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Maps being considered for ASL16
(3)Apocalypse
(2)Champion 2.0
(4)Tempest
(4)Shooting Break
(4)La Campanella
(2)Invader
Maps confirmed for ASL16
(2)Neo Dark Origin
-Sylphid
-Retro
Link: https://910map.tistory.com/category/ASL/ASL 시즌 16Poll: Which map would you like to see in ASL16?(2)Champion 2.0 (22) 43% (3)Apocalypse (3) 6% (4)Tempest (8) 16% (4)La Campanella (7) 14% (2)Invader (11) 22% 51 total votes Your vote: Which map would you like to see in ASL16? (Vote): (2)Champion 2.0
(Vote): (3)Apocalypse
(Vote): (4)Tempest
(Vote): (4)La Campanella
(Vote): (2)Invader
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I like literally all new proposals, holy heck, amazing looking maps.
Neo Dark Origin - nah, why.
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On June 17 2023 16:27 Nirli wrote:
I like literally all new proposals, holy heck, amazing looking maps.
Neo Dark Origin - nah, why.
Same. All of them look pretty neat. Meanwhile, Neo Dark Origin looks like shit. What a shame.
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기존맵중에서는 레트로와 실피드를 고민중에 있으며 = Among the existing maps, I am considering retro and sylphid.
Why choice of maps belongs to just one person? I wonder what race does he play?
(3)Apocalypse has no any creative things compare to any 3 players maps
(2)Champion 2.0 is good for big combat and balance for all matchup. 3rd base is a bit large with one ramp, so far to come. These things favor Terran players, anyway it helps game last long, so fun to watch and very nice to replace Eclipse, Butter.
(4)Tempest is the best unbalanced I've seen ever. Terran can't lose here
(4)Shooting Break has nice idea. It's good for Zerg with 3 gas early from 2 bases. But Terran, Protoss will be happy also, due to they can defend easily at natural. And main base is so hard for Mutas. In short, this is a good map.
(4)La Campanella is very good. I love this map so much. Look at 3rd, 4th base that you will 2 options. One is easy to take but hard to defend. The other one is easy to defend but hard to take. The center base is always a thing which I love. In a competition, if you have something ahead, you should get a advantage from the map.
(2)Invader is Eclipse 2.0, that's it. It will be fun some new games but so boring after that.
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I think on Tempest , in PvT , protoss has no other choice but to go carriers..
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Wait why they replaced Dark Origin with Neo? Old one was perfect, I saw so many epic games not only on ASL, KCM but on streams, especially those narrow paths where you could escape, now they blocked them. Lame...
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I just looked at the maps in-game and La Campanella seems like a bad zerg map. There is a 250 mineral patch at the natural where you can mine to access 3rd base below. However, that would take some time, but terran can just float the CC down and protoss can do the pylon trick to get a probe behind the minerals so they both can get their 3rd base up faster. Zerg would have to research burrow, but even then it would take several tries to get a drone behind the lines.
Also, the 3rd base seems like it would be hard to defend against tanks placed on the high ground so I think terran would have a nice time with this map if the other races took the 3rd base below. The rest seems fairly good, especially shooting break where all 3 races can get a third gas right away.
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On June 17 2023 18:40 Souden wrote:
I just looked at the maps in-game and La Campanella seems like a bad zerg map. There is a 250 mineral patch at the natural where you can mine to access 3rd base below. However, that would take some time, but terran can just float the CC down and protoss can do the pylon trick to get a probe behind the minerals so they both can get their 3rd base up faster. Zerg would have to research burrow, but even then it would take several tries to get a drone behind the lines.
Also, the 3rd base seems like it would be hard to defend against tanks placed on the high ground so I think terran would have a nice time with this map if the other races took the 3rd base below. The rest seems fairly good, especially shooting break where all 3 races can get a third gas right away.
You can just push a drone through
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Cool. The pros are already testing the new maps.
But where is the crazy one this season?
My first impression is that they are not anti Terran as everyone thought.
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ALLEYCAT BLUES51032 Posts
lot of lower ground/same ground mains in this pool.
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lol, looks like they're really going all out to prevent Terran getting near the final this season. TvZ on Apocalypse when T spawns on 12 when Z spawns on 4 is going to be ass, Champion and Tempest are gonna be TvP graveyards with those 3rd base positions.
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They’re playing the maps in proleague today
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On June 17 2023 20:34 Terrorbladder wrote:
lol, looks like they're really going all out to prevent Terran getting near the final this season.
I don't think so. Would take something really special to beat the combination of 76 + HBR + Nemesis + Dark Origin.
TvZ on Apocalypse when T spawns on 12 when Z spawns on 4 is going to be ass
Is it that much of a difference compared to Sylphid when T spawns on 12 and Z on 8?
Champion and Tempest are gonna be TvP graveyards with those 3rd base positions.
3rd base on Champion is similar to 3rd on Polypoid, except it's not on high ground but it looks like you can siege from main. 3rd on Tempest is similar to Ascension except the paths are even narrower which can only benefit Terran.
Think about the 3rd on Eclipse, FS, Retro. If it's not harder than those (especially Eclipse) then it's fine.
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On June 17 2023 18:39 outscar wrote:
Wait why they replaced Dark Origin with Neo? Old one was perfect, I saw so many epic games not only on ASL, KCM but on streams, especially those narrow paths where you could escape, now they blocked them. Lame...
Same feelings here. Overcorrection strikes again.
Sad.
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On June 17 2023 21:12 MineraIs wrote:
They’re playing the maps in proleague today
This will make me start watching it again. Thx for the info, bro 
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On June 17 2023 20:34 Terrorbladder wrote:
lol, looks like they're really going all out to prevent Terran getting near the final this season. TvZ on Apocalypse when T spawns on 12 when Z spawns on 4 is going to be ass, Champion and Tempest are gonna be TvP graveyards with those 3rd base positions.
Where did we heard that before, hmm.. :3
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On June 17 2023 18:39 outscar wrote:
Wait why they replaced Dark Origin with Neo? Old one was perfect, I saw so many epic games not only on ASL, KCM but on streams, especially those narrow paths where you could escape, now they blocked them. Lame...
PvZ is under 40% winrate for P in that map, also T is below 50% winrate vs both races, maybe that's why it was changed-
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On June 17 2023 18:40 Souden wrote:
I just looked at the maps in-game and La Campanella seems like a bad zerg map. There is a 250 mineral patch at the natural where you can mine to access 3rd base below. However, that would take some time, but terran can just float the CC down and protoss can do the pylon trick to get a probe behind the minerals so they both can get their 3rd base up faster. Zerg would have to research burrow, but even then it would take several tries to get a drone behind the lines.
Also, the 3rd base seems like it would be hard to defend against tanks placed on the high ground so I think terran would have a nice time with this map if the other races took the 3rd base below. The rest seems fairly good, especially shooting break where all 3 races can get a third gas right away.
Classic forum user feedback, no wonder ASL doesn't let people vote on such things and don't read threads.
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On June 17 2023 21:13 TMNT wrote:Show nested quote +On June 17 2023 20:34 Terrorbladder wrote:
lol, looks like they're really going all out to prevent Terran getting near the final this season. I don't think so. Would take something really special to beat the combination of 76 + HBR + Nemesis + Dark Origin. Is it that much of a difference compared to Sylphid when T spawns on 12 and Z on 8? Show nested quote +Champion and Tempest are gonna be TvP graveyards with those 3rd base positions. 3rd base on Champion is similar to 3rd on Polypoid, except it's not on high ground but it looks like you can siege from main. 3rd on Tempest is similar to Ascension except the paths are even narrower which can only benefit Terran. Think about the 3rd on Eclipse, FS, Retro. If it's not harder than those (especially Eclipse) then it's fine.
76 is only bad TvP, not TvZ. It's 52.7% TvZ (small sample size, but still).
Nemesis is 54.2% PvT, but 57.8% TvZ..
Sylphid is balanced in every matchup except TvZ, which is insanely enough at 60%.
Dark Origin is slightly anti Terran, but certainly playable, at 54.8% PvT and 53.4% ZvT. It's fine.
Heartbreak Ridge is balanced in ZvT at 51.4% ZvT, but with a more significant 58.7% PvT.
The last ASL did not have an anti Terran map pool. It had some balanced maps, some maps with farouable TvZ but also favourable PvT, some slightly anti Terran maps, and some pro Terran maps.
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On June 17 2023 23:32 ZakRoM wrote:Show nested quote +On June 17 2023 18:39 outscar wrote:
Wait why they replaced Dark Origin with Neo? Old one was perfect, I saw so many epic games not only on ASL, KCM but on streams, especially those narrow paths where you could escape, now they blocked them. Lame... PvZ is under 40% winrate for P in that map, also T is below 50% winrate vs both races, maybe that's why it was changed-
ZvP at 60% is a yikes and should be changed, but some 55ers in any direction are fine.
I don't think anyone is worried about 54.8% PvT and 53.4% ZvT.
55% just means that over 20 games, the stats are 11 - 9. so, every twentieth game, the favoured race gets an extra win.
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