[Korean Column] Savior, where Bonjwa Starts & Ends - Page 3

On November 08 2009 01:37 yhnmk wrote:
Boxer won a slew of leagues all at once. Savior did. Iloveoov/Nada didn't really fit that pattern

On November 08 2009 02:02 Oystein wrote:

uuuh? Oov and Nada both won 3 MSLs in a row following up with an OSL right afterward, if that`s not winning a slew of leagues then what is?

On November 07 2009 19:25 QibingZero wrote:

So yeah, I don't think these are the factors that made savior bonjwa. Sure, it's part stats, but it's also feeling. Feeling in the same way star sense is feeling. When Savior played, you knew he was going to somehow find victory, regardless of what his opponent was doing at the time. Despite being one of the best and closest games of all time, it somehow wasn't that surprising when Savior beat Iris during Shinhan 3. That was what he did - he found victory no matter where it was hiding.

It's that type of feeling where a player knows the game so well you sense as if he'd be no better if he were actually maphacking. Savior had it, and we've seen glimpses of that only a few times since (for me, a huge one was Jaedong's comeback vs fantasy during Batoo).

On November 08 2009 00:11 scintilliaSD wrote:
I think the defining bonjwa rule is the following.

1) If someone else can make a convincing argument why another player of the same era should be a bonjwa, then none of the players in question are.

On November 08 2009 02:33 lone_hydra wrote:


I completely agree. No one can be a bonjwa. One can only be THE bonjwa. The current situation reminds me of the Romance of 3 Kingdoms. Jaedong would have to be Ciao Ciao as he rules over the largest army on the scene currently, the zerg. Bisu and Flash are Liu Bei and Sun Quan. They both can match Jaedong individually, but their armies currently pale in comparison.

Savior would probably be Dong Zhuo.

The theory of Bonjwa has started with Savior and ended with Savior.

On November 08 2009 02:59 Eeevil wrote:


If we take a broader view of the Bonjwa term you can use this rule:
If there is a discussion if a player is bonjwa or not, the player in question is not bonjwa.


Bonjwa is an ugly word anyways.

On November 08 2009 03:15 quiong wrote:


I see that rule quoted in this thread but that's a pretty bad rule tbh. It's not rigorous at all. Titles, records, rivalries, finals appearances, etc. are much better measures of bonjwa status. In fact, instead of being a "broader" view, this is possibly the narrowest of all bonjwa definitions.

If a player is dominant and commonly accepted to be a bonjwa, all it would take is someone to open a thread discussing whether that player is a bonjwa or not, and by this rule, that player would no longer be bonjwa.

And how do you define the scope of "discussion"? Does someone have to write an article, or post a thread on a fansite? What if I'm walking down the street with my friend, and we have a convo:

Me: Hey, I don't think Nada is/was a bonjwa, lets discuss
Friend: k, let's discuss. Well I think he is. But now that we've discussed it, he's not a bonjwa anymore by definition. Congrats, you've just single handedly stripped Nada of bonjwa status.
Me: Yep, cool.

Pretty retarded.

On November 08 2009 01:33 dukethegold wrote:
Well, Bisu v.s. Savior MSL final was before my time. I got around the scene after Bisu already lost to Mind in the MSL final. However, one thing that I noticed is that some of the old posts already addressed Bisu as a bonjwa. Seemed to me that prior to Bisu v.s. Mind and Bisu dropped out of that OSL after attaining his third MSL, Bisu was being seriously considered as a bonjwa by some of the community back then.

I am not really clear on that on. Confirm?

On November 07 2009 17:48 darktreb wrote:


Yes, this insane fact is forgotten sometimes nowadays!

Also not losing a BoX for basically an entire year.

But with Savior I'll always remember the MSL semifinals against Mind, where he lost 3-2. It was his last gasp and Mind was better, but he still could have won, and faced Bisu in what would have been probably the biggest final in SC history. I think he would have lost to Bisu but you never know.

Once he lost to Mind there it seemed clear that it was over. In my mind it'll always be the one that got away. The one that could have been...

On November 08 2009 04:43 kvilx wrote:
If Jaedong had won OSL, MSL and Proleague last season, he would set some good fundaments for new Bonjwa reign. Without this - sorry, he is just the best player at the moment.

On November 08 2009 04:33 yhnmk wrote:
Umm...no. The idea isn't that there is literally *a* conversation, but that there is a dispute, a lack of consensus, debate. Theres a few people who say jaedong is bonjwa. Most dont. Hence he is not.

If there is a discussion if a player is bonjwa or not, the player in question is not bonjwa.

If there is a discussion if a player is bonjwa or not, the player in question is not bonjwa.

There is complete consensus for nada/oov/boxer/savior, even if one random twit opens a thread and begs to differ...

On November 08 2009 04:58 samachking wrote:


lol
you do realize only one player won OSL/MSL at once, let alone a 5 round PL with it with a completely shitty back bone team line, if he actually did what you said,Jaedong wouldnt only be bonjwa, he would be the greatest progamer of all time without any denial.