Well, Daily E-sports (www.dailyesports.com) has slapped a big EXCLUSIVE title on a few new articles, which are sourced from their video interview with Jaedong.
Q: It seems like even you didn't know you'd come out on the FA market AL: Uhhhh.. yeah. *awkward laughter*
Q: Are you going to convince your parents to let you stay? A: Um yeah, it's that kind of situation.
Q: A lot of people think that you were overworked on Hwaseung, what do you think? A: I think that a lot of people think that I'm carrying a heavy burden on my shoulders, and I'm having a hard time. My parents think so too. But me personally, as always, I've been having a great time with my teammates and coaches, and even though I've had a packed schedule and sometimes it's a bit excessive on my body, even if i'm tired physically, I'm still having a lot of fun, and just living with the people I love was very happy and fun, I didn't even know time was passing as we went through the season. I wish people would realize this, and know that I don't feel that way in my heart.
Q: What does Hwaseung mean to you? A: For me to grow like this, and become a top gamer, it's because of all my teammates and coach who were always helping me from my side. I consider the people who were always silently helping me to be my teammates and my coach, and I believe that without them, I wouldn't be anything.
Q:Is Lee Jaedong indispensable to Hwaseung? A: Well, right now... (sheepish smile) yes.
Q: Do you understand your parents' worries about you? A: Yes, I understand thoroughly. It's all for my sake, looking into the future and caring for me, so I understand completely.
Q: You weren't able to practice enough because of the FA ordeal? A: (Smiles) Well actually, I started practicing just yesterday. On Thursday, all day I was just wrestling (with the negotiations), all day, and at night I felt so empty, with a lot of emotions overlapping, it was just so hard on me I couldn't even hold a mouse. But my teammates helped me out, and my coach looked realistically towards the final, and from Friday I came to my senses and I was able to practice. Actually after WCG (prelims), I wanted practice properly, but things outside the game kind of weighed me down, but still it was ZvZ that I'm confident in, so I think that's why the result was good.
Q: There's a lot of attention on where you're going to go. A: Yeah, a lot of people seem to be wondering about, and interested in where I'm going. Just keep watching, and trust in my choices, please.
Q: A word to your fans? A: Thanks for the cheers, and uh.. (makes heart shape with hands) I love you guys!
Jaedong: When I get back to Ulsan (his hometown) from the finals, I'm going to convince my parents to let me stay at OZ. Until my last day as a progamer, I want to be with my OZ teammates, Coach Cho Jeong Woon, and Coach Han Sangyong. If I hadn't been with Hwaseung, it would have been difficult for me to become the great player I am today. Of course I'll discuss my future with my parents, but I'll let them know for sure that I want to remain with OZ."
Jaedong: Everyone knows that parents care about their children. I think all this controversy comes from my parents worrying about what appears to be me taking on a heavy burden. (The first two lines are ambiguous, the original article's use of quotation marks is terrible). My parents were probably looking into the far future when they declared my FA status. They want to make sure I have a successful future, and I respect their effort to try and guarantee that for me.
Jaedong: My tough schedule really does exhaust me physically, but mentally I'm at my best because I'm truly happy. Working with the people you love is a truly wonderful thing, and it's what gave me the strength to get through such a long, hard season. I don't want to lose the happiness that comes from being with the people you love."
Jaedong is still 19 years of age, and cannot negotiate contracts without parental permission according to Kespa regulations.
'I don't want to lose the happiness that comes from being with the people you love.'
Urge to make Homo for Lomo joke rising. This is an interesting dilemma really. I hope Jaedong comes out of the whole FA situation happily and that he can continue to play in the way he wants to.
so Jaedong really wants to stay at Oz but his parents won't let him? Hmm, he is almost old enough to decide for himself. I'd say let him stay at Oz under the condition that they somehow get other players to help with the burden he carries.
What a stupid rule. :/ I'm sure his parents will agree to his wishes though, it would mean more money to them in the long run because a happy jaedong is a healthy jaedong and a healthy jaedong is gg for everybody else.
I think this article goes a long way to making sure JD doesn't leave Oz. If his parents take him out of Oz they look like a bad guy. Hoping he stays on Oz just because it would be sad for him if he had to leave. Not a JD fan, but feel bad for him.
Wow...What a turn of events here. I was really hoping for a JD/flash partnership in order to revive the old KTF vs SKT rivalry but sheez. This quote is really striking:
My tough schedule really does exhaust me physically, but mentally I'm at my best because I'm truly happy. Working with the people you love is a truly wonderful thing, and it's what gave me the strength to get through such a long, hard season.
Would JD really do better overall if he were on a team that gave him some breathing room? I'm not so sure anymore. But I'm leaning towards yes. However, we don't know what sort of ramifications it would have on JD's performance/practice/motivation if he were taken away from such a loving/supportive environment.
Jaedong comes from a poor family in Oz, I've said that in one of my threads.
But that makes him all the more determined, aye? No sense going to SKT where everyone has everything and doesn't give two shits about others as long as they pull off their marvelous plays.
Jaedong cares, that's why he does what he does, aye?
First of all, Jaedong needs to talk to other players first to know what happens when you switch teams. Right now, I feel like Jaedong's just this kid who doesn't know the world, and is simply afraid of leaving a comfortable situation that he's familiar with.
But the reality is, just because he's comfortable doesn't mean it's the best situation. And he really should at least try to explore other options. Especially if it means more $$$.
On August 23 2009 16:31 baubo wrote: First of all, Jaedong needs to talk to other players first to know what happens when you switch teams. Right now, I feel like Jaedong's just this kid who doesn't know the world, and is simply afraid of leaving a comfortable situation that he's familiar with.
But the reality is, just because he's comfortable doesn't mean it's the best situation. And he really should at least try to explore other options. Especially if it means more $$$.
Well can you put a price on friendship and happiness?
I guess I'm still a kid at heart, but how much is money worth over happiness? I'll admit though it might not be that bad, he can still make new friends on other teams and see his Oz buddies. Though he'll probably feel like he is letting his team down.
110,000$ is very disrespectful for the best current player! :/ And it was not made not just one attempt to strengthen team. :/ Disgrace to Hwaseung! :/
On August 23 2009 16:31 baubo wrote: First of all, Jaedong needs to talk to other players first to know what happens when you switch teams. Right now, I feel like Jaedong's just this kid who doesn't know the world, and is simply afraid of leaving a comfortable situation that he's familiar with.
But the reality is, just because he's comfortable doesn't mean it's the best situation. And he really should at least try to explore other options. Especially if it means more $$$.
Well can you put a price on friendship and happiness?
I guess I'm still a kid at heart, but how much is money worth over happiness? I'll admit though it might not be that bad, he can still make new friends on other teams and see his Oz buddies. Though he'll probably feel like he is letting his team down.
Just because he's leaving Oz doesn't mean he'll be unhappy. You go to another team. You make new friends. You learn new strategies from new coaches. None of those are automatically bad things.
On August 23 2009 16:31 baubo wrote: First of all, Jaedong needs to talk to other players first to know what happens when you switch teams. Right now, I feel like Jaedong's just this kid who doesn't know the world, and is simply afraid of leaving a comfortable situation that he's familiar with.
But the reality is, just because he's comfortable doesn't mean it's the best situation. And he really should at least try to explore other options. Especially if it means more $$$.
Well can you put a price on friendship and happiness?
I guess I'm still a kid at heart, but how much is money worth over happiness? I'll admit though it might not be that bad, he can still make new friends on other teams and see his Oz buddies. Though he'll probably feel like he is letting his team down.
Well for him it´s a job and not a hobby so he should go there where he earns most, friends won´t feed you in the future, only money does... It´s childish to say "Mumy i wanna stay with my friends and hug instead of earning money"
On August 23 2009 16:16 Hinanawi wrote: Oz needs to at least cough up enough money to match Jaedong's salary to Flash's. Jaedong is extremely underpaid right now.
oz needs to at least cough up money for some decent players imo
On August 23 2009 16:31 baubo wrote: First of all, Jaedong needs to talk to other players first to know what happens when you switch teams. Right now, I feel like Jaedong's just this kid who doesn't know the world, and is simply afraid of leaving a comfortable situation that he's familiar with.
But the reality is, just because he's comfortable doesn't mean it's the best situation. And he really should at least try to explore other options. Especially if it means more $$$.
Well can you put a price on friendship and happiness?
I guess I'm still a kid at heart, but how much is money worth over happiness? I'll admit though it might not be that bad, he can still make new friends on other teams and see his Oz buddies. Though he'll probably feel like he is letting his team down.
Well for him it´s a job and not a hobby so he should go there where he earns most, friends won´t feed you in the future, only money does... It´s childish to say "Mumy i wanna stay with my friends and hug instead of earning money"
Is his pay on Oz that bad or something? It's the age old career debate over dream job or highest paying job, expect with friends.
You know I can I almost imagine this being a movie and the other kids pooling their small amount of money to keep their teammate, expect of course they can't afford to pay to keep him with their money. Though isn't the issue the overwork more than the money?
On August 23 2009 16:31 baubo wrote: First of all, Jaedong needs to talk to other players first to know what happens when you switch teams. Right now, I feel like Jaedong's just this kid who doesn't know the world, and is simply afraid of leaving a comfortable situation that he's familiar with.
But the reality is, just because he's comfortable doesn't mean it's the best situation. And he really should at least try to explore other options. Especially if it means more $$$.
Well can you put a price on friendship and happiness?
I guess I'm still a kid at heart, but how much is money worth over happiness? I'll admit though it might not be that bad, he can still make new friends on other teams and see his Oz buddies. Though he'll probably feel like he is letting his team down.
Well for him it´s a job and not a hobby so he should go there where he earns most, friends won´t feed you in the future, only money does... It´s childish to say "Mumy i wanna stay with my friends and hug instead of earning money"
Come on now, I'm sure you know that's just exaggerating towards one extreme to make a point. On the opposite end we have "I'm going to sell my soul for money, giving up what I know has true value for me now in exchange for phantom worth in the future."
Now, the reality of the situation could be anything, we really don't know anything outside what media, rumors, and leaks tell us. And even those have to be taken with a significant grain of salt.
But there's one thing that I think is worth noting. Almost every star pro-gamer, from whatever team or whatever background, when offered a huge contract from a wealthy team, ended up taking the money. I can't speculate as to what that meant about their personal situations, or their situations with their teams, or whatever else there may be to consider. Yellow, Nal_ra, Reach, Gorush, Chojja, Bisu, Nada (though the rumors at the time mentioned various other unsavory factors) all left the teams they had attained glory with. Xellos is the only notable exception I can think of.
If in the end, Jaedong does convince his parents, and stays with OZ, then we know it will be a significant oddity. And of course then, we still won't have enough information to judge him. But it's my personal opinion that in that situation, a situation that goes heavily against the grain, it would be insulting to dismiss Jaedong as childish. You would have to think, maybe, there is something he knows, not just in his mind, but in his heart, that lead him to that decision.
And if your life view is truly so cynical at a base level, then I won't argue the point.
On August 23 2009 15:19 SuperArc wrote: Winning the Golden Mouse sure should help JD with convincing his parents.
You might want to put 'spoilers' next time you spoil something without warning. (especially since it hasn't even been 24 hours yet)
On topic: I'm glad JD wishs to stay on Oz. Perhaps this will encourage Oz to practice harder in the future for their matches so jaedong doesnt have to carry them =O
That's a really good point that their parents take care of him. Well I'm pretty sure there will be a solution for him and his parents. Hwaseung Jaedong forever.
On August 23 2009 15:19 SuperArc wrote: Winning the Golden Mouse sure should help JD with convincing his parents.
You might want to put 'spoilers' next time you spoil something without warning. (especially since it hasn't even been 24 hours yet)
On topic: I'm glad JD wishs to stay on Oz. Perhaps this will encourage Oz to practice harder in the future for their matches so jaedong doesnt have to carry them =O
pretty sure you're losing the discretion vs common sense argument in this particular case.
He needs to stay on Oz, because he is a huge inspirational figure for the team and I think if he left, the rest of Oz would really struggle, even more so than if jaedong just wasn't playing.
Besides, I think its awesomely cute that he would rather stay with good friends, than chase another team.
Also to those saying that he isn't be outgoing enough, Oz is hardly a bad team, its no MBC or wemade Fox.
I have to agree with some of the sentiments that Jaedong may feel extra attached to his team since hes still fresh in his youth and grew up a bit there. But would his happiness differ that much? The make new friends argument is pretty strong but hell. Who knows how drastic it could be, also its pretty unfair to make his parents out to seem like bad people... i mean everyone saw how friggin emo he got after pro league.
So after roaming the korean websites, I was able to get the real scoop on the story... In short Coach Cho is an asshole: he declared to the media that if Jaedong stayed he would offer him "the best deal people have yet seen" which turned out to be 140M Won + options which roughly came out to 200M. That is some bullshit because Bisu is estimated to receive ~250M (SKT1 hasn't released their players' salaries) a year (last year it was 200M, compared to Jaedong's 70M). Coach Cho worked Jaedong like a freakin workhorse and only offers him about half of what Bisu is getting paid? Jaedong fucking carried Jaedong OZ to the proleague finals, and brought them so much fame by making it to the semi's of both ind leagues, being a zvz god + Show Spoiler +
AND WINNING THE FUCKING GOLDEN MOUSE
etc. It's not about just the money, a player's salary is also his pride. If I were Jaedong's parents, I would be fucking furious at how Coach Cho said he would offer the best deal ever, and then pay half of what Bisu (arguably equal in skill) gets. The reason why the initial negotiations were broken up was because Jaedong's parents wanted 200M in pure salary plus options, which is not a steep call at all, but that D-bag of a coach didn't offer anything over 140M.
This is just what me thinks, but here's what I think is the reason to Coach CHo's douchebaggery: Because of the new stupid FA rules, if a team wants to take a player away from another team, they either have to pay 200% of their suggested salary from his original team, PLUS his new salary, or 100% of their suggested salary and give up a player to that team (they can sanction 6, and then the other team can pick any player except those 6) PLUS his new salary. That means in order to take Jaedong, a team must pay either 2*140M + 200M or 140M + 200M + player, which comes out to 340M and a player or 480M in pure money. No team in the right mind would be paying that. It is jaedong, but in such a volatile scene where bonjwas come and go so quickly, it would be crazy to shell out nada's 3 years worth of salary to get 1 player for a year. So it will probably go to renegotiations with coach Cho aka douchebag, and Jaedong will be forced to take the crappy deal, albeit being the greatest player in the starcraft scene today. Coach Cho offered 140M, which is just enough to make the cost of Jaedong too high for other teams to take, and knowing that Jaedong wanted to stay on the team, he is using that to pay Jaedong the minimal amount of money. DOUCHEBAG i am so mad
edit: I decided to include players receiving around Jaedong's range just for reference, so you can see why I am so mad. Bisu: estimated 250M+ fantasy: estimated 200M+ flash: estimated 200M+ Calm: 130M Nada: 110M Kal: 100M Hwasin: 100M
Don't think it's enough to just give Jaedong more money. They should also be obligated to get a decent player on the FA market. Sadly... there isn't any real A-class player out there so it's a shitty situation for them.
his parents asked for just 40M more, im sure he can ask hwaseung for that since jaedong is their ONLY competent player and should be retained at all costs. hell he should have cut into his own salary to offer jaedong a better deal if nothing worked out. And if he knew he couldnt offer a good enough deal, he shouldnt have publicly announced to media that he would offer an amazing deal he couldnt refuse.
On August 24 2009 00:20 nonduc wrote: …in order to take Jaedong, a team must pay either 2*70M + 200M or 70M + 200M + player…
PS. If only the previous salary was 70M but not 60M. I suggest it was 60M because Jaedong’s mom asks for 3 previous salaries = 180M.
hmm are you sure about that? At fomos it just says "their salary" but I always got the impression that they were doing it by the new salary they were offered. Either way, thanks for correcting me on his previous salary also, that is fucking terrible pay, considering sea was paid 80M last year.
Jaedongs parents might take the role of badguys willingly. They act in the best interest of their son so it's not like the public will hate them for it. On the other hand if Jaedong switches teams he doesn't loose his status as a "loyal" player since it was out of his hands. Same with his fans and the oz fans. They can't really be angry at Jaedong if his parents make the final decision. So Jaedong will most likely keep all his fans while getting new ones, should he really switch. And without the usual bad blood when a player changes teams for a better salary.
On August 23 2009 23:56 rotinegg wrote: This is just what me thinks, but here's what I think is the reason to Coach CHo's douchebaggery: Because of the new stupid FA rules, if a team wants to take a player away from another team, they either have to pay 200% of their suggested salary from his original team, PLUS his new salary, or 100% of their suggested salary and give up a player to that team (they can sanction 6, and then the other team can pick any player except those 6) PLUS his new salary. That means in order to take Jaedong, a team must pay either 2*140M + 200M or 140M + 200M + player, which comes out to 340M and a player or 480M in pure money. No team in the right mind would be paying that. It is jaedong, but in such a volatile scene where bonjwas come and go so quickly, it would be crazy to shell out nada's 3 years worth of salary to get 1 player for a year. So it will probably go to renegotiations with coach Cho aka douchebag, and Jaedong will be forced to take the crappy deal, albeit being the greatest player in the starcraft scene today. Coach Cho offered 140M, which is just enough to make the cost of Jaedong too high for other teams to take, and knowing that Jaedong wanted to stay on the team, he is using that to pay Jaedong the minimal amount of money. DOUCHEBAG i am so mad
edit: I decided to include players receiving around Jaedong's range just for reference, so you can see why I am so mad. Bisu: estimated 250M+ fantasy: estimated 200M+ flash: estimated 200M+ Calm: 130M Nada: 110M Kal: 100M Hwasin: 100M
Jaedong's parents have the right reaction -- it's an insult for the arguably best player in the scene to be making so little compared to the other players. Especially considering how overworked he is compared to other top players, and he still puts up the good results.
Jaedong just wants to be happy which is a good outlook (and I'm sure it contributes to his success as well), but he is being "cheated" and I'm glad his parents are sticking up for him.
Oh, this interview puts his free agency into a whole new perspective, i thought it was him declaring himself as one in the first place. I guess he will just get a payrise and stay in Oz.
Normally I wouldn't approve of parent's going against the will of their son like this but you also have to bear in mind the east asian culture when talking about this. It's possible that Jaedong isn't as thanksful and wanting to stay in his team as he says. Giving respect to an older person or ones coachs etc is expected in all of east asia.
Think about it. If Jaedong really wanted to leave and felt his time was done in OZ then what would he say? He wouldn't go out into the media saying he's tired of his team and time to move on etc etc. He'd say just what he is saying now and then he would keep his honor towards the team.
It's of course more likely that he wants to stay with his friends are the ones who heleped him grow as a player but lets not rule out anything. I doubt he is happy about his parents being made to look like heartless moneygrubbing bastards though.
Why can't jaedong (at least his mom) deny all offers and finally turn to be semi-pro (without any team). After that he is free to sign contract whichever team he wants without huge salary bonuses to Hwaseung Oz?
Then other teams might offer 200M without 200% salary.
Its not like Jaedong would not be picked up by some team.
I don't see how Oz wouldn't be willing to pay Jaedong at least 200M won. You figure they'd lose more money than that if he left the team. But I guess they figure they can lowball him and still keep him.
On August 23 2009 15:19 NeverGG wrote: 'I don't want to lose the happiness that comes from being with the people you love.'
Urge to make Homo for Lomo joke rising. This is an interesting dilemma really. I hope Jaedong comes out of the whole FA situation happily and that he can continue to play in the way he wants to.
I felt really bad for Jaedong when I was watching this: + Show Spoiler +
His mom is doing the right thing. It is his career, he needs to go where he will get paid what he's worth and have the best chance of success. I honestly think Jaedong would have won the osl, msl and the proleague if he had been on any of the other teams that made the proleague playoffs.
On August 24 2009 01:53 Too_MuchZerg wrote: Why can't jaedong (at least his mom) deny all offers and finally turn to be semi-pro (without any team). After that he is free to sign contract whichever team he wants without huge salary bonuses to Hwaseung Oz?
Then other teams might offer 200M without 200% salary.
Its not like Jaedong would not be picked up by some team.
Because you are pretty much unable to compete in any leagues if you are classed as 'semi-pro' until the next FA period next year.
His mom is doing the right thing. It is his career, he needs to go where he will get paid what he's worth and have the best chance of success. I honestly think Jaedong would have won the osl, msl and the proleague if he had been on any of the other teams that made the proleague playoffs.
WTF send JD to hite... he would be much happier XD
The 140M figure I believe is the new offer, it would be even more insulting if Oz didn't offer Jaedong some sort of pay raise which means his original salary was less than 140M.
I hope he get's his parents convinced so that he can stay with Oz, but somehow still get a reasonable payrise.. can't really imagine him anywhere else.
probably a newbie question but how do teams generate revenue? does proleague or individual league success translate to more $$ for the successful teams?
On August 24 2009 07:03 nonduc wrote: Original salary was 60M.
Hmm, I thought I read 70M in this thread before. Oh well, doesn't make that much of a difference either way. Must have been a 2+ year contract from when he was good in PL, but way less of a monster than he is now.
On August 24 2009 07:21 xbarisg wrote: probably a newbie question but how do teams generate revenue? does proleague or individual league success translate to more $$ for the successful teams?
PL title gives a fair amount of money (not sure about this year, but the last few years it was 80M), but that's only for the team winning it all. In the most of the money simply comes in form of sponsorship by the companies owning the teams.
I've been a fan of oz but these negotations with JD completely turned me off to oz. Oz realizes there are only a few teams that have the resources to pay for JD with the terrible free agent signing rules and those few teams that have that kinda cash dont have as much a need for JD as other teams. Now i do believe Coach Cho has limited control over these negotiations since Hwaseung is paying and they have complete control over what goes on so i wouldnt call him a douchebag. I hope this is the case or its just so wrong. Oz would be nothing without JD and hes obviously the best players in pro sc atm and he deserves to be paid like one.
Jaedong should earn base salary 200M+ won. Period. Anything less is a pure disgrace. Transfer to another team if you have to, OZ shouldn't be running a pro-league team if they can't shell out 200M won for the best player.
If coach Cho said he would make Jaedong the highest paid progamer and then ended up offering 140m won + bonuses, the most logical explanation to me is that he really had the intention of making Jaedong a great offer (since I'm sure he realizes how valuable he is to the team) but likely got shut down by the accountants/managers in charge of the team finances, or when going begging for more money to the corporate sponsor (Hwaseung). I could easily see him asking for 300m won to pay to his star player, arguing how it would be worth it and being told by the Hwaseung rep that 140m won is as high as he can go. Just a thought before people go blaming the coach for all this, since I imagine it really is mostly out of his hands.
Only problem in this whole story is stupid rules. Why would teams pay players so much if they don't have to. Problem is in those rules. Players should be able to choose whatever they want after their contract expires. It should work like this: "your contract expires -> you're free man, sign with whoever you want", and that's it, that is the only solution for all problems. If someone finishes his contract, then he did everything, he finished it. Player should not own anything to that team anymore and other teams should not pay them.
It's clear that SOMEONE in the Hwaesung Oz company is being a huge doucebag, but we're not sure it's Coach Cho, so let's not jump to conclusions about him.
It's entirely possible that it's simply some suit-and-tie in the Hwaesung company none of us know of who looked at the new bullshit FA rules and said "We can get away with paying him $140 mil because any other team that wants him would have to shell out around 350 mil to take him from us under the new rules".
Jaedong's parents are doing the right thing, I think. It's a no-lose situation, at the very least it puts pressure on Hwaesung Oz to pay Jaedong what he deserves by giving the company negative public attention for perceived abuse of a beloved Starcraft player.
Let me see if I understand this. I've read all the Jaedong threads but there is a lot of speculation and some contradictory information.
If a team wants Jaedong right now, they have to pay (70M x2) + new salary (no less than 140M), so at least 280M up front (and probably more if they want to draw Jaedong away from Hwaseung).
If Hwaseung kept Jaedong this year and another team wanted to buy him next year, they'd be shelling out (140M x2) + even higher salary, so at least 420M and probably more.
Basically, the cost of buying Jaedong this year is going to be ~140M less than buying him in the future, because his salary in the past has been relatively low, but is getting bumped up a notch now. IMO this suggests that Jaedong is likely to be bought, because if a team can't afford 280M now (not much more than Bisu's annual salary), they sure as hell won't be able to afford 420M later. It's now or never, assuming the rules remain the same.
...Right?
Edit: Or if a team goes for the [salary + 7th most desirable player] option instead of the [salary x2] option, Jaedong could be had for even less; the only teams that have anything to lose by sacrificing someone outside their top six are STX and CJ, who have very broad line-ups. And those guys have plenty of zergs anyway. Jaedong could be bought for 70M + (say) 250M and a random player; it's still a big expense, but not absolutely prohibitive.
The more I think about it, the less I think that this system actually benefits the players themselves; a system that benefited the players would enable them to switch to higher-paying teams easily, whereas this system makes it almost impossible for a good player to actually get bought. Couldn't SKT easily lowball Bisu, for example? If his salary is 250M, they could slash that by 75M and still nobody could buy Bisu because they'd need to be shelling out (250M + ~200M + [250M or a player]). That's 450M and a player, or 700M which is totally insane. So what's stopping a team like SKT from chipping away at an expensive player's salary? These rules seem to make it harder for a player to seek a good contract, not easier. I feel like I must be misunderstanding something here.
FA rules are so skewed in favor of the teams and is pretty much designed to make sure players stay with their original teams. You HAVE to fix the rules when the best sc player on the planet at this time is being forced to take 140 million won and over 100 million less than the 2nd best player on the planet. I am now wishing some rich team like skt or ktf will pay up and take JD. Being a poor team is no excuse for pretty much screwing over the player that worked his butt off carrying OZ. Seriously there probably isnt anyone else on OZ making over 30 million won so they can find 200 million somewhere or gtfo of proleague.
On August 24 2009 09:09 nonduc wrote: 2 Djabanete: new Jaedong’s team has to pay 2 x 60M + 180M = 300M. (60M—previous salary; 180M—new salary asked by Jaedong’s parents.)
Thanks. And isn't it the case that if Hwaseung hung on to jaedong for a year for 140M, then a purchasing team would need to pay 2 x 140M + 180M = 460M? Seems like if anyone wants to buy Jaedong, now is the time.
By my understanding, if Jaedong doesn't transfer now, he'll be stranding himself on Oz for good, for a worse salary than if he transferred. Jaedong stock is higher than it's ever been, and can it realistically get any better? The guy's got to move if he doesn't want to get paid half of what Bisu earns for the rest of his life.
(Tell me Jaedong isn't being shafted here --- suppose he does transfer, and commands an 180M salary --- how will he ever get a higher salary than that? He won't be able to use the "I'll transfer" leverage that he has (or his parents have) over OZ, because the cost of a transfer from a 180M salary is astronomical --- 2x180 + ~200 = 560M! So basically, if he doesn't transfer he'll be left with a 140M salary, which is underpaying him massively, and if he does transfer, he'll be absolutely locked in for good with a 180M salary, which is underpaying him slightly. There will be no incentive for a team to give him a pay raise from there, because he's already untouchable at that salary, so they can freely lowball him. Looks to me like it's damned if you do, damned if you don't --- someone please tell me Jaedong isn't just getting shafted here. I can't see how he can possibly work himself up to a Bisu/fantasy level of pay, and yet isn't he worth just as much as them, if not more?)
On August 24 2009 09:09 nonduc wrote: 2 Djabanete: new Jaedong’s team has to pay 2 x 60M + 180M = 300M. (60M—previous salary; 180M—new salary asked by Jaedong’s parents.)
Thanks. And isn't it the case that if Hwaseung hung on to jaedong for a year for 140M, then a purchasing team would need to pay 2 x 140M + 180M = 460M? Seems like if anyone wants to buy Jaedong, now is the time.
By my understanding, if Jaedong doesn't transfer now, he'll be stranding himself on Oz for good, for a worse salary than if he transferred. Jaedong stock is higher than it's ever been, and can it realistically get any better? The guy's got to move if he doesn't want to get paid half of what Bisu earns for the rest of his life.
(Tell me Jaedong isn't being shafted here --- suppose he does transfer, and commands an 180M salary --- how will he ever get a higher salary than that? He won't be able to use the "I'll transfer" leverage that he has (or his parents have) over OZ, because the cost of a transfer from a 180M salary is astronomical --- 2x180 + ~200 = 560M! So basically, if he doesn't transfer he'll be left with a 140M salary, which is underpaying him massively, and if he does transfer, he'll be absolutely locked in for good with a 180M salary, which is underpaying him slightly. There will be no incentive for a team to give him a pay raise from there, because he's already untouchable at that salary, so they can freely lowball him. Looks to me like it's damned if you do, damned if you don't --- someone please tell me Jaedong isn't just getting shafted here. I can't see how he can possibly work himself up to a Bisu/fantasy level of pay, and yet isn't he worth just as much as them, if not more?)
He'll have to trust that the team that signs him won't lowball him.
A lot of teams are fair or more than fair with their players, especially their top players. SKT, STX, Wemade, CJ, etc.
Flash is a bit under paid as well IMO even though KT has the resources. I highly doubt for all that the "child labor terran" does for his team he should be paid at least as much as Bisu (and from the threads that have come out he's making 50 mil less (200kk vs 250kk)). And this is as an SKT fan -_-
On August 24 2009 08:36 Goragoth wrote: If coach Cho said he would make Jaedong the highest paid progamer and then ended up offering 140m won + bonuses, the most logical explanation to me is that he really had the intention of making Jaedong a great offer (since I'm sure he realizes how valuable he is to the team) but likely got shut down by the accountants/managers in charge of the team finances, or when going begging for more money to the corporate sponsor (Hwaseung). I could easily see him asking for 300m won to pay to his star player, arguing how it would be worth it and being told by the Hwaseung rep that 140m won is as high as he can go. Just a thought before people go blaming the coach for all this, since I imagine it really is mostly out of his hands.
First of all, Coach Cho did not say anything. The statement said "Hwaseung has promised to make him the highest paid progamer." Hwaseung is the company. Coach Cho is just like a coach in the NBA. They do not own the players, they just train them and are there for support.
On August 24 2009 09:09 nonduc wrote: 2 Djabanete: new Jaedong’s team has to pay 2 x 60M + 180M = 300M. (60M—previous salary; 180M—new salary asked by Jaedong’s parents.)
Thanks. And isn't it the case that if Hwaseung hung on to jaedong for a year for 140M, then a purchasing team would need to pay 2 x 140M + 180M = 460M? Seems like if anyone wants to buy Jaedong, now is the time.
By my understanding, if Jaedong doesn't transfer now, he'll be stranding himself on Oz for good, for a worse salary than if he transferred. Jaedong stock is higher than it's ever been, and can it realistically get any better? The guy's got to move if he doesn't want to get paid half of what Bisu earns for the rest of his life.
(Tell me Jaedong isn't being shafted here --- suppose he does transfer, and commands an 180M salary --- how will he ever get a higher salary than that? He won't be able to use the "I'll transfer" leverage that he has (or his parents have) over OZ, because the cost of a transfer from a 180M salary is astronomical --- 2x180 + ~200 = 560M! So basically, if he doesn't transfer he'll be left with a 140M salary, which is underpaying him massively, and if he does transfer, he'll be absolutely locked in for good with a 180M salary, which is underpaying him slightly. There will be no incentive for a team to give him a pay raise from there, because he's already untouchable at that salary, so they can freely lowball him. Looks to me like it's damned if you do, damned if you don't --- someone please tell me Jaedong isn't just getting shafted here. I can't see how he can possibly work himself up to a Bisu/fantasy level of pay, and yet isn't he worth just as much as them, if not more?)
He'll have to trust that the team that signs him won't lowball him.
A lot of teams are fair or more than fair with their players, especially their top players. SKT, STX, Wemade, CJ, etc.
Flash is a bit under paid as well IMO even though KT has the resources. I highly doubt for all that the "child labor terran" does for his team he should be paid at least as much as Bisu (and from the threads that have come out he's making 50 mil less (200kk vs 250kk)). And this is as an SKT fan -_-
These rules screw over the players in favor of the teams, who have large discretion over what they choose to pay existing players. The salary Oz is offering JD is laughable.
On August 24 2009 09:09 nonduc wrote: 2 Djabanete: new Jaedong’s team has to pay 2 x 60M + 180M = 300M. (60M—previous salary; 180M—new salary asked by Jaedong’s parents.)
Thanks. And isn't it the case that if Hwaseung hung on to jaedong for a year for 140M, then a purchasing team would need to pay 2 x 140M + 180M = 460M? Seems like if anyone wants to buy Jaedong, now is the time.
By my understanding, if Jaedong doesn't transfer now, he'll be stranding himself on Oz for good, for a worse salary than if he transferred. Jaedong stock is higher than it's ever been, and can it realistically get any better? The guy's got to move if he doesn't want to get paid half of what Bisu earns for the rest of his life.
(Tell me Jaedong isn't being shafted here --- suppose he does transfer, and commands an 180M salary --- how will he ever get a higher salary than that? He won't be able to use the "I'll transfer" leverage that he has (or his parents have) over OZ, because the cost of a transfer from a 180M salary is astronomical --- 2x180 + ~200 = 560M! So basically, if he doesn't transfer he'll be left with a 140M salary, which is underpaying him massively, and if he does transfer, he'll be absolutely locked in for good with a 180M salary, which is underpaying him slightly. There will be no incentive for a team to give him a pay raise from there, because he's already untouchable at that salary, so they can freely lowball him. Looks to me like it's damned if you do, damned if you don't --- someone please tell me Jaedong isn't just getting shafted here. I can't see how he can possibly work himself up to a Bisu/fantasy level of pay, and yet isn't he worth just as much as them, if not more?)
He'll have to trust that the team that signs him won't lowball him.
A lot of teams are fair or more than fair with their players, especially their top players. SKT, STX, Wemade, CJ, etc.
Flash is a bit under paid as well IMO even though KT has the resources. I highly doubt for all that the "child labor terran" does for his team he should be paid at least as much as Bisu (and from the threads that have come out he's making 50 mil less (200kk vs 250kk)). And this is as an SKT fan -_-
These rules screw over the players in favor of the teams, who have large discretion over what they choose to pay existing players. The salary Oz is offering JD is laughable.
Just imagine if the government made a similar rule for all employees... there would be fucking riots. KESPA needs to revisit this one.
Well, not saying they don't screw over the players... they do. I don't think there's anyone here who wouldn't say KeSPA and their "rules" need HUGE revisions EVERYWHERE.
But there are more advantageous situations out there if he wants to get paid that is. Sounds like he's not concerned about that so much, but his parents are and hopefully have his best interests in mind.
I agree with other people say about Jaedong deserving at least 200 mil won. I think its really time for Jaedong to consider another team. He can always make new friends and learn to adapt. I understand that Oz must be like his 2nd home but when he's severely underpaid, its seriously a disgrace to his reputation.
At first, I wanted to Jaedong to remain at Oz. Oz doesn't even buy any new players and Coach Cho played against Hite today without JD so Hwaseung is probably prepared to lose Jaedong. If Bisu is paid 250+ mil, then KT or SKT just needs to offer more than 280 (140 times 2) to get Jaedong. I don't think paying Jaedong 281 mil is a bad deal since its like a guaranteed semi finals / finals ticket in proleague
140 mil won? Man thats only 10 mil more than Calm. I know there's more than 10 mil price difference between Calm and Jaedong for sure
On August 24 2009 11:51 AzureEye wrote: I agree with other people say about Jaedong deserving at least 200 mil won. I think its really time for Jaedong to consider another team. He can always make new friends and learn to adapt. I understand that Oz must be like his 2nd home but when he's severely underpaid, its seriously a disgrace to his reputation.
At first, I wanted to Jaedong to remain at Oz. Oz doesn't even buy any new players and Coach Cho played against Hite today without JD so Hwaseung is probably prepared to lose Jaedong. If Bisu is paid 250+ mil, then KT or SKT just needs to offer more than 280 (140 times 2) to get Jaedong. I don't think paying Jaedong 281 mil is a bad deal since its like a guaranteed semi finals / finals ticket in proleague
140 mil won? Man thats only 10 mil more than Calm. I know there's more than 10 mil price difference between Calm and Jaedong for sure
I agree...
pay him what he's earned plz....
and anytime i read anything about kespa regulations find them more and more absurd... everytime... kespa gtfo kthx
If Savior and Nada are still getting paid 200-300mil, Jaedong should at least get 200. I'm pretty sure Bisu and Flash get 200-300 and Jaedong is just as valuable if not more.
It is generally found to be a bad idea to mix personal and business relations. This is exactly what's going on here. I wouldn't find it such a bad decision for Jaedong to retire from pro-gaming. Sure he can say he's happy while being worked like a dog, but will he feel about it the same when he looks back a few years from now? That kind of stress can leave a long term impact.
I find Jaedong to thrive under the situation that the Oz house provided, ie. he wanted to be the heavy workhorse on the team. and cutting into his sleeping schedule and the other crazy stuff he pulled was of his own making - surely he got everyone worried when he was training at his craziest. No coach could ever force that kind of stuff on a player, or if they did there wouldnt be much love between a player and a coach who did this. A hypothetical new team would be hard pressed to make Jaedong work less and it might even be an annoyance for JD to have a competing ace around, who knows.
Additionally, Many on the Oz team were sucked in on Jaedongs heavy workload. Other folk like Lomo and HiyA were happy to stay up late and cut in to their vacation time to help Jaedong practice. Its this kind of team spirit that is very, very rare in any kind of professional sporting team, and I can only imagine these things play a heavy part in Jaedongs will to stay with Oz.
It is an undeniable fact that he is severely underpaid, though. Whatever happens I hope mr Jaedong will find happiness because that much he really does deserve. Since his passion and dedication for the game is still a flame burning bright it would be sad to every and all counterparts if he were to go to university now, against his own will. What good could ever come out of that?
You can only play at the top level at a certain golden age of your lifetime. You can get an university degree at 50 and even later. Parents will be always be parents, but parents are also human and therefore prone to stupidity just like any people.
Jaedong should keep playing if that is what he wants to do and undoubtedly that is what he wants.
This really makes me wonder what Anytime's salary was before he decided to prematurely retire. He wasn't doing super well at the time either so he wouldn't have looked that attractive to other teams, so Oz might have thought they could have kept Anytime for little and he decided to just retire.
If Jaedong wasn't doing well currently like Anytime was back then, what would he be able to do. If he was doing poorly with the rest of the Oz team. Who knows, maybe he'd have to retire.
On August 24 2009 13:13 soudo wrote: If Savior and Nada are still getting paid 200-300mil, Jaedong should at least get 200. I'm pretty sure Bisu and Flash get 200-300 and Jaedong is just as valuable if not more.
Nada gets paid 100k now I think, and Savior's obviously would have went down as well. In his top earning period Savior was getting 200-300 mil. And during the radio interview Bisu and Flash were getting paid 200-300 mil and probably around the same amount now.
at first I thought JD's parents were being greedy but now I completely sympathize with their position. if JD doesn't get paid at least as much as bisu/flash then it's simply an injustice. JD is the most valuable player in proleague imo.
Man, either KHAN or KT would be fucking unstoppable with him. I mean, any team will do well with Jaedong on it (look at OZ), but those two just need one really good zerg.
I'd root for him joining Fingerboom though. Both because the Dong goes so well with it, and because having Jaedong and Flash on one team would be insanely baller. Not as baller as Fantasy + Bisu + Jaedong, but that would break the internet forever.
i'm all for jaedong getting as much money as he can while he is still at the top of his game, because as much as he is really one of the world's top players right now an esports player's working life span is extremely limited, shorter that even those of the "usual" professional sports like soccer.. he should earn as much as he can now, for sure, unless he has some sort of really good back up employment plans for when he retires as a progamer. I think his parents know that.
EPT
I wouldnt mind him staying at Oz 
![[image loading]](http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b13/InSenG/jaedonggay.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/8228/jaedongheart.jpg)
