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Belgium9950 Posts
Introduction
Age of 15. You read a relatively unknown book recommended by one of your close friends. As you start to read, it absorbs you. You get caught in it's strange but oh so familiar scenario. It has a way of looking at life that completely intrigues you. It changed your way of thinking, you feel enlightened. The book was perfect.
Eight years later, they announce a movie based on the novel you read when you were still a teenager. You reread it and extract more knowledge and values from it than you did when you were young.
Fourteen months later you arrive at the theatre an hour early, making sure you get a good seat. You are hungry, but refuse to buy pop corn as it may distract you too much. The movie starts. It sucks you in the same atmosphere the book did nine years before.
After two hours of an intense movie experience, you remain seated in the theatre and meditate about what you just witnessed.
The film was awesome, and you fully enjoyed it, but something was missing. It was made to mirror the book, and could therefor never transcend it's greatness. It could only disappoint. Through lack of depth, context and inspiring creativity.
StarCraft
StarCraft is a great game, and I doubt anyone on this website will deny that. Many of you will even claim StarCraft is perfect, a flawless game.
StarCraft 2 is being developped as a sequel, trying to combine the old SC1 gameplay with new additions and innovations. It's trying to copy the elements that made the original game such a success, while introducing more modern RTS functions and graphics to make the game compete with other similar games in the stores today.
The problem? As long as StarCraft 2 is being developped to follow up our beloved game, it will always be in it's shadow.
What StarCraft 2 needs is more creativity, making it a stand alone game. Blizzard shouldn't be afraid to scare away the hardcore fans of the original game. They should make a completely new game, based off refreshing new foundations.
That's the only way SC2 will never become 'the easy version of SC'.
That's the only way they can win the hearts of the hardcore fans, showing the same creativity they did when making SC1, instead of reapplying the old ideas to create a raped version of StarCraft 1.
Oh well, those were some random thoughts. Please excuse me of my bad English writing style.
Discuss.
 
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United States24799 Posts
It's not guaranteed that a sequel to a good game can't be strongly based on it, yet better. Although it is pretty common for the better sequels to be changed more from the original....
I think what you are suggesting will happen, will actually happen, but not because it is inherent to the situation... just because it will work out that way.
On September 14 2008 23:41 RaGe wrote:
You are hungry, but refuse to buy pop corn as it may distract you too much. The movie starts. It sucks you in the same atmosphere the book did nine years before.
I'm not sure about Belgium, but where I live the main motivation not to buy popcorn is that it's about three times too expensive in the theater XD
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I completely completely disagree
starcraft is the best RTS ever made, after 10 years people still love it, there is no other RTS thats like it, so why wouldnt you want them to be similar?
if you want it completely different from sc, you're basically just asking for a different game with starcraft 2. If you can ignore the lore aspect, there are plenty of other games like that out already waiting for you to play
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Rage, I couldn't agree more. I hope Dustin B. and the Dev. team sees this, but I'm almost certain they never will unless you tell them personally.
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United States24799 Posts
This is one of those threads (like the Bisu vs Savior prediction thread) where it will be fun in a year or two to quote from it. I'm definitely remember what people say here!
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I agree 110%. Whenever anyone I know complains about a Starcraft 2 implementation, saying that it would change the game and it wouldn't feel like Starcraft anymore, I say good, because it's a completely different game. If all that was going to be changed/added was a few new units and abilities it'd be just an expansion pack, not a new game.
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Belgium9950 Posts
On September 15 2008 00:01 fusionsdf wrote:
I completely completely disagree
starcraft is the best RTS ever made, after 10 years people still love it, there is no other RTS thats like it, so why wouldnt you want them to be similar?
if you want it completely different from sc, you're basically just asking for a different game with starcraft 2. If you can ignore the lore aspect, there are plenty of other games like that out already waiting for you to play
-Well, what I was trying to point out in this article was that basing it on a successful formula while adding changes, will definately result in a good game, a decent product, but it will be in the shadows of SC1 which has the same things except for "the annoying changes".
-I think Blizzard should play it a bit riskier and try to make a new game like they did when they made SC1. It could completely fail, but it could also deliver us the same brilliance in a new package.
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MrHoon
10183 Posts
Honestly this is what will happen on first day of starcraft 2.
1) Huge Hype
2) Everyone waits in line, buys one and runs home and installs
3) Everyone cheat codes single player/goes to battlenet for no apparent reason
4) People will complain "WTF DIS GAEM IZ UNBALNCD"
5) Countless threads of "WORLD OF WARCRAFT MADE BLIZZARD MAKE SHITTY GAMES"
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South Africa4316 Posts
I disagree with you. as micronesia said, fundamentally rather than practically. Firstly, your example uses two different mediums (film vs book), and in my opinion, books always have a longer lasting value. SC and SC2 are both the same medium, so it would be more fair to compare it with sequels of the same genre.
Secondly, many games surpass their originals, for instance Diablo 2, to me at least, was a much more complete game than Diablo 1. Hopefully we'll be able to say te same about SC2. A game that is designed as a sequel does not necessarily have to be worse than the original.
You say that Blizzard must move away from the fundamentals of SC, but look at a gaming series like HoMM. HoMM 1
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South Africa4316 Posts
I disagree with you. as micronesia said, fundamentally rather than practically. Firstly, your example uses two different mediums (film vs book), and in my opinion, books always have a longer lasting value. SC and SC2 are both the same medium, so it would be more fair to compare it with sequels of the same genre.
Secondly, many games surpass their originals, for instance Diablo 2, to me at least, was a much more complete game than Diablo 1. Hopefully we'll be able to say te same about SC2. A game that is designed as a sequel does not necessarily have to be worse than the original.
You say that Blizzard must move away from the fundamentals of SC, but look at a gaming series like HoMM. HoMM 1 was good, HoMM 2 was a much much more complete game, and better. HoMM 4 was built on different foundations, and even though I love it, I know it is widely regarded as the worst game in the series. Another example is Warcraft 3. Starcraft was something of an improvement on Warcraft 2, but Warcraft 3 had different fundamentals. It's a good game, but it's no Starcraft or successor to Starcraft.
Like I said in the begining, I'm not arguing with you about the way it's going to end up, it might very well end up like you say it will. If it is like you say, however, I think the fault will lie with the game itself and not with the way in which the game was designed.
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Rage, I think this belongs in the SC2 Section or even the Featured Section to get some debate going.
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sc2 , well , sc2 , the doubt, the misinformation, the misunderstoodment, the anticipation, the weigh of the starcraft title...
there is no doubt that it will be a big e-sport title...
but will it be as important as brood war?
will it allow the same mind-games warfare?
will it create great rivalries?
will it require constant ability peak to its players?
will it require the same or more multitask than broodwar?
honestly? i really fear Blizzard has taken the wrong way with sc2...
but only time will tell, will sc2 became a treason or a gift?!
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Best case scenario: SC2 is just as good as SC (if not better) and there is a smooth transition for all BW players, especially pro SC players into SC2.
Worst case scenario: SC2 is a really good game but not as good as SC or doesn't have the right draw, the community splits into SC2 players and SC1 players, and neither SC1 or SC2 will be as big as BW currently is.
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United States24799 Posts
On September 15 2008 03:16 Ideas wrote:
Worst case scenario: SC2 is a really good game but not as good as SC or doesn't have the right draw, the community splits into SC2 players and SC1 players, and neither SC1 or SC2 will be as big as BW currently is.
Unfortunately this is not even close to the worst case scenario lol.
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Starcraft (unless im much mistaken) took years of tweaking and patching to make it the great, very well balanced game it is. I have no doubts what so ever that Starcraft 2 (when coming out) will need many patches and stuff to make it "playable". few years after the release of Sc2 im pretty sure it will be equal 2 Starcraft if not better.
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was there an actual starcraft movie?
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On September 15 2008 03:26 micronesia wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2008 03:16 Ideas wrote:
Worst case scenario: SC2 is a really good game but not as good as SC or doesn't have the right draw, the community splits into SC2 players and SC1 players, and neither SC1 or SC2 will be as big as BW currently is. Unfortunately this is not even close to the worst case scenario lol.
God forbid, worst case scenario for an RTS is when a UMS game comes out on moar people end up playing that than the real game...
Oh wait.
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WC3 ladder was not fun at all =[
that's not a legitimate comparison D:
edit: WC3 would be so fun if shit still didn't die after fighting for 10 years ... make macro more important with larger armies that die faster and no upkeep -_-
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On September 15 2008 03:26 micronesia wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2008 03:16 Ideas wrote:
Worst case scenario: SC2 is a really good game but not as good as SC or doesn't have the right draw, the community splits into SC2 players and SC1 players, and neither SC1 or SC2 will be as big as BW currently is. Unfortunately this is not even close to the worst case scenario lol.
What do you think it would be?
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United States24799 Posts
On September 15 2008 06:39 Ideas wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2008 03:26 micronesia wrote:On September 15 2008 03:16 Ideas wrote:
Worst case scenario: SC2 is a really good game but not as good as SC or doesn't have the right draw, the community splits into SC2 players and SC1 players, and neither SC1 or SC2 will be as big as BW currently is. Unfortunately this is not even close to the worst case scenario lol. What do you think it would be?
I have no idea what the worst case scenario would be..... but for starters how about the game is horribly imbalanced and no matter how much the patch it... it remains imbalanced an incompatible with high level competitive play. Or maybe it will mutate into a sentient existence via the internet and will slowly brainwash the masses using subliminal messages and brute force brainwashing in the form of 'Thisiscombatexbringingyouanotherfpvod' etc.
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Holy Smokes! Its the Lord Of the Rings all over again! Or the Godfather!
I personaly loved Godfather III, The plot was completely different and the whole atmosphere was modern, business like, Father-Daughter relationship based. It was not the brutal swings, betrayal, underground racket and loyalty anymore.
But I loved it! Not in the oldschool jawdropping Godfather I way, but in a new, modern and more contemporary Godfather III way!
And I sure do hope that Starcraft II will like be the third of Godfather's.
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There's just some things that shouldn't have sequels, imo. Is Starcraft one of them? Perhaps, though SC2 could bring a lot of unique opportunities to e-sports.
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Lol. There's absolutely no reason to say StarCraft 2 can't be better simply because it resembles its predecessor. The more videos I watch, the more differences I'm seeing between the two. I think your perception of how similar they are is inaccurate.
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On September 15 2008 06:47 micronesia wrote:+ Show Spoiler +On September 15 2008 06:39 Ideas wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2008 03:26 micronesia wrote:On September 15 2008 03:16 Ideas wrote:
Worst case scenario: SC2 is a really good game but not as good as SC or doesn't have the right draw, the community splits into SC2 players and SC1 players, and neither SC1 or SC2 will be as big as BW currently is. Unfortunately this is not even close to the worst case scenario lol. What do you think it would be? I have no idea what the worst case scenario would be..... but for starters how about the game is horribly imbalanced and no matter how much the patch it... it remains imbalanced an incompatible with high level competitive play. Or maybe it will mutate into a sentient existence via the internet and will slowly brainwash the masses using subliminal messages and brute force brainwashing in the form of 'Thisiscombatexbringingyouanotherfpvod' etc.
If SC2 turns out to be crap, everyone will just go back to SC1 (like when WC3 came out). But if it turns out to be almost as good, I think that will be a lot worse the community because both games well be competing against each other, and the community will be split with neither side being as big as SC is now.
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On September 15 2008 06:47 micronesia wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2008 06:39 Ideas wrote:On September 15 2008 03:26 micronesia wrote:On September 15 2008 03:16 Ideas wrote:
Worst case scenario: SC2 is a really good game but not as good as SC or doesn't have the right draw, the community splits into SC2 players and SC1 players, and neither SC1 or SC2 will be as big as BW currently is. Unfortunately this is not even close to the worst case scenario lol. What do you think it would be? I have no idea what the worst case scenario would be..... but for starters how about the game is horribly imbalanced and no matter how much the patch it... it remains imbalanced an incompatible with high level competitive play. Or maybe it will mutate into a sentient existence via the internet and will slowly brainwash the masses using subliminal messages and brute force brainwashing in the form of 'Thisiscombatexbringingyouanotherfpvod' etc.
or they pull a duke nukem forever.
that would suck.
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On September 15 2008 05:19 paper wrote:
WC3 ladder was not fun at all =[
that's not a legitimate comparison D:
edit: WC3 would be so fun if shit still didn't die after fighting for 10 years ... make macro more important with larger armies that die faster and no upkeep -_-
Ya I agree. Way too much HP and shit in that game so slow going ;(
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I say blizzard needs to put a new race in SC2. WHOS WITH ME!!!
I bet they're doing it in secrecy then when they release sc2 it will be insane promotion, "OMG SC2 has new race omgomgogmomgg!!!"
I wish....
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United States24799 Posts
On September 15 2008 11:41 Jonoman92 wrote:
I say blizzard needs to put a new race in SC2. WHOS WITH ME!!!
I bet they're doing it in secrecy then when they release sc2 it will be insane promotion, "OMG SC2 has new race omgomgogmomgg!!!"
I wish....
Ok, I'll play you in all the horribly imbalanced matchups lol.
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United States889 Posts
I lived in Belgium for three years. I never could do the sugar on the popcorn at the Atomium.
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I agree
Starcraft: Ghost woulda been cool
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Belgium9950 Posts
On September 15 2008 12:27 Arrian wrote:
I lived in Belgium for three years. I never could do the sugar on the popcorn at the Atomium.
lol what?
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United States889 Posts
On September 16 2008 01:38 RaGe wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2008 12:27 Arrian wrote:
I lived in Belgium for three years. I never could do the sugar on the popcorn at the Atomium. lol what?
The discussion of movies in the OP prompted my tangential contribution. At least when I went (96ish) they put sugar on the popcorn. I can't eat popcorn with sugar on it. That is all.
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Partially true.
On the other hand, blizzard north is gone, so I'm not exactly confident in their ability to make a competitive game.
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Valhalla18444 Posts
On September 15 2008 04:57 CommanderFluffy wrote:Show nested quote +On September 15 2008 03:26 micronesia wrote:On September 15 2008 03:16 Ideas wrote:
Worst case scenario: SC2 is a really good game but not as good as SC or doesn't have the right draw, the community splits into SC2 players and SC1 players, and neither SC1 or SC2 will be as big as BW currently is. Unfortunately this is not even close to the worst case scenario lol. moar
don't do this
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EPT
