EPTWhat happened to the TLPD? - Page 3
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FO-nTTaX
Johto4942 Posts
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739
Bearded Elder29903 Posts
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Epoxide
Magic Woods9326 Posts
On June 21 2017 02:20 DarkNetHunter wrote: Could someone clarify who actually has ownership of the TLPD topic and would that person mind chiming in on current status and future plans for TLPD? I checked http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/TeamLiquid.net_Staff and there seems to be a few people involved, although no clarity on who leads the section. Currently no one. GMarshal used to be overall TLPD "leader", I used to be for the SOSPA/amateur BW TLPD. prech is/was after me. | ||
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PVJ
Hungary5221 Posts
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FO-nTTaX
Johto4942 Posts
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Peeano
Netherlands5062 Posts
Can't we just abandon TLPD and recreate it in an easier to edit format on LP? We could then fill all tourney results starting from ASL1 to present and go from there. I'd be more than happy to manually fill in all said results. Shoot out to Prech! <3 | ||
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FO-nTTaX
Johto4942 Posts
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thezanursic
5488 Posts
On June 21 2017 05:13 Peeano wrote: Strictly speaking for BW... Can't we just abandon TLPD and recreate it in an easier to edit format on LP? We could then fill all tourney results starting from ASL1 to present and go from there. I'd be more than happy to manually fill in all said results. Shoot out to Prech! <3 Honestly this isn't a too bad of an idea, especially if editing TLPD is that hard, leave SOSPA TLPD as a time capsule of 2012-2017, and start anew for the ASL period. Have a link on it from TLPD, and compile statistics on a more easily editabled fashion so that we avoid more PSTD stricken TLPD mods. | ||
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Epoxide
Magic Woods9326 Posts
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Cele
Germany4016 Posts
On June 21 2017 05:15 FO-nTTaX wrote: As i said, we are building more TLPD like features into Liquipedia, so that isn't out of the question, but especially on older events pre 2007 Liquipedia could use some serious work in the BW section. prech can tell you what is needed there, as he spearheads the BW wiki. that's cool and all, but by virtue of implementation (TLPD is on TL.net, Wiki's are seprate) i think TLPD for a user is faster accessible, contains less info im not looking for atm, so everything elese but out results and ELO rankings, basically. Further, navigating TLPD is actually quite pleasant from a pure users pov. To me it seems, "we need" either a application of Liquipedia that is implemented on TL or a new Database, preferrably with the old TLPD info ported. When foreigner tours are concerned, i can from my experience, that not enough edits and done for LP:BW to warrant it being an "official database". The tours i ran/co worked for/casted for BW include:  http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/German King of the Hill, complete series. LP has 8 editions, we ran 11. Gecko did 90% of the edits, i did the other 10% where i could figure out what to do w/o any understanding for wiki code.A bunch of Cups run by me and Gecko, prizes were Hearthstone and Heroes of the Storm beta acesses. One example here: fine LP page imo! Done by Gecko. [wiki1]http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/Broodwar.de_Hearthstone_Oldschool_Cup[/wiki] On the contrary: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/ICCup Nation League At this time, i was highly involved in the ICCup Team + Show Spoiler +that's the non-korean server where everybody played, until recently. Some relevant tours aren't don't have a page at all. I don't mean to be critical and it would've been me to create the wiki pages for the tours i ran, i got support from you specifically and other in this, FO. I wanna point out: State of the BW LP currently is from my PoV: it's very arbitrary if relevant tours are entered [correctly] into the wiki, or if they are not or incomplete. It depends on "luck" if somebody has the skills and motivation to enter them. TL Staff certainly enters their tours, people like Gecko enter tours they find interesting, some russians just want to run "a fun tour" and have never even opened Liquipedia, speak little to no english and have no idea of coding. Yet their tours are relevant, have the best non-korean players, big prizes and decent coverage. So TL;DR: if LP:BW is intended to be a replacement for TLPD, somebody needs to be in charge to enter all relevant tours and to make a judgement call, about which tours are relevant. In this case, relying on the mass of editors to do it right, will not work in my humble opinion. I don't know enough about LP. I have a good view on the multitude of different tours that were ran in the last years by the non-english speaking Broodwar community and those events are underrepresented in Liquipedia. But if you want LP to be a tournament, player and map Database like TLPD, it needs to contain all relevant tours, maps and players in a given timeframe. | ||
2Pacalypse-
Croatia9510 Posts
But then again, keeping the history of changes is what's mediawiki is all about, so it would make sense not to reinvent the wheel and somehow incorporate it with Liquipedia. | ||
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FO-nTTaX
Johto4942 Posts
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Epoxide
Magic Woods9326 Posts
On June 21 2017 07:09 FO-nTTaX wrote: The thing though Cele is, if a publicly editable thing is not updated by people, what makes you believe another thing would be and if you think updating the wiki is hard or tedious you are for sure not going to enjoy editing TLPD more | ||
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sM.Zik
Canada2549 Posts
 One of the thing I liked the most about TL so many years ago | ||
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Cele
Germany4016 Posts
On June 21 2017 07:09 FO-nTTaX wrote: The thing though Cele is, if a publicly editable thing is not updated by people, what makes you believe another thing would be i don't. I wanted to bring it to your attention merely, as my impression is: you ofc know LP very well, but might not know how much relevant Data is not entered when it comes to foreign BW. I don't have a solution for it; it would only work if one or more persons would be motivated to make sure all relevant Data is entered. If that was already known to you and others in this thread, i wrote a wall of text for nothin (; On June 21 2017 08:54 Epoxide wrote: and if you think updating the wiki is hard or tedious you are for sure not going to enjoy editing TLPD more i had some talk with a TLPD editor about it. You're right, i wouldn't want to do it. | ||
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FO-nTTaX
Johto4942 Posts
On June 21 2017 19:18 Cele wrote: i don't. I wanted to bring it to your attention merely, as my impression is: you ofc know LP very well, but might not know how much relevant Data is not entered when it comes to foreign BW. I don't have a solution for it; it would only work if one or more persons would be motivated to make sure all relevant Data is entered. If that was already known to you and others in this thread, i wrote a wall of text for nothin (; Well at least to me it is painfully obvious. I might not be super active in the BW community or on the BW Liquipedia, but i am very aware of the state of the wikis. | ||
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GeckoXp
Germany2016 Posts
On June 21 2017 07:09 FO-nTTaX wrote: The thing though Cele is, if a publicly editable thing is not updated by people, what makes you believe another thing would be Because Liquipedia is not a prominent tool in the BW community when it comes to analysis related issues. Liquipedia BW first and foremost role used to be to promote strategies, until it shifted to look up several Korean pages. The impression I had was that users mostly took it as kind-of lexicon, a very static page. You basically view the wiki from nowaday's point of view through the eye of a developer. Obviously, Liquipedia has a huge potential when it comes to SMW. Yet, SMW was barely used and is a very abstract idea to readers. However, to become a contributor, you first have to realize what the wiki could do and how you would put it to use. Liquipedia doesn't really achieve to show its potential, thus making it harder to recruit more editors, especially among the ranks of the younger people, who're used to get everything they want in the easiest way possible. You basically exclusively attract die-hards to a very specific subject, or people interesting in coding, but not in content. Hence the low editor numbers. This trend might be different from newer titles, which had the fortune that both organizers and casters used Liquipedia as resource. Cele's argument has a basis, as an easy accessible interface would at least make entering data easier. The rest of his suggestions is already there, at least to some extent. When it comes to judging the "relevance" of an event, you have editors/reviewers/admins in place. Btw, judging about relevance sort-of annoys me already, remembering some TL.net "guidelines" about relevance in the past. Sounds good for Korea, doesn't work for foreign BW. | ||
BigFan
TLADT24920 Posts
+ Show Spoiler [off-topic] + That and I also really don't like how LP recently changed its format. imo, it's worse now than before, sorry guys | ||
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SirKibbleX
United States479 Posts
Someone explain why this is so hard. Edit: Most databases support different levels of GRANT privileges, so it's possible to ensure that someone only has the ability to INSERT or READ records, and not UPDATE or DELETE or make schema changes. Someone with root access should be able to update the schema to make this possible. Just give more people access with limited privileges. And run offsite backups with a cronjob every month or two. | ||
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BigFan
TLADT24920 Posts
On June 22 2017 03:02 SirKibbleX wrote: Okay, what the shit. I don't claim to be some high and mighty dev, but 18 weeks to do an INSERT statement on a database? Motherfucker, someone here should be able to scrape the existing TLPD and format and copy it into a standard MYSQL database. Hell, I could stand up a mysql DB and format it in a matter of hours, and give you an API to access and operate on it (with documentation!) within days. Hell, I could just set up a quick little wordpress/laravel website to give you a nice shiny front-end even. Someone explain why this is so hard. umm BD was making a joke lol. He wasn't being serious. | ||
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