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l10f
United States3241 Posts
09-10 KeSPA Rule Changes!
▶ Chatting
Players who type anything besides 'gg' or 'GG' are no longer disqualified from the match, but are given a 'warning'. The KeSPA referee's decision is placed higher than this rule.
Ex. If a player accidentally types 'a', he would not be disqualified, but warned. But if a player types something like 'sexsexpussyhair' they can still be disqualified by KeSPA referee's decision.
▶ Complaining
If a coach complaint comes in during a match, the game is paused immediately and the complaint is reviewed. Before, if a coach complained, the referee would listen to the complaint and then decide if the game is going to be paused.
▶ Disqualifications and Removal
If a player or a coach does something that directly effects the game, or hinders the game in any way, must leave the stage to the waiting room. The details are discussed in the waiting room.
▶ "Gather" and "Return Cargo"
The "return cargo" bug to get a worker past another unit has been previously banned. Now they are adding the "gather" command onto the list. A player is only allowed to use "move" to move past other units, not "gather" or "return cargo".***
***NOTE: I think it only affects SCOUTING and for ENEMY UNITS. You can't scout through other units using Gather or Return Cargo to go through units.
Directly from KeSPA website:
On October 10 2009 02:07 konadora wrote:Show nested quote +⑪ 일꾼 비비기 버그 : 정찰을 목적으로 시야가 밝혀지지 않은 상대 진영을 일꾼의 Gather, Cargo 명령을 이용해 입구를 막고 있는 상대 유닛과 비비며, 상대 유닛에 의해 막혀있던 진영을 이동할 수 있는 버그 Worker 'Rubbing' Bug : Glitching through units that are blocking ramps using the 'Gather' and 'Return Cargo' command to get to a location while there is no vision is banned. This means yes you can still block 4 pool And yes, using the mineral-click gather-glitch on Destination is STILL valid. Scan rush on Hitchhiker is STILL valid. This rule only applies for the illegal gather-click glitch and return-cargo glitch on terrain (what Paladin mentioned earlier, eg Nal_rA vs ForGG on Loki).
Source:Fomos
+ Show Spoiler [Original Article] +
▶ 채팅 규정
‘gg’, ‘GG’ 이외의 문자 입력 시 ‘몰수패’, ‘주의’가 동시에 내려지던 징계 기준을 ‘구두주의’ 또는 ’주의’ 징계로 완화하고, 채팅과 관련된 사항에서 심판의 재량권이 발휘 되도록 수정되었다.
▶ 이의제기 규정
경기장 현장 이의제기와 경기종료 후 서면을 통한 이의제기에 대한 내용이 보완되었다. 경기 중 감독의 일시 중단 요청 시 심판이 당위성을 판단해 경기를 중지하던 규정을 감독의 일시 중단 요청이 있을 경우 즉시 경기를 중단 시킨 뒤 상황을 파악해 판정을 내리는 규정으로 변경하였다.
▶ 퇴장, 몰수패 규정
경기결과에 직접적으로 영향을 주거나, 경기 진행에 방해가 되는 행위를 행하는 선수, 코칭스태프의 퇴장 이후 대기장소를 ‘선수대기실’로 명기하여 구체적인 퇴장에 대한 내용 및 절차를 마련하였다.
▶ 일꾼 비비기 버그 규정
금지된 버그 중 하나인 자원을 들고 있는 일꾼의 Cargo 명령을 이용한 일꾼 비비기 버그에 Gather 명령을 이용한 일꾼 비비기 버그 내용이 추가 되었다. 추가된 규정을 통해 일꾼의 Move 명령 이외에 Cargo, Gather 명령을 이용한 일꾼 비비기는 금지된다.
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Calgary26003 Posts
REUTRN CARGO IS BANNED? LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL
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no drone drill? what the fuck
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Calgary26003 Posts
Wait, so like you can't stack drones vs zealots? You can't defend sunkens with drones? are you fucking kidding me?
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Norway1530 Posts
wow, this is the stupidest thing ever... when i read the last sentence, my face turned from -.^ to O.O
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l10f
United States3241 Posts
On October 10 2009 01:32 Chill wrote:
Wait, so like you can't stack drones vs zealots? You can't defend sunkens with drones? are you fucking kidding me?
People are on KeSPA website asking why and they're not getting an answer. It seems like you can't block 4pool anymore.
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They banned "gather"? Just using it as a bug or completely?
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Is this will affect for example a zerg defending his mineral line against zealots? Or prevent lings from attacking a cannon with probes?
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intrigue
Washington, D.C9935 Posts
if this means what i think it means, it's absolutely absurd. here are the situations i think of immediately:
- your scout dies, but you click on their mineral patch before you lose vision so your second scout can get in. this has been a staple move since i first started 1v1.
- moving through your own units - can you not maynard through your army, or stack scvs to defend against harass? a funny extreme interpretation would be to not allow scvs to pass through each other after returning their minerals, instead having to be manually moved back LOL
- any sort of drilling, especially for breaking ramps or moving stasis blocks
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what a bad decision by kespa..drilling is not allowed.. they maybe taking drugs to produce this ridiculous desision.
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On October 10 2009 01:32 Chill wrote:
Wait, so like you can't stack drones vs zealots? You can't defend sunkens with drones? are you fucking kidding me?
Wait.. what, I just select all my drones and click on a patch then click somewhere else... Is whats banned or am I not doing it right?
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Belgium9950 Posts
I think this means not a single drill is allowed. Not even dronedrilling a zealot in your mineral line.
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Look on the bright side...at least you can message "a"!
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First part, pretty awesome, last one is a "WTF" moment
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it is illusionary to think players could stop using these basic commands they have used for thousands of games....
If this rule stays, the game will become much more aggressive again!
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Katowice25012 Posts
wait so does this mean you can't maynard workers?
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KeSPA didn't take certain circumstances into account before announcing rule changes. Wow, this never happens.
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I10f says he found more information, but I'm really doubtful of Kespa doing what the wording seems to imply. They've made some stupid business decisions with regard to dealing with players and some extremely strict enforcement of some rules (rules that are usually understandable), but they've not had precedent (IMO) of touching on accepted, wide-spread game mechanics, so...
Edit:
Then when I finish posting he's taken off the more information part. Arr.
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Calgary26003 Posts
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l10f
United States3241 Posts
NOTE: I think it only affects SCOUTING. You can't scout through other units using Gather or Return Cargo to go through units.
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Oh wow. The Norwegian Nobel Committee has nothing on KeSPA when it comes to making batshit decisions.
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4 5 6 or what kind of pool it is will probably work!
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▶ "Gather" and "Return Cargo"
The "return cargo" bug to get a worker past another unit has been previously banned. Now they are adding the "gather" command onto the list. A player is only allowed to use "move" to move past other units, not "gather" or "return cargo". *
What? I'm confused
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holy shit have kespa lost their FUCKING MINDS?
I guess there's gonna be alot more agressive play this season now that worker defences are banned. holy shiit.
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U guys seem not to understand it correctly. I think it means that SCOUTING with Return Cargo and Gather is not allowed, which has nothing to do with worker drilling move. I remember a game when fOrGG did the same trick against Nal_rA on Loki(?) and he was disqualified. After that i've never seen it happen again, but i might be wrong. I think there's nothing to worry about.
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l10f
United States3241 Posts
Yeah it looks like it's just banned if you use it for scouting purposes. Although netizens are still confused whether it affects if used while blocking a rush.
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PvZ now becomes much more difficult - the zerg can just put 2 lings on their ramp after killing the initial scouting probe and have no reason to get speed.
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I don't mind this change.
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On October 10 2009 01:52 l10f wrote:
Yeah it looks like it's just banned if you use it for scouting purposes. Although netizens are still confused whether it affects if used while blocking a rush.
imo it's quite obvious it doesn't. There is a bug, when you could glitch your worker through units blocking the ramp with spamming return cargo a lot (see Nal_rA vs fOrGG game i've mentioned before). So i guess KeSPA found out that Gather works too, so they've banned it.
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Braavos36402 Posts
tbh i don't think these changes make that big of a difference
did people really think they banned worker drilling altogether? come on.
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Calgary26003 Posts
On October 10 2009 01:51 (paladin)roMAD wrote:
U guys seem not to understand it correctly. I think it means that SCOUTING with Return Cargo and Gather is not allowed, which has nothing to do with worker drilling move. I remember a game when fOrGG did the same trick against Nal_rA on Loki(?) and he was disqualified. After that i've never seen it happen again, but i might be wrong. I think there's nothing to worry about.
That has been banned for years, so obviously that's not what they're talking about.
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On October 10 2009 01:56 (paladin)roMAD wrote:So i guess KeSPA found out that Gather works too, so they've banned it.
Makes sense.
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Well, looks like good decisions across the board, then. Kespa > Nobel.
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On October 10 2009 01:58 Chill wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2009 01:51 (paladin)roMAD wrote:
U guys seem not to understand it correctly. I think it means that SCOUTING with Return Cargo and Gather is not allowed, which has nothing to do with worker drilling move. I remember a game when fOrGG did the same trick against Nal_rA on Loki(?) and he was disqualified. After that i've never seen it happen again, but i might be wrong. I think there's nothing to worry about. That has been banned for years, so obviously that's not what they're talking about.
They added Gather to the ban list. That's how i see it.
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konadora
Singapore66364 Posts
⑪ 일꾼 비비기 버그 : 정찰을 목적으로 시야가 밝혀지지 않은 상대 진영을 일꾼의 Gather, Cargo 명령을 이용해 입구를 막고 있는 상대 유닛과 비비며, 상대 유닛에 의해 막혀있던 진영을 이동할 수 있는 버그
Worker 'Rubbing' Bug : Glitching through units that are blocking ramps using the 'Gather' and 'Return Cargo' command to get to a location while there is no vision is banned.
This means yes you can still block 4 pool
And yes, using the mineral-click gather-glitch on Destination is STILL valid. Scan rush on Hitchhiker is STILL valid.
This rule only applies for the illegal gather-click glitch and return-cargo glitch on terrain (what Paladin mentioned earlier, eg Nal_rA vs ForGG on Loki).
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konadora
Singapore66364 Posts
I think Fomos misinterpreted the rule rofl
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konadora
Singapore66364 Posts
In the Fomos article, you forgot to translate the part where it was mentioned 'workers holding resources'.
▶ 일꾼 비비기 버그 규정
금지된 버그 중 하나인 자원을 들고 있는 일꾼의 Cargo 명령을 이용한 일꾼 비비기 버그에 Gather 명령을 이용한 일꾼 비비기 버그 내용이 추가 되었다. 추가된 규정을 통해 일꾼의 Move 명령 이외에 Cargo, Gather 명령을 이용한 일꾼 비비기는 금지된다.
▶ Working Glitching Bug update/fix/change
One of the banned bugs was the bug where workers holding resources will use the 'Return Cargo' command to glitch through units blocking the ramp. It is now updated to include 'Return Cargo' AND 'Gather'.
But the last sentence is still very questionable, because it says that "Through this updated rule, other than using the 'Move' command, glitching through units with workers using the 'Return Cargo' and 'Gather' command is banned."
I still think Fomos could have phrased the sentence better. (meaning this is a total misunderstanding)
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Calgary26003 Posts
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Katowice25012 Posts
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For a moment I was like WTF. Coming from KeSpa I can believe anything.
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Damn...I was so scared after reading that last rule...glad everyone cleared it up.
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I must say that these are some good updates, looks like there will be no more mess and running arround for 1h when some coach decides to complain.
Also, no more instant DQ for some random letter appearing is a good thing.Kespa takes the right course, finally?
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On October 10 2009 01:57 Hot_Bid wrote:
did people really think they banned worker drilling altogether? come on.
yeah seriously - ever heard of "lost in translation" guys?
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▶ Complaining
If a coach complaint comes in during a match, the game is paused immediately and the complaint is reviewed. Before, if a coach complained, the referee would listen to the complaint and then decide if the game is going to be paused.
This is not good thing. Coach can easily interrupt game if other player has good momentum going on.
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On October 10 2009 05:02 Too_MuchZerg wrote:Show nested quote +
▶ Complaining
If a coach complaint comes in during a match, the game is paused immediately and the complaint is reviewed. Before, if a coach complained, the referee would listen to the complaint and then decide if the game is going to be paused.
This is not good thing. Coach can easily interrupt game if other player has good momentum going on.
My thoughts exactly, much more important to note than that "scouting glich" thing (P.S. thnx for clearing that one up) 
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Sweden33719 Posts
With the clarifications to the last rule, these seem like excellent changes.
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On October 10 2009 05:02 Too_MuchZerg wrote:Show nested quote +
▶ Complaining
If a coach complaint comes in during a match, the game is paused immediately and the complaint is reviewed. Before, if a coach complained, the referee would listen to the complaint and then decide if the game is going to be paused.
This is not good thing. Coach can easily interrupt game if other player has good momentum going on.
But if his 'complaint' isn't valid then this rule:
If a player or a coach does something that directly effects the game, or hinders the game in any way, must leave the stage to the waiting room. The details are discussed in the waiting room. takes care of it. He could be reprimanded/removed from the game.
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On October 10 2009 05:33 seppolevne wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2009 05:02 Too_MuchZerg wrote:
▶ Complaining
If a coach complaint comes in during a match, the game is paused immediately and the complaint is reviewed. Before, if a coach complained, the referee would listen to the complaint and then decide if the game is going to be paused.
This is not good thing. Coach can easily interrupt game if other player has good momentum going on. But if his 'complaint' isn't valid then this rule: Show nested quote + If a player or a coach does something that directly effects the game, or hinders the game in any way, must leave the stage to the waiting room. The details are discussed in the waiting room. takes care of it. He could be reprimanded/removed from the game.
Ace match, coach affects the game in some way and gets kick out. His player still increased his advantage.
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If a coach REALLY fucks up his player can still get a fcking default loss. Refs are the rules 
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Wow, I thought that Kespa have changed into something completely new until I saw the worker drill restriction (that people say MIGHT be a mistranslation)
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On October 10 2009 09:05 Doso wrote:If a coach REALLY fucks up his player can still get a fcking default loss. Refs are the rules
There are always certain reason that coaches can say (like he got information from audience or bad sound proof) and those are hard to proof true or false.
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hmm what would be an example of the illegal gather/return cargo trick?
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ForGG versus Nal_Ra on Loki.
Thanks for the clarification Kondara/Romad.
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On October 10 2009 23:18 nosliw wrote:
hmm what would be an example of the illegal gather/return cargo trick?
Go.go versus TT as well, I think, but there's no vod.
http://www.teamliquid.net/tlpd/games/2987_go.go_vs_TT
IIRC I was watching it live. TT was so pissed because the KeSPA ref didn't give him the game. He left so quickly.
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any1 gt the youtube video of the worker glitch???
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So, if I'm understanding all the updates on the gather thing correctly:
Your scouting probe dies near the enemy mineral line. While you still have vision inside the enemy base, you order another probe to gather the enemy mineral line, causing it to pass through units blocking a ramp. This is still legal.
There's some bug I wasn't previously aware of that allowed you to get up a ramp by spamming gather when you have no vision inside the enemy base at all, similar to the return cargo spam bug. This is now banned.
That about right?
If that's the case, these seem like good changes except for the coach pausing rule. That's very easily abusable to screw with matches. Hopefully that will get reverted sometime soon.
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United States4796 Posts
At least they got rid of the stupid nothing but gg rule...
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What about if your scouting probe is in the enemy base with minerals and you use the return cargo command to safely get past zerglings when your probe has been trapped?
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On October 10 2009 05:00 darktreb wrote:Show nested quote +On October 10 2009 01:57 Hot_Bid wrote:
did people really think they banned worker drilling altogether? come on. yeah seriously - ever heard of "lost in translation" guys?
Do you know the things Kespa has done? .>>>>
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They lightened the gg rule.
But the gather thing only affects scouting rite? Thats what it sounds like.
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Thanks for posting. I did not know about the gather/return cargo issue until reading the original post and comments. Definitely learned something there!
The new pausing rule due to a coach concern seems a little odd. I'm not sure how often coaches have those sort of complaints/concerns, but it seems like it could be rather disruptive if it happens much at all.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://www.fomos.kr/board/issue/1255065510_1.jpg)
