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The greatest season of OSL/MSL ever?

Forum Index > BW General
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GTR
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
51418 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-07 09:08:54
July 06 2014 09:00 GMT
#1
Inspired by the greatest game of BW ever thread...

Let's go through each OSL/KPGA/MSL season one-by-one shall we? I'll try my best to remember storylines and stuff from each.

OSL
PKO '99 - First ever major Starcraft league
Hanaro OSL - First time league on the new OGN channel, first (and only) foreigner to win an OSL (Grrrr...)
Freechal OSL - First OSL played at the Megaweb Studio in COEX, First OSL to have an external venue for the finals. Legend of the Fall is created.
Hanbitsoft OSL - First instance of the 'Royal Roader' (Boxer)
Coca-Cola OSL - First instance of the Lim/Jin-rok Rivalry (Boxer vs Yellow)
SKY 2001 OSL - Legend of the Fall comes back. Third foreigner to play in an OSL (Asmodey, after Pillars and Grrrr...).
NATE OSL - 'The Forgotten OSL' due to the 2002 World Cup running at the same time.
SKY 2002 OSL - Legend of the Fall returns (Reach). Fourth (and last) foreigner in an OSL (ElkY).
Panasonic OSL - Nada royal roads. Last appearance of GARIMTO and many other veterans, signifying the end of the 'first-generation' of Starcraft professionals.
Olympus OSL - Yellow loses opportunity to secure an OSL. Beginning of the 'second-generation' of Starcraft professionals.

mycube OSL - Boxer vs Joyo. Baseball stadium finals. Paradoxx ruined Zergs.
NHN OSL - Silent_Control cheeses his way to 3rd place. Veteran Zeus finally makes it to an OSL final, only to be stopped by Nal_rA.
Gillette OSL - First OSL played in the renovated Megaweb studio. First appearance of iloveoov and JulyZerg, who royal roads this season. Boxer fails to qualify for an OSL for the first time.
EVER 2004 OSL - Boxer returns all the way from the qualifiers to make it to the final, dispatching long-time rival Yellow on the way in dramatic fashion. However, he is stopped by his protege, iloveoov.
IOPS OSL - Second peak of Nada. First league to ever have only one representative of a race (Reach, Protoss).
EVER 2005 OSL - July's second title.
So1 OSL - Golden Mouse created. Boxer's attempts to win the Golden Mouse ended by Royal Roader Anytime, thus resurrecting the myth of The Legend of the Fall.
Shinhan 2005 OSL - First of four OSL's sponsored by Shinhan Bank consecutively. iloveoov sweeps the finals 3-0 vs July.
Shinhan 2006 OSL S1 - First OSL to move to a 24 player tournament. Casy gets luckiest bracket ever and wins.
Shinhan 2006 OSL S2 - Nada eludes personal tragedy and the Legend of the Fall to win the first Golden Mouse trophy. First OSL to be played at the newly built e-Sports Stadium in iPark Mall, Yongsan.
Shinhan 2006 OSL S3 - Savior confirms his 'bonjwa' status by finally winning an OSL title. The 'third-generation' of Starcraft professionals begin to take over.

Daum OSL - Return to the 16 player tournament format. First OSL for 'wonderkid' Flash who places fourth. GGPlay is the first ever player to win a final down two sets.
EVER 2007 OSL - Jaedong royal roads. First instance of 'Taek-Bang-Leessang' all appearing in an OSL.
Bacchus 2008 OSL - Flash wins his first OSL title. First instance of a map being removed halfway through the tournament (Demon's Forest).
EVER 2008 OSL - First OSL to introduce the 36-man format. July comes out of nowhere and acquires the second Golden Mouse.
Incruit OSL - After two second-place finishes, Stork finally wins an OSL. Fantasy revolutionizes TvZ with his mech build.
Batoo OSL - Fantasy loses his second consecutive OSL final.
Bacchus 2009 OSL - Jaedong acquires the third Golden Mouse and is the first back-to-back champion since Boxer in 2001.
EVER 2009 OSL - Flash dominates the competition and marks the beginning of his 'god' reign.
Korean Air OSL S1 - Greatest OSL finals venue ever? Effort takes the surprise win over Flash.
Korean Air OSL S2 - First OSL finals overseas (Shanghai, China). First (and only) Leessang OSL final. Flash claims the fourth (and final) Golden Mouse.
Bacchus 2010 OSL - Fantasy finally wins an OSL.
Jin Air OSL - First OSL after a six month hiatus. Return to the 16 man format. Jangbi fulfills Legend of the Fall.
tving OSL - The last Starleague. First ever back-to-back finalists. Consecutive wins for Jangbi.

KPGA/MSL
KPGA 1st Tour - Dunno?
Reebok KPGA - Beginning of Nada's first dominance era.
Pepsi Twist KPGA - It's Nada again.
Baskin and Robbins KPGA - Nada wins three in a row, foreshadows what would happen again in the Panasonic OSL a few weeks later.

Stout MSL - First MSL since geMBC rebrands to MBCgame, new studio at Sejong Game World. New double-elimination tournament format.
TriGem MSL - Yellow once again fails to win a major title. Beginning of iloveoov's period of dominance.
HanaFOS CenGame MSL - Dunno?
SPRIS MSL - Nal_rA recall game.

You Are The Golf King MSL - First (and only) MSL final that was Bo7.
UZOO MSL - Beginning of sAviOr's dominance era.
CYON MSL - Dunno?
Pringles MSL S1 - Format change to Ro16 dual-tournament format. First MSL in newly renovated studio at Sejong Game World.
Pringles MSL S2 - sAviOr's third title.

GOMTV MSL S1 - 3/3 revolution. sAviOr falls from grace. Beginning of 18 month sponsorship by GOMTV. First MSL in new studio at COEX.
GOMTV MSL S2 - Bisu wins back to back MSL's. Format changes to Ro32.
GOMTV MSL S3 - Mind upsets Bisu in finals.
GOMTV MSL S4 - Jaedong wins first MSL.
Arena MSL - First MSL in new studio at LOOX. Birth of 'the pretender'.
ClubDay Online MSL - Bisu earns third MSL title.

Lost Saga MSL -
Avalon MSL - Zerg mirrors all day.
NATE MSL - Infamous power outage final.
Hana Daetoo Securities MSL -
Bigfile MSL - Awesome semi-finals.
PDPOP MSL -
ABC Mart MSL - The last ever MSL.




Personally for me;
Best OSL - EVER 2004, but tving has a really close spot to my heart because I was there for the semi-finals and finals live in person.
Best MSL - Bigfile MSL




+ Show Spoiler [스폰서 캐치프레이즈 (Ignore pls)] +
스마트폰의 시작, 마이큐브! The start of the smartphone, mycube!
따라올 수 없는 재미, 한게임! Unmatched fun, Hangame!
내 생애 첫 면도는 질레트와 함께! / 넘버 원은 넘버 원 다워야 한다, 질레트! Your first and only shave should be Gillette! / Number one is supposed to be number one, Gillette!
나를 새롭게 만드는 휴대폰, EVER! Create me a new cell phone, EVER!
보여주고 싶은 MP3, IOPS! Show me your MP3 player, IOPS!
나를 새롭게 하는 휴대폰, EVER! My new cell phone, EVER!
모든 휴대폰은 So1에서 만난다, 오픈 모바일 So1! Meet all the cell phones at So1, Open Mobile So1!
처음부터 끝까지 함께하는 신한은행! Together from the beginning to the end, Shinhan Bank!
도전하는 젊음과 함께하는 더 큰 감동! The challenge of youth, and an even bigger sensation that everyone experiences!
UCC 세상, 다음! UCC World, Daum!
세상의 SHOW, 에버와 즐겨라! World's SHOW, enjoy EVER!
지치지 않는 열정, 박카스! Tireless enthusiasm, Bacchus!
더하는 즐거움, 함께 나누는 감동, EVER! Attaching pleasure in sharing emotion, EVER!
나만의 취업전략, 인크루트! My own employment strategy, Incruit!
이제는 바투 한판! Play Batoo now!
나를 강하게 하는 친구, 박카스! Be stronger with friends, Bacchus!
유쾌한 상상, 넘치는 즐거움, EVER! Imagine delight and enjoyment, EVER!
새로운 세상을 여는 첫 걸음, 대한항공! The first step in opening a whole new world, Korean Air!
꿈을 향한 비상, 대한항공! Flying towards a dream, Korean Air!
당신의 진짜 피로 회복제, 박카스! The real remedy to fatigue, Bacchus!
색다른 도전의 시작, 진에어! The beginning of a different challenge, Jin Air!
세상의 모든 동영상을 담다, 티빙! All of the world's videos in a box, Tving!

Commentator
evilfatsh1t
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia8632 Posts
July 06 2014 11:00 GMT
#2
god i miss bw
Epoxide
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Magic Woods9326 Posts
July 06 2014 11:20 GMT
#3
2006 Shinhan Season 2 is just too amazing for me
LiquipediaSouma: EU MM is just Russian Roulette. Literally.
Highways
Profile Joined July 2005
Australia6103 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-06 11:21:40
July 06 2014 11:21 GMT
#4
Shinhan 2006 OSL S3 . sAviOr winning on all the anti-zerg maps.

On July 06 2014 20:00 evilfatsh1t wrote:
god i miss bw


Yea, nothing about SC2 is memorable at all. Everything is attack move, four years after release there are barely pimpest plays or insane micro vids.
#1 Terran hater
Chameleon
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
United States604 Posts
July 06 2014 11:31 GMT
#5
I'm gonna have to go back and watch a bunch of games to jog my memory, but i remember GOMTV3 (MInd vs Bisu finals) having some really exciting games, for me probably that one or Pringles off the top of my head. EVER 2004 OSL was insanely good, but I also like EVER 2008 (July's golden mouse).
TL's #1 Horang2 fan
Titusmaster6
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
United States5937 Posts
July 06 2014 11:37 GMT
#6
Savior's OSL win was pretty sick. I've seen pretty much everything from 2004 til the end of bw and I honestly can not pick out a "best" season. So much nostalgia just reading those short storylines. I want to rewatch them all
Shorts down shorts up, BOOM, just like that.
zulu_nation8
Profile Blog Joined May 2005
China26351 Posts
July 06 2014 11:39 GMT
#7
Ever 2005 OSL was probably my favorite, it had the July vs. Goodfriend forte game.
Rigodon666
Profile Joined November 2006
Canada183 Posts
July 06 2014 11:58 GMT
#8
Shinhan 2006 OSL S2 for me was solid all around. I was really invoved in it.
Shinhan 2006 OSL S3 was one of the best when it came to drama and quality of games too.
I'll call the guy who will call Nada
DarkPlasmaBall
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
United States44116 Posts
July 06 2014 12:04 GMT
#9
EVER 2004 OSL - Boxer returns all the way from the qualifiers to make it to the final, dispatching long-time rival Yellow on the way in dramatic fashion. However, he is stopped by his protege, iloveoov.


and

GOMTV MSL S1 - 3/3 revolution. sAviOr falls from grace. Beginning of 18 month sponsorship by GOMTV. First MSL in new studio at COEX.


for me
"There is nothing more satisfying than looking at a crowd of people and helping them get what I love." ~Day[9] Daily #100
Qikz
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United Kingdom12022 Posts
July 06 2014 12:10 GMT
#10
Bacchus 2010 OSL - Fantasy finally wins an OSL


Best OSL finals and entire OSL ever.
FanTaSy's #1 Fan | STPL Caster/Organiser | SKT BEST KT | https://twitch.tv/stpl
neptunusfisk
Profile Blog Joined July 2012
2286 Posts
July 06 2014 12:30 GMT
#11
The Tving one had this bittersweet apocalyptic feel. Everyone was playing out of their minds for the last chance to win. Ro8, ro4, finals, all were sick matches. Especially Jangbi vs Zero. That was tense.
maru G5L pls
neobowman
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Canada3324 Posts
July 06 2014 12:58 GMT
#12
Tyving OSL had a really disappointing finals though. I still made a mousepad out of it though.

For me, there were a couple of big OSLs, but I generally rank them based on the finals. Ever 2007 because that was an amazing comeback for Jaedong. First game loss but absolute domination over the next 3 games. Ever 2008 because literally no one predicted July to come in from nowhere let alone win the finals 3-0. Batoo for the sheer wtf factor of the finals (Jaedongggguuuu). Korean Air 1 was great but Effort completely wrecked the event planner's plans XD. To be frank, I'd probably pick Jin Air OSL just because it was literally the least likely comeback I've ever seen. Batoo was pretty crazy but Jangbi's games were insane.
Jenia6109
Profile Blog Joined December 2008
Russian Federation1612 Posts
July 06 2014 13:10 GMT
#13
Last two OSLs, so good for a Protoss fan and overall so many awesome games
INnoVation TY Maru | Classic Stats Dear sOs Zest herO | Rogue Dark soO
hitthat
Profile Joined January 2010
Poland2262 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-06 13:27:55
July 06 2014 13:26 GMT
#14
Bigfile MSL- great finals, semis plus Calm-Fantasy lulz XD
Shameless BroodWar separatistic, elitist, fanaticaly devoted puritan fanboy.
VGhost
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States3613 Posts
July 06 2014 14:10 GMT
#15
In terms of finals, Jaedong vs. fantasy at Batoo was probably the best set of games I remember... closely followed byt JangBi vs. fantasy at Jin Air. But I have to mention the one that got me into watching Starcraft, years and years ago - the TriGem MSL (iloveoov vs. YellOw).
#4427 || I am not going to scan a ferret.
chongu
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Malaysia2585 Posts
July 06 2014 14:41 GMT
#16
Batoo OSL - Reason being - I was a hardcore JD fanboy back then.

A close second would be the second last BW OSL, featuring Jangbi vs Fantasy. It was nail-bitingly close, best PvT series ever.

SC2 is to BW, what coke is to wine.
N.geNuity
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
United States5112 Posts
July 06 2014 15:42 GMT
#17
pdpop should be recognized for snow vs jaedong.

nostalgia hitting me harder for incruit osl (fantasy osl run), but digging through some liquipedias I'm not sure what I would call the best from the elimination brackets, and I can't really remember as much of the group stage (eg like leta pure ro36 in ever osl).
iu, seungah, yura, taeyeon, hyosung, lizzy, suji, sojin, jia, ji eun, eunji, soya, younha, jiyeon, fiestar, sinb, jung myung hoon godtier. BW FOREVERR
Chameleon
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
United States604 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-06 16:42:11
July 06 2014 15:44 GMT
#18
Bacchus 2008, despite demons forest being stupid (and Flash getting embarrassed by Rock on it) was really good.

The final bracket had some awesome matchups in it
[image loading]

and it had my favorite intro of all (I still associate that song with pro BW, it just stuck in my mind as the starcraft progaming anthem)

TL's #1 Horang2 fan
chaosTheory_14cc
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
Canada1270 Posts
July 06 2014 17:09 GMT
#19
Ever 2009 OSL and Arena MSL
SynC[gm]
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
United States3127 Posts
July 06 2014 18:45 GMT
#20
First ever OSL I ever watched was EVER 2008 when July beat BeSt. Back then, I remember watching Luxury beat FlaSh and was like "Oh, cool, he used Guardians." Back then, I had no clue who anyone was and didn't know that FlaSh had just won an OSL. Luxury ended up being one of my favorite players, and oh how I regret that now...

Favorite season of OSL/MSL either has to be Arena MSL or Lost Saga MSL. Arena MSL because of fOrGG's epic run to victory, beating KaL in that epic 5-game series including the two games on Colosseum. Then, he beats FlaSh in the semis and then dismantles his then-teammate Jaedong and comes out of nowhere to win. Lost Saga MSL probably because of the awesome group selections, where maGma talked crap about Bisu and anyone that doubted him, sAviOr and his decent run, and my then-favorite player Luxury winning it all.

I really liked the MSL's... Enjoyed Kim Min Chul and Lee Seung Won.
twitch.tv/dizzywee
xccam
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
Great Britain1150 Posts
July 06 2014 19:09 GMT
#21
Incruit OSL and the Jin Air OSLs for me

Nate MSL

As an aside, bisu running at the camera in slow mo on the Bacchus 08 OSL intro kills me every time (its at like 0:45, its so funny).
Plexa
Profile Blog Joined October 2005
Aotearoa39261 Posts
July 06 2014 19:16 GMT
#22
So1 is the correct answer. EVER04 also acceptable. Shinhan S3 not bad either.
Administrator~ Spirit will set you free ~
Caihead
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Canada8550 Posts
July 06 2014 19:30 GMT
#23
I think it would be much much easier to identify a worst OSL/MSL, every OSL/MSL I can remember a fan favorite gets eliminated in the Ro32 or not qualify at all so there's bound to be somebody who's salty about it. My vote is for BigFile for the quality of Ro16+.
"If you're not living in the US or are a US Citizen, please do not tell us how to vote or how you want our country to be governed." - Serpest, American Hero
Qikz
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United Kingdom12022 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-06 19:43:10
July 06 2014 19:39 GMT
#24
On July 07 2014 04:30 Caihead wrote:
I think it would be much much easier to identify a worst OSL/MSL, every OSL/MSL I can remember a fan favorite gets eliminated in the Ro32 or not qualify at all so there's bound to be somebody who's salty about it. My vote is for BigFile for the quality of Ro16+.


Worst would easily be the Nate MSL (if only for the final). The finals was a complete joke from start to finish, starting with the players being in an entirely seperate building/area to the fans and secondly the powercut which basically destroyed any hope of Flash winning that series. He was in such a good place to make the comeback and had that power cut never happened he probably would've won that game. I still to this day don't understand the referees decision. That made me salty all weekend.

That and seeing Jangbi cheese Fanta out of the final OSL with DTs ruined my day too, but it was still a good OSL.
FanTaSy's #1 Fan | STPL Caster/Organiser | SKT BEST KT | https://twitch.tv/stpl
Caihead
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Canada8550 Posts
July 06 2014 19:49 GMT
#25
On July 07 2014 04:39 Qikz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 07 2014 04:30 Caihead wrote:
I think it would be much much easier to identify a worst OSL/MSL, every OSL/MSL I can remember a fan favorite gets eliminated in the Ro32 or not qualify at all so there's bound to be somebody who's salty about it. My vote is for BigFile for the quality of Ro16+.


Worst would easily be the Nate MSL (if only for the final). The finals was a complete joke from start to finish, starting with the players being in an entirely seperate building/area to the fans and secondly the powercut which basically destroyed any hope of Flash winning that series. He was in such a good place to make the comeback and had that power cut never happened he probably would've won that game. I still to this day don't understand the referees decision. That made me salty all weekend.

That and seeing Jangbi cheese Fanta out of the final OSL with DTs ruined my day too, but it was still a good OSL.


That salt.

The less terrans you have in the Ro8 the less exciting it is imo, Avalon / PDPop never forget.
"If you're not living in the US or are a US Citizen, please do not tell us how to vote or how you want our country to be governed." - Serpest, American Hero
Daeno
Profile Joined June 2007
Canada76 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-06 20:33:06
July 06 2014 20:13 GMT
#26
2007 Daum OSL:

Had Flash vs Bisu on Monty Hall.

And perhaps one of the BEST 5 game finals ever. With an absolutely incredible game 5 from GGPlay over Iris to win it.

Edit:

Also had the manliest OSL intro moment @ 18s:

lolmlg
Profile Joined November 2011
619 Posts
July 06 2014 20:16 GMT
#27
The problem with rating the latter day tournaments according to their finals is that most of them had much more exciting semifinal matches.
Qikz
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United Kingdom12022 Posts
July 06 2014 20:37 GMT
#28
In terms of intros tving was great



Flash and Fantasy look so stylish. Although I still think Fantasy looks more handsome with glasses.
FanTaSy's #1 Fan | STPL Caster/Organiser | SKT BEST KT | https://twitch.tv/stpl
nimdil
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Poland3748 Posts
July 06 2014 20:47 GMT
#29
On July 06 2014 18:00 GTR wrote:
OSL
(...)
SKY 2001 OSL - Legend of the Fall comes back. Third foreigner to play in an OSL (Asmodey, after Pillars and Grrrr...).
SKY 2002 OSL - Legend of the Fall returns (Reach). Fourth (and last) foreigner in an OSL (ElkY).

You missed eVERLAST in PKO!

It was:
1. eVERLAST @ 1999 Tooniverse PKO
2-3. Grrrr... & Pillars @ 2000 Hanaro OSL
4. Asmodey @ 2001 SKY OSL
5. Elky @ 2002 SKY OSL
Cuce
Profile Joined March 2011
Turkey1127 Posts
July 06 2014 20:48 GMT
#30
ever 2004 osl
64K RAM SYSTEM 38911 BASIC BYTES FREE
josephmcjoe
Profile Joined October 2009
United States57 Posts
July 06 2014 21:01 GMT
#31
Korean Air OSL S1, Flash vs. Effort.

I will never forget watching that final series. Flash looked untouchable through games one and two.
"This guy is the Bob Ross of adept shading: a little shade here, a little shade there." -Lambo
TelecoM
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States10668 Posts
July 06 2014 21:21 GMT
#32
On July 06 2014 20:00 evilfatsh1t wrote:
god i miss bw


Same........SC2 is depressing...
AKA: TelecoM[WHITE] Protoss fighting
art_of_turtle
Profile Blog Joined September 2012
United States1183 Posts
July 07 2014 02:32 GMT
#33
I remember watching live the Korean Air OSL 3:00 in the morning before class. Was so epic especially rooting for Effort.
Flash should fear Sacsri
GolemMadness
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Canada11044 Posts
July 07 2014 04:21 GMT
#34
Ever 2009 was pretty great, and that was the first time I actually started really following BW and watched every single game.
Jin Air, those two games on Pathfinder in the finals...
Tving.
http://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=FLABREZU
Zoler
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Sweden6339 Posts
July 07 2014 04:35 GMT
#35
Why was BW so amazing, and SC2 so bad....

Oh well at least I have Melee
Lim Yo Hwan forever!
Hier
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
2391 Posts
July 07 2014 04:46 GMT
#36
Well, I joined TL too late (November 2009) to watch most leagues live (and watching past VODs doesn't necessarily capture the feel of the OSL/MSL as a whole), but I thought JangBi's story in Jin Air literally could not be more fairytale than it was.
"But on a more serious note..." -everyone on this forum at some point.
Caladbolg
Profile Joined March 2011
2855 Posts
July 07 2014 05:08 GMT
#37
It'd be easier to identify the bad seasons. BW had such a wonderful run EVER04, Avalon, Lost Saga, Bacchus, Daum, Korea Air... maaan wonderful seasons, all of them.
"I don't like the word prodigy at all. To me prodigy sounds like a person who was 'gifted' all these things rather than a person who earned all these talents by hard training... I must train harder to reach my goal." - Flash
Xiphos
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Canada7507 Posts
July 07 2014 05:21 GMT
#38
You guys are making me fucking pissed off again that BW professional scene was killed off by Blizzard.

And I've made peace with it the hard way 1 year ago.
2014 - ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ Raise your bows brood warriors! ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ
Reborn8u
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States1761 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-07 05:27:43
July 07 2014 05:25 GMT
#39
GOMTV MSL 10 The revolution. Bisu vs Savoir

There are few moments in all of starcraft history that changed the game as much as this one series. A dominating zerg hero faces a massive underdog in the young protoss Bisu. The finals that changed everything.

Here is the TL thread with the vods and descriptions. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/news-archive/50519-savior-vs-bisu-msl-finals

Edit: links are outdated in that thread here is one that works
:)
Titusmaster6
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
United States5937 Posts
July 07 2014 06:16 GMT
#40
I keep coming back to this thread and get sadder every time because no more bw. Stop posting people T_T

+ Show Spoiler +
Don't stop it hurts so good
Shorts down shorts up, BOOM, just like that.
Chameleon
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
United States604 Posts
July 07 2014 07:35 GMT
#41
Savior was so good in the rest of that msl and so oblivious during the finals, given that he was such a massive favorite--makes me wonder whether that was a series he threw...

screw savior
TL's #1 Horang2 fan
nimdil
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Poland3748 Posts
July 07 2014 07:53 GMT
#42
On July 07 2014 16:35 Chameleon wrote:
Savior was so good in the rest of that msl and so oblivious during the finals, given that he was such a massive favorite--makes me wonder whether that was a series he threw...

screw savior

LoL - look at the careers of Bisu and sAviOr after the final. It was obviously not a throw. sAviOr career more or less collapsed after Bisu's revolution while Bisu skyrocketed to fame and was forever known as the best PvZ player of all time and probably the best Protoss as well - he is the only protoss to win more than 2 starcraft leagues (and only three protosses won 2: GARIMTO, Nal_ra and JangBi).

I can't imagine what amount of money would have sAviOr to get in order to sacrifice his career for it.
Qikz
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United Kingdom12022 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-07 09:17:11
July 07 2014 09:10 GMT
#43
On July 07 2014 16:53 nimdil wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 07 2014 16:35 Chameleon wrote:
Savior was so good in the rest of that msl and so oblivious during the finals, given that he was such a massive favorite--makes me wonder whether that was a series he threw...

screw savior

LoL - look at the careers of Bisu and sAviOr after the final. It was obviously not a throw. sAviOr career more or less collapsed after Bisu's revolution while Bisu skyrocketed to fame and was forever known as the best PvZ player of all time and probably the best Protoss as well - he is the only protoss to win more than 2 starcraft leagues (and only three protosses won 2: GARIMTO, Nal_ra and JangBi).

I can't imagine what amount of money would have sAviOr to get in order to sacrifice his career for it.


He didn't need any money. He just saw Bisu's face and he knew that was it. He converted to the church of BSports.

The entire purpose of his career was from then on to give Bisu a true rise to power that he deserved.
FanTaSy's #1 Fan | STPL Caster/Organiser | SKT BEST KT | https://twitch.tv/stpl
dRaW
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
Canada5744 Posts
July 07 2014 09:19 GMT
#44
Which OSL/MSL had the most high ranked players in the final 16/8/4/2 etc? (i.e top 8 kespa ranked finished in top 8)
I don't need luck, luck is for noobs, good luck to you though
gngfn
Profile Joined January 2009
United States1726 Posts
July 07 2014 09:20 GMT
#45
On July 07 2014 05:13 Daeno wrote:
2007 Daum OSL:

Had Flash vs Bisu on Monty Hall.

And perhaps one of the BEST 5 game finals ever. With an absolutely incredible game 5 from GGPlay over Iris to win it.

Edit:

Also had the manliest OSL intro moment @ 18s:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LT_hNrqcz-8&feature=youtu.be&t=18s

The exposure in the opening video, of course, was a result of this being Reach's return to OSL after a long hiatus thanks to the extraordinary exhibition of manliness that was Reach vs. Sea on Hitchhiker.

Also featured Reach cruising through his group 3-0 only to lose a heartbreaker to Stork 1-2 in the Ro8.

Sick opening video + lots of Reach + the first OSL I watched = probably my favorite OSL, although there were certainly others with better games and it always annoyed me that GGplay won instead of Iris.
nimdil
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Poland3748 Posts
July 07 2014 10:26 GMT
#46
On July 07 2014 18:10 Qikz wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 07 2014 16:53 nimdil wrote:
On July 07 2014 16:35 Chameleon wrote:
Savior was so good in the rest of that msl and so oblivious during the finals, given that he was such a massive favorite--makes me wonder whether that was a series he threw...

screw savior

LoL - look at the careers of Bisu and sAviOr after the final. It was obviously not a throw. sAviOr career more or less collapsed after Bisu's revolution while Bisu skyrocketed to fame and was forever known as the best PvZ player of all time and probably the best Protoss as well - he is the only protoss to win more than 2 starcraft leagues (and only three protosses won 2: GARIMTO, Nal_ra and JangBi).

I can't imagine what amount of money would have sAviOr to get in order to sacrifice his career for it.


He didn't need any money. He just saw Bisu's face and he knew that was it. He converted to the church of BSports.

The entire purpose of his career was from then on to give Bisu a true rise to power that he deserved.

It's funny how god of crushing terrans sacrificed himself to give power to someone whose ability to fight top terrans was always in question
hitthat
Profile Joined January 2010
Poland2262 Posts
July 07 2014 11:14 GMT
#47
On July 07 2014 19:26 nimdil wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 07 2014 18:10 Qikz wrote:
On July 07 2014 16:53 nimdil wrote:
On July 07 2014 16:35 Chameleon wrote:
Savior was so good in the rest of that msl and so oblivious during the finals, given that he was such a massive favorite--makes me wonder whether that was a series he threw...

screw savior

LoL - look at the careers of Bisu and sAviOr after the final. It was obviously not a throw. sAviOr career more or less collapsed after Bisu's revolution while Bisu skyrocketed to fame and was forever known as the best PvZ player of all time and probably the best Protoss as well - he is the only protoss to win more than 2 starcraft leagues (and only three protosses won 2: GARIMTO, Nal_ra and JangBi).

I can't imagine what amount of money would have sAviOr to get in order to sacrifice his career for it.


He didn't need any money. He just saw Bisu's face and he knew that was it. He converted to the church of BSports.

The entire purpose of his career was from then on to give Bisu a true rise to power that he deserved.

It's funny how god of crushing terrans* sacrificed himself to give power to someone whose ability to fight top terrans was always in question


* rule does not contain firebats and terrans with wacky celebrations
Shameless BroodWar separatistic, elitist, fanaticaly devoted puritan fanboy.
~chut~
Profile Joined September 2003
France1317 Posts
July 07 2014 11:59 GMT
#48
The whole problem is the same as in the "best game ever" problem: what qualifies as a best league?

Best players? Best Finals? Around the same numbers of T/P/Z ? Best maps? Best storyline?
It's hard to tell really.

Let's try :
MSLs :

I personnally enjoyed a lot the You are the golf king MSL, not only for its stupid name, but also its storyline, the comeback of the spoiled kid Gorush who showed his immense skill at the game. The Bo7 final against Nada was great. Not a lot of Protoss though.

On other sides, i loved LG Cyon MSL and GOM season 1 because of the Savior rise and fall. I know he already won Uzoo before and he didn't even win LG Cyon, but it was in that MSL that he managed to go 5-0 against Oov, totally setting new standards for ZvT. The game on Ride of Valkyries is one of my favourites ever with the 2 big armies facing each other on high ground... One of the best ever for sure, it was noted by someone in the "best game" thread btw.
Also, it was a great time to be on TL, the atmosphere was just great, and Chojja winning wasn't a bad thing, after all his crushing defeats, it also allowed some fun on tl since tfeign could pretend Chojja was the best player of the moment, which was very much debatable Also contained in this msl, beginning of the Ra vs Savior rivalry.
Gom Season 1 was the fall, after so much domination, trouble maintaining his dominance over terrans (the semi final against Hwasin was awesome, never saw a zerg preventing dropships this well), Savior, just like Oov before him, lost to a promising newcomer who set new standards for PvZ, letting the old king wondering. Games, especially the finals, were not that great to be honest, but the story is great and the fact that the "03-03" thread is revived every single year shows how influencial it was.

The one i hate most is probably KPGA 2nd tour, Yellow was up 2-0 and still managed to lose. Damn it.

About OSLs, i still need to think about it, i started watching those during Coca Cola OSL..
Letmelose
Profile Blog Joined September 2006
Korea (South)3227 Posts
July 07 2014 13:45 GMT
#49
My personal list, with token leagues often remembered by the general populus,

1) Coca Cola OGN StarLeague: The birthplace of the epic rivalry between BoxeR and YellOw, but really man, considering how heavily OGN "tweaked" things just to put BoxeR on a pedestal, it delegitimizes the entire tournament for me.

2) 2002 SKY OGN StarLeague: The origin of the "Legend of the Fall", and the rise of a new hero for the protoss race. The finals had more than 25,000 people attending live, probably the most fondly remembered league for protoss fans in Korea.

3) Gillette OGN StarLeague: There's a saying in Korea, which roughly translates into, "did you only start watching OGN since Gillette OGN StarLeague you newb?", the duo-viewer magnets of BoxeR and YellOw both failed to qualify, but this league kind of signified a new era, with great games to go along with the ride. My personal favourite by far.

4) 2004 EVER StarLeague: The most fondly remembered league by many, due to 7 out of the 8 quarter-finalists having been previous OGN StarLeague/MSL winners (the odd man out being YellOw). Probably the go to choice for many. If I'm to be honest, I'm a little tired of any half decent league with BoxeR doing well in it being praised as the greatest ever.

6) YATGK MSL: One of the most thoroughly planned league, that sacrificed commercially successful elements to ensure the best players were rewarded. Some really classic match-ups, and the birth of the "Tim-Dal-Rok", the best rivalry going when the triumvirate of July, NaDa, and GoRush ruled supreme.

5) So1 OGN StarLeague: The most commercially successful league. I remember hating the horrid map pool with a vengeance, but people always wanted to see BoxeR do well, and boy did he deliver in spades. Personally, the rise of the neo-triumvirate of the protoss race (PuSan, Anytime, and Stork) was noteworthy.

6) UZOO MSL: In the same vein as YATGK MSL, one of the most highly concentrated leagues in terms of game quality, with the rise of one incredibly talented IPXZerg, some fantastic games from the legend Reach, and a back-up cast of some of the most talented players from the era. I personally think despite the commercial success of the GomTV leagues (due to the ease of access from the viewers), the vintage MSL from the days when double-elimination were the real deal, MBCGame actually brought a fresh angle that OGN StarLeague repeatidly failed to give (Jesus Christ, we get it, you want BoxeR to do well, just stop making it so goddamned obvious OGN).

To be honest, I loved them all. Even when OGN did their weird decisions just to appease the BoxeR fetish, even when MSL tried to go in a direction that I disliked just to stay afloat business-wise. But if I had to choose, I personally prefer the individual leagues that happened before the rise of the ProLeague (which took away the limelight from the individual leagues both in terms of viewership and progamer priorities), the leagues that didn't go out of their way just to cling on to the blockbuster stars of the time just to succeed commercially, and had the confidence in the participating players to create new and exciting storylines. And in the height of Starcraft's success in Korea, circa 2004~2005, when the old guard were still there, and the new blood were hungry to get the limelight the likes of BoxeR enjoyed, it was simply a pleasure to watch.

But that's just me. We all have our favourites. I mean, there's magic to be found in each and every one.

TL+ Member
Elyvilon
Profile Joined August 2008
United States13143 Posts
July 07 2014 14:52 GMT
#50
On July 07 2014 16:53 nimdil wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 07 2014 16:35 Chameleon wrote:
Savior was so good in the rest of that msl and so oblivious during the finals, given that he was such a massive favorite--makes me wonder whether that was a series he threw...

screw savior

LoL - look at the careers of Bisu and sAviOr after the final. It was obviously not a throw. sAviOr career more or less collapsed after Bisu's revolution while Bisu skyrocketed to fame and was forever known as the best PvZ player of all time and probably the best Protoss as well - he is the only protoss to win more than 2 starcraft leagues (and only three protosses won 2: GARIMTO, Nal_ra and JangBi).

I can't imagine what amount of money would have sAviOr to get in order to sacrifice his career for it.

I agree with your main point, but sAviOr's career didn't collapse after that final; he was still the indisputable best zerg player in the world and consistently top 5 for at least another 6 months after that final.
Liquipedia
appletree
Profile Joined September 2010
Denmark109 Posts
July 07 2014 14:52 GMT
#51
"EVER 2008 OSL - First OSL to introduce the 36-man format. July comes out of nowhere and acquires the second Golden Mouse.
Incruit OSL - After two second-place finishes, Stork finally wins an OSL. Fantasy revolutionizes TvZ with his mech build.
Batoo OSL - Fantasy loses his second consecutive OSL final.
Bacchus 2009 OSL - Jaedong acquires the third Golden Mouse and is the first back-to-back champion since Boxer in 2001."



Can someone help me clarify this.

1st. July wins Golden Mouse (2)
2nd. Stork wins OSL. Fantasy 2nd place
3rd. Fantasy 2nd place.
4th. Jaedong wins Golden Mouse (3) - But also back to back champion, winning over Fantasy in Batoo OSL.

My question is

Who did Jaedong play in the finals @ Bacchus '09 OSL finals ??
a
Elyvilon
Profile Joined August 2008
United States13143 Posts
July 07 2014 14:56 GMT
#52
On July 07 2014 23:52 appletree wrote:
Show nested quote +
"EVER 2008 OSL - First OSL to introduce the 36-man format. July comes out of nowhere and acquires the second Golden Mouse.
Incruit OSL - After two second-place finishes, Stork finally wins an OSL. Fantasy revolutionizes TvZ with his mech build.
Batoo OSL - Fantasy loses his second consecutive OSL final.
Bacchus 2009 OSL - Jaedong acquires the third Golden Mouse and is the first back-to-back champion since Boxer in 2001."



Can someone help me clarify this.

1st. July wins Golden Mouse (2)
2nd. Stork wins OSL. Fantasy 2nd place
3rd. Fantasy 2nd place.
4th. Jaedong wins Golden Mouse (3) - But also back to back champion, winning over Fantasy in Batoo OSL.

My question is

Who did Jaedong play in the finals @ Bacchus '09 OSL finals ??

Yarnc
Liquipedia
oGoZenob
Profile Joined December 2011
France1503 Posts
July 07 2014 16:23 GMT
#53
Damn I get goosebumps just by reading the op... I wonder if I'll ever love a game the way i love bw ^^
I like starcraft
Xiphos
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Canada7507 Posts
July 07 2014 18:01 GMT
#54
On July 07 2014 23:52 appletree wrote:
Show nested quote +
"EVER 2008 OSL - First OSL to introduce the 36-man format. July comes out of nowhere and acquires the second Golden Mouse.
Incruit OSL - After two second-place finishes, Stork finally wins an OSL. Fantasy revolutionizes TvZ with his mech build.
Batoo OSL - Fantasy loses his second consecutive OSL final.
Bacchus 2009 OSL - Jaedong acquires the third Golden Mouse and is the first back-to-back champion since Boxer in 2001."



Can someone help me clarify this.

1st. July wins Golden Mouse (2)
2nd. Stork wins OSL. Fantasy 2nd place
3rd. Fantasy 2nd place.
4th. Jaedong wins Golden Mouse (3) - But also back to back champion, winning over Fantasy in Batoo OSL.

My question is

Who did Jaedong play in the finals @ Bacchus '09 OSL finals ??


Yellow[arnc]

Luxury's bro.
2014 - ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ Raise your bows brood warriors! ᕙ( •̀ل͜•́) ϡ
REDBLUEGREEN
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
Germany1903 Posts
July 07 2014 18:08 GMT
#55
On July 07 2014 04:16 Plexa wrote:
So1 is the correct answer. EVER04 also acceptable. Shinhan S3 not bad either.

Yup it's So1 for me too. I can't remember the quality of the games but as a Boxer fan his fight for the golden mouse was so exiting.
The Ro8 also had some of my all time favorite players in it with BoxeR, Reach, Goodfriend, Pusan, oov, July, XellOs and Anytime.
rift
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
1819 Posts
July 08 2014 05:30 GMT
#56
On July 07 2014 22:45 Letmelose wrote:
My personal list, with token leagues often remembered by the general populus,

1) Coca Cola OGN StarLeague: The birthplace of the epic rivalry between BoxeR and YellOw, but really man, considering how heavily OGN "tweaked" things just to put BoxeR on a pedestal, it delegitimizes the entire tournament for me.

2) 2002 SKY OGN StarLeague: The origin of the "Legend of the Fall", and the rise of a new hero for the protoss race. The finals had more than 25,000 people attending live, probably the most fondly remembered league for protoss fans in Korea.

3) Gillette OGN StarLeague: There's a saying in Korea, which roughly translates into, "did you only start watching OGN since Gillette OGN StarLeague you newb?", the duo-viewer magnets of BoxeR and YellOw both failed to qualify, but this league kind of signified a new era, with great games to go along with the ride. My personal favourite by far.

4) 2004 EVER StarLeague: The most fondly remembered league by many, due to 7 out of the 8 quarter-finalists having been previous OGN StarLeague/MSL winners (the odd man out being YellOw). Probably the go to choice for many. If I'm to be honest, I'm a little tired of any half decent league with BoxeR doing well in it being praised as the greatest ever.

6) YATGK MSL: One of the most thoroughly planned league, that sacrificed commercially successful elements to ensure the best players were rewarded. Some really classic match-ups, and the birth of the "Tim-Dal-Rok", the best rivalry going when the triumvirate of July, NaDa, and GoRush ruled supreme.

5) So1 OGN StarLeague: The most commercially successful league. I remember hating the horrid map pool with a vengeance, but people always wanted to see BoxeR do well, and boy did he deliver in spades. Personally, the rise of the neo-triumvirate of the protoss race (PuSan, Anytime, and Stork) was noteworthy.

6) UZOO MSL: In the same vein as YATGK MSL, one of the most highly concentrated leagues in terms of game quality, with the rise of one incredibly talented IPXZerg, some fantastic games from the legend Reach, and a back-up cast of some of the most talented players from the era. I personally think despite the commercial success of the GomTV leagues (due to the ease of access from the viewers), the vintage MSL from the days when double-elimination were the real deal, MBCGame actually brought a fresh angle that OGN StarLeague repeatidly failed to give (Jesus Christ, we get it, you want BoxeR to do well, just stop making it so goddamned obvious OGN).

To be honest, I loved them all. Even when OGN did their weird decisions just to appease the BoxeR fetish, even when MSL tried to go in a direction that I disliked just to stay afloat business-wise. But if I had to choose, I personally prefer the individual leagues that happened before the rise of the ProLeague (which took away the limelight from the individual leagues both in terms of viewership and progamer priorities), the leagues that didn't go out of their way just to cling on to the blockbuster stars of the time just to succeed commercially, and had the confidence in the participating players to create new and exciting storylines. And in the height of Starcraft's success in Korea, circa 2004~2005, when the old guard were still there, and the new blood were hungry to get the limelight the likes of BoxeR enjoyed, it was simply a pleasure to watch.

But that's just me. We all have our favourites. I mean, there's magic to be found in each and every one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjyRQNlaams

can you expand on how ogn tweaked the coca cola osl in boxer's favor? and other starleagues? i'm really curious
Brobe
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
United States75 Posts
July 08 2014 06:27 GMT
#57
PDPOP MSL was Hydra vs great. If you want to watch insane Hive tech ZvZ you just have to watch the finals. The last MSL was Flash vs Zero and I think it featured a TBLS group of death (?) I don't remember for sure.
[Protoss: Jangbi/Movie] [Zerg: Calm] [Terran: FBH/Reality] In honor of KT Violet
GTR
Profile Blog Joined September 2004
51418 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-08 06:46:20
July 08 2014 06:42 GMT
#58
On July 08 2014 14:30 rift wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 07 2014 22:45 Letmelose wrote:
My personal list, with token leagues often remembered by the general populus,

1) Coca Cola OGN StarLeague: The birthplace of the epic rivalry between BoxeR and YellOw, but really man, considering how heavily OGN "tweaked" things just to put BoxeR on a pedestal, it delegitimizes the entire tournament for me.

2) 2002 SKY OGN StarLeague: The origin of the "Legend of the Fall", and the rise of a new hero for the protoss race. The finals had more than 25,000 people attending live, probably the most fondly remembered league for protoss fans in Korea.

3) Gillette OGN StarLeague: There's a saying in Korea, which roughly translates into, "did you only start watching OGN since Gillette OGN StarLeague you newb?", the duo-viewer magnets of BoxeR and YellOw both failed to qualify, but this league kind of signified a new era, with great games to go along with the ride. My personal favourite by far.

4) 2004 EVER StarLeague: The most fondly remembered league by many, due to 7 out of the 8 quarter-finalists having been previous OGN StarLeague/MSL winners (the odd man out being YellOw). Probably the go to choice for many. If I'm to be honest, I'm a little tired of any half decent league with BoxeR doing well in it being praised as the greatest ever.

6) YATGK MSL: One of the most thoroughly planned league, that sacrificed commercially successful elements to ensure the best players were rewarded. Some really classic match-ups, and the birth of the "Tim-Dal-Rok", the best rivalry going when the triumvirate of July, NaDa, and GoRush ruled supreme.

5) So1 OGN StarLeague: The most commercially successful league. I remember hating the horrid map pool with a vengeance, but people always wanted to see BoxeR do well, and boy did he deliver in spades. Personally, the rise of the neo-triumvirate of the protoss race (PuSan, Anytime, and Stork) was noteworthy.

6) UZOO MSL: In the same vein as YATGK MSL, one of the most highly concentrated leagues in terms of game quality, with the rise of one incredibly talented IPXZerg, some fantastic games from the legend Reach, and a back-up cast of some of the most talented players from the era. I personally think despite the commercial success of the GomTV leagues (due to the ease of access from the viewers), the vintage MSL from the days when double-elimination were the real deal, MBCGame actually brought a fresh angle that OGN StarLeague repeatidly failed to give (Jesus Christ, we get it, you want BoxeR to do well, just stop making it so goddamned obvious OGN).

To be honest, I loved them all. Even when OGN did their weird decisions just to appease the BoxeR fetish, even when MSL tried to go in a direction that I disliked just to stay afloat business-wise. But if I had to choose, I personally prefer the individual leagues that happened before the rise of the ProLeague (which took away the limelight from the individual leagues both in terms of viewership and progamer priorities), the leagues that didn't go out of their way just to cling on to the blockbuster stars of the time just to succeed commercially, and had the confidence in the participating players to create new and exciting storylines. And in the height of Starcraft's success in Korea, circa 2004~2005, when the old guard were still there, and the new blood were hungry to get the limelight the likes of BoxeR enjoyed, it was simply a pleasure to watch.

But that's just me. We all have our favourites. I mean, there's magic to be found in each and every one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjyRQNlaams

can you expand on how ogn tweaked the coca cola osl in boxer's favor? and other starleagues? i'm really curious


- finals map order was heavily in favour of boxer (for coca-cola), neo hall of valhalla was going to be played twice which was awful for yellow.

- rumors floated around that the golden mouse was created solely just for boxer to 'win' to help cement his place in starcraft history (all the so1 hype was literally 'can boxer win the golden mouse?)

- when the osl shifted to a 24 man format for shinhan 2006 season 1, many speculated it was only because they wanted boxer in the league as he failed to qualify for the initial 16 man tournament.

honestly though you can't really blame the ogn pd's for their decisions, boxer was starcraft's golden boy and they (ogn) had to try and keep him relevant as much as possible without looking too suspicious.
Commentator
nimdil
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Poland3748 Posts
July 08 2014 08:10 GMT
#59
On July 08 2014 15:42 GTR wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 08 2014 14:30 rift wrote:
On July 07 2014 22:45 Letmelose wrote:
My personal list, with token leagues often remembered by the general populus,

1) Coca Cola OGN StarLeague: The birthplace of the epic rivalry between BoxeR and YellOw, but really man, considering how heavily OGN "tweaked" things just to put BoxeR on a pedestal, it delegitimizes the entire tournament for me.

2) 2002 SKY OGN StarLeague: The origin of the "Legend of the Fall", and the rise of a new hero for the protoss race. The finals had more than 25,000 people attending live, probably the most fondly remembered league for protoss fans in Korea.

3) Gillette OGN StarLeague: There's a saying in Korea, which roughly translates into, "did you only start watching OGN since Gillette OGN StarLeague you newb?", the duo-viewer magnets of BoxeR and YellOw both failed to qualify, but this league kind of signified a new era, with great games to go along with the ride. My personal favourite by far.

4) 2004 EVER StarLeague: The most fondly remembered league by many, due to 7 out of the 8 quarter-finalists having been previous OGN StarLeague/MSL winners (the odd man out being YellOw). Probably the go to choice for many. If I'm to be honest, I'm a little tired of any half decent league with BoxeR doing well in it being praised as the greatest ever.

6) YATGK MSL: One of the most thoroughly planned league, that sacrificed commercially successful elements to ensure the best players were rewarded. Some really classic match-ups, and the birth of the "Tim-Dal-Rok", the best rivalry going when the triumvirate of July, NaDa, and GoRush ruled supreme.

5) So1 OGN StarLeague: The most commercially successful league. I remember hating the horrid map pool with a vengeance, but people always wanted to see BoxeR do well, and boy did he deliver in spades. Personally, the rise of the neo-triumvirate of the protoss race (PuSan, Anytime, and Stork) was noteworthy.

6) UZOO MSL: In the same vein as YATGK MSL, one of the most highly concentrated leagues in terms of game quality, with the rise of one incredibly talented IPXZerg, some fantastic games from the legend Reach, and a back-up cast of some of the most talented players from the era. I personally think despite the commercial success of the GomTV leagues (due to the ease of access from the viewers), the vintage MSL from the days when double-elimination were the real deal, MBCGame actually brought a fresh angle that OGN StarLeague repeatidly failed to give (Jesus Christ, we get it, you want BoxeR to do well, just stop making it so goddamned obvious OGN).

To be honest, I loved them all. Even when OGN did their weird decisions just to appease the BoxeR fetish, even when MSL tried to go in a direction that I disliked just to stay afloat business-wise. But if I had to choose, I personally prefer the individual leagues that happened before the rise of the ProLeague (which took away the limelight from the individual leagues both in terms of viewership and progamer priorities), the leagues that didn't go out of their way just to cling on to the blockbuster stars of the time just to succeed commercially, and had the confidence in the participating players to create new and exciting storylines. And in the height of Starcraft's success in Korea, circa 2004~2005, when the old guard were still there, and the new blood were hungry to get the limelight the likes of BoxeR enjoyed, it was simply a pleasure to watch.

But that's just me. We all have our favourites. I mean, there's magic to be found in each and every one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjyRQNlaams

can you expand on how ogn tweaked the coca cola osl in boxer's favor? and other starleagues? i'm really curious


- finals map order was heavily in favour of boxer (for coca-cola), neo hall of valhalla was going to be played twice which was awful for yellow.

- rumors floated around that the golden mouse was created solely just for boxer to 'win' to help cement his place in starcraft history (all the so1 hype was literally 'can boxer win the golden mouse?)

- when the osl shifted to a 24 man format for shinhan 2006 season 1, many speculated it was only because they wanted boxer in the league as he failed to qualify for the initial 16 man tournament.

honestly though you can't really blame the ogn pd's for their decisions, boxer was starcraft's golden boy and they (ogn) had to try and keep him relevant as much as possible without looking too suspicious.

Oh wow. You really should write down the history of professional SC:BW: from start-ups into KeSPA to the Hybrid Proleague sad finale.

And you still missed eVERLAST as first foreign progamer in OSL unless he is 0th progamer, being in PKO etc.
lastride
Profile Joined April 2014
2390 Posts
July 08 2014 08:27 GMT
#60
ever2004 osl for me
Letmelose
Profile Blog Joined September 2006
Korea (South)3227 Posts
July 08 2014 08:29 GMT
#61
On July 08 2014 14:30 rift wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 07 2014 22:45 Letmelose wrote:
My personal list, with token leagues often remembered by the general populus,

1) Coca Cola OGN StarLeague: The birthplace of the epic rivalry between BoxeR and YellOw, but really man, considering how heavily OGN "tweaked" things just to put BoxeR on a pedestal, it delegitimizes the entire tournament for me.

2) 2002 SKY OGN StarLeague: The origin of the "Legend of the Fall", and the rise of a new hero for the protoss race. The finals had more than 25,000 people attending live, probably the most fondly remembered league for protoss fans in Korea.

3) Gillette OGN StarLeague: There's a saying in Korea, which roughly translates into, "did you only start watching OGN since Gillette OGN StarLeague you newb?", the duo-viewer magnets of BoxeR and YellOw both failed to qualify, but this league kind of signified a new era, with great games to go along with the ride. My personal favourite by far.

4) 2004 EVER StarLeague: The most fondly remembered league by many, due to 7 out of the 8 quarter-finalists having been previous OGN StarLeague/MSL winners (the odd man out being YellOw). Probably the go to choice for many. If I'm to be honest, I'm a little tired of any half decent league with BoxeR doing well in it being praised as the greatest ever.

6) YATGK MSL: One of the most thoroughly planned league, that sacrificed commercially successful elements to ensure the best players were rewarded. Some really classic match-ups, and the birth of the "Tim-Dal-Rok", the best rivalry going when the triumvirate of July, NaDa, and GoRush ruled supreme.

5) So1 OGN StarLeague: The most commercially successful league. I remember hating the horrid map pool with a vengeance, but people always wanted to see BoxeR do well, and boy did he deliver in spades. Personally, the rise of the neo-triumvirate of the protoss race (PuSan, Anytime, and Stork) was noteworthy.

6) UZOO MSL: In the same vein as YATGK MSL, one of the most highly concentrated leagues in terms of game quality, with the rise of one incredibly talented IPXZerg, some fantastic games from the legend Reach, and a back-up cast of some of the most talented players from the era. I personally think despite the commercial success of the GomTV leagues (due to the ease of access from the viewers), the vintage MSL from the days when double-elimination were the real deal, MBCGame actually brought a fresh angle that OGN StarLeague repeatidly failed to give (Jesus Christ, we get it, you want BoxeR to do well, just stop making it so goddamned obvious OGN).

To be honest, I loved them all. Even when OGN did their weird decisions just to appease the BoxeR fetish, even when MSL tried to go in a direction that I disliked just to stay afloat business-wise. But if I had to choose, I personally prefer the individual leagues that happened before the rise of the ProLeague (which took away the limelight from the individual leagues both in terms of viewership and progamer priorities), the leagues that didn't go out of their way just to cling on to the blockbuster stars of the time just to succeed commercially, and had the confidence in the participating players to create new and exciting storylines. And in the height of Starcraft's success in Korea, circa 2004~2005, when the old guard were still there, and the new blood were hungry to get the limelight the likes of BoxeR enjoyed, it was simply a pleasure to watch.

But that's just me. We all have our favourites. I mean, there's magic to be found in each and every one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjyRQNlaams

can you expand on how ogn tweaked the coca cola osl in boxer's favor? and other starleagues? i'm really curious


It's already been explained pretty well, but I'll get into the specifics.

1) Ragnarok, widely regarded as one of the worst abominations ever created, was strangely chosen as the map whenever BoxeR played with an inexplicable frequency. BoxeR played SEVEN games on Ragnarok, which is a far greater number than he should have played under reasonable circumstances. No other champion I know of gained their championship by essentially playing HALF their games under what were basically free-win conditions.

2) BoxeR actually struggled during the group stages, and was due for a tie-breaker. However, due to this strange "point system", where the points (which appears on the screen at the end of the game) were added up, and BoxeR was allowed to go through without having to do a tie-breaker. This horrible system was introduced just for this tournament, and was abandoned afterwards. Terrans are always guaranteed good points versus the zerg race due to how the match-up works, and the efficiency of their units, and I'm willing to bet any number of cash that if BoxeR was somehow disadvantaged due to this retarded system, it wouldn't have been implemented.

3) There are numerous instances where OGN got out of their way to help BoxeR, and my god were they rewarded with commercial success, which urged them to push their agenda even further. The guy was a genius, and a fine poster boy for the scene, but due to the circumstances mentioned before, I really had trouble fully enjoying any of his successful leagues. There were certain scenarios that tickled the masses just right, and successful players that didn't gain enough public approval were never backed the way popular players were (case in point, July). It's not that OGN didn't try, but once their efforts fell flat, they were quick to abandon certain players in order to make "stars" of more commercially viable pretty boys.

By the way, while it was the most obvious with BoxeR, it was never an even playing field for all the players involved. That's why I love Gillette OGN StarLeague the most. July was never meant to win. He played the "hideous alien" race, he was from a terrible non-sponsored team that nobody supported, he was a nobody, and on top of that he didn't have the pretty-boy looks that was oh so important for those fan-girls. He won his fans over with his dedication, his gutsy play, and out of the world mechanics for his time. It was such a cinderella story, but alas, he didn't have the face for it. But I'll always remember.
TL+ Member
radadaundandan
Profile Joined May 2007
Bulgaria3148 Posts
July 08 2014 08:52 GMT
#62
Broodwar 4ever!
Flash returns...
nimdil
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Poland3748 Posts
July 08 2014 09:31 GMT
#63
On July 08 2014 17:29 Letmelose wrote:

1) Ragnarok, widely regarded as one of the worst abominations ever created, was strangely chosen as the map whenever BoxeR played with an inexplicable frequency. BoxeR played SEVEN games on Ragnarok, which is a far greater number than he should have played under reasonable circumstances. No other champion I know of gained their championship by essentially playing HALF their games under what were basically free-win conditions.

O wow - when I looked up statistics, in the final there was only one fairly balanced map (55% TvZ) and YellOw won on it. Two maps were incredibly imbalanced (Ragnarok and Neo Legacy of Char - one point for each of them) and Neo Hall of Valhalla twice - 66% TvZ.
batsnacks
Profile Blog Joined April 2014
United States4466 Posts
July 08 2014 11:15 GMT
#64
Bacchus 2009 OSL I think. Jaedong golden mouse plus awesome Kelly Clarkson intro.
oGoZenob
Profile Joined December 2011
France1503 Posts
July 08 2014 11:36 GMT
#65
On July 08 2014 18:31 nimdil wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 08 2014 17:29 Letmelose wrote:

1) Ragnarok, widely regarded as one of the worst abominations ever created, was strangely chosen as the map whenever BoxeR played with an inexplicable frequency. BoxeR played SEVEN games on Ragnarok, which is a far greater number than he should have played under reasonable circumstances. No other champion I know of gained their championship by essentially playing HALF their games under what were basically free-win conditions.

O wow - when I looked up statistics, in the final there was only one fairly balanced map (55% TvZ) and YellOw won on it. Two maps were incredibly imbalanced (Ragnarok and Neo Legacy of Char - one point for each of them) and Neo Hall of Valhalla twice - 66% TvZ.

yeah, but was it the map that were imbalanced, or the metagame at thattime on these maps ?
I like starcraft
nimdil
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Poland3748 Posts
July 08 2014 11:57 GMT
#66
On July 08 2014 20:36 oGoZenob wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 08 2014 18:31 nimdil wrote:
On July 08 2014 17:29 Letmelose wrote:

1) Ragnarok, widely regarded as one of the worst abominations ever created, was strangely chosen as the map whenever BoxeR played with an inexplicable frequency. BoxeR played SEVEN games on Ragnarok, which is a far greater number than he should have played under reasonable circumstances. No other champion I know of gained their championship by essentially playing HALF their games under what were basically free-win conditions.

O wow - when I looked up statistics, in the final there was only one fairly balanced map (55% TvZ) and YellOw won on it. Two maps were incredibly imbalanced (Ragnarok and Neo Legacy of Char - one point for each of them) and Neo Hall of Valhalla twice - 66% TvZ.

yeah, but was it the map that were imbalanced, or the metagame at thattime on these maps ?

Well the balance of a map has sense only in the context of given metagame. If the amateurs - for example - have around 80% winrate in TvZ in specific map but it is "balanced" when played by pros in Korea, that's little consolation, because maybe it requires mechanics for Z that are way beyond their skill. Similarly I don't see how it would help the situation if Ragnarok would turn out to be balanced after sAviOr reshaped the matchup (I'm not saying it is balanced - just making a point).
~chut~
Profile Joined September 2003
France1317 Posts
July 08 2014 13:04 GMT
#67
Such excellent posts from you Letmelose. I share your feelings about OGN, about how proleague became too important while i always thought individual leagues should have been the real deal..

OSL had a lot of controversies. Of course choosing Valhalla to be played twice in Coca cola OSL was one of them. I became of fan of Yellow because of game 1 of this final, a 50 minutes desperate attempt at surviving (also because of his desperate sunken rush on the worst map of all, Ragnarok).
I have to say that Boxer also got owned by OGN when they edited Incubus before his final against Garimto and he couldn't land a tank on a small island behind the natural..

I think i agree with you on Gillette. The level was very good, most series went the distance, July was the first zerg to win, in a SL with only 3 zergs, there was a come back to form from Reach and that semifinal against Oov, omg such a good moment in BW ! Oov was the ultimate challenge, no one could imagine him lose, especially in a bo5, against a no name zerg. This osl had it all, even race and match-up distribution was ok, since July made it far.

It's strange that another OSL which stands out for me is Ever2005, also won by July. This time it was mostly about tvz and again July showed how good he was. The last game was crazy, the best final game i've watched and i've watched many. Yes, i think it was better than the Jangbi comeback against Fantasy. It shadows almost everything else, although i remember good semifinals.

Shinhan bank season 2 and 3 were good ones. Season 2 could have got better if Anytime actually managed to win but it was still a good osl. Season 3 had the whole "Finally Savior managed to qualify for an osl" story. He did through an ODT group containing Jaedong, Casy and Sea... That was already something. Then some rivalries appeared, with a red hot Midas, with his teammate Iris and of course Nada.
The only problem i had with those OSLs is the stupid 24 men format which made the group phase almost irrelevant since only the last guy was eliminated. I just couldn't stand it, it took out half the fun.

Daum OSL was a good one in terms of gameplay even though i never really felt connected anyhow to GGPlay, he was mechanically great but it was emotionally not that good.

Curiously, the lastest OSLs have left less impressions on me, even though i really liked Jaedong and Flash. That's strange when i realize the crazy run of Flash against Jaedong, Bisu and Stork to win his first title, but i don't remember any of it except for the final shutdown. Same thing for the first Jangbi title, a long time coming one, but i forgot the circumstances. Maybe it's because the times were more about proleague, i don't know.




~chut~
Profile Joined September 2003
France1317 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-08 13:22:00
July 08 2014 13:12 GMT
#68
Ragnarock was a bad map, whatever metagame you consider. It had an impact of course but not that much.
It's just that the nat was in a dumb place that made it easy to defend as terran with tanks and difficult as zerg because the travel distance was quite long.
Any competent terran would prevent zerg from expanding and would win easily from there.

Btw, it was on that map that Boxer played 7 times (7/0) during Coca-Cola OSL, including 1 tvp. He played Valhalla 4 times (4/0), Jungle Story (a quite fair map by 2001 standards) twice and Legacy of Char (very good for zerg) twice, and he lost the 4 games on those 2 maps. It makes me mad to think about it actually.
RowdierBob
Profile Blog Joined May 2003
Australia13004 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-08 13:35:25
July 08 2014 13:35 GMT
#69
Hmm tough choice but I'd have to go:

Savior > Nada @ Shinhan 2006. The rivalry between these two at this time was epic. Savior was just so good back then it was almost unfair. There was so much hype before this game.

GGPlay > Iris @ Daum 07. The players themselves weren't huge names in the history or BW stars but I think this was this was the best finals in terms of game quality. It didn't have the hype of a Savior vs Nada but the games were amazing. GGPlay's play in game 3 under the most intense pressure is one of the most incredible BW feats I've seen. An amazing hold.

Garimto > Boxer @ SKY 2001. The first OSL final I ever saw. Boxer was pretty unbeatable at the time so this was a big upset.

Honourable mention to Jangbang in the Jin Air final. Intense play under huge pressure.

Was never into the MSL as much as OSL but you can't go past Bisu > Savior. Was it ever confirmed if Savior threw this series? Still, this ranks as the biggest ever BW upset, IMO.
"Terrans are pretty much space-Australians" - H
nimdil
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Poland3748 Posts
July 08 2014 13:50 GMT
#70
After thinking this through I decided that the most memorable OSLs for me were the last two.

JangBi's first OSL was memorable because it was such indredible cindirella story - lucky wild card tournament won, than being 0-1 behind Flash but eventually getting to the final which was so exciting. And the last game with carriers (IIRC) - couldn't be better.

JangBi's second OSL was memorable mostly for the final, were so many legends assembled to say good bye to the scene that was so kind to them. I don't remember much about this tournament, but the final goodbye was truly amazing.

Of all the MSLs I remember two the most. When Flash won Golden Badge because I facepalmed so hard when Jaedong lost to Zero and king of "14cc into yaaawn..." repeated NaDa's feat but with WCG gold on top of that and the previous one when Flash went all "LoL I'm fabulous" into "0-2", I rooted so HARD for Jaedong's Golden Badge and then evenly hard facepalmed when he lost to Hydra in semis.

Which translates that I remember mostly OSLs when I was happy for JangBi and MSLs I was frustrated by Jaedong. It's incredible that player with so immaculate ZvZ (73% based on TLPD!) lost three times in MSL semis in ZvZ. Especially in PDPop when he knew there was no terran waiting for him, no Flash, no doom. This was his one sure shot at golden badge.

From the tournaments that happened before I started watching SC:BW I think I liked July's titles the most, especially the 3rd one. He was obviously excited about getting golden mouse, so unlike Nada.
soujiro_
Profile Joined June 2010
Uruguay5195 Posts
July 08 2014 13:55 GMT
#71
ty letmelose, i <3 yellow more now
ace hwaiting!!
Pippah
Profile Joined January 2010
Denmark353 Posts
July 08 2014 16:27 GMT
#72
On July 07 2014 14:21 Xiphos wrote:
You guys are making me fucking pissed off again that BW professional scene was killed off by Blizzard.

And I've made peace with it the hard way 1 year ago.


Agree!
Dazed.
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Canada3301 Posts
July 08 2014 17:37 GMT
#73
OSL was Saviors win, hands down. I cant think of one exceptional MSL season, though I suppose overall my fav would be Bisu 3:2 > stork.
Never say Die! ||| Fight you? No, I want to kill you.
Kaal
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
Djibouti2514 Posts
July 08 2014 20:46 GMT
#74
I think all of the EVER OSLs have a place in my heart, 06 or 08 best. 07 dat intro tho.
rabidch
Profile Joined January 2010
United States20289 Posts
July 10 2014 10:42 GMT
#75
jin air and gomtv 3. i'm not fond of toss play but god damn those were good ones


i sure miss pro BW now
LiquidDota StaffOnly a true king can play the King.
riyanme
Profile Joined September 2010
Philippines940 Posts
July 10 2014 16:32 GMT
#76
broodwar for life~!
-
AhAiHi
Profile Joined July 2014
United States31 Posts
July 10 2014 21:39 GMT
#77
To me, even as a Terran, I loved the Dragon season. Bisu was SOOO close to making it past Stork in the Ro16, and then messed up his micro to lose. Stork went on to win that OSL. After that match Bisu suddenly turned on this gear that made him dominant in PvP/PvT, the 2 match up he always had trouble with. He won the MSL/GOM Thing and was beyond great for his team.

The second would have to be Flash's emergence the second time, to be arguably the most dominant player of all time. He went from be this turtle style player to reinventing himself for 3 whole seasons. Eventually he won both the MSL and OSL in the same season.

And for nostalgia sake, Savior's final title in the OSL was amazing after going through all these maps "intended" to destroy him and Zergs.
Xeofreestyler
Profile Blog Joined June 2005
Belgium6768 Posts
July 10 2014 22:07 GMT
#78
Gah... so hard to choose. BW leagues had sooo many epic storylines. Really miss that era

Thank god ssbm is sort of filling the void for me.

Also, fuck sc2.
Graphics
Carnivorous Sheep
Profile Blog Joined November 2008
Baa?21242 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-11 01:42:39
July 11 2014 01:42 GMT
#79
I don't know what the best one is, but Shinhan 2006 1 was the worst one.
TranslatorBaa!
DragoonPK
Profile Blog Joined July 2007
3259 Posts
July 11 2014 02:26 GMT
#80
My favorite was Daum OSL, which is the first one I actually watched. Dat GGPlay doe :3
rift
Profile Blog Joined September 2007
1819 Posts
July 29 2014 03:23 GMT
#81
On July 08 2014 17:29 Letmelose wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 08 2014 14:30 rift wrote:
On July 07 2014 22:45 Letmelose wrote:
My personal list, with token leagues often remembered by the general populus,

1) Coca Cola OGN StarLeague: The birthplace of the epic rivalry between BoxeR and YellOw, but really man, considering how heavily OGN "tweaked" things just to put BoxeR on a pedestal, it delegitimizes the entire tournament for me.

2) 2002 SKY OGN StarLeague: The origin of the "Legend of the Fall", and the rise of a new hero for the protoss race. The finals had more than 25,000 people attending live, probably the most fondly remembered league for protoss fans in Korea.

3) Gillette OGN StarLeague: There's a saying in Korea, which roughly translates into, "did you only start watching OGN since Gillette OGN StarLeague you newb?", the duo-viewer magnets of BoxeR and YellOw both failed to qualify, but this league kind of signified a new era, with great games to go along with the ride. My personal favourite by far.

4) 2004 EVER StarLeague: The most fondly remembered league by many, due to 7 out of the 8 quarter-finalists having been previous OGN StarLeague/MSL winners (the odd man out being YellOw). Probably the go to choice for many. If I'm to be honest, I'm a little tired of any half decent league with BoxeR doing well in it being praised as the greatest ever.

6) YATGK MSL: One of the most thoroughly planned league, that sacrificed commercially successful elements to ensure the best players were rewarded. Some really classic match-ups, and the birth of the "Tim-Dal-Rok", the best rivalry going when the triumvirate of July, NaDa, and GoRush ruled supreme.

5) So1 OGN StarLeague: The most commercially successful league. I remember hating the horrid map pool with a vengeance, but people always wanted to see BoxeR do well, and boy did he deliver in spades. Personally, the rise of the neo-triumvirate of the protoss race (PuSan, Anytime, and Stork) was noteworthy.

6) UZOO MSL: In the same vein as YATGK MSL, one of the most highly concentrated leagues in terms of game quality, with the rise of one incredibly talented IPXZerg, some fantastic games from the legend Reach, and a back-up cast of some of the most talented players from the era. I personally think despite the commercial success of the GomTV leagues (due to the ease of access from the viewers), the vintage MSL from the days when double-elimination were the real deal, MBCGame actually brought a fresh angle that OGN StarLeague repeatidly failed to give (Jesus Christ, we get it, you want BoxeR to do well, just stop making it so goddamned obvious OGN).

To be honest, I loved them all. Even when OGN did their weird decisions just to appease the BoxeR fetish, even when MSL tried to go in a direction that I disliked just to stay afloat business-wise. But if I had to choose, I personally prefer the individual leagues that happened before the rise of the ProLeague (which took away the limelight from the individual leagues both in terms of viewership and progamer priorities), the leagues that didn't go out of their way just to cling on to the blockbuster stars of the time just to succeed commercially, and had the confidence in the participating players to create new and exciting storylines. And in the height of Starcraft's success in Korea, circa 2004~2005, when the old guard were still there, and the new blood were hungry to get the limelight the likes of BoxeR enjoyed, it was simply a pleasure to watch.

But that's just me. We all have our favourites. I mean, there's magic to be found in each and every one.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjyRQNlaams

can you expand on how ogn tweaked the coca cola osl in boxer's favor? and other starleagues? i'm really curious


It's already been explained pretty well, but I'll get into the specifics.

1) Ragnarok, widely regarded as one of the worst abominations ever created, was strangely chosen as the map whenever BoxeR played with an inexplicable frequency. BoxeR played SEVEN games on Ragnarok, which is a far greater number than he should have played under reasonable circumstances. No other champion I know of gained their championship by essentially playing HALF their games under what were basically free-win conditions.

2) BoxeR actually struggled during the group stages, and was due for a tie-breaker. However, due to this strange "point system", where the points (which appears on the screen at the end of the game) were added up, and BoxeR was allowed to go through without having to do a tie-breaker. This horrible system was introduced just for this tournament, and was abandoned afterwards. Terrans are always guaranteed good points versus the zerg race due to how the match-up works, and the efficiency of their units, and I'm willing to bet any number of cash that if BoxeR was somehow disadvantaged due to this retarded system, it wouldn't have been implemented.

3) There are numerous instances where OGN got out of their way to help BoxeR, and my god were they rewarded with commercial success, which urged them to push their agenda even further. The guy was a genius, and a fine poster boy for the scene, but due to the circumstances mentioned before, I really had trouble fully enjoying any of his successful leagues. There were certain scenarios that tickled the masses just right, and successful players that didn't gain enough public approval were never backed the way popular players were (case in point, July). It's not that OGN didn't try, but once their efforts fell flat, they were quick to abandon certain players in order to make "stars" of more commercially viable pretty boys.

By the way, while it was the most obvious with BoxeR, it was never an even playing field for all the players involved. That's why I love Gillette OGN StarLeague the most. July was never meant to win. He played the "hideous alien" race, he was from a terrible non-sponsored team that nobody supported, he was a nobody, and on top of that he didn't have the pretty-boy looks that was oh so important for those fan-girls. He won his fans over with his dedication, his gutsy play, and out of the world mechanics for his time. It was such a cinderella story, but alas, he didn't have the face for it. But I'll always remember.

this actually makes me happy boxer never won the golden mouse.
XenOsky
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Chile2257 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-29 04:42:01
July 29 2014 04:39 GMT
#82
My top 3:

1- EVER 2004 OSL - Best storyline
2- Korean Air OSL S1 - i was rooting for effort so badly, i hated FlaSh at the time... i was so happy when effort won, great memories
3- ClubDay Online MSL - i'm a Bisu fan <3

Bonus: + Show Spoiler +
(Z)JulyZerg vs (P)BeSt don't remember which League it was exactly... all games were memorable as fuck
StarCraft & Audax Italiano.
Chameleon
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
United States604 Posts
July 29 2014 05:09 GMT
#83
On July 29 2014 13:39 XenOsky- wrote:
My top 3:

1- EVER 2004 OSL - Best storyline
2- Korean Air OSL S1 - i was rooting for effort so badly, i hated FlaSh at the time... i was so happy when effort won, great memories
3- ClubDay Online MSL - i'm a Bisu fan <3

Bonus: + Show Spoiler +
(Z)JulyZerg vs (P)BeSt don't remember which League it was exactly... all games were memorable as fuck


+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]
TL's #1 Horang2 fan
XenOsky
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Chile2257 Posts
July 29 2014 05:48 GMT
#84
On July 29 2014 14:09 Chameleon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 29 2014 13:39 XenOsky- wrote:
My top 3:

1- EVER 2004 OSL - Best storyline
2- Korean Air OSL S1 - i was rooting for effort so badly, i hated FlaSh at the time... i was so happy when effort won, great memories
3- ClubDay Online MSL - i'm a Bisu fan <3

Bonus: + Show Spoiler +
(Z)JulyZerg vs (P)BeSt don't remember which League it was exactly... all games were memorable as fuck


+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


exactly! ^_^!
StarCraft & Audax Italiano.
wptlzkwjd
Profile Joined January 2012
Canada1240 Posts
July 29 2014 06:10 GMT
#85
My favorite would be the 5 straight MSL finals that sAviOr appeared. I only watched VioleTAK's videos back then and the only games he posted of sAviOr was when he won so I actually thought this guy was completely invincible. The only game I saw sAviOr lose was that semi-final game 1 vs Nal_Ra where it came down to 1 pylon and 1 extractor.
Feel free to add me on steam: http://steamcommunity.com/id/MagnusAskeland/
Chameleon
Profile Blog Joined January 2008
United States604 Posts
July 29 2014 06:18 GMT
#86
On July 29 2014 14:48 XenOsky- wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 29 2014 14:09 Chameleon wrote:
On July 29 2014 13:39 XenOsky- wrote:
My top 3:

1- EVER 2004 OSL - Best storyline
2- Korean Air OSL S1 - i was rooting for effort so badly, i hated FlaSh at the time... i was so happy when effort won, great memories
3- ClubDay Online MSL - i'm a Bisu fan <3

Bonus: + Show Spoiler +
(Z)JulyZerg vs (P)BeSt don't remember which League it was exactly... all games were memorable as fuck


+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]


exactly! ^_^!


That was the finals of EVER OSL 2008 (July's golden mouse run). I loved that finals mostly because I was totally pumped for either player to win. Best was one of my top 2 or 3 favorite players at the time, but you just couldnt help but want Tushin to pull it off.
TL's #1 Horang2 fan
zer0das
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States8519 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-07-29 06:36:42
July 29 2014 06:36 GMT
#87
I still think Daum OSL where GGPlay beat Iris was the best that I ever got to watch while it was airing. I was rooting for Iris and started watching in the middle of the second game, and by the end of it I was so pissed at GGPlay for denying Iris, but also rooting for him because the kid had nerves of steel.
[sc1f]eonzerg
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Belgium6540 Posts
July 29 2014 08:24 GMT
#88
Nada vs Savior OSL was the best i think
iamho
Profile Joined June 2009
United States3347 Posts
August 02 2014 03:52 GMT
#89
EVER2008 was amazing. Not just the finals but also Luxury's and Best's runs. Jinair 2011 had the most memorable finals for me. And of course the last OSL was amazing not because of the games, but for the closing ceremony, especially what Kim Carrier said.
Morbidius
Profile Joined November 2010
Brazil3449 Posts
August 02 2014 03:56 GMT
#90
ABC Mart MSL would have been great if we weren't robbed of the destined final Flash vs Jaedong final.
Has foreign StarCraft hit rock bottom?
Elyvilon
Profile Joined August 2008
United States13143 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-08-02 04:51:36
August 02 2014 04:09 GMT
#91
The troll in me(and the rest of me too) still loves Arena MSL; everything seemed to be saying Flash vs Jaedong and fOrGG basically went "fuck that shit I'ma gonna crush all of you."

Also I'm still of the opinion that the fOrGG vs Kal quarterfinal series was the most underrated series since at least the beginning 2008, that was hilarious.
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Last Romantic
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
United States20661 Posts
August 02 2014 04:13 GMT
#92
Ever 2004 clearly the best despite bunker rush

the finals and 3rd place match were all so great

reach vs oov was good too
ㅋㄲㅈㅁ
XenOsky
Profile Blog Joined March 2008
Chile2257 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-08-02 11:44:29
August 02 2014 11:43 GMT
#93
Another good tournament was the first GOMTV Classic...

Tasteless made all the games epic to watch, it was amazing to have english cast of korean pro games.

is there a way to watch that league all over again? i can't find the vods anywhere
StarCraft & Audax Italiano.
don_kyuhote
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
3006 Posts
Last Edited: 2014-08-02 12:03:21
August 02 2014 12:00 GMT
#94
On July 07 2014 00:44 Chameleon wrote:
[image loading]

Does anyone know off the top of their head if this was the toughest road to starleague championship?
Flash had to beat JD, Bisu, and Stork...one guy from TaekBang LeeSsang rising above and beating the other three consecutively...a truly worthy of a feat for a OSL champion.
For what shall it profit a man, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul?
StarStruck
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
25339 Posts
August 02 2014 12:31 GMT
#95
No bias here: Daum OSL was epic.
Letmelose
Profile Blog Joined September 2006
Korea (South)3227 Posts
August 02 2014 15:58 GMT
#96
On August 02 2014 21:00 don_kyuhote wrote:
Show nested quote +
On July 07 2014 00:44 Chameleon wrote:
[image loading]

Does anyone know off the top of their head if this was the toughest road to starleague championship?
Flash had to beat JD, Bisu, and Stork...one guy from TaekBang LeeSsang rising above and beating the other three consecutively...a truly worthy of a feat for a OSL champion.


Let's take a statistical look at it. The player's opponents will be rated by their Y-Rankings (rankings used by YGOSU) at the time of the match-up.

Flash's Bacchus OGN StarLeague 2008 run.

RO16 opponents
1) Rumble: Outside of the top 30
2) Rock: Outside of the top 30
3) Stork: Ranked 1st

RO8 opponent: Jaedong
Ranked 2nd

RO4 opponent: Bisu
Ranked 4th

Finals opponent: Stork
Ranked 2nd

So Flash's RO16 opponents were extremely soft, except for Stork, who was ranked 1st at the time. He then proceded to defeat three top four players. Stork's Y-Ranking dropped from 1st place to 2nd by the time the finals took place since Jaedong overtook him due to performing better in the same period.

Off the top of my head, ForGG's Arena MSL run could be regarded as just as hard.

RO16 opponent: Sea
Ranked 5th

RO8 opponent: Kal
Ranked 9th

RO4 opponent: Flash
Ranked 2nd

Finals opponent: Jaedong
Ranked 1st

I'll count ForGG's opponents from RO16 onwards since I can't be bothered matching the lower platforms of the OGN tournaments that corresponds to the RO32 stages of the MSL. While his round of eight opponent is of a lesser calibre, his RO16, RO4 and Finals opponents were performing better statistically. Whether you weigh the rounds accordingly, or just take the average strength of the opponents, ForGG's opponents during his run from RO16 onwards were better just in terms of statistics.

I know that the story of Flash defeating all the members of the Taek-Beng-LeeSsang was quite the storyline considering the legacy all those four players have built since then, but just take into consideration that these four players had a total of TWO OGN StarLeague trophies between them at the time (even if you include Flash's debut title at that tournament), so there were more "decorated" bracket line-ups in history, and I just pointed out how 2008 Bacchus OGN StarLeague wasn't necessarily the toughest bracket if you just look at the statistical rankings of the players at the time, especially so if you take into account the RO16.

Of course, you can argue that ForGG depended on a lot of cheese to overcome his opponents, but the same could be said for Flash. Both their victories were dependent on unorthodox builds that worked just right at the time, but probably would have worked the second time they were used.
TL+ Member
Elyvilon
Profile Joined August 2008
United States13143 Posts
August 02 2014 16:17 GMT
#97
On August 03 2014 00:58 Letmelose wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 02 2014 21:00 don_kyuhote wrote:
On July 07 2014 00:44 Chameleon wrote:
[image loading]

Does anyone know off the top of their head if this was the toughest road to starleague championship?
Flash had to beat JD, Bisu, and Stork...one guy from TaekBang LeeSsang rising above and beating the other three consecutively...a truly worthy of a feat for a OSL champion.


Let's take a statistical look at it. The player's opponents will be rated by their Y-Rankings (rankings used by YGOSU) at the time of the match-up.

Flash's Bacchus OGN StarLeague 2008 run.

RO16 opponents
1) Rumble: Outside of the top 30
2) Rock: Outside of the top 30
3) Stork: Ranked 1st

RO8 opponent: Jaedong
Ranked 2nd

RO4 opponent: Bisu
Ranked 4th

Finals opponent: Stork
Ranked 2nd

So Flash's RO16 opponents were extremely soft, except for Stork, who was ranked 1st at the time. He then proceded to defeat three top four players. Stork's Y-Ranking dropped from 1st place to 2nd by the time the finals took place since Jaedong overtook him due to performing better in the same period.

Off the top of my head, ForGG's Arena MSL run could be regarded as just as hard.

RO16 opponent: Sea
Ranked 5th

RO8 opponent: Kal
Ranked 9th

RO4 opponent: Flash
Ranked 2nd

Finals opponent: Jaedong
Ranked 1st

I'll count ForGG's opponents from RO16 onwards since I can't be bothered matching the lower platforms of the OGN tournaments that corresponds to the RO32 stages of the MSL. While his round of eight opponent is of a lesser calibre, his RO16, RO4 and Finals opponents were performing better statistically. Whether you weigh the rounds accordingly, or just take the average strength of the opponents, ForGG's opponents during his run from RO16 onwards were better just in terms of statistics.

I know that the story of Flash defeating all the members of the Taek-Beng-LeeSsang was quite the storyline considering the legacy all those four players have built since then, but just take into consideration that these four players had a total of TWO OGN StarLeague trophies between them at the time (even if you include Flash's debut title at that tournament), so there were more "decorated" bracket line-ups in history, and I just pointed out how 2008 Bacchus OGN StarLeague wasn't necessarily the toughest bracket if you just look at the statistical rankings of the players at the time, especially so if you take into account the RO16.

Of course, you can argue that ForGG depended on a lot of cheese to overcome his opponents, but the same could be said for Flash. Both their victories were dependent on unorthodox builds that worked just right at the time, but probably would have worked the second time they were used.

Thanks for this. What about Mind's MSL run?
Liquipedia
Letmelose
Profile Blog Joined September 2006
Korea (South)3227 Posts
August 02 2014 17:00 GMT
#98
On August 03 2014 01:17 Elyvilon wrote:
Show nested quote +
On August 03 2014 00:58 Letmelose wrote:
On August 02 2014 21:00 don_kyuhote wrote:
On July 07 2014 00:44 Chameleon wrote:
[image loading]

Does anyone know off the top of their head if this was the toughest road to starleague championship?
Flash had to beat JD, Bisu, and Stork...one guy from TaekBang LeeSsang rising above and beating the other three consecutively...a truly worthy of a feat for a OSL champion.


Let's take a statistical look at it. The player's opponents will be rated by their Y-Rankings (rankings used by YGOSU) at the time of the match-up.

Flash's Bacchus OGN StarLeague 2008 run.

RO16 opponents
1) Rumble: Outside of the top 30
2) Rock: Outside of the top 30
3) Stork: Ranked 1st

RO8 opponent: Jaedong
Ranked 2nd

RO4 opponent: Bisu
Ranked 4th

Finals opponent: Stork
Ranked 2nd

So Flash's RO16 opponents were extremely soft, except for Stork, who was ranked 1st at the time. He then proceded to defeat three top four players. Stork's Y-Ranking dropped from 1st place to 2nd by the time the finals took place since Jaedong overtook him due to performing better in the same period.

Off the top of my head, ForGG's Arena MSL run could be regarded as just as hard.

RO16 opponent: Sea
Ranked 5th

RO8 opponent: Kal
Ranked 9th

RO4 opponent: Flash
Ranked 2nd

Finals opponent: Jaedong
Ranked 1st

I'll count ForGG's opponents from RO16 onwards since I can't be bothered matching the lower platforms of the OGN tournaments that corresponds to the RO32 stages of the MSL. While his round of eight opponent is of a lesser calibre, his RO16, RO4 and Finals opponents were performing better statistically. Whether you weigh the rounds accordingly, or just take the average strength of the opponents, ForGG's opponents during his run from RO16 onwards were better just in terms of statistics.

I know that the story of Flash defeating all the members of the Taek-Beng-LeeSsang was quite the storyline considering the legacy all those four players have built since then, but just take into consideration that these four players had a total of TWO OGN StarLeague trophies between them at the time (even if you include Flash's debut title at that tournament), so there were more "decorated" bracket line-ups in history, and I just pointed out how 2008 Bacchus OGN StarLeague wasn't necessarily the toughest bracket if you just look at the statistical rankings of the players at the time, especially so if you take into account the RO16.

Of course, you can argue that ForGG depended on a lot of cheese to overcome his opponents, but the same could be said for Flash. Both their victories were dependent on unorthodox builds that worked just right at the time, but probably would have worked the second time they were used.

Thanks for this. What about Mind's MSL run?


Just take a quick look at his opponents, the dates of their games, and match it to the nearest date possible on this site, and make sure the dates of the rankings precedes the games in question so that the result of the actual games don't affect the actual rankings.

http://www.ygosu.com/reports/?m2=yrank&s_race=all&s_year=2004&s_date=2004-07-26

RO16: iloveoov
Ranked 13th

RO8: Memory
Ranked 28th

RO4: sAviOr
Ranked 2nd

Finals: Bisu
Ranked 3rd

Bisu isn't ranked as high as one imagines, because of his horrid ProLeague record at the time, sAviOr's past results have decayed enough to drop him from first place, and the rest of the players, while worthy opponents, aren't anything of note in the grand scale of things.
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