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I don't think a switch to SC2 is inevitable. We've been slowly entering the age of disillusionment for a long time with SC2, as it has become evident that the game isn't as interesting or entertaining as BW.
The BW community needs to do more to reverse BW's image as 'that old game' and reclaim some of the spotlight here, especially when the only thing SC2 has over it is flashier explosions. I would love to watch more BW, but, where is it?
Revitalization needs to begin from the bottom up. It would be possible for BW's scene to run in parallel to the SC2 scene instead of one pushing the other out, but this requires BW's scene to grow. Perhaps the strategy should be to intertwine the two games more closely so that the growing number of SC2 viewers could spill over into BW.
In any case, accepting defeat seems silly to me. Brood War is a game that has already stood the test of time impeccably. It is viewed, more or less, as perfected.
SC2 is widely viewed as flawed, and Blizzard does not seem to be working towards fixing it or forging a more solid gameplay. The design strategy is to add more flashy and shiny distractions, but eventually it will fall back into disillusionment. So much so that the community has been taking matters into its own hands for years now, with custom tournament versions of maps that are necessary to fix flaws in the game design and even a movement to change the fundamental setup of the game (FRB) in order to promote more interesting gameplay. These issues in the game will become more and more pronounced as the community's interests move further and further from Blizzard's. Some of these things (e.g. APM) have been fixed, but usually these issues are allowed to drag on for far longer than they should. Bnet2.0, as well, isn't built to harbor a strong community, either. All of these things will weaken SC2 in the long run, and each and every time something isn't quite right, the same thing will be said.
Every time.
"We didn't have this problem in BW."
A constant reminder, perhaps, that SC2 is unlikely to ever step out of the shadow of its predecessor. It is a cold comfort that, if BW dies, it will at least haunt its unworthy heir forever.
Allow me to clarify that I watch both SC2 and BW passionately, and play both, but understand that while I think SC2 is a good game, it is not BW and does not deserve to surmount BW in this fashion. Allow me also to clarify that I think I should stop writing long posts late at night.
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Repeating what I said in the BW coaches thread, I was planning on minimizing my SC viewing anyway since I'm going to attend grad school in a faraway country with a timezone not conducive to live KST viewing in a few months- I don't function well with sub-optimal sleep (thanks aging), my schedule will involve research and unpredictable hours, and I'm not the type of student who can slack off and still do well in the end.
Although SC2 just doesn't captivate me in the way BW does (but I've seen some really good SC2 games, can't be denied), if the transition starts soon I'll probably watch the first few games of the transition and see how that goes. I'll also watch the odd foreign BW event.
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Looking forward to more free time i guess, but in the past year I've only really watched Khan play anyway. Long time spectator, was more of a War3 gamer a few years ago. My BW viewing will probably deteriorate the same way my war3 viewing did. I used to watch almost every night elf game till Moon, soccer and a few others started playing sc2 more.
Quite sad really, BW was like no other scene, least i saw jangbang win the last OSL live  If he makes it again this year i may go again.
Think i'm echoing most people in saying that SC2 isn't very interesting to me. SC2 graphics make my eyes bleed as well.
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I wasn't aware that BW was up and leaving.....
Still got plenty of vods and old friends even if they ever stop running BW on Korean TV.
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I'm gonna watch this final OSL (watered down though it may be) and I'm out
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SNM said on the stream (to what I agree) that SC2 is more fun to play than to watch. Despite millions of SC2 events available, I figured, that I only care about BW streams, If there are none, I just play the game, and ocassionally watch some dusty VODs. Or I teach others how to play BW, to create a bunch of weaker opponents to own I am definitely reluctant to "new versions", I already had to decide once. It was Quake vs Quake 3, and I didn't like the new one. I still (very) occasionally play the original Quake, because I like it. Think, the same will be for SCBW vs SC2 unless Blizzard comes with a new concepts that will make this game epic. Because now it is not.
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On April 22 2012 06:45 firehand101 wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 04:08 jpak wrote:
I'll start following foreign BW a bit more.
Also League of Legends. What? that doexsnt make any sense?
What part of my statement did you not understand?
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On April 22 2012 14:23 Rkynick wrote:
I don't think a switch to SC2 is inevitable. We've been slowly entering the age of disillusionment for a long time with SC2, as it has become evident that the game isn't as interesting or entertaining as BW.
The BW community needs to do more to reverse BW's image as 'that old game' and reclaim some of the spotlight here, especially when the only thing SC2 has over it is flashier explosions. I would love to watch more BW, but, where is it?
Revitalization needs to begin from the bottom up. It would be possible for BW's scene to run in parallel to the SC2 scene instead of one pushing the other out, but this requires BW's scene to grow. Perhaps the strategy should be to intertwine the two games more closely so that the growing number of SC2 viewers could spill over into BW.
In any case, accepting defeat seems silly to me. Brood War is a game that has already stood the test of time impeccably. It is viewed, more or less, as perfected.
SC2 is widely viewed as flawed, and Blizzard does not seem to be working towards fixing it or forging a more solid gameplay. The design strategy is to add more flashy and shiny distractions, but eventually it will fall back into disillusionment. So much so that the community has been taking matters into its own hands for years now, with custom tournament versions of maps that are necessary to fix flaws in the game design and even a movement to change the fundamental setup of the game (FRB) in order to promote more interesting gameplay. These issues in the game will become more and more pronounced as the community's interests move further and further from Blizzard's. Some of these things (e.g. APM) have been fixed, but usually these issues are allowed to drag on for far longer than they should. Bnet2.0, as well, isn't built to harbor a strong community, either. All of these things will weaken SC2 in the long run, and each and every time something isn't quite right, the same thing will be said.
Every time.
"We didn't have this problem in BW."
A constant reminder, perhaps, that SC2 is unlikely to ever step out of the shadow of its predecessor. It is a cold comfort that, if BW dies, it will at least haunt its unworthy heir forever.
Allow me to clarify that I watch both SC2 and BW passionately, and play both, but understand that while I think SC2 is a good game, it is not BW and does not deserve to surmount BW in this fashion. Allow me also to clarify that I think I should stop writing long posts late at night.
I think Sayle's casts got a lot of SC2 people into watching BW(including me). But getting into playing BW is sooo hard, i've spoken about that before. ICCup is really empty, it's hard to find similar skilled players, you can't play on mornings/late at night and even if you play at a peak time it is still hard to get a game if you can't host (I'm talking of my own experiences at D- rank). And thats not even going into the game being hard itself or some people having trouble running it on Windows 7..
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On April 22 2012 14:23 Rkynick wrote:
We've been slowly entering the age of disillusionment for a long time with SC2, as it has become evident that the game isn't as interesting or entertaining as BW.
SC2 is widely viewed as flawed,
Maybe to people on this site but for casuals that is not true at all. That's the issue.
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On April 21 2012 05:19 ImbaTosS wrote:Show nested quote +On April 21 2012 04:08 jpak wrote:
I'll start following foreign BW a bit more.
Also League of Legends. I was about to say- do people really want BW to die with this? It doesn't have to, we just have to keep it running in our community. As we already are doing lol. What's with all this BW apocalypse "it's all over" crap?? Come on guys, the only ones killing the game at that point are you! It's not like we're dependant on the Korean scene to function 0,o What a bunch of emos.. Are you gonna wander off sobbing, or organise a fucking tournament? I know which one will keep BroodWar going, and which is self-indulgent pointless nonsense.
Exactly!
And you go, Elegant! Don't let the UK latch onto that trendy Euro bullshit. "All the countries in Europe are making the switch, blah blah blah." Well guess what? I'm paying in Pounds, bitches.
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it won't be as entertaining as BW, maybe i will watch some games when they switch just for curiosity, but i think i'll leave, i don't like this stuff, BW is better, and they now change just because SC2 has better graphics and more casual players watching it, but when another good RTS comes out i think Sc2 won't last for so long and so well as BW did
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United States10393 Posts
With this final osl, i feel like its right for flash to win and set the most osl and msls combined. it just feels right.
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No such thing as "post BW".
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On April 23 2012 02:43 huehuehuehue wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 14:23 Rkynick wrote:
I don't think a switch to SC2 is inevitable. We've been slowly entering the age of disillusionment for a long time with SC2, as it has become evident that the game isn't as interesting or entertaining as BW.
The BW community needs to do more to reverse BW's image as 'that old game' and reclaim some of the spotlight here, especially when the only thing SC2 has over it is flashier explosions. I would love to watch more BW, but, where is it?
Revitalization needs to begin from the bottom up. It would be possible for BW's scene to run in parallel to the SC2 scene instead of one pushing the other out, but this requires BW's scene to grow. Perhaps the strategy should be to intertwine the two games more closely so that the growing number of SC2 viewers could spill over into BW.
In any case, accepting defeat seems silly to me. Brood War is a game that has already stood the test of time impeccably. It is viewed, more or less, as perfected.
SC2 is widely viewed as flawed, and Blizzard does not seem to be working towards fixing it or forging a more solid gameplay. The design strategy is to add more flashy and shiny distractions, but eventually it will fall back into disillusionment. So much so that the community has been taking matters into its own hands for years now, with custom tournament versions of maps that are necessary to fix flaws in the game design and even a movement to change the fundamental setup of the game (FRB) in order to promote more interesting gameplay. These issues in the game will become more and more pronounced as the community's interests move further and further from Blizzard's. Some of these things (e.g. APM) have been fixed, but usually these issues are allowed to drag on for far longer than they should. Bnet2.0, as well, isn't built to harbor a strong community, either. All of these things will weaken SC2 in the long run, and each and every time something isn't quite right, the same thing will be said.
Every time.
"We didn't have this problem in BW."
A constant reminder, perhaps, that SC2 is unlikely to ever step out of the shadow of its predecessor. It is a cold comfort that, if BW dies, it will at least haunt its unworthy heir forever.
Allow me to clarify that I watch both SC2 and BW passionately, and play both, but understand that while I think SC2 is a good game, it is not BW and does not deserve to surmount BW in this fashion. Allow me also to clarify that I think I should stop writing long posts late at night. I think Sayle's casts got a lot of SC2 people into watching BW(including me). But getting into playing BW is sooo hard, i've spoken about that before. ICCup is really empty, it's hard to find similar skilled players, you can't play on mornings/late at night and even if you play at a peak time it is still hard to get a game if you can't host (I'm talking of my own experiences at D- rank). And thats not even going into the game being hard itself or some people having trouble running it on Windows 7..
This is very well said. I love watching Brood War now that I actually know it exists (I was 6 years old in Japan when it came out, give me a break). But playing it? Holy cow. There are some D rank players that could have gone pro in the first months of the game. This is the culmination of 14 years of strategic evolution. It's extremely difficult to even know where to start. I for one will be happy to find someone as bad as me and just play for fun. I really wish I had been around to see the legends, but oh well.
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On April 23 2012 03:26 jeeeeohn wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2012 02:43 huehuehuehue wrote:On April 22 2012 14:23 Rkynick wrote:
I don't think a switch to SC2 is inevitable. We've been slowly entering the age of disillusionment for a long time with SC2, as it has become evident that the game isn't as interesting or entertaining as BW.
The BW community needs to do more to reverse BW's image as 'that old game' and reclaim some of the spotlight here, especially when the only thing SC2 has over it is flashier explosions. I would love to watch more BW, but, where is it?
Revitalization needs to begin from the bottom up. It would be possible for BW's scene to run in parallel to the SC2 scene instead of one pushing the other out, but this requires BW's scene to grow. Perhaps the strategy should be to intertwine the two games more closely so that the growing number of SC2 viewers could spill over into BW.
In any case, accepting defeat seems silly to me. Brood War is a game that has already stood the test of time impeccably. It is viewed, more or less, as perfected.
SC2 is widely viewed as flawed, and Blizzard does not seem to be working towards fixing it or forging a more solid gameplay. The design strategy is to add more flashy and shiny distractions, but eventually it will fall back into disillusionment. So much so that the community has been taking matters into its own hands for years now, with custom tournament versions of maps that are necessary to fix flaws in the game design and even a movement to change the fundamental setup of the game (FRB) in order to promote more interesting gameplay. These issues in the game will become more and more pronounced as the community's interests move further and further from Blizzard's. Some of these things (e.g. APM) have been fixed, but usually these issues are allowed to drag on for far longer than they should. Bnet2.0, as well, isn't built to harbor a strong community, either. All of these things will weaken SC2 in the long run, and each and every time something isn't quite right, the same thing will be said.
Every time.
"We didn't have this problem in BW."
A constant reminder, perhaps, that SC2 is unlikely to ever step out of the shadow of its predecessor. It is a cold comfort that, if BW dies, it will at least haunt its unworthy heir forever.
Allow me to clarify that I watch both SC2 and BW passionately, and play both, but understand that while I think SC2 is a good game, it is not BW and does not deserve to surmount BW in this fashion. Allow me also to clarify that I think I should stop writing long posts late at night. I think Sayle's casts got a lot of SC2 people into watching BW(including me). But getting into playing BW is sooo hard, i've spoken about that before. ICCup is really empty, it's hard to find similar skilled players, you can't play on mornings/late at night and even if you play at a peak time it is still hard to get a game if you can't host (I'm talking of my own experiences at D- rank). And thats not even going into the game being hard itself or some people having trouble running it on Windows 7.. This is very well said. I love watching Brood War now that I actually know it exists (I was 6 years old in Japan when it came out, give me a break). But playing it? Holy cow. There are some D rank players that could have gone pro in the first months of the game. This is the culmination of 14 years of strategic evolution. It's extremely difficult to even know where to start. I for one will be happy to find someone as bad as me and just play for fun. I really wish I had been around to see the legends, but oh well.
Yea, I've got to echo this statement. A month or so ago I decided to reinstall BW after watching some Pro-league games. It really is more interesting to watch and you don't have to be a BW vet to tell which game takes more skill. BW pros are truly inspiring. However, after getting kicked from 5-6 custom games because I had a 0-0-0 record, I decided to just play SC2...
I'd definitely want to get into BW again but it's really hard to, not even considering the actual game play difficulty.
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On April 23 2012 01:09 jpak wrote:Show nested quote +On April 22 2012 06:45 firehand101 wrote:On April 21 2012 04:08 jpak wrote:
I'll start following foreign BW a bit more.
Also League of Legends. What? that doexsnt make any sense? What part of my statement did you not understand?
He probably did the same thing I did the first 3 times I read it. My mind completely omitted "foreign"...hmm, wonder what that means..
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when sc2 came out and most guys in the foreign scene switched over i started playing css. i still loved watching proleague and userstreams tho and the fact that there was less and less bw with time going by, it was a good preparation for saying goodbye, if you can fully say goodbye after almost 12 years being around.
bw will never die in my heart, i still keep watching streams for sure.
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On April 23 2012 03:20 FlaShFTW wrote:
With this final osl, i feel like its right for flash to win and set the most osl and msls combined. it just feels right.
No, just no.
Forever SongByungGoo, if he becomes LoLByungGoo or SC2Bonjwa i'll follow no matter where he goes.
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On April 23 2012 04:39 RezChi wrote:Show nested quote +On April 23 2012 03:20 FlaShFTW wrote:
With this final osl, i feel like its right for flash to win and set the most osl and msls combined. it just feels right. No, just no. Forever SongByungGoo, if he becomes LoLByungGoo or SC2Bonjwa i'll follow no matter where he goes.
he will obv start massing diablo 3 
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EPT
