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I attend a club every sunday night at a church and have been doing so for a little more than a year. I was introduced to the club by my sister which is a real close friend to the group leader. I'm 19, sister 18 and the leader is 29.
To me, it has always been an ackward club to be in for some reason, I just don't really like it (i like the people in it, which is composed of about 12 people including children, youth, young adults and married people... i know, ackwards... but I don't agree with most of their ideals).
Now that I have been going to that group meeting for such a long time, for some reason the leader of the group (is a female) has developed this crazy thing about us; she's always telling us what to and what not to do. She for some reason thinks she has more authority over my sister than my mom and wants to do that with me too. But since I'm a pretty laid back and realistic person, I just find this offensive. My sister on the other hand, has submitted herself to her will and I'm not pleased at all.
The other day I brought my gf to the church. My gf and I are really close and we've been going out for such A LONG TIME, I'm pretty sure I'm going to marry her. So we met and everything seemed alright (and the usual ackwardness I've always felt) next day the leader comes up to me and tells me that I shouldn't go out with my gf because she thinks that "it is a distraction for me and she does not like her personality, so I should break up with her" (have in mind that the leader is almost 30 and has never had a bf is not married and never kissed let alone had sex with a guy)
This... pissed me off to hell. Who the hell does she think she is???? MY MOTHER??? EVEN MY MOTHER LOVES MY GF and now this ... I won't insult her... woman wants me to break up with the love of my life? FUCK OFF.
This is not the only thing she has COMMANDED me to do btw.
Next sunday we met, she prepared a whole 3 hour speech for the rest of the group on how they should come up to her if they gave a gf/bf so she can tell if she approves them to go out or not. WTF? This was spoken in front of people ranging from 9-30 years old (who the hell makes a group including people of those ages???) and as always they all nodded and agreed with her.
I've always been the "rebellious" person in the group for the fact that I don't do what she tells me to do. I have no respect for her anymore. She seems to now know that I'm a latino and she's an american. WE ARE DIFFERENT CULTURES. And the saddest thing is that my sister is becoming like her, my sister is always in constant argument with me, we can't be loving brother and sister like we used to, i still love her and do stuff for her, but she seems to be like... blind... and keeps on with the fighting/judging me for everything i do and always at the end, she tells me i should do 100% of what the group leader (her apparently best friend) tells me, she is a whole different person now, and i'm really sad.
More background on the group leader: She is a very lonely person, as I explained, she has never gone out with anybody and will be 30 in december. She made this group because she had no friends apparently and because of that she feels in power and thus kicks my ass around everywhere if she feels like it. Her best and only friends are my 18 year old sister, a 14 year old girl that acts like she's 40 and two 9 year old girls that should be in elementary school and in a children's group, not an adult one like this one. The leader of the group is also constantly talking about secret stuff which only the group leaders should know about (my sister and others) ALL THE TIME. EVERYTHING HAS TO BE A FUCKING SECRET. This is the reason many other adults have left the group before. SHE'S ALWAYS KEEPING STUFF CLASSIFIED and me, Josue, am not worthy of knowing what they talk about when the rest of the group is not around.
We can never talk about anything because of the age range difference and thus we waste those 3 hours of time every sunday night for apparently nothing. If we talk about sex there are children, so we mostly talk about gay childish shit and you guys know how a 19 year old latino that likes to party and gang around will respond to a fucking conversation that is about baby stuff.
I'm there only for my sister. I want her to be herself once again as she's becoming like the leader more and more everyday. You wouldn't believe it but, the leader of the group comes like 5 times a week to pick up my sister to a restaurant and talk more about secret shit. My sister leaked some information the other day (because she's becoming more immature and more bounded by the leader's ideals) and told us, THE ENTIRE FAMILY, that the meeting she had the other day was to talk about how the leader's husband will be, and otyher girly crap. She after realized what she had done and shut up (she gets really hyper and acts really immature thus stuff gets our of her mouth, i know its my sister and i love her with all my heart, but i want to know why is she becoming like this AND I DONT LIKE IT)
IF THE LEADER WANTS TO GET LAID FFS GO OUT AND TALK TO GUYS OR MEET WITH PEOPLE YOUR AGE DONT BE AFRAID TO HUG A GUY AND STOP MAKING GROUPS CONSISTING OF GIRLS 20 YEARS YOUNGER THAN YOU AND BRAINWASHING THEM TO BE LIKE YOU SO YOU DONT FEEL ALONE.
FUCK
Don't mess up other people's lives ffs, you did this to my sister and im willing do everything in my power to get her back. I swear.
What the fuck should i do guys? Please help me on this, this is the subject of my everyday life and I want it out if me. I don't want to wake up anymore to someone other than my parents odering me what to do. I want my sister back, i want the leader to chill out and make a group of a certain age group not 0 - 100 and only 10 people in it. I want her to stop fucking other people's lives.
Is this a mental disease? Or just depression? I want to know.
Please let's keep the offtopic to the minimum.
Forgive my unorganization of the blog, i'm mad and i spoke my mind so i wouldn't forget to type stuff in.
thanks.
  
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16993 Posts
Stop going to the club?
It seemed pretty obvious.
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I've considered that several times already.
But I can't man my sister is in there and I feel that if I leave, she will pretty much die to me. Also the leader will insult/make fun of me for the rest of my life and will convince the rest of the group (which are close friends) of that.
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Valhalla18444 Posts
just tell her that shit is none of her business
be polite about it
as for your sister, you can give her advice, but you shouldnt try to enforce anything cuz that aint cool. i know you care about her but she gotta make her own decisions
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She only has power because you guys give them to her, take it away.
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United States24701 Posts
I'd say leave the club and just make sure your parents are aware of what really goes on there, if that is an option. I know you want what's best for your sister, but she is an adult, and all you can do is offer her advice.
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Sounds like the club is on its way to becoming a cult!
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The thing is, if I talk to her and tell her all of this stuff, she will go "Mmm Hmm, mmm Hmm, ok, yes, ok, ok... We'll talk about it later, right now we gotta do this."
She doesn't listen.
I know my sister is an adult already, and I can just give her advice. But know that the leader is giving no advice to anyone, she's just giving orders and my sister submits herself to them.
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who does she think she is lol.
quit going to that retarded club, seriously fuck shit like that. no one controls your life but you man.
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You're going to a club at a church. That alone should have been setting off alarms. Everyone here is right, just leave. The fact that this wasn't immediately obvious to you shows how scary this little club is =/
As for the problem with your sister. I dunno man, girls can be difficult (well I guess people in general, but in my experience, girls) to get out of a rut when they've been set in their ways for awhile. If you try to reason with her and she refuses to listen, you might end up creating a hostility between the two of you. Decide if you're okay with that. Frankly, I think the best course of action is to stop going to the place, and wait for your sister to ask why, then tell her you think the leader is a manipulative piece of shit who is taking advantage of too many weak minded people. You sister will get offended, but at least she won't be able to pretend you're just trying to be an asshole to her, because she asked you.
Well I dunno... That actually seems to complex =/ Just tell your sister what you think and hope for the best.
EDIT: Tell your parents too. If they hear about your sister being ordered around by some stranger, believe me, they're gonna whoop that strangers ass 
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On October 31 2008 01:03 Rotodyne wrote:
Sounds like the club is on its way to becoming a cult!
Yeah this.
But well, just talk to your sister or maybe your parents. Since its a club in the church, why not talk to someone like the pastor or something?
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On October 31 2008 01:03 Rotodyne wrote:
Sounds like the club is on its way to becoming a cult!
this.
I was thinking the same thing. They are spellbound. She is a witch. Kill it with fire. Expose her for the powerhungry manipulator she is. If nobody listens----> O shit.
It seems the other people like having no control at all and have surrendered their free will.
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I'm concerned for your sister. Please pull her out, cuz this is bullshit and it is EXACTLY what the description of a cult is.
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Just leave man, that "club" is not going anyplace good, it's really scary stuff you are telling us. If you decide to stay learn how to effectively talk back to someone and make them "small". There are severaly ways to talk and act to lessen her "power" but I dont really got any links or examples to give you. This migh be dangerous and hard to do so just leave and talk to your parents about what the leader is up to.
EDIT:Found some examples, making a new post how you can try to "own" her.
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She sounds so batshit insane I seriously think she could be capable of murder.
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United States22883 Posts
On October 31 2008 00:56 EsX_Raptor wrote:
I've considered that several times already.
But I can't man my sister is in there and I feel that if I leave, she will pretty much die to me. Also the leader will insult/make fun of me for the rest of my life and will convince the rest of the group (which are close friends) of that.
I don't think you have a choice. You can't just stay in and "pull" her back like a game of tug of war. If your friends would do that, then they're retarded to begin with. My guess is there are other people who think she's fucking nuts but no one wants to be the first to leave.
I can't help but think of Jim Jones.
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Why the fuck are you there in the first place? If that group of dumb people like themselves to be bossed around, let them be. But why the fuck should you care? Well, ok, your sister...but you shouldn't have to be going there to suffer all this shit just because you're trying to get her out of there too.
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If she voices an idea or something you repeats that as your own and pretend she didnt say anything.
When she talks seem uninterested and go through some papers and yawn.
When she is trying to say something important you starts to giggle and say that she sounds like some cartoon character, have a funny accent or something like that. Works best if it is true.
Make plans and agreements with persons within the club that she dont know about. As alot of you are going to do some fun thing together and she get's told about it right before. Tell her that she should have tried to inform herself about the activity beforehand.
Talk to the others that you are suspicous about that she is single at that age and seems to hang out alot with girls. Claim that you suspect that she is a lesbian.
Whatever she does say it's bad. That she is lazy and slow or sloppy if she does it fast.
Good luck.
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MrHoon
10183 Posts
On October 31 2008 00:58 FakeSteve[TPR] wrote:
just tell her that shit is none of her business
be polite about it
as for your sister, you can give her advice, but you shouldnt try to enforce anything cuz that aint cool. i know you care about her but she gotta make her own decisions
this man knows about life, listen. This is the best advice I've read so far.
And remember, you gotta keep your cool the whole time when you explain to her.
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On October 31 2008 02:00 Eatme wrote:
If she voices an idea or something you repeats that as your own and pretend she didnt say anything.
When she talks seem uninterested and go through some papers and yawn.
When she is trying to say something important you starts to giggle and say that she sounds like some cartoon character, have a funny accent or something like that. Works best if it is true.
Make plans and agreements with persons within the club that she dont know about. As alot of you are going to do some fun thing together and she get's told about it right before. Tell her that she should have tried to inform herself about the activity beforehand.
Talk to the others that you are suspicous about that she is single at that age and seems to hang out alot with girls. Claim that you suspect that she is a lesbian.
Whatever she does say it's bad. That she is lazy and slow or sloppy if she does it fast.
Good luck.
This seems like a pretty neat idea. Try anything to fuck with her, make her look bad in front of the group and expose her. You really gotta rattle that cage to help people wake up but be subtle enough to not get kicked out of the group.
Be creative. 
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You should leave that club. You obviously hate it. And it's like full of controlling manipulative people it seems.
And you know what, screw that leader, she can make fun of you all he wants. That should be the least of your worries. You are getting on with your life, you are happy with your girlfriend.
Your sister needs to take care of herself. You still are her sibling. That will never ever change. And you can tell her why you left. It's your example that she will recognize she is probably in the wrong place.
Now there are probably cool people you know from the club too, but you don't have to be in the club to be their friends. The club is like an excuse, a little buffer zone, a tool. Get their phone numbers, call them up and have some Barbeque. Eff.
Does this make any sense to you?
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attend a club every sunday night at a church
This right here is your problem.
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Like other people said, this sounds like a cult. Don't drink the Kool-aid.
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lol @ people going "it's a cult." It just sounds like one lady who let a little influence get to her head. Or maybe she's genuinely concerned but she's overzealous and probably a bit misguided.
There's no need to be a dick about it and spread rumors and crap. FakeSteve's advice is the best in the thread.
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Yeah just stop going, its just stressing you out and not benefitting you in any way
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Russian Federation4235 Posts
Does your sister have parents? She must have a latino dad who must be unhappy with her puritanistic behavior, so I guess you shouldn't be taking all the responsibility on your shoulders, just make sure they recognize the problem and take action.
Contrary to what FakeSteve said, DON'T be polite with the bitch. She's definetely trying to delve into stuff noone is allowed to access, so your best bet is to tell her to fuck off in the most determined way possible, preferably, in front of an audience. Of course, you should first guarantee that your sister stops attending as well to prevent further distancing. Try to get the parents involved, force her, whatever, she is clearly not able to think on her own just now, thus needs your help. Consider it medicine - yes it hurts but it's benefical in a long run.
Diplomacy is a cool thing, but it's a mere tool, don't confuse is with a goal you should pursue. If you have nothing to gain from a specific person and that person annoys you, do something cruel.
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This is from my experience with my little sister:
It's like this, who are close to your sister?
Girls, they want someone to care about them, always do things like taking them to dinner, helping with homework, cooking, talk to them when they have problems... sharing secrets, small stuffs, but that's important
The leader is willing to do that, that's why ur sister got hooked. if you can do that kind of stuff better than your leader, your sister will trust you and follow your ideal.
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The fact that you call her 'the leader' is scary. Sounds like a cult to me. Get the fuck out dude.
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Grow balls. Present your grievances politely and openly in front of the club. Leave.
If your sister won't listen to you, her loss.
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What do you have to gain/lose/retain by obeying this cult leader?
What do you have to gain/lose/retain by leaving the cult?
Were I in your shoes, I'd pick my gf over the damn cult leader anytime, and as most people had stated, if your sister doesnt want to leave, let her be, its her choice. If you care about her, if shes happy with the group, cant you live with that?
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tell her to eff off, thats what everyone on this thread has been telling you. in a polite manner ofc.
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Get. The. Fuck. Out.
NOWWW!!!!!!
And make sure you take your sister with you, no matter what favours you need to call in or whatever the fuck you need to do. Make sure you bring your sister with you.
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If you care about her, if shes happy with the group, cant you live with that?
I dunno dude, he's basically guaranteeing himself serious baggage in the future if he doesn't stop this early. It's a matter of securing himself with a happy future... Not a lot of people can feel okay if they just let their younger sibling slip when they could have done something. The OP obviously isn't one of those people, even if you are.
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On October 31 2008 06:28 PsycHOTemplar wrote:Show nested quote +If you care about her, if shes happy with the group, cant you live with that? I dunno dude, he's basically guaranteeing himself serious baggage in the future if he doesn't stop this early. It's a matter of securing himself with a happy future... Not a lot of people can feel okay if they just let their younger sibling slip when they could have done something. The OP obviously isn't one of those people, even if you are.
True this.
I see many people saying you should just get out and leave your sister with some good advice. Fuck that. She's your sister and if you're the only one in a position to rationally pick apart the nature of this group then you have an obligation to really make your sister think twice about this group and specifically it's leader.
Your sister will eventually have to decide for herself but you should be there for her, on the other side of the spectrum from that woman, fighting her influence all the way. Don't let your sister waste away under some bs morals and ideals when she should be living.
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Thanks again for your support guys, I really needed to vent that out and seek some advice/help on this because honestly I'm going through it alone.
I just came back from the university (like 30 min ago) and the whole trip home was a discussion with my sister about that group, and what we do in there. I was winning the argument but she told me to stop, that she didn't want to listen to me anymore.
When I look back in time and see how my sis and I used to have fun together as siblings (which was since the beginning of our lives until like last year) I really start regretting ever meeting that person and her group guys, it's crazy how a single person can fuck someone's life this bad 
I will be seeing her once again this Sunday, will grow a pair and talk to her straight up about this for real.
I'll post back here to let you know about what happened, wish me luck.
thanks
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16993 Posts
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I went to talk to her, she indeed pulled me out of the crowd and sat me down in a chair and told me that she thought I didn't seem committed.
I said yes and that I've had some RL issues which had to be taken into consideration. She didn't care, she said that I had already committed and that I need to finish what I started.
My father yesterday noticed a change in my sister and when she went out of the car into the house he told me that someone must be putting something in her mind for her to be such a different person now, that she wasn't like this before. She was screaming to us the whole trip to the house defending the leader which we were talking about. Literally screaming her lungs out.
I feel I can't really do anything guys that leader is so mind controlling that when i sat to speak to her I couldn't really speak my mind... for some reason I just couldn't! (btw she didn't speak 1-1 to me, she brought a friend of hers... 6 years younger than her -.-)
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United States22883 Posts
Stop attending the group, Seriously, there's nothing else.
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YOU ARE DOING IT ALL WRONG ! ! !
I just came back from the university (like 30 min ago) and the whole trip home was a discussion with my sister about that group, and what we do in there. I was winning the argument but she told me to stop, that she didn't want to listen to me anymore.
I mean usually, it's impossible to talk logic with girl. Think emotionally. Probably she's feeling that this is a chance to prove herself/be independent. It's impossible to convince her now as she's being emotional/biased.
What i would do for the time being:
- Let she do what she want. Act normally but keep silent to her, silent is golden!
- You're also being emotional now so take sometime off to think about what happened.
After things calm down, proceed to the following step:
So, what your sister wants from that fucking group is:
- social activities
- recognitions
Now, what you can do is change her perspective. I don't know, host a picnic with your friends and take her with you. Traveling, sport, musics, art.... Open her eyes and let she decides if sticking with that cult is the best choice for her life. Provide her a chance to find out that she can have so much more fun/social activities/recognitions/independence else where. You know her hobbies so do what you think is best for her. Do it before it's too late.
+ Show Spoiler +If all things fail, then you have no choice but to accept it and move on
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It's really sad when a family is fighting with each other.
I'm really glad I don't have any fights with my family. I mean, there's been small little disagreements, but we never hated each other. We've beat the crap out of each other, but thats just how us men deal with things. Makes us better people.
Something that my church encourages in family's is to have weekly Family Home Evenings together. Like at least once a week, to spend time with one another, the mormon "standard" is like monday night.(it can really be on any day) Without all the distractions. Those are really important in family life, for any family really. because people progress and get happier when they can support each other, not be contentious. Or use guilt as a motivator. Guilt is terrible. Only through love can you expect things to get better. Keep talking with your parents. Just because you are an adult now and so is she, doesn't mean that you HAVE to be all alone now.
Just remember that you love your sister no matter what.
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I got out of that group on January 1st.
Now the chick's acting all bitch towards me and rubbing it in my face that my sister's still in there.
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Get her out of there - it's not any good for her obviously.
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lol @ the countless times i've tried to do that.
my parents are extreme and theyre always in control of us even though im 19 and her 18, this pisses her off hardcore and wants to feel independent, thus she resorts to this chick who treats her a little better than my parents (yet still treats her like shes a little dumby girl... but she dont realize it for some gay reason) and now i have an immature younger sister who likes to acts all independent and scream @ my parents.
edit: my sister's never had a bf and she started to INSANELY like this dude like a couple months ago and she's now been acting all childish 10 year old because of it.
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maybe it would be different if i were in your shoes but i think ignoring that woman would be the best course of action here? how is she in your face about your sister while you are out of the club?
if your parents are extreme and controlling then tell them about it. that woman should not be harassing you and your parents should be doing something about it. Also tell them about your sister, though they should already know. she's 18, if she makes stupid decisions and is involved in this cult, and screams to spite your parents they(being extreme) should kick her out of the house, no? let that woman financially support your sister please.
the connection between your parents always being extreme and controlling and this woman doing the same thing doesn't make sense to me.
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That 30 year old woman just has a serious inferiority complex. There's no real getting around that...so just avoid her as much as possible unless you want to get into a big blown up fight with her...though I don't recommend it.
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club sounds suspiciously similar to a personality cult. Eh?
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You're handling it the good way. Good luck!
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EPT
