Proxy Pylon should be ban in the professional leagues. Proxy Pylon always bring advantage for Protoss too much. This's why no one Terran wants to play TvP in 2 players maps.

3. The Namja Iyagi map is one of the best map in history of StarCraft. if it's no Namja Iyagi we also have no Chupung-Ryeong, Harmony, Return of the King... maps.

4. I wish we will have some nice maps like Namja Iyagi in 2024.


you are fucking D rank man.


What's wrong with D rank man? You wouldn't say that to me at LAN.
FT.aCt)Sony
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States1048 Posts
May 25 2024 20:02 GMT
#18
On May 26 2024 04:47 Sva3 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 26 2024 04:40 jinjin5000 wrote:
On May 24 2024 16:11 bovienchien wrote:
If you are gosu, you will know why he did it.

I am the one of the best players in Vietnam, I can explain and tell something for you.

Terran only destroys Gates, Pylons in inside or near his main when Gates have not completed yet. So when he saw 2 the Gates were completed, he pulled scv came back the Mineral line was right 100%.

Of course you can ask me, the game would be good for Terran if the Pylon was killed. No, Protoss just needed to build 2 Pylons to buy Zealots non stop. And then Terran would die sooner than the game you watched.

Something I tell you

1. If Protoss are discovered the strategy of Proxy like that. The game looks like balance at that time even Protoss can't kill any units of Terran, Protoss just starts game normal with advantage from economic. Terran still will die but slower.

2. Proxy Pylon should be ban in the professional leagues. Proxy Pylon always bring advantage for Protoss too much. This's why no one Terran wants to play TvP in 2 players maps.

3. The Namja Iyagi map is one of the best map in history of StarCraft. if it's no Namja Iyagi we also have no Chupung-Ryeong, Harmony, Return of the King... maps.

4. I wish we will have some nice maps like Namja Iyagi in 2024.


you are fucking D rank man.


What's wrong with D rank man? You wouldn't say that to me at LAN.


Rofl Sva coming out here flexing.
jinjin5000
Profile Joined May 2010
United States1476 Posts
May 25 2024 20:02 GMT
#19
On May 26 2024 04:47 Sva3 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 26 2024 04:40 jinjin5000 wrote:
On May 24 2024 16:11 bovienchien wrote:
If you are gosu, you will know why he did it.

I am the one of the best players in Vietnam, I can explain and tell something for you.

Terran only destroys Gates, Pylons in inside or near his main when Gates have not completed yet. So when he saw 2 the Gates were completed, he pulled scv came back the Mineral line was right 100%.

Of course you can ask me, the game would be good for Terran if the Pylon was killed. No, Protoss just needed to build 2 Pylons to buy Zealots non stop. And then Terran would die sooner than the game you watched.

Something I tell you

1. If Protoss are discovered the strategy of Proxy like that. The game looks like balance at that time even Protoss can't kill any units of Terran, Protoss just starts game normal with advantage from economic. Terran still will die but slower.

2. Proxy Pylon should be ban in the professional leagues. Proxy Pylon always bring advantage for Protoss too much. This's why no one Terran wants to play TvP in 2 players maps.

3. The Namja Iyagi map is one of the best map in history of StarCraft. if it's no Namja Iyagi we also have no Chupung-Ryeong, Harmony, Return of the King... maps.

4. I wish we will have some nice maps like Namja Iyagi in 2024.


you are fucking D rank man.


What's wrong with D rank man? You wouldn't say that to me at LAN.


I will at next lan before i get blasted by all the TvT. Just you wait
XenOsky
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Chile2316 Posts
May 25 2024 21:36 GMT
#20
On May 26 2024 04:40 jinjin5000 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 24 2024 16:11 bovienchien wrote:
If you are gosu, you will know why he did it.

I am the one of the best players in Vietnam, I can explain and tell something for you.

Terran only destroys Gates, Pylons in inside or near his main when Gates have not completed yet. So when he saw 2 the Gates were completed, he pulled scv came back the Mineral line was right 100%.

Of course you can ask me, the game would be good for Terran if the Pylon was killed. No, Protoss just needed to build 2 Pylons to buy Zealots non stop. And then Terran would die sooner than the game you watched.

Something I tell you

1. If Protoss are discovered the strategy of Proxy like that. The game looks like balance at that time even Protoss can't kill any units of Terran, Protoss just starts game normal with advantage from economic. Terran still will die but slower.

2. Proxy Pylon should be ban in the professional leagues. Proxy Pylon always bring advantage for Protoss too much. This's why no one Terran wants to play TvP in 2 players maps.

3. The Namja Iyagi map is one of the best map in history of StarCraft. if it's no Namja Iyagi we also have no Chupung-Ryeong, Harmony, Return of the King... maps.

4. I wish we will have some nice maps like Namja Iyagi in 2024.


you are fucking D rank man.


SAVAGE
StarCraft & Audax Italiano.
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