On August 18 2011 09:59 Keone wrote:Even the SC2 kids... so they can respect not only the heritage of SC2, but so that they can know. How incredible. Boxer/Nada/July were in their day. They were gods among mortals, they walked every huge stage, they won everything, they were the top of the gaming world, standing on stages we only dream of.
I'm one of your 'SC2 kids', and I was very surprised at exactly the opposite. I mean, I know that no one had ever won more than 3 OSLs, but I was genuinely surprised by the... I guess lack of dominance. There were no stretches where you only had 2 or 3 people who were even capable of making a final. There were a few people who only appeared once in a finals, and won the whole thing. Maybe its just because you can't see the full tournament brackets, but I really can't see how winning 3 OSLs out of the MANY that have taken place over the course of the last decade can be construed as dominance. If anything, the parity is simply astounding to me.
Keep in mind that there's not an OSL every month, more like 3 per year unlike the GSL so two OSLs would take a time span of about 6 - 7 months
edit: and most of the players who are "dominating" over a period of time are in two leagues at once, and only 2 people have won dual golds in one season... only 2 dominant players have won dual leagues just to give you an example of how challenging it is for them.
On August 18 2011 09:59 Keone wrote:Even the SC2 kids... so they can respect not only the heritage of SC2, but so that they can know. How incredible. Boxer/Nada/July were in their day. They were gods among mortals, they walked every huge stage, they won everything, they were the top of the gaming world, standing on stages we only dream of.
I'm one of your 'SC2 kids', and I was very surprised at exactly the opposite. I mean, I know that no one had ever won more than 3 OSLs, but I was genuinely surprised by the... I guess lack of dominance. There were no stretches where you only had 2 or 3 people who were even capable of making a final. There were a few people who only appeared once in a finals, and won the whole thing. Maybe its just because you can't see the full tournament brackets, but I really can't see how winning 3 OSLs out of the MANY that have taken place over the course of the last decade can be construed as dominance. If anything, the parity is simply astounding to me.
Keep in mind that there's not an OSL every month, more like 3 per year unlike the GSL so two OSLs would take a time span of about 6 - 7 months
edit: and most of the players who are "dominating" over a period of time are in two leagues at once, and only 2 people have won dual golds in one season... only 2 dominant players have won dual leagues just to give you an example of how challenging it is for them.
That second part is really my point, and its not in any way meant to be a slight, quite the opposite actually. The fact that is HAS been nearly impossible to win dual golds speaks to the EQUALITY amongst the highest level of talent, and the fact that NO ONE has been able to truly dominate the scene over long periods of time. Even those who most consider the greatest fell to other players.
To the point in the previous post, perhaps you're right. Perhaps the number of similar names in the Ro16 is the best indication of "dominance" on the scene. However, by that line of reasoning, there are alot more "dominant" players that most people around these parts are willing to give credit to. I look at all the OSL tournaments that Reach made, but no one seems to put him on the same pedestal as BoxeR, NaDa, et al, when the fact of the matter is that it appears to me that StarCraft was very much, to use the old football phrase "on any given Sunday, any team can beat any other team".
Again, please don't take this as a criticism, or negativity. Its just that, when put up against other sports, StarCraft never really seemed to have the one or two figures that were truly unbeatable.
On August 18 2011 09:59 Keone wrote:Even the SC2 kids... so they can respect not only the heritage of SC2, but so that they can know. How incredible. Boxer/Nada/July were in their day. They were gods among mortals, they walked every huge stage, they won everything, they were the top of the gaming world, standing on stages we only dream of.
I'm one of your 'SC2 kids', and I was very surprised at exactly the opposite. I mean, I know that no one had ever won more than 3 OSLs, but I was genuinely surprised by the... I guess lack of dominance. There were no stretches where you only had 2 or 3 people who were even capable of making a final. There were a few people who only appeared once in a finals, and won the whole thing. Maybe its just because you can't see the full tournament brackets, but I really can't see how winning 3 OSLs out of the MANY that have taken place over the course of the last decade can be construed as dominance. If anything, the parity is simply astounding to me.
Look at the amount of OSL's. There aint a lot, theres like two a year, this isnt the GSL where you spit one out nonchalantly every month.
There have been 32 OSLs. In those 32, there have been 21 different winners and 34 unique participantts in the finals. So the most successful players have won slightly less than 10% of the OSLs over the last decade, and have been in 20% of the finals. Compare that to another 1 on 1 tournament style sport like tennis for example. There have been 40 Grand Slam finals over the past decade. Roger Federer has been in 23 of them. Rafa Nadal has been in 13. Combined, they take up 36 of the 80 possible spots for top 2 finishes in the "Majors". Over the course of the last decade, only 14 men have combined to win all 40 major championships.
Edit: I see from responses that people are comparing SC to SC2 in the sense of dominance, while that is fair, it is important to note that GSL hasn't even existed for a year yet. It may be too soon to say that dominance of that kind isn't possible in SC2. I'd still like to point out though, that in terms of other sports (yes, eSports are sports), SC:BW was blessed with something that many other sports lack... parity.
On December 05 2010 18:00 IntoTheEmo wrote: Can't believe no one has posted the song list for the OSL Montage Video yet (Korean Air S2 10 years Tribute Vid). <- I love this video to death, watch/listen to their songs every day.
Secondhand Serenade: (In the same order as the video)
Reach For The Sky Distance You And I World Turns Something More Only Hope
All off their Hear Me Now album, couldn't find all of the songs on YouTube, so here's their myspace page instead, has the player with music.
^^ Remember posting about this in the Pro Scene Music thread.
The music is sooo perfect, back when I was doing my internship I would listen to a round of it religiously every day. It helped me get through .
All the setbacks, all the heartaches, all the hardships us BW fans have had to face in the past year, this montage reminds us of what we're fighting to preserve.
Thanks for sharing this with everyone, now if only I could get this to play on my iPod touch, can't find it on the Youtube app or copy pasting the link
If there was so much equality then nada, iloveoov, savior, and flash (boxer too I guess) would not have had their period(s) where they were nearly invincible
If you don't think flash winning 2 osl's and msl's in one year and getting dual golds in the process, iloveoov and nada winning 3 msl's in a row and then an osl, or savior making 5 msl finals in a row and winning 3 of them along with playing terran imba maps and making the terrans look like amateurs on them isn't dominance then I don't know what to say
On August 19 2011 06:52 Cheeseburgered wrote: If there was so much equality then nada, iloveoov, savior, and flash (boxer too I guess) would not have had their period(s) where they were nearly invincible
If you don't think flash winning 2 osl's and msl's in one year and getting dual golds in the process, iloveoov and nada winning 3 msl's in a row and then an osl, or savior making 5 msl finals in a row and winning 3 of them along with playing terran imba maps and making the terrans look like amateurs on them isn't dominance then I don't know what to say
Ah, but I've been getting my information based upon OSL not MSL! See, now saying someone has won 3 MSL's in a row, or making 5 MSL finals in a row, yes, I can say that's dominant.
The motherfucking EVER OSL ambush always succeeds. I completely erase it from my memory time after time, only to mentally break down the next time I see Boxer crying T.T
MY favorite OSL is still the Daum, even though watching Iris(<3) lose to GGGay was like a shot to the balls. It was also the last OSL I avidly watched (job, not because I hated Iris losing, or more so GGPlay winning).
On August 19 2011 06:52 Cheeseburgered wrote: If there was so much equality then nada, iloveoov, savior, and flash (boxer too I guess) would not have had their period(s) where they were nearly invincible
If you don't think flash winning 2 osl's and msl's in one year and getting dual golds in the process, iloveoov and nada winning 3 msl's in a row and then an osl, or savior making 5 msl finals in a row and winning 3 of them along with playing terran imba maps and making the terrans look like amateurs on them isn't dominance then I don't know what to say
Ah, but I've been getting my information based upon OSL not MSL! See, now saying someone has won 3 MSL's in a row, or making 5 MSL finals in a row, yes, I can say that's dominant.
i think you cant really measure dominance by looking at how often someone won a title in a certain time.
if you look at football, no one will doubt that barcelona is clearly the best team for some years already. in fact they only won champions league (the most imporant competition) twice during the last five seasons. still everyone has been scared about them and no one would dare to say that theres a better team than them, i think thats pretty similar to SC:BW if we look at the bonjwas
On August 19 2011 06:52 Cheeseburgered wrote: If there was so much equality then nada, iloveoov, savior, and flash (boxer too I guess) would not have had their period(s) where they were nearly invincible
If you don't think flash winning 2 osl's and msl's in one year and getting dual golds in the process, iloveoov and nada winning 3 msl's in a row and then an osl, or savior making 5 msl finals in a row and winning 3 of them along with playing terran imba maps and making the terrans look like amateurs on them isn't dominance then I don't know what to say
Ah, but I've been getting my information based upon OSL not MSL! See, now saying someone has won 3 MSL's in a row, or making 5 MSL finals in a row, yes, I can say that's dominant.
i think you cant really measure dominance by looking at how often someone won a title in a certain time.
if you look at football, no one will doubt that barcelona is clearly the best team for some years already. in fact they only won champions league (the most imporant competition) twice during the last five seasons. still everyone has been scared about them and no one would dare to say that theres a better team than them, i think thats pretty similar to SC:BW if we look at the bonjwas
And the fact that the individual leagues don't have nearly as many games played as Proleague where dominance is displayed even more over a wider range of opponents.
1984 was a book about an overbearing government that had complete control over it's people. In that context, he meant that all of the cheaters had been stricken from the record as if they never existed.
On August 19 2011 06:52 Cheeseburgered wrote: If there was so much equality then nada, iloveoov, savior, and flash (boxer too I guess) would not have had their period(s) where they were nearly invincible
If you don't think flash winning 2 osl's and msl's in one year and getting dual golds in the process, iloveoov and nada winning 3 msl's in a row and then an osl, or savior making 5 msl finals in a row and winning 3 of them along with playing terran imba maps and making the terrans look like amateurs on them isn't dominance then I don't know what to say
Ah, but I've been getting my information based upon OSL not MSL! See, now saying someone has won 3 MSL's in a row, or making 5 MSL finals in a row, yes, I can say that's dominant.
Hey dude thx for posting this video, whoever made it thx as well, Im crying, SO HAPPY, SO MANY Memories, great great years of starcraft. LOVE STARCRAFT!!!! Korean e-sports ftw!!!!
On August 19 2011 06:52 Cheeseburgered wrote: If there was so much equality then nada, iloveoov, savior, and flash (boxer too I guess) would not have had their period(s) where they were nearly invincible
If you don't think flash winning 2 osl's and msl's in one year and getting dual golds in the process, iloveoov and nada winning 3 msl's in a row and then an osl, or savior making 5 msl finals in a row and winning 3 of them along with playing terran imba maps and making the terrans look like amateurs on them isn't dominance then I don't know what to say
Ah, but I've been getting my information based upon OSL not MSL! See, now saying someone has won 3 MSL's in a row, or making 5 MSL finals in a row, yes, I can say that's dominant.
EPT
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