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Bill307
Canada9103 Posts
On January 13 2007 06:19 Aphelion02 wrote:
The main thing is, I can't figure out why BGHers who have even been exposed to low money would stick with BGH. Is it cause its easier to find games, playing with a team, or afraid of being a noob at low money and losing their status as elite players in their own realms? That seems like picking the blue pill to me.
In addition to the fact that they probably see more depth in BGH than you or I (which I guess is the aim of your post: to find out what they know about BGH that we don't), different people weigh different forms of entertainment and fun differently. In the end it'll probably come down to these individual differences for why people prefer one or the other (which results in repetitive posts like "but BGH has less of X than low-money" and so on).
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On January 13 2007 08:52 Bill307 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2007 06:19 Aphelion02 wrote:
The main thing is, I can't figure out why BGHers who have even been exposed to low money would stick with BGH. Is it cause its easier to find games, playing with a team, or afraid of being a noob at low money and losing their status as elite players in their own realms? That seems like picking the blue pill to me. In addition to the fact that they probably see more depth in BGH than you or I (which I guess is the aim of your post: to find out what they know about BGH that we don't), different people weigh different forms of entertainment and fun differently. In the end it'll probably come down to these individual differences for why people prefer one or the other (which results in repetitive posts like "but BGH has less of X than low-money" and so on).
 It's just like what Bill just said, "different people weigh different forms of entertainment and fun differently." Another reason would be the people around them. I have 2 accounts, One I play with BGHers, and the other I play low money maps with my clan, Go)G. The people around me in each account influence me to play different maps. But I feel more excited in playing BGH because of the atmosphere of the 2v2. It is so breathtaking and each move can determine the outcome, just like how 1v1 gives the players.
And, Testie and Idra have played kOOlam and Babotoss. I am not sure how many games, but I've just seen one of them.
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On January 13 2007 09:20 Sacajawea wrote:
koolam reps please
Exactly my thoughts. Enuff talk, let's seem some action!
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Some of koolam's replays can be found at BGHers.com in the downloads section.
But the replays of the games that testie,idra, koolam, and others play, I won't upload it.
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On January 13 2007 06:13 Hot_Bid wrote:
gandalf, i think we CAN safely assume that the top low money guys are more talented than the BGH guys.
we can all pretty much agree that the main advantage the top BGH players have is that they've played the map more than testie or mondragon or whoever.
if testie and mondragon played BGH as much (or even 1/2 as much) as the BGH guys did, even you said that they'd win. that translates to more talent.
i mean take it to the extreme, if we have Nada and Savior playing BGH, less than a dozen games and they'd be the best BGH players. yes it'd take longer than the top foreigners (less talent) but the potential is still there.
regardless thats not what this showmatch is about.
Nada/Savior is different, they could beat anyone without playing the map, just looking at it before hand.
I'm only saying its possible the the talent-advantage testie has MIGHT not be enough to overcome the extra practice advantage BGH players have.
Also talent has different aspects. Talent could be talent in mechanical skills, or in strategical analyses etc etc. A great header isnt always a great dribbler. Some shitty players make great coaches, and some great coaches make shitty players. Obviously testie has more talent when it comes to strategical game play. Mechanical talent, I'm not so sure. Maybe, maybe not. But I believe in this regard testie and koolam would be very, very close. Also, on BGH, strategical play matters very little as opposed to mechanical/technical strengths.
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Let's throw in a fastest player too. 
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On January 13 2007 05:43 IdrA wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2007 03:38 Gandalf wrote:
Players like koolam have had 9 years of predominantly protoss practice. Testie, on the other hand, is a random player, which means roughly a third of his matches have given him protoss over the same amount of time. The OBVIOUS conclusion is that the ONLY way testie can have better control is IF he has GREATER INNATE TALENT. I fully agree that this is ENTIRELY possible, but you must also admit the possibility that it is NOT, and that koolam might actually have greater technical potential. Or are you going to state that there is no way in hell koolam could have better zealot/goon micro because testie is testie and is a low map player?
low maps generally lead to more micro and more different kinds of micro meaning that he has more experience with unit control in general, but i dont think i ever played koolam so i dont really know how they compare. those games were fun, we should play more of them.
Yep, low maps need more micro overall + more diverse micro, and low players are obviouly superior in this regard. BGH players will definitely be poor with mid and late game units.
Early game micro I think top BGH players will be around as good as top low players. A little less, or maybe a little more, but with very little difference. Why? Because every single decent skilled game in BGH involves hardcore early unit micro.
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On January 13 2007 05:57 Ghin wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2007 02:01 Gandalf wrote:
I'm not here to defend BGH players or to argue they are superior in any way i laughed out loud
hmmm....why...I'm just here to make sure people dont start attacking poor old me
I mean, what if the BGHers lose 0-15 and everyone starts flaming me haha
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United States5262 Posts
Everybody wants a piece of TL.net nowadays. Korean websites... BGH websites... it's never going to end. Haha. We pwn, I love it.
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On January 13 2007 07:27 MYM.Testie wrote:
...
The scores are wrong on BGH..
Testie / Daze lost 3-4 didn't we?
Testie / Idra won I can't remember.
Testie / Mondragon / Idra went 5-0 (but Kural aka Koolam did not play)
Testie / Kural are 17-0 vs BGHers. He's an amazing ally. And he will be difficult to beat on BGH & possibly low.
He's quite talented. I really like how his units are always moving, and killing peoples at a greater rate. He's used to constant warfare with his units. I'm sure with enough practice, and if he were a low player, he'd still be known.
You/daze lost 1-3.
You/idra won 4-3.
Trust me, these scores are accurate. If you play I always make sure I know the score.
I think I can have fwiffo dig out the thread for this if he's got it archived, if you like.
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On January 13 2007 08:14 Bill307 wrote:Show nested quote +On January 13 2007 05:44 IdrA wrote:On January 13 2007 05:40 Hot_Bid wrote:
er isnt this going to be between normal forum members, not the elite? in that case why is everyone talking about if testie would win on bgh
all its going to do is expose how bad normal forum members of TL are on bgh and how bad their forum members are on low just from glancing over the site it seems like theirs is more of a small community site whereas tl.net draws a far wider range of people, their average forum member is gonna be closer to their best in skill than tl's i think. Agreed. My money is on BGHers.com . In addition to your point, they specialize on BGH and are going to have much better timing and knowledge of strategies on that map than almost anyone here (the only exception I can think of is Testie).
Yeah, this notion is spot on!
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On January 13 2007 08:44 EscPlan9 wrote:
Gandalf, are you just making up the scores on the past TL games on BGH? Testie and Idra, both who played the matches, have refuted your claims. It's like you're just pulling the scores out your ass the whole time to make your argument. If you don't know what the scores were, don't mention what they were, it's very disingenious, especially when you try to use it to support your argument.
Relax and stop being so offensive. The scores I mentioned are 100% accurate. BGHers.com made a big deal out of this cuz they won with an overall score of 6-5(3-4 + 3-1). I believe I have at least some of those reps, but I'll have to look for them. I believe the admins of bghers.com might be pull out their old news report (it was on the older version of the site).
Neither testie nor idra have "refuted" the scores I stated. Idra only added they won 5-0 (vs non-hDn). Testie metioned different scores, but stated he does not remember clearly.
I have absolutely no reason to lie. Why the fuck would I? God knows how many people saw and followed those matches. I would have to be both retarded AND unscrupulous to make up scores -_-
Whats more, I was rooting for TESTIE during those games.
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wierd gandalf is about half this thread.
well, what do you think a lot of low money players played before low money? BGH! before that? FASTEST!
i know for a fact theres still a lot of people that can play bgh here
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I could release our BGH replays if you'd like and gather them up and upload them.
The ones of Testie/Mondi/Idra & Me and Koolam
I think Daze / I's were already uploaded to bgh.net some time ago but I can include them as well.
When allied, koolam outplays me in a lot of the games. Often i'm zerg, and have been rushed, or had to go all lings early yet not quite dead but can no longer build helpful units, so i sunken and macro and while I do that, without even building cannons for defense he trusts his units and uses them well that he can take armies that are bigger than his out. Last game he did that I thought to myself.. "if I had any other ally they'd of lost and blamed me for not having units to help them."
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I've got seven reps from the testie/idra/daze vs koolam/merf/babotoss. 4 of testie/idra vs them, 3 of testie/daze vs them. I'm not sure if its ok to upload them though -_-
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On January 13 2007 09:46 MYM.Testie wrote:
Often i'm zerg, and have been rushed, or had to go all lings early yet not quite dead but can no longer build helpful units, so i sunken and macro and while I do that, without even building cannons for defense he trusts his units and uses them well that he can take armies that are bigger than his out. Last game he did that I thought to myself.. "if I had any other ally they'd of lost and blamed me for not having units to help them."
LOL.
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Merf/Koolam pwn everyone on that map and of the times that a friend of mine and I have played them we got beat very handily. They have awesome teamwork and they play very much like its a low map while still powering off one base because its BGH. Ive never seen them play 1v1 on BGH so Im not sure of their skill level.
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Yeah I've never seen koolam play 1;1 BGH ever, but I've heard he is good. I saw the replays of vatos[locos]og beating fayth 6-1 on BGH 6v7. 6v7 BGH is a UMS where the map is rigged so that the players spawn at the 6 o'clock and 7 o'clock. Games are fast and furious and micro intensive because of the proximity.
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Someone should interview kOOlam and see what he thinks of testie's skill on BGH, it would be a cool idea.
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EPT
