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ASL21 Strategy, Pimpest Plays Discussions

Forum Index > BW General
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b0mBerMan
Profile Joined April 2012
Japan288 Posts
Last Edited: 2026-04-14 07:21:35
April 14 2026 07:19 GMT
#1
20+ years and this game still keeps on giving.
definately best game ever!!! AMAZE AMAZE AMAZE!!!

There is ASL21 general discussion thread, but this thread is in depth and comprehensive discussion on specific builds and pimpest plays. I had amateur experience with bw proleague and i want to share and discuss with you guys.

I start with 2 things -
1. tulbo vs. sSak dt vs. cloaked wraith
2. jaedong vs. queen miracle comeback

first - we are always taught in training that terrans can always survive dt rush if you can get at least 2 wraiths out.
how? dt rush always means either proxy gates or even regular 2 gates at least, and very late forge and no tech. this means that protoss has to kill you or abandon all in dt and transition to mass gates.

what tulbo did wrong - messed with his 2 gates, it delayed his attack, and could have killed 4 or more scvs. moreover, he was late to attack the starport tower. those are asap actions in dt rush because that is only way terran can win. mostly, why did he leave probes to die? he panicked with dt micro and was late in canons.

what did sSak do right - he made good decision to rush the cloak as soon as he smelled dt rush, and was able to make more wraiths, otherwise dragoon would kill him easily. second and most important is the pimp scv chase trap while he was hiding turrets on cc landing site. once sSak consolidated army in cc, it was game over.

second - jaedong and queen muta fight.
everyone think it was a miracle and queen made major mistake.
its true, jaedong was behind but the queen chase was not a mistake, only unlucky. people think queen overextended when he hunted overlord and queen, but that was actually good decision. the real mistake for queen, and miracle for jeadong was jaedong sacced 2 scourges in order to save 4 mutas, this was pimpest and was the backbone of the miracle comeback. when queen hunted the stray overlord, he panicked when he saw that jd had 2 groups - group 1 was the miracle 4 mutas with backup which easily killed queens chasing muta because he panicked. second was the rally group which cleaned up the stray queen mutas. up until the second major muta fight, queen was in a good position. the real problem was he was not able to kill the four mutas and panicked during the second muta wars.


im excited to see more flash, bisu, rain, and snow plays and the new strategies they have for this asl.
i heard flash has a new gols only timing for jane doe, snow has been training pvz very hard, and bisu is now back to bonjwa level.
b0mBerMan
Profile Joined April 2012
Japan288 Posts
Last Edited: 2026-04-20 14:49:42
April 20 2026 11:13 GMT
#2
We just saw the Flash goliatg build that I talked about. It was all the buzz in the korean progamer community, Flash perfecting it during practive for ASL in TvZ.

+ Show Spoiler [Ro16 spoiler] +
I will talk about the details why it went wrong, but JD just played perfectly aggressively.
BLinD-RawR
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
ALLEYCAT BLUES50976 Posts
April 20 2026 14:50 GMT
#3
keep spoilers in spoilers
Brood War EICWoo Jung Ho, never forget.| Twitter: @BLinDRawR
RJBTVYOUTUBE
Profile Joined December 2023
Netherlands1242 Posts
April 20 2026 17:09 GMT
#4
Ample vs Soulkey is full of highlights imo
JDON MY SOUL!
mtcn77
Profile Joined September 2013
Turkey702 Posts
April 20 2026 20:06 GMT
#5
Is this even a question? Ro24 Piano vs Rush:
Turrican
b0mBerMan
Profile Joined April 2012
Japan288 Posts
Last Edited: 2026-04-21 23:22:07
April 21 2026 10:48 GMT
#6
ASL RO16 Deep-dive and Detailed Analysis
HOW XXX SMASHED YYY




+ Show Spoiler +
HOW JAEGOD SMASHED FLASH THE ULTIMATE WEAPON
Deep-dive and Detailed Analysis


Flash brilliant idea
without doubt, flash build was genius, and play it 1 million times agains anyone other than jeagod and he wins 100%. The build - this was initiated in the old bw playoffs before sc2, i dont remember the game, but it was spoiled early because flash lifted his baracks early and jd lings finished him early even before he can execute it. this asl season, he tinkered with it vs snow, as an aggressive counter to snow's godly shuttle reaver + gate attack. then in offline practice with soma he realized that it is still viable in present TVZ meta because maps favor semi mech where he can be conservative in the opening and mass gols while allowing tanks as needed. Flash perfected in in Jane Doe, but obviously works well as well in PoleStar.

The general concept of flash gol build - send early 1 vult to delay third. it should live, but even if it dies, it might work mind game because zerg will be free to push without the vulture and see terran base and aggro, and zerg will be forced to play conservative, that is 1-2 sunks plus delayed 3rd plus delayed hydra upgrades. then behind this, double armory, and always be +1 ahead of hydra upgrades, and make 2-4 tanks as needed depending on zerg aggressiveness. if zerg does not pressure, no tanks needed, and it will be super gols vs. mutas + hydra + ling, ezpz. moreover, flash can split 2 or 3 way between natural and third and consolidate in the middle without losing ground. then at midgame flash will be +2+2 with 130-150 supplies a-moving to oblitirate squeasy zerg.

Jaegod's general approach.
people who have no formal pro level training will say oh jaedong has this new mentality, tyrant is back, etc etc. this is crap, wins and losses at the level of progamers is all about half second timing advantages, snowballing of early small advantage, positions and micro, and of course meta and counter meta mind games.

of course lets get the mentality thing out of the way. jaedong has expressed recently, iirc after his god-level game against zero, that his mentality is disregard build order disadvantage, disregard fear of losing, and just play well. that oversimplifies it, that is why i say it is only a very small fraction of his winning form lately, but we must admit it is a factor.

now lets go to the actual analysis. jaedong smashed because jaegod played very smart while playing vintage jaedong crazy aggression. to illustrate, before, jaedong will see an entrenched terran nat with 2 tanks and 1 full bunker with good simcity. he would have attacked with 8 speed lings and see a glimmer of hope because he destroyed the bunker and killed 2 marines, then he would go retarded and make 24 speedling and micro to 400 and hope it is enough against terrans defensive advantage, especialy if that terran is flash. this drove calm and killer crazy before, why he can have all it takes to win against flash - micro, strategy, intelligence to mindgame, and yet get emotional and retarded and just suicide his army against terran. but this time, he played very smart, not emotional, making every move with purpose to win. so now let us go to the detailed analysis.

Detailed Analysis
3 mins - flash plan is going perfectly, and jeagod was able to see 14cc + sim nat.

5 mins - jd kills vulture, still according to plan for flash,. but here is the first mind game win by jd and him not thinking out of his scrotum. his spire finishes, but instead of getting defensive with sunk, he got 3rd and then double hatched. flash did not factor this and thought a few mutas would be harassing, but did did not think jd would have more mutas, we will discuss this later.

6 mins - flash got played, but he is still perfectly within his build, double armory

7 mins - jd won another mindgame, and flash does something below flash level of starsense here. he knew early that jd had 6-8 lings, and he knew also that the muta timing was off, so either it was a muta fake but instead a ling lurker rush, or mass lings. he was exploring the top left quadrant, and for sure, he would have seen even just a single ling. but he saw none. he should immediately thought of the only possibility - burrowed lings. it cannot be that the lings were away roaming savior style because at that point, they are already useless, so why would jd make them more useless and hide them in his base wasting supply when he can use them to recon. this is truly where flash lost.

8 mins - jd has optimized min max for mutas, this is what we are talking about earlier, normally, there would be 8, that is why flash also had 8 initial gols to defend the third. then jd saw where the gols where and saw that flash was starting third. this is the formal beginning of the end. jd adjustment to gols was to deny the third and force flash to balance gol and tanks by switching muta and hydras. but let us not get ahead. he saw 3rd starting and 6-8 gols. he delays it with 11 mutas, cc does not die, but delay successful. here is the new mature jd. old tyrant jd would have thrown 16 mutas against 10 gols and lost. here jd went soma-style - sniping scvs, harassing nat, and switch to hydra, while remaining myta to be used to snipe tanks and vess

10 mins - jd saw the timing, no tanks on the front and only 1 vess. muta + hydra was successful, flash forced to pull scvs. and first tank was out. again mature jd - clean up scvs, snipe 1 tank, and regather.

11 mins - at this point, they both know the 3rd at 12 is the battle point. jd will not attack the nat because high ground tanks, and flash knows jd is mass hydra so he needs more vess-irra and tanks. another jd mindgame win, more on this later.

12 mins - flash is outplayed and loses 3rd and has too many gols and only 1 tank and overcompensated by making more tanks in the next 2 cycles. jaedong almost has a brainfart here and loses 10 or so hydras in the nat entry, which is what he was avoiding earlier. he retreats and again pressures the newly landed third. he plays smart and avoids tanks while focusing on damaging the cc and scvs, while avoiding tank rangse. cleaning gols arrive, jd retreats

13 mins - flash overcompensation backfires. he has 5-6 tanks now, and only 4 gols. jd moves for the kill with a new batch of mutas, jd kills all except 1 tank, and another tank in highground main.

14 mins - jd is now up 20 supply, he uses 1 group muta to do pre attack harass by way of natural,. killing the annoying tank in high ground and another in the 3rd. flash completely messed the unit compo because of jd mindgames, he thought maybe old jd would 0-100 supply, but jd played smart and saved leftover mutas and hydras. now flash is 90 mech supply trapped in 3rd, and jd is 120 supply hydra muta. after stopping 3rd, jd does not waste supply in 3rd anymore and pushes to nat, this is purpose of sniping camping tank earlier.

in the end, sauron hydra + muta snipers vs. gols + 2 tanks = flash was smeshed like a trash noob.


Summary
flash played at his best level but got outplayed by a smart-aggressive, not retard-aggressive jaedong, who faked and pushed flash to react and always be 1 step behind and cannot have a good unit compo and position against Jaegod.

b0mBerMan
Profile Joined April 2012
Japan288 Posts
April 21 2026 10:53 GMT
#7
Im excited with next flash vs. snow if it happens.
flash has practiced hard anti-snow counter - leta-style.
practice say he can win in 11-12 mins, no more long macro games tzp which is hard for his hand, but advantage to snow
.
mtcn77
Profile Joined September 2013
Turkey702 Posts
April 21 2026 14:42 GMT
#8
You press [s] after you have highlighted the text you want to antispoil. Please edit, I haven't watched group C yet.
Turrican
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States45915 Posts
April 21 2026 15:10 GMT
#9
On April 21 2026 19:48 b0mBerMan wrote:
+ Show Spoiler +
I dont know how to spoilers, so obviously ASL spoilers incoming.

HOW JAEGOD SMASHED FLASH THE ULTIMATE WEAPON
Deep-dive and Detailed Analysis


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CtMFmBDf1tI

Flash brilliant idea
without doubt, flash build was genius, and play it 1 million times agains anyone other than jeagod and he wins 100%. The build - this was initiated in the old bw playoffs before sc2, i dont remember the game, but it was spoiled early because flash lifted his baracks early and jd lings finished him early even before he can execute it. this asl season, he tinkered with it vs snow, as an aggressive counter to snow's godly shuttle reaver + gate attack. then in offline practice with soma he realized that it is still viable in present TVZ meta because maps favor semi mech where he can be conservative in the opening and mass gols while allowing tanks as needed. Flash perfected in in Jane Doe, but obviously works well as well in PoleStar.

The general concept of flash gol build - send early 1 vult to delay third. it should live, but even if it dies, it might work mind game because zerg will be free to push without the vulture and see terran base and aggro, and zerg will be forced to play conservative, that is 1-2 sunks plus delayed 3rd plus delayed hydra upgrades. then behind this, double armory, and always be +1 ahead of hydra upgrades, and make 2-4 tanks as needed depending on zerg aggressiveness. if zerg does not pressure, no tanks needed, and it will be super gols vs. mutas + hydra + ling, ezpz. moreover, flash can split 2 or 3 way between natural and third and consolidate in the middle without losing ground. then at midgame flash will be +2+2 with 130-150 supplies a-moving to oblitirate squeasy zerg.

Jaegod's general approach.
people who have no formal pro level training will say oh jaedong has this new mentality, tyrant is back, etc etc. this is crap, wins and losses at the level of progamers is all about half second timing advantages, snowballing of early small advantage, positions and micro, and of course meta and counter meta mind games.

of course lets get the mentality thing out of the way. jaedong has expressed recently, iirc after his god-level game against zero, that his mentality is disregard build order disadvantage, disregard fear of losing, and just play well. that oversimplifies it, that is why i say it is only a very small fraction of his winning form lately, but we must admit it is a factor.

now lets go to the actual analysis. jaedong smashed because jaegod played very smart while playing vintage jaedong crazy aggression. to illustrate, before, jaedong will see an entrenched terran nat with 2 tanks and 1 full bunker with good simcity. he would have attacked with 8 speed lings and see a glimmer of hope because he destroyed the bunker and killed 2 marines, then he would go retarded and make 24 speedling and micro to 400 and hope it is enough against terrans defensive advantage, especialy if that terran is flash. this drove calm and killer crazy before, why he can have all it takes to win against flash - micro, strategy, intelligence to mindgame, and yet get emotional and retarded and just suicide his army against terran. but this time, he played very smart, not emotional, making every move with purpose to win. so now let us go to the detailed analysis.

Detailed Analysis
3 mins - flash plan is going perfectly, and jeagod was able to see 14cc + sim nat.

5 mins - jd kills vulture, still according to plan for flash,. but here is the first mind game win by jd and him not thinking out of his scrotum. his spire finishes, but instead of getting defensive with sunk, he got 3rd and then double hatched. flash did not factor this and thought a few mutas would be harassing, but did did not think jd would have more mutas, we will discuss this later.

6 mins - flash got played, but he is still perfectly within his build, double armory

7 mins - jd won another mindgame, and flash does something below flash level of starsense here. he knew early that jd had 6-8 lings, and he knew also that the muta timing was off, so either it was a muta fake but instead a ling lurker rush, or mass lings. he was exploring the top left quadrant, and for sure, he would have seen even just a single ling. but he saw none. he should immediately thought of the only possibility - burrowed lings. it cannot be that the lings were away roaming savior style because at that point, they are already useless, so why would jd make them more useless and hide them in his base wasting supply when he can use them to recon. this is truly where flash lost.

8 mins - jd has optimized min max for mutas, this is what we are talking about earlier, normally, there would be 8, that is why flash also had 8 initial gols to defend the third. then jd saw where the gols where and saw that flash was starting third. this is the formal beginning of the end. jd adjustment to gols was to deny the third and force flash to balance gol and tanks by switching muta and hydras. but let us not get ahead. he saw 3rd starting and 6-8 gols. he delays it with 11 mutas, cc does not die, but delay successful. here is the new mature jd. old tyrant jd would have thrown 16 mutas against 10 gols and lost. here jd went soma-style - sniping scvs, harassing nat, and switch to hydra, while remaining myta to be used to snipe tanks and vess

10 mins - jd saw the timing, no tanks on the front and only 1 vess. muta + hydra was successful, flash forced to pull scvs. and first tank was out. again mature jd - clean up scvs, snipe 1 tank, and regather.

11 mins - at this point, they both know the 3rd at 12 is the battle point. jd will not attack the nat because high ground tanks, and flash knows jd is mass hydra so he needs more vess-irra and tanks. another jd mindgame win, more on this later.

12 mins - flash is outplayed and loses 3rd and has too many gols and only 1 tank and overcompensated by making more tanks in the next 2 cycles. jaedong almost has a brainfart here and loses 10 or so hydras in the nat entry, which is what he was avoiding earlier. he retreats and again pressures the newly landed third. he plays smart and avoids tanks while focusing on damaging the cc and scvs, while avoiding tank rangse. cleaning gols arrive, jd retreats

13 mins - flash overcompensation backfires. he has 5-6 tanks now, and only 4 gols. jd moves for the kill with a new batch of mutas, jd kills all except 1 tank, and another tank in highground main.

14 mins - jd is now up 20 supply, he uses 1 group muta to do pre attack harass by way of natural,. killing the annoying tank in high ground and another in the 3rd. flash completely messed the unit compo because of jd mindgames, he thought maybe old jd would 0-100 supply, but jd played smart and saved leftover mutas and hydras. now flash is 90 mech supply trapped in 3rd, and jd is 120 supply hydra muta. after stopping 3rd, jd does not waste supply in 3rd anymore and pushes to nat, this is purpose of sniping camping tank earlier.

in the end, sauron hydra + muta snipers vs. gols + 2 tanks = flash was smeshed like a trash noob.


Summary
flash played at his best level but got outplayed by a smart-aggressive, not retard-aggressive jaedong, who faked and pushed flash to react and always be 1 step behind and cannot have a good unit compo and position against Jaegod.


I second this. Absolutely untouchable.
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
mtcn77
Profile Joined September 2013
Turkey702 Posts
April 23 2026 12:49 GMT
#10
On April 21 2026 19:53 b0mBerMan wrote:
Im excited with next flash vs. snow if it happens.
flash has practiced hard anti-snow counter - leta-style.
practice say he can win in 11-12 mins, no more long macro games tzp which is hard for his hand, but advantage to snow
.

I really cheer for Leta. All this time I have been saying 2-port wraith is peak terran and only 2 players have been able to demonstrate this to its full potential. I've tried reaching out to the community making my ideas known, looks like Jaedong is the only one listening.
+ Show Spoiler +
Like, why don't we have archon drops into the mineral line? Is it too impossible to make it work? It is fast, it is cheap, it is big and clumsy, it is too frustrating for terran to deal with in the mineral line. If you order your scvs away from mining, you better not click the ground, or they will all get drilled into each other. It doesn't dud... There is nothing to counter it. The best part: archons are the strongest units at the start of the game when terran has the least amount of vultures.

+ Show Spoiler +

I have told time and again, the only way you play with hydralisks is if you pull aggro from goliaths with mutalisks. Mutalisks count as small units and have insane stats vs goliaths vs hydralisks.
Turrican
b0mBerMan
Profile Joined April 2012
Japan288 Posts
April 23 2026 21:46 GMT
#11
On April 23 2026 21:49 mtcn77 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 21 2026 19:53 b0mBerMan wrote:
Im excited with next flash vs. snow if it happens.
flash has practiced hard anti-snow counter - leta-style.
practice say he can win in 11-12 mins, no more long macro games tzp which is hard for his hand, but advantage to snow
.

I really cheer for Leta. All this time I have been saying 2-port wraith is peak terran and only 2 players have been able to demonstrate this to its full potential. I've tried reaching out to the community making my ideas known, looks like Jaedong is the only one listening.
+ Show Spoiler +
Like, why don't we have archon drops into the mineral line? Is it too impossible to make it work? It is fast, it is cheap, it is big and clumsy, it is too frustrating for terran to deal with in the mineral line. If you order your scvs away from mining, you better not click the ground, or they will all get drilled into each other. It doesn't dud... There is nothing to counter it. The best part: archons are the strongest units at the start of the game when terran has the least amount of vultures.

+ Show Spoiler +

I have told time and again, the only way you play with hydralisks is if you pull aggro from goliaths with mutalisks. Mutalisks count as small units and have insane stats vs goliaths vs hydralisks.

re: archon drop
i guess its a timing issue:
reaver - gate, cyber, robo, robo bay
archon - gate, cyber, citadel, archives, merge

you get reavers earlier that archons, and by the time you have archons, the opponent already know whats up.

re: hydra muta
jaegod made it work by maximing the composition and living on knife's edge with aggression before the +1 and +2 gols hit, while being very smart and not suiciding his army for no reason.
the first muta cycle into the third was timed before the +1, and the hydra before the +2, and flash was reacting badly that he was fooled by jaegod about the incoming attack army.
but you are correct to a point, muta to snipe and harass and hydra to finish, but you need godlike micro like jaedong and and crazy deception mindgames.
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