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zensccc
Bangladesh12 Posts
I would not mind to lock my bases under F9-F12 and spawn points and critical places under F2-F6. 2. Do you consider changing the binding keys? Like i'd love to swap ctrl with space bar. It's unnatural to use pinky finger to bind control groups. Thumb on space bar is way more comfortable!! | ||
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Gruntt
United States175 Posts
However.... Now whenever I see muta micro at a high level, I'll just not be as impressed. A small bit of me will think "well, the shit used to be tougher to do." I also feel this game has lasted 19 years. It did NOT last 19 years due to casual players. Casual players stuck around for a couple years, and then it was GG for them. The Korean professional scene is the ONLY reason Starcraft has survived at this level for this long. This is a gameplay system that has held against the test of time. Everyone had the SAME TOOLS. Everyone had to deal with the SAME PROBLEMS. It was hard as hell using patrol to react slightly quicker. It was hard as hell pressing keys all the way on the right side of the keyboard with 100% accuracy all the time. Watching the greats gods of this game play has been a major joy of my life. Now, I will soon see those gods play it with easier tools. I'll now see the basketball rim lowered to a height that player prefers it to be. I'll now see the bobsled shaped more properly for the sledders, with the exact type of weight they want it to be. I now get to watch the driver choose the type of wheels he or she likes, rather than use the same car. When you see someone in World of Warcraft have an addon assist them by reminding them of every single mechanic and every timer so that they don't mess up... are you impressed by the player? or.. the tool they are using? So basically this is how I see it: -Everyone will take advantages of the same hotkeys -Everyone will be on equal footing -Every time we watch a game, we'll think "well, it used to be harder to do that, but I guess it's easier now" -The magic of boxer's incredible lockdown won't be as magical anymore. Tell me... what is better for the competitive scene? We already balanced the hell out of this game and it's PERFECT. It had its patches and it had its balancing changes. Changing hotkeys is something blizzard could've done back when the game came out. They chose not to, and it became one of the greatest games I've ever played. Now we're fucking with that perfect formula and people are cool with it? You really want to see Jaedong do muta micro and think about how all that insane practice he put in it for incredible precision is now on a joke level for people below him? This is the one single game we CANNOT allow the casuals to mess up. Call it elitism or whatever, but casuals did NOT keep this game alive. The godly players from Korea kept this game alive. There has been no other video game in history to hold such an incredible status for so long that has not been propped up by casuals spending money on it. I want to miss keys. I want to think about how difficult it is to do, because the ONLY REASON I WATCH THIS GAME is because it's INSANELY hard to play at a high level. I'm IMPRESSED by the players. Don't ruin the viewership by making the game easier to play. It has lasted 19 years and needs no change to the gameplay... period. | ||
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Rainalcar
Croatia350 Posts
Back to the point, there is space for improvement in BW, it is not Gospel, and calling rebindable keys balance-breaking is laughable (to use the often cited pun, "balance" it with maps if it's such an issue). | ||
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Sadiv
11 Posts
Brood War actually can be resurected big time with SC:R, the scene can grow again. A lot of players from sc2 will switch, some new players will come in. But the game needs to feel fresh to get this going. Besides, even with custom hotkeys the game is still the hardest to play mechanicaly. Players will be able to do things a bit better, but doing things perfect will still be impossible, because the ceiling is sky high. Maybe we will see some plays, that were not possible before and that I think is a good thing. | ||
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Cascade
Australia5405 Posts
It would be interesting to know what the top korean players think about this. How big difference do they think it'll make? Will they change hotkeys? Which and how many? They must have talked about this on stream (right?), but I haven't seen anything in this thread. Maybe I missed it... Anyone knows or can find out? Even the pros cant know for sure until it's been in place for a while of course, but they should be the ones in the best position to predict the impact of this. | ||
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ProMeTheus112
France2027 Posts
there is no way ability to change hotkeys like this will impact seriously watching high level matches... I don't believe it at all, lol there is a lot to be impressed more than the distance between some keys I just think this is really nice, not that many strategy games have a hotkey remaping interface do they? I think of the older ones anyway.. it's not necessarily needed, but for bw its really good, because its really tough to control, and because people play it a lot, etc.. I can see where one could think, shit now I have to think about all my hotkeys like spells, should I move them to a easier place or not, will I be disadvantaged if I don't, is that the case though? I also wonder, can you save your hotkeys file and quickly import it when you play on a different computer? can you upload it from your online bnet account? | ||
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WhosQuany
Germany257 Posts
On May 20 2017 04:09 Lazare1969 wrote: When you join a game they need to add an togglable option so people can see who is using custom hotkeys or not in the game lobby. lol why? | ||
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dibban
Sweden1279 Posts
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Starecat
932 Posts
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TibbersCute
19 Posts
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SHODAN
United Kingdom1060 Posts
On May 22 2017 16:30 Gruntt wrote:it's PERFECT let me just activate my BW elitist defense matrix... brood war is not perfect. brood war is as close to perfect as any RTS has ever got. no wonder that old school players are in arms about even the slightest changes. if I played brood war for 25 years, I'd probably feel the same way as you. given that sc2 is in such a disastrous state, it's no wonder that brood war fans are strongly opposed to any new changes resembling sc2. but in theory, brood war could be improved. if all the planets aligned, there would be a way. "it's PERFECT" - this is the emotional response, which I don't agree with. "it's close to perfect, but any attempt to improve the gameplay system will likely do more harm than good." - this is the conservative response, which is fair enough. "it's close to perfect. let's change one variable (hotkeys)." - this is where I'm at. "it's close to perfect. let's change one variable (hotkeys) and also another variable (multiple building selection or unlimited unit selection)." - this is where I draw the line. for all its disappointments, I think the hotkey system of sc2 is a triumph. I like it because it does not intrude on the gameplay. the sc2 hotkey system is designed to translate your thoughts to your hands to action on screen in the fastest, most intuitive way possible. maximum control, maximum potential. even though I dislike the game overall, I still feel the urge to play it simply because the keyboard dance is so satisfying. on the other hand, the intrusive hotkey system of brood war is a core part of the gameplay. why do you like it? I'm not sure why you enjoy stretching your left hand across the keyboard. when you watch the pros, do you think, "wow, Bisu really nailed those stretches to 9"? for you, the keyboard acrobatics are part of what makes the game. for me, the action on screen is more important. I believe that taking the onus off keyboard acrobatics could spell new opportunities for pro players to show their skill in other ways. it seems like the only way to settle this debate is testing at the pro level. I'm not convinced by the sure-shot claims that re-mappable control groups would buff zerg. here's my theory: the benefits of re-mappable control groups would be balanced out by the increased effort it takes to assign and edit those control groups. maybe those additional zergling control groups are not worth the effort. maybe box-clicking and using the mini-map is still the best way to manage a maxed army. either way, it is a perfect test scenario because there is only one variable in play. | ||
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404AlphaSquad
839 Posts
On May 23 2017 01:59 SHODAN wrote: for all its disappointments, I think the hotkey system of sc2 is a triumph. I like it because it does not intrude on the gameplay. the sc2 hotkey system is designed to translate your thoughts to your hands to action on screen in the fastest, most intuitive way possible. I agree with your post except on this point. The sc2 hotkey system does interfere with gameplay. Rapidfire is one example for it. In fact, snipe had to be balanced around it. Then again BW doesnt have smartcast, so this chance is off the table. Alot of the BW elitists overreact tbh. One could argue right clicking to set a rally point, was just a patch that ruined the game. But the game did fine with this ez-mode patch too. Do people really think they are gonna start losing/winning because of hotkey changes, then they are sad and don't want BW to keep growing. | ||
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SHODAN
United Kingdom1060 Posts
On May 23 2017 02:09 404AlphaSquad wrote: I agree with your post except on this point. The sc2 hotkey system does interfere with gameplay. Rapidfire is one example for it. In fact, snipe had to be balanced around it. Then again BW doesnt have smartcast, so this chance is off the table. the good old days when sc2 had to be balanced around Mvp | ||
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Bisu-Fan
Russian Federation3329 Posts
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ninazerg
United States7291 Posts
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StarscreamG1
Portugal1652 Posts
On May 22 2017 07:03 KrOjah wrote: Ya I think it's more design issues. Not that I think Sc2 is bad at all, but it did not reach its potential. Not doing better in Korea was the biggest fail. Personally I haven't played the game in years and doubt I ever will again. Nothing wrong with the pathing mind, it actually a less volatile game in that regard. Units react well to instructions generally. When I talk about pathing I mean the way they move, not how they response. One storm, 2 banes can finish a game because of that. I don't know if you played Starbow, it was a great "SC2", and had all the mechanics easiness. So yeah, we can agree it was not about easier meachanics that SC2 was not a hit and so volatile. | ||
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Jealous
10088 Posts
On May 23 2017 01:15 TibbersCute wrote: It's completely false that the game is only alive due to Korea. Personally I was very active in 2007-2010 in the map making scene, and didn't even realize Korea was a thing until around 2010. lol User was warned for this post | ||
FlaShFTW
United States9977 Posts
On May 21 2017 20:03 Cascade wrote: If you make sc:r as a gift to the people already playing sc:bw, then I agree with you, makes sense. If you want to bring in more people to the game, then I think it's important to understand the potential newcomers or returners. Not blindly following whatever people want of course, but take into consideration. I get the impression that people are a bit split between these two angles of approach and I think blizzard is trying to do changes that they think fit both of these. Brood War is brood war at the end of the day. People just wanted a graphic redesign with some small tweaks to how the game operated from a logistics standpoint, not a gameplay standpoint. Blizzard did this as basically a gift to korea. | ||
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CarbonTwelve
Australia525 Posts
On May 23 2017 09:34 FlaShFTW wrote: Brood War is brood war at the end of the day. People just wanted a graphic redesign with some small tweaks to how the game operated from a logistics standpoint, not a gameplay standpoint. Blizzard did this as basically a gift to korea. You say "people" as though you know the thoughts of everyone interested in the game. The ones who get to decide how the game is designed is Blizzard themselves, and the people they choose to listen to, and hence who "has a say", is up to them. There seems to me to be a lot of attitude here from brood war fans that this is their game, and it belongs to them, not the 'casuals' or people new to the game. It really isn't. It's Blizzard's game, and they'll do what they think is best, which may mean designing things in ways that aren't representative of what old-school fans might want (and it should be pointed out again that not even within old school fans does there seem to be a consensus on what is best). I don't think it's appropriate to be telling people who's allowed to have an opinion on the game design. | ||
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Dazed.
Canada3301 Posts
Blizzard wants what we want because were the only demographic that actually realistically matters in regards to broodwar. | ||
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