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I always enjoyed chemistry, and I knew that I wanted to take it in University. But this year (grade 12) in chemistry my mark is fairly horrid. At the start of the year I started out at a good mark of about 85% but I have slowly been getting bad on tests and that mark has dropped down to about a 72%. My physics is at a 72% and I know I suck at physics and I never liked the course or try very hard in it anyway.
I just got back our 2nd last test of the course and I got a 50%. I am extremely disappointed about that mark especially since I studied very hard and thought I understood the unit very very well.
This has been re-occuring in my past few tests and as a result my mark has been dropping substantially. I always go into the test extremely confident, I even come out extremely confident. But when I get that back it's always extremely disappointing. I think that my estimated mark is inversely proportional to my actual mark. I think I will get a low 90 and I will get a 72% or as on this test I thought I would get a low 80% but got a 50%. I don't understand wtf is happening.
It makes me wonder if I should actually take chemistry in university or not. Good thing that University applications are due in a few weeks. Sigh I just don't know what to do anymore.
Some people may say "just work harder" I have been working hard, I study for these tests for at least 10 hours. Even quizzes I study for like 3 hours and still do horrible. I also tried not studying on a test, and let me tell you I got about the same mark I would have studying.
I don't know if chemistry is right for me anymore...I just plainly don't know what to do...
 
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i was in the same situation. in grade 12 chem was my favorite class with my best mark. i took it in first and second year and not quite as large a fan as i once was. i still dont really know what i want to do
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It seems to me that your problem is you don't know what you know really well/ what to prepare for tests. However, universities have a source of help that high school does not. TAs. Usually if you do studying with their help, you get a more realistic view of your knowledge of the subject (Directed studying is SO much better than trying to do it on your own). If you honestly enjoy chemistry, I wouldn't give up on it just because you got a few low test scores.
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CA10824 Posts
studying a lot isn't the same as studying well
do all the book problems, go in and ask the teacher for more help after school on the ones that you don't understand. just because you understand things conceptually (although of course this is very important) doesn't mean that you are able to solve all the problems.
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16953 Posts
The bad news is chemistry in college is much more difficult. Introductory chemistry (equivalent of your AP Chem) is graded very harshly, and is a general weed-out course for students. Introductory organic chemistry is much the same.
It's much more difficult than in high school. More analytical and stuff.
But good luck anyway :/
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On December 18 2008 07:23 LosingID8 wrote:
studying a lot isn't the same as studying well
do all the book problems, go in and ask the teacher for more help after school on the ones that you don't understand. just because you understand things conceptually (although of course this is very important) doesn't mean that you are able to solve all the problems.
Yes i know what you mean I had an organic chemistry test (pure memorization) and there was only simple math really involved. It took me about 7 hours but i managed to memorize everything, and I only got a 65%. It's really annoying since somehow people would come in go "Omg theres a test today?" and still clutch better marks then me.
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You just need to play more Starcraft!
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Do you have your test with you? You should post some questions that you got wrong and what you put as your answer, and your reasoning, so we could maybe see what your problem is. It could be anything from you not understanding the material (rather than just memorising it), the teacher is a bitch ass marker, you simply don't know the answer, or your way of answering questions isn't great.
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It's the beginning of the year, everyone does good in the beginning, but slowly and slowly they get lazy, well at least I do.
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I think that my estimated mark is inversely proportional to my actual mark. I think I will get a low 90 and I will get a 72% or as on this test I thought I would get a low 80% but got a 50%. I don't understand wtf is happening.
This is actually proportional, not inversely.
Chemistry is all about math. Learn it.
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CA10824 Posts
On December 18 2008 08:00 FzeroXx wrote:
Chemistry is all about math. Learn it.
organic chemistry is definitely not all about math
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In university, chemistry starts branching off into general chemistry and organic chemistry. It will become more than just memorization. Not only do you have to understand concepts, why such and such occurs, but you'll need to know how apply it (such as synthesizing more complex molecules from simple starting materials).
High school chemistry hardly scratches the surface chemistry and only a few will be adequately prepared for it in university. If you don't enjoy it now, it will be the bane of your existence in the future. Especially since the lecturers (in my case) hardly teach you; like in high school where the teachers hold your hand when you need help, the lecturers spew off stuff out of the textbooks making the lecture boring for those that have read it and useless for procrastinators (who will just cram the textbook).
The trend you get about your marks actually occurs quite often with all science courses. One small conceptual mistake and it screws up everything. It happens. A good solution to this is to partner up with someone who does well (and isn't some competitive asshole) that not only will help you understand, but motivate you to do better. They will be able to catch your mistakes and not only that, fix your bad habits in both studying and doing problems.
Furthermore, those people that say "shit there's a test today?" and go into panic mode, chances are they know their material but procrastinated (as in they're most likely smart enough to retain material but don't do the whole study like crazy bit). The people that don't care don't bother with saying it, they take it on the chin.
Chemistry gets extremely tough down the road, and unless you're really good at it, a study group is almost always a good idea (make sure to have a smarter person than you). Don't be intimidated of someone being smarter than you. In university, there will always be an overachiever that will rape every single test and exam that they write.
Ten hours of study doesn't do much unless of course you're studying correctly. Reading material and doing problems are two different things (this applies to physics definitely). Understanding concepts is not enough and in university they definitely emphasize that with mass word problems and ambigious wordings to catch you off guard. Again, a study group or a study buddy is always a good course of action (that is if the group or person is either a) smart and will help you, or b) will motivate you into doing better). Eventually you'll be able to catch your own mistakes and correct others which will really show how much you know the material. If you can teach it to someone correctly and very well, explain problems to them, you know you've got it down. In those 10 hours, instead of just reading and doing problems, try interacting with your peers, ask if they have trouble and help them. If you're stuck where they are, then you've found a hole in your knowledge and you can fix it.
That's really all I have to say I guess. Chemistry becomes a fiend in later years, a lot of people will despise it even though they have done very well in high school (90% mark students I'm talking about here). The bright side is that you'll be doing frequent labs where the reports are pretty easy (much easier than in high school). But I guess that depends on the person. Hope this helps.
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Yes just looking through them now it seems that a main problem I am making is not setting up my problems properly. I will list some problems I had and what tests they were on.. It could be the fact that, well I noticed while studying for my last test that some of my notes were incorrect.
Equilibreum:
mostly messed up when setting up my equation (stoichyopmetry)
-things that favor reaction...notes were backwards ended up getting 0/6.
- I make one little mistake in an equation like forgetting a 2x coeficicient when solving for equilibreum concentrations, and get 3/8.
Mini test / Chemical kinetics:
-2/4 for answering question but not explaining. Question was state identify 2 properties.. teacher wasn't there so couldn't ask him so i just put down the answer with no explanation.
-3/4 not using the termanology
-3/6 drawing diagram, I put my enthalpy change as positive instead of negative..
-writing a paragraph instead of just stating "order = 1"
Organic Chemistry:
-25/40 on multiple choice, which is pure memorization and I know it like that back of my hand. Finished it in like half the time of others and thought i got atleast 94% and got a 65%...
I usually make a review sheet on the computer before a test, and I always make mock tests and exchange them with friends...
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On December 18 2008 08:00 FzeroXx wrote:
Chemistry is all about math. Learn it.
A common misconception in high school. Especially in Grade 11 (for our curriculum anyway) where the majority of chemistry is focused on stoichiometry. It's essential yes (especially in general chemistry) but if you plan on taking organic chem, this mindset will cause you to shit bricks when they show you some 20 carbon molecule and they say synthesize starting with only a pentane using any chemical reagents you want (yes, they word it so you can't say shit like, "ask a professor for it").
General chemistry (involving quantum theory and a buttload of quantitative dealies) is a fuckton harder in university then in high school. The average for the first test at our university I believe was 47%. You might think that's low but even those that aced high school chemistry start to falter. Yes, it could be blamed on the crappy lectures and useless labs but I'm just saying that it takes a lot of initiative to do well in university.
EDIT:
In organic chemistry, in my experience, you'll get your ass raped so badly if you just memorize. Multiplce choice will be only like 10% of your test, while the other 90% rests on the shoulder of 4 or 5 short/long answer questions. Start preparing because they show no mercy.
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On December 18 2008 08:18 Tynuji wrote:Show nested quote +On December 18 2008 08:00 FzeroXx wrote:
Chemistry is all about math. Learn it. A common misconception in high school. Especially in Grade 11 (for our curriculum anyway) where the majority of chemistry is focused on stoichiometry. It's essential yes (especially in general chemistry) but if you plan on taking organic chem, this mindset will cause you to shit bricks when they show you some 20 carbon molecule and they say synthesize starting with only a pentane using any chemical reagents you want (yes, they word it so you can't say shit like, "ask a professor for it"). General chemistry (involving quantum theory and a buttload of quantitative dealies) is a fuckton harder in university then in high school. The average for the first test at our university I believe was 47%. You might think that's low but even those that aced high school chemistry start to falter. Yes, it could be blamed on the crappy lectures and useless labs but I'm just saying that it takes a lot of initiative to do well in university.
What uni u go too?
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Just take first year science in university, and if you decide you cant do chemistry, then you still have a lot of options open to you. At the very least you could use your first year as electives if you switched to Arts or Business or whatever. I wouldnt stress about it if I was you. You dont need to know what your future is going to be when you start University. Take some courses, see what you like, and go from there.
I went to University thinking I was going to do a chem major, after first year I decided I also loved math, so I was going to do a double major. After second year I decided I could no longer stand chemistry lab reports(they are brutal), but I still loved the rest of chemistry. I made the hard choice of leaving chemistry and just doing math. As part of the math program I had to take some comp sci courses. I fell in love with programming, and now I am a comp sci major with a math minor. I am graduating in 4 months. I did all of comp sci in 2 years. The point I am trying to make is that it doesnt matter if you decide you dont like your major, or if you like another major more, you can just switch and still use most(maybe all) of the courses you already took as electives.
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University of Toronto. Life Sciences program. If you're into science, don't come to U of T for your undergraduate. It sucks balls. They also don't show favouritism for their medschools. Fucking first generation asian parents are retarded and think when a school has the city's name attached to it, it's the godsend of universities.
It's also boring as shit.
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Yeah, tbh I found Gr.12 Chemistry really easy, like 90+ percent without studying and then when i went to university, I got 50 percent on the first two quizzes. It's a lot harder in university >.> just a heads-up if you really want to take it.
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I am concerned about my average for getting into universities. Most of them require an 80 and im scared that if I don't get it I won't get to go where I want and then I wont be in a good program or anything. My current average is only 79 because my chemistry is so low. I really am afraid I wont get into any of the places I am applieing to...
Chemistry at..
-UofT
-MAC
-Guelph
-Western
-Waterloo
-Queens
-St.Fx
-UBC
and Buisness at
-Laurier
I am really afraid that I won't get into most of them, that's why I am applieing to so many places..
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Come to UofT post graduate.
I think it only required an 80 average but it was pretty competitive and people with 90 averages were applying. I would aim for waterloo or MAC (if by MAC you mean McMaster). Plus it's early, as I remember there were two mark submissions. One for early acceptance and one more to see if you actually get in (hopefully you've improved by this time).
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Organic chemistry is more like biology... >_>
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I've always advised people to choose subjects they enjoy rather than just the ones they get high scores in. I always did better in economics tests than maths, but I'm still doing a maths degree.
Is your chemistry grade significantly worse than another subject you're considering?
And how are you losing marks? Is it lack of understanding, forgot a detail, trivial mistakes?
Nice that you get to apply to so many unis, here we get 5 choices and medical students get 4.
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On December 18 2008 08:41 Nytefish wrote:
I've always advised people to choose subjects they enjoy rather than just the ones they get high scores in. I always did better in economics tests than maths, but I'm still doing a maths degree.
Is your chemistry grade significantly worse than another subject you're considering?
And how are you losing marks? Is it lack of understanding, forgot a detail, trivial mistakes?
Nice that you get to apply to so many unis, here we get 5 choices and medical students get 4.
I very much enjoy chemistry. I haven't really considered other courses I just always loved chemistry..
I will post my study sheet in a few minutes maybe someone could do me a favour and check it over to make sure it's free of mistakes before i study from it.
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16953 Posts
Haha, I only applied to three, two of them being state schools :/
<_<
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On December 18 2008 07:27 nAi.PrOtOsS wrote:
Yes i know what you mean I had an organic chemistry test (pure memorization) and there was only simple math really involved. It took me about 7 hours but i managed to memorize everything, and I only got a 65%. It's really annoying since somehow people would come in go "Omg theres a test today?" and still clutch better marks then me.
Maybe you should not study at all and go into a test saying "OMG, there's a test today." I say that all the time and get higher grades than my peers.
On a more serious note, you should upload your test. Then we could see how hard the problems are. Maybe you have this crazy teacher that is too harsh with grades.
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I felt confident with high school chemistry..
but when first year came around..let's just say i bombed the final
and yes i studied quite a bit lols..
*praying for a good scaled mark*
my gr12 average was 86ish, and to my disbelief i actually made it.. not sure on the current acceptance averages tho since i don't think provincials are required for many universities any more
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i think its like someone else pointed out, its about studying well, not studying a lot. study however and as long as you feel most comfortably, i did very good in chemistry (high school anyways) and people were always suprised about my study habits compared to theirs
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On December 18 2008 08:41 doghunter wrote:
Organic chemistry is more like biology... >_>
Actually, organic chemistry and biology differ vastly. Yes they are connected, but in first year, biology focuses on evolution, behaviours and patterns in living things. There will be some genetics yes, but the majority focuses on why an organism does this and how we can predict the reasons for it and test it experimentally. A lot of people make the connection orgo chem is like biology because the examples many people use have to do with the reactions in our body because people commonly that go into science pursue human care (pharmaceuticals, physician etc) so examples are provided that will link into what they'll most likely encounter.
Organic chemistry focuses on organic molecules, how they react, how they are synthesized, why certain reagents do this and such. During the first year, making the connections to biology and organic chemistry is hard. You'll get a DNA here and there and in genetics you might use some chemistry (charges and acid base stuff) but overall biology focuses on the organism itself and digs deep into evolution.
A lot of people think they're very close because of stuff like cell membranes and phospholipid bilayer, nucleotides and amino acids. But that hardly touches the subject of evolution, natural selection, behaviour, mating and etc.
Biology actually branches out into various fields. A lot of people will think, "Oh biology! I'll take it to become a doctor!" On the contrary, biology leads into subjects such as "Human Biology" or "Biochemistry" which then you'll go into the field of medicine.
First year biology will actually focus much more on ecology and stuff like that, how animals evolved appendages, how they evolved mate calling and dancing etc. It's in second year where chemistry and biology merge into what people commonly see as "biology" and studies into medicine.
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Get a smart classmate to study with. It's usually better to work in a study group.
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Just to be clear at all the people picking apart my Chemistry is all about math statement, Organic Chemistry is usually two-three classes out of a chemistry major in university that is about 50-60% based on your knowledge of how to setup math problems. It looks like he knows the theory and is not setting up the problems correctly or solving them properly. I understand Organic Chemistry isn't about math, its about making chemistry jokes like the FERRIS WHEEL or MERCEDES BENZENE.
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I know how you feel. I took this entry level programming course and really enjoyed it. I understood everything in the class. However, I did terrible in it. I wasn't fast enough on the tests (containing 4 - 5 programming problems where you write the code by hand) and did badly on them.
I've noticed that many (most) asian students I've known study in a way that I consider sub-optimal. They seem to memorize things most of the time. For example, in writing a note sheet, if there are a couple "types" of problems that are going to be on the test (such as a specific stoichiometry problem or something) they will copy down examples from the book on that type of problem. Not that it is the wrong approach, many times they get better grades than most people, but I just consider it sub-optimal.
My strategy is to learn as little as possible. My goal in any class I take is to memorize and learn as little new material as possible. If I want to solve a problem, I start with a few fundamental equations and work myself up to the logic of the problem. I never write examples on my note sheets, only the basic equations. I usually do just as well (if not better than) students who laboriously study, and spend a lot less time.
Of course I didn't major in chemistry so I may be completely wrong here....wasn't into the biochem stuff at all :D
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EPT
