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ImbaTosS
United Kingdom1732 Posts
I'm sure it's a fun enough game, but it doesn't fill the same space imo, it's just kinda... put there. I also really don't understand the "time will tell. It may become as awesome as BW" attitude which I read a LOT. I just... I already have BW. There is no reason for me to pick the game up. But let the records show that I did try it, and I tried it pretty intensely. | ||
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Percutio
United States1672 Posts
I'm not sure why the OP didn't try to explain how the new pathing and mechanics change player to player interactions and emphasize things that Brood War didn't as much. Or at the very least explain how simpler mechanics should shrink the margin of error and really emphasize optimized play and heavily punish even the smallest of mistakes, therefore creating a lot more tension and pressure earlier in the game. Granted the play is still underdeveloped, but once it catches up to or perhaps even exceeds the level of refinement the top Brood War pros have, then we can really see players put a ton of effort into every single action and be similarly amazed at the results. Either that or the game really is flawed and the ball of death is the best and there won't be any back and forth because too much will hinge on the first real mistake in a game ): | ||
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TwoToneTerran
United States8841 Posts
On January 28 2012 01:30 KenNage wrote: another give it 10 more years to be a good game? i wonder how many times ive read this, the sad thing is that ppl dont realize that this statement is wrong. Let all the expansions and the final product come out. Taking SC2 as a full game right now would've been like taking the original Starcraft as a complete game before Broodwar ever came out. It's silly. Anyhow I gave SC2 a few chances and just didn't enjoy the game that much. I'll try it again when the expansions are all released. | ||
BLinD-RawR
ALLEYCAT BLUES51546 Posts
On January 28 2012 01:30 KenNage wrote: another give it 10 more years to be a good game? i wonder how many times ive read this, the sad thing is that ppl dont realize that this statement is wrong. personally I do feel like we should give it time because we can't really judge and unfinished product,but at the same time I feel that its not going to make that much of a difference because the way the design of the game is going. | ||
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blubbdavid
Switzerland2412 Posts
Btw, altough the time distance between BW and SC2 is 10 years, SC2 has evolved much faster, therefore giving it "10 years time" is not a correct statement. | ||
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Mazaire
Australia217 Posts
On January 28 2012 01:30 KenNage wrote: another give it 10 more years to be a good game? i wonder how many times ive read this, the sad thing is that ppl dont realize that this statement is wrong. I never said it was a bad game, nothing is further from the truth. but in reality it is going to take time for the game to the the level of maturity that BW did. Remember it took time for BW to mature as well. Also, why don't you think that SC2 has the capability to mature? | ||
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KenNage
Chile885 Posts
On January 28 2012 01:40 BLinD-RawR wrote: personally I do feel like we should give it time because we can't really judge and unfinished product,but at the same time I feel that its not going to make that much of a difference because the way the design of the game is going. i agree with give it time but, i cant help but feel weird about this kind of posts, i mean come on the guy doesnt even know when bw was released, if u gonna post in the bw forum at least get your facts right if u gonna give a statement like this, (it may sound rude but i dont know to put it different) and most sc2 ppl assume that bw has been patched countless times thought his 13 years, when in fact the last balance patch was in 2001-05-18, the following were just bug fixes and alike. also at this point, i mean in terms of release date wise, we didnt even had the replay function at this point ! which also came with the 1.08 Patch in 2001-05-18, this should be kind of sticky thing ahah  , i mean if they gonna say "bw had 10+ years to balance ! give sc2 time!" they are mixing this up, because race balance and game development through years of playing are different things | ||
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Megaliskuu
United States5123 Posts
Much happier playign bw cuz its actually fun. | ||
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Percutio
United States1672 Posts
On January 28 2012 02:03 KenNage wrote: i agree with give it time but, i cant help but feel weird about this kind of posts, i mean come on the guy doesnt even know when bw was released, if u gonna post in the bw forum at least get your facts right if u gonna give a statement like this, (it may sound rude but i dont know to put it different) and most sc2 ppl assume that bw has been patched countless times thought his 13 years, when in fact the last balance patch was in 2001-05-18, the following were just bug fixes and alike. also at this point, i mean in terms of release date wise, we didnt even had the replay function at this point ! which also came with the 1.08 Patch in 2001-05-18, this should be kind of sticky thing ahah , i mean if they gonna say "bw had 10+ years to balance ! give sc2 time!" they are mixing this up, because race balance and game development through years of playing are different thingsBut at the same time vanilla SC had hilariously bad balance and play and Brood War went on to change that. | ||
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MrTortoise
1388 Posts
On January 27 2012 19:02 sluggaslamoo wrote: Well the thing is, nearly all BW players have tried SC2 to a certain extent. Not many SC2 players have even seen BW. I believe that is what is called progress? | ||
ArvickHero
10387 Posts
The points about limited information/safety/adaptation could be taken as valid points, as it is always good to be forced to think about the game instead of simply just following builds and trends you've seen in pro-games without actually knowing all the thought and details behind it. But I would argue that playing 2v2, 3v3 BGH or Fastest could accomplish the same thing but even better, since it's actually the same game, only with different playstyles, timings and strategies, with heavier emphasis on certain elements over others. Playing such "non-serious" modes of the game can give players a fresh take on the game and present new paradigms regarding certain units and dynamics. If anything, you should play SC2 to just expand your strategical scope/understanding, but not much else can be gleaned from it. | ||
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KenNage
Chile885 Posts
On January 28 2012 02:10 Percutio wrote: But at the same time vanilla SC had hilariously bad balance and play and Brood War went on to change that. that's true it was hilarious ahah, but you also have to know that sc at that time had almost no background, i mean, was a new game, you cant release a software with no flaws, thats impossible. i cant help but feel that blizzard could have made much better with the amount of information and time they had to develop the game seeing as one sequel of the other. | ||
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evilfatsh1t
Australia8928 Posts
didnt like it never looked back | ||
Ver
United States2186 Posts
Most of the points though are either are inaccurate or just don't make sense. sc2 having no defenders advantage doesn't make the early game more tense or make you approach it differently, it just means you lose more frequently to blind build order luck that's mostly out of your control, in part because you can't scout enough. That isn't a draw to sc2, it's a way to make people (even sc2 pros) sick of it lol. This is why a lot of pros open terrible builds by any BW-measure (think reactor hellion cc tvz or making triple bunker turret tvp) just so they can rule out a lot of dangerous coinflips. The last point on sc2 being a new game might apply a little bit to bw progamers, but frankly foreign bw players/fans have such a poor understanding that it really doesn't matter. A lot of bw pros get simple decisions wrong at many points during the game, which is why players like Flash who consistently make good decisions are so good and rare. Basically sc2 has such a lower strategic depth that even though it's 'less known,' the very best sc2 kor players are already hitting closer to that ceiling than most bw progamers. Copying someone like MMA or MVP is not only a lot easier than copying Flash beyond the 9th minute, but it also will pay similar dividends. Then you factor in that it's much easier to understand/follow sc2, so despite bw being much more developed, foreign players have less to figure out in sc2 on their own than in bw sadly. I don't think I explained this very well sorry but basically sc2 being less developed is a myth in a lot of ways. However, it is possible in sc2 for a mediocre foreigner to make a somewhat valid strategic contribution, whereas in bw the strategic complexity is so huge that you need to be a good progamer to simply understand a lot of things, let alone find new solutions. | ||
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darkmighty
Brazil48 Posts
IDK about Russia, but in SA they brought this subscription model just so lower-income people can be attracted to the game (altough in the longer run it becomes more expensive), but you can also buy the full game or check out of the subscription and pay the full price (the subscription payments are taken into account). | ||
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Eun_Star
United States322 Posts
If I'm going to improve in BW, I'm going to improve through BW. | ||
rotinegg
United States1719 Posts
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PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
if you only watched and played BW before muta stack micro and you watch it now, the games are radically different in the way they feel and play out. at least as a BW zerg player i feel that.  I'm also saddened that a good natured pro-sc2 post got so much dislike and people got so defensive about BW in here.  anyway definitely look at some modern SC2 games if you are all caught up on proleague. preferably look at the korean scene. ^^ | ||
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imPermanenCe
Netherlands595 Posts
On January 28 2012 02:22 darkmighty wrote: IDK about Russia, but in SA they brought this subscription model just so lower-income people can be attracted to the game (altough in the longer run it becomes more expensive), but you can also buy the full game or check out of the subscription and pay the full price (the subscription payments are taken into account). it's the same in those other areas too, yes. | ||
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Facultyadjutant
Sweden1876 Posts
Sc2 forum is a hyped conformist idiocy meanwhile bw forums is an elitist circlejerk Everyone should play a little bit of sc2, and everyone should play some bw. User was warned for this post | ||
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