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On October 11 2018 06:36 iopq wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2018 06:09 FlaShFTW wrote:On October 11 2018 06:00 iopq wrote:
Action over Effort, LUL
that's some incredible recency bias considering that effort has been a choke artist before this tournament, im still very cautious about him. and action has been improving the fastest of all players right now, look at his spon matches. he's a solid player that many people are underestimating right now. Choke artist or not, he won VANT36.5 National Starleague and SSL Classic Season 1 When has Action won anything? I'm not saying he's bad and he won't win things in the future, but you have to give someone who's an actual champion SOME credit
that still was a very long time a go so it doesn't really mean any much in terms of his performance now days
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The recency bias is real here. What should happen is you should really weigh in those sponsored matches more. That's where the pros try real hard, especially the popular ones.
There is no better metric. Offline tournaments are good too but they don't tell the whole story.
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On October 12 2018 03:51 Connor56201 wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2018 06:36 iopq wrote:On October 11 2018 06:09 FlaShFTW wrote:On October 11 2018 06:00 iopq wrote:
Action over Effort, LUL
that's some incredible recency bias considering that effort has been a choke artist before this tournament, im still very cautious about him. and action has been improving the fastest of all players right now, look at his spon matches. he's a solid player that many people are underestimating right now. Choke artist or not, he won VANT36.5 National Starleague and SSL Classic Season 1 When has Action won anything? I'm not saying he's bad and he won't win things in the future, but you have to give someone who's an actual champion SOME credit that still was a very long time a go so it doesn't really mean any much in terms of his performance now days
Yes but even if you go off recent performance only, Effort had a better month than Action. That's where the critique comes from.
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On October 11 2018 21:45 GTR wrote:
effort is good, but calling him better the best zerg of all time (better than jaedong, savior, yellow etc) is just straight out wrong.
I don't get what is your reference of "best" I am only talking about skill here. Please don't tell me you think YellOw or sAviOr are or were better players, Jaedong and EffOrt reached a level way beyond their reach. And god knows I would trade any stream in the world just to watch sAviOr.
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On October 12 2018 05:06 iFU.pauline wrote:Show nested quote +On October 11 2018 21:45 GTR wrote:
effort is good, but calling him better the best zerg of all time (better than jaedong, savior, yellow etc) is just straight out wrong. I don't get what is your reference of "best" I am only talking about skill here. Please don't tell me you think YellOw or sAviOr are or were better players, Jaedong and EffOrt reached a level way beyond their reach. And god knows I would trade any stream in the world just to watch sAviOr.
Since "best" in a game context usually implies "greatest" which factors in achievements, I usually describe what you're saying as "highest skill" or "peak ability".
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United States33554 Posts
On October 12 2018 05:09 darktreb wrote:Show nested quote +On October 12 2018 05:06 iFU.pauline wrote:On October 11 2018 21:45 GTR wrote:
effort is good, but calling him better the best zerg of all time (better than jaedong, savior, yellow etc) is just straight out wrong. I don't get what is your reference of "best" I am only talking about skill here. Please don't tell me you think YellOw or sAviOr are or were better players, Jaedong and EffOrt reached a level way beyond their reach. And god knows I would trade any stream in the world just to watch sAviOr. Since "best" in a game context usually implies "greatest" which factors in achievements, I usually describe what you're saying as "highest skill" or "peak ability".
I don't think there's any meaningful consensus on what those words mean, which is why every power rank in every sport is pretty contentious :D
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darktreb that was my point yes.
Also I do not have any problems with the power rank though, Action can be before EffOrt for all I care and on top of that he has been impressive indeed.
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very impressed with Last lately
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Sorry to nitpick but I wouldn't say this about Actions win over Jaedong:
he allowed Jaedong to get overconfident and managed to come back.
Jaedong basically played a better game, got in a very advantageous position and then lost by having bad control in a muta engagement.
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On October 15 2018 16:37 Elroi wrote:Sorry to nitpick but I wouldn't say this about Actions win over Jaedong: Jaedong basically played a better game, got in a very advantageous position and then lost by having bad control in a muta engagement.
jd drop from second to this position is a sad story,u cant drop him like that for lossing a final then lossing in asl as third after taking a game from FlaSh and almost winning the rematch,the game vs action was also a tragedy,he did eveything almost perfect except that muta attack,hard to tell,maybe he thought he was very far ahead(he was ahead) but no to trade all the mutas like that.
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My boy Shuttle should be moving up also. Don’t forget to put him as being the toss with the best lategame according to Effort and Bisu.
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Power rankings aka argue about who u think r the best players  it is interesting to see what you all think tho
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This powerranking didn't age well haha. Action cheesed hard and still lost. Was fun to watch but call it what it is. Also Artosis apparantly watches JD streams and mentioned that JD said that Action beat him because of a hotkey that wasn't properly set before the game. Action was definitely overrated in retrospect.
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+ Show Spoiler +Even worse now, Effort just showed that he's the #1 Zerg in the world just now in his dismantling of Last. Besides, that burrow usage was cluth
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You guys need to relax and not take things so seriously.
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I second that Effort has been underappreciated by these last few power ranks.
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I really don't see the problem. Power Rankings are, as far as I can see, a lot more about recency bias than historically based. Where history is more of a tipping point in cases of doubt, than anything else.
+ Show Spoiler +And it's not like there's a huge difference between Effort and Action in the ranking. They're right by each others' side. Action had come back from the army and showed increasingly stronger form, whereas effort hadn't performed really well in any ASL og KSL for a long time. In doubt between the two, I can easily see it tipping towards Action. Ya'll fanboys going apeshit over nothing. But having that said, Effort really had some of the most beautiful ZvT I've seen in a while, except for G1 and G4 which were more on the opposite end of the specter.
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On October 21 2018 23:06 Incomplete..ReV wrote:I really don't see the problem. Power Rankings are, as far as I can see, a lot more about recency bias than historically based. Where history is more of a tipping point in cases of doubt, than anything else. + Show Spoiler +And it's not like there's a huge difference between Effort and Action in the ranking. They're right by each others' side. Action had come back from the army and showed increasingly stronger form, whereas effort hadn't performed really well in any ASL og KSL for a long time. In doubt between the two, I can easily see it tipping towards Action. Ya'll fanboys going apeshit over nothing. But having that said, Effort really had some of the most beautiful ZvT I've seen in a while, except for G1 and G4 which were more on the opposite end of the specter.
If power rankings are nothing more than a list that tells you who got the furthest in the last tournament/2 tournaments, then there is zero point to having them - just look at the tournament brackets.
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United States10302 Posts
On October 21 2018 20:59 [sc1f]eonzerg wrote:
go remake this thing
This is the reason why people don't want to make power ranks. Bro, it's a simple prediction based upon trend lines of players performing. It is not an end all be all for how the next month will play out. The ranking is merely how I believe players will play. Mini got 3rd but was matched with FlaSh. It doesn't mean I think Mini will finish 3rd.
You guys take this way too seriously and too literally for how people will play. Things happen, players get better or slump. I'm not a prophet, never pretended to be. If the criticism of a PR is after the fact of games being played, please, just don't even start. FlaSh could lose to Shuttle in the semis and I wouldn't even bat an eye on how I made this month's PR.
No one was arguing Last at #2, but oh he loses and now everyone gets to come here and try to bash this? Really?
On October 22 2018 05:34 Rodya wrote:Show nested quote +On October 21 2018 23:06 Incomplete..ReV wrote:I really don't see the problem. Power Rankings are, as far as I can see, a lot more about recency bias than historically based. Where history is more of a tipping point in cases of doubt, than anything else. + Show Spoiler +And it's not like there's a huge difference between Effort and Action in the ranking. They're right by each others' side. Action had come back from the army and showed increasingly stronger form, whereas effort hadn't performed really well in any ASL og KSL for a long time. In doubt between the two, I can easily see it tipping towards Action. Ya'll fanboys going apeshit over nothing. But having that said, Effort really had some of the most beautiful ZvT I've seen in a while, except for G1 and G4 which were more on the opposite end of the specter. If power rankings are nothing more than a list that tells you who got the furthest in the last tournament/2 tournaments, then there is zero point to having them - just look at the tournament brackets.
Not even true. If I was making it solely on finishes, then Last would be #1, Jaedong would still be top 5, Rain and SK would both be top5, especially Rain.
Do people here even bother to read the explanations at all?
On October 21 2018 23:06 Incomplete..ReV wrote:I really don't see the problem. Power Rankings are, as far as I can see, a lot more about recency bias than historically based. Where history is more of a tipping point in cases of doubt, than anything else. + Show Spoiler +And it's not like there's a huge difference between Effort and Action in the ranking. They're right by each others' side. Action had come back from the army and showed increasingly stronger form, whereas effort hadn't performed really well in any ASL og KSL for a long time. In doubt between the two, I can easily see it tipping towards Action. Ya'll fanboys going apeshit over nothing. But having that said, Effort really had some of the most beautiful ZvT I've seen in a while, except for G1 and G4 which were more on the opposite end of the specter.
Wow, someone who actually understands the point I was trying to go with this PR. Thank god. And his fantastic play will be reflected in the next PR. Imagine that.
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EPT
