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So, still working bit by bit on my little game project. I've found that the more I try to figure out how to do stuff, the more I seem to tunnel-vision on to one aspect, and as a result I don't seem to move forward much. More than anything, I've found that i'm now at a loss as to what I actually want to make happen in this game. I've got some fancy little gravity-changing things going on, but unless I manage to make fairly good AI or implement online multiplayer (neither is impossible for a newbie like me, but would take significant time) I don't have any ideas that seem like they'd be fun.
Current ideas that I think are viable to implement without SO much time.
-Balls or something that move along a set path, objectives are other balls that you move character to in order to capture; enemy balls increase in number/speed(?) as you capture more of the other ballz.
-Simple multiplayer? I've learned a lot about networking and stuff so to be honest I know more than the average joe about network connections, so once I figure out how exactly to script that kind of thing, this might not be too hard. But it will be very time consuming to figure out
-Guantlet style game, have something constantly chasing by moving directly at you (stupid AI) and force you to jump around through traps and stuff maybe. This might be hard because of actual level design in 3d space.
Another thing that's on my list of to-do for this game is to find models to use... I'm probably going to look for some free to use ones for the moment, as placeholders at the very least. It gets hard to guage how much I've actually progressed when all I see are cubes and rectangles littered throughout my screen.
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There are two golden rules about game programming in my mind after doing it for 15 years (started at 9 years old) and never accomplishing anything great, although I got really good at making engines 
1. The hardest part about coding a game is actually finishing it.
2. Making a popular game is like putting a blind-fold on and throwing darts at a wall until you hit the bullseye.
You have to realise that the only indie developers you know are the ones that are successful, you don't know about the hundreds of thousands of aspiring developers that didn't get anywhere.
How many indie developers do you know that planned out to be successful? I'd say almost none of them. Just look at VVVVVV.
With these points in mind my best advice to you is stop caring about what your game is gonna be, those are for game companies.
The most important thing is to just do something, the more you stop, the harder it gets to start again. Its not hard to change later down the track. Get a rhythm going and make sure you are completing features at a steady pace, I call it the "DONE... NEXT!" strategy.
You're also going to find yourself hitting "the great wall of lost interest" many times and feel like you would have an easier time using another library or another language or another type of game, the problem is this is how you end up having 100 unfinished projects and all that does is leave you with a feeling of un-accomplishment and you are more likely to do it again. Once you push past this wall you will find renewed interest to keep going.
![[image loading]](https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSVWVIvym-GoldJM_lpfDRRjuHBWNjSvkZkAfbVQeawy9SyhJsi)
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Hmmm, kinda not in the same boat as you guys, kinda in the same boat atm. I just really grinded hard on network programming because I knew just as much as the average joe about it two weeks ago. Now I look into threading, I know that optimizing your game comes last, but I think big and want to make sure I implement my engine really scaleable, so I already want to have data structures and functional blocks that later can be easily multithreaded if need be.
I have a very clear idea of what my game is going to be and am willing to put in many month of work to make it the way I envision it. I try to do everything on my own for now, just for more control of my prototype, even though I am not that interrested in coding. And Sluggaslamoo, I so plan on being successful, talk to you in a year :D.
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On October 22 2013 22:10 sluggaslamoo wrote:+ Show Spoiler +There are two golden rules about game programming in my mind after doing it for 15 years (started at 9 years old) and never accomplishing anything great, although I got really good at making engines 1. The hardest part about coding a game is actually finishing it. 2. Making a popular game is like putting a blind-fold on and throwing darts at a wall until you hit the bullseye. You have to realise that the only indie developers you know are the ones that are successful, you don't know about the hundreds of thousands of aspiring developers that didn't get anywhere. How many indie developers do you know that planned out to be successful? I'd say almost none of them. Just look at VVVVVV. With these points in mind my best advice to you is stop caring about what your game is gonna be, those are for game companies. The most important thing is to just do something, the more you stop, the harder it gets to start again. Its not hard to change later down the track. Get a rhythm going and make sure you are completing features at a steady pace, I call it the "DONE... NEXT!" strategy. You're also going to find yourself hitting "the great wall of lost interest" many times and feel like you would have an easier time using another library or another language or another type of game, the problem is this is how you end up having 100 unfinished projects and all that does is leave you with a feeling of un-accomplishment and you are more likely to do it again. Once you push past this wall you will find renewed interest to keep going.
I can relate with so much of the stuff you just said. Many a time have I said "This... This is the one I'm going to finish!". But it never is... At least my current project is going smoothly so far. Wonder how long that'll last.
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Remember to have "smart" goals! (Specific, measurable, attainable, relevant, and time-bound)
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On October 22 2013 23:29 Chezus wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2013 22:10 sluggaslamoo wrote:+ Show Spoiler +There are two golden rules about game programming in my mind after doing it for 15 years (started at 9 years old) and never accomplishing anything great, although I got really good at making engines 1. The hardest part about coding a game is actually finishing it. 2. Making a popular game is like putting a blind-fold on and throwing darts at a wall until you hit the bullseye. You have to realise that the only indie developers you know are the ones that are successful, you don't know about the hundreds of thousands of aspiring developers that didn't get anywhere. How many indie developers do you know that planned out to be successful? I'd say almost none of them. Just look at VVVVVV. With these points in mind my best advice to you is stop caring about what your game is gonna be, those are for game companies. The most important thing is to just do something, the more you stop, the harder it gets to start again. Its not hard to change later down the track. Get a rhythm going and make sure you are completing features at a steady pace, I call it the "DONE... NEXT!" strategy. You're also going to find yourself hitting "the great wall of lost interest" many times and feel like you would have an easier time using another library or another language or another type of game, the problem is this is how you end up having 100 unfinished projects and all that does is leave you with a feeling of un-accomplishment and you are more likely to do it again. Once you push past this wall you will find renewed interest to keep going. I can relate with so much of the stuff you just said. Many a time have I said "This... This is the one I'm going to finish!". But it never is... At least my current project is going smoothly so far. Wonder how long that'll last.
LOL I have echoed that exact same quote in my head about 100 times :<
These days I realise that things are much more time consuming than they seem on the surface, so I've been doing much simpler stuff although not exactly oriented around games, like writing open-source libraries for ruby, and actually finishing them.
What always bogged me down was assets, I spent hours looking for the right song or creating art-assets and then realise that I wanna do a 3D game because with my retarded logic I believe the whole process will be easier because animations are easier than drawing 2D frames, so I make a 3d engine, from scratch, and then realise I don't have the money to actually get decent 3d assets, so I start again, from scratch... in an entirely new language... because it seems easier... and I have a better idea for a game and that somehow justifies starting again from scratch in a new language. I guess the silver lining is that now I can program proficiently in 20 different languages but still.
Sometimes I actually got a playable working prototype, built from scratch, and an engine people would actually much prefer over those on the market, but I'm just too lazy to release the code. I think game programming just causes you to become insane, you end up using some seriously twisted logic to justify some of your actions that you would never do if you just took a break for a while.
Although all this was in my early teens, I'm a lot more realistic and disciplined now, but I still have 70+ original engines of unfinished projects from those times .
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thanks for the responses, and I'll definitely keep in mind a the stuff you mentioned sluggaslamoo xD.Yeah, i really don't plan on making anything big and popular, but something real simple is really what I should try to do for now. The only reason I was really trying to think of what to do was so that I could at least work towards a solid goal of what to finish making
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On October 23 2013 11:12 sluggaslamoo wrote:Show nested quote +On October 22 2013 23:29 Chezus wrote:On October 22 2013 22:10 sluggaslamoo wrote:+ Show Spoiler +There are two golden rules about game programming in my mind after doing it for 15 years (started at 9 years old) and never accomplishing anything great, although I got really good at making engines 1. The hardest part about coding a game is actually finishing it. 2. Making a popular game is like putting a blind-fold on and throwing darts at a wall until you hit the bullseye. You have to realise that the only indie developers you know are the ones that are successful, you don't know about the hundreds of thousands of aspiring developers that didn't get anywhere. How many indie developers do you know that planned out to be successful? I'd say almost none of them. Just look at VVVVVV. With these points in mind my best advice to you is stop caring about what your game is gonna be, those are for game companies. The most important thing is to just do something, the more you stop, the harder it gets to start again. Its not hard to change later down the track. Get a rhythm going and make sure you are completing features at a steady pace, I call it the "DONE... NEXT!" strategy. You're also going to find yourself hitting "the great wall of lost interest" many times and feel like you would have an easier time using another library or another language or another type of game, the problem is this is how you end up having 100 unfinished projects and all that does is leave you with a feeling of un-accomplishment and you are more likely to do it again. Once you push past this wall you will find renewed interest to keep going. I can relate with so much of the stuff you just said. Many a time have I said "This... This is the one I'm going to finish!". But it never is... At least my current project is going smoothly so far. Wonder how long that'll last. LOL I have echoed that exact same quote in my head about 100 times :< These days I realise that things are much more time consuming than they seem on the surface, so I've been doing much simpler stuff although not exactly oriented around games, like writing open-source libraries for ruby, and actually finishing them. What always bogged me down was assets, I spent hours looking for the right song or creating art-assets and then realise that I wanna do a 3D game because with my retarded logic I believe the whole process will be easier because animations are easier than drawing 2D frames, so I make a 3d engine, from scratch, and then realise I don't have the money to actually get decent 3d assets, so I start again, from scratch... in an entirely new language... because it seems easier... and I have a better idea for a game and that somehow justifies starting again from scratch in a new language. I guess the silver lining is that now I can program proficiently in 20 different languages but still. Sometimes I actually got a playable working prototype, built from scratch, and an engine people would actually much prefer over those on the market, but I'm just too lazy to release the code. I think game programming just causes you to become insane, you end up using some seriously twisted logic to justify some of your actions that you would never do if you just took a break for a while. Although all this was in my early teens, I'm a lot more realistic and disciplined now, but I still have 70+ original engines of unfinished projects from those times .
How did you learn to make engines in your teens? :o
I'm personally doing a ton of small side projects every now and then, but they are all pretty simple. Never done anything like a whole engine, I wouldn't even know where to start other than "Ok... here's some variables.. uhh.... yeah. About that engine...."
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On October 23 2013 21:22 3FFA wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2013 11:12 sluggaslamoo wrote:On October 22 2013 23:29 Chezus wrote:On October 22 2013 22:10 sluggaslamoo wrote:+ Show Spoiler +There are two golden rules about game programming in my mind after doing it for 15 years (started at 9 years old) and never accomplishing anything great, although I got really good at making engines 1. The hardest part about coding a game is actually finishing it. 2. Making a popular game is like putting a blind-fold on and throwing darts at a wall until you hit the bullseye. You have to realise that the only indie developers you know are the ones that are successful, you don't know about the hundreds of thousands of aspiring developers that didn't get anywhere. How many indie developers do you know that planned out to be successful? I'd say almost none of them. Just look at VVVVVV. With these points in mind my best advice to you is stop caring about what your game is gonna be, those are for game companies. The most important thing is to just do something, the more you stop, the harder it gets to start again. Its not hard to change later down the track. Get a rhythm going and make sure you are completing features at a steady pace, I call it the "DONE... NEXT!" strategy. You're also going to find yourself hitting "the great wall of lost interest" many times and feel like you would have an easier time using another library or another language or another type of game, the problem is this is how you end up having 100 unfinished projects and all that does is leave you with a feeling of un-accomplishment and you are more likely to do it again. Once you push past this wall you will find renewed interest to keep going. I can relate with so much of the stuff you just said. Many a time have I said "This... This is the one I'm going to finish!". But it never is... At least my current project is going smoothly so far. Wonder how long that'll last. LOL I have echoed that exact same quote in my head about 100 times :< These days I realise that things are much more time consuming than they seem on the surface, so I've been doing much simpler stuff although not exactly oriented around games, like writing open-source libraries for ruby, and actually finishing them. What always bogged me down was assets, I spent hours looking for the right song or creating art-assets and then realise that I wanna do a 3D game because with my retarded logic I believe the whole process will be easier because animations are easier than drawing 2D frames, so I make a 3d engine, from scratch, and then realise I don't have the money to actually get decent 3d assets, so I start again, from scratch... in an entirely new language... because it seems easier... and I have a better idea for a game and that somehow justifies starting again from scratch in a new language. I guess the silver lining is that now I can program proficiently in 20 different languages but still. Sometimes I actually got a playable working prototype, built from scratch, and an engine people would actually much prefer over those on the market, but I'm just too lazy to release the code. I think game programming just causes you to become insane, you end up using some seriously twisted logic to justify some of your actions that you would never do if you just took a break for a while. Although all this was in my early teens, I'm a lot more realistic and disciplined now, but I still have 70+ original engines of unfinished projects from those times . How did you learn to make engines in your teens? :o I'm personally doing a ton of small side projects every now and then, but they are all pretty simple. Never done anything like a whole engine, I wouldn't even know where to start other than "Ok... here's some variables.. uhh.... yeah. About that engine...."
I guess you just start off with a thought like: "Time to learn OpenGL/Direct3D" or something. Then to actually make that useful you kinda figure you need some way to load images, so you add a library like libpng and before you know it you're coding an entire engine. At least that's my story :D.
I have a friend who keeps dragging me in to his engine projects. He always seems to come up with new ideas to improve his engine, and instead of rewriting his engine he finds it easier to just rewrite the engine in its entirety. We never seem to use our own engines over existing ones. But I guess the experience is really helpful. It just doesn't really show on a CV, unless you release it, or start blogging about bits and pieces.
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On October 23 2013 21:22 3FFA wrote:Show nested quote +On October 23 2013 11:12 sluggaslamoo wrote:On October 22 2013 23:29 Chezus wrote:On October 22 2013 22:10 sluggaslamoo wrote:+ Show Spoiler +There are two golden rules about game programming in my mind after doing it for 15 years (started at 9 years old) and never accomplishing anything great, although I got really good at making engines 1. The hardest part about coding a game is actually finishing it. 2. Making a popular game is like putting a blind-fold on and throwing darts at a wall until you hit the bullseye. You have to realise that the only indie developers you know are the ones that are successful, you don't know about the hundreds of thousands of aspiring developers that didn't get anywhere. How many indie developers do you know that planned out to be successful? I'd say almost none of them. Just look at VVVVVV. With these points in mind my best advice to you is stop caring about what your game is gonna be, those are for game companies. The most important thing is to just do something, the more you stop, the harder it gets to start again. Its not hard to change later down the track. Get a rhythm going and make sure you are completing features at a steady pace, I call it the "DONE... NEXT!" strategy. You're also going to find yourself hitting "the great wall of lost interest" many times and feel like you would have an easier time using another library or another language or another type of game, the problem is this is how you end up having 100 unfinished projects and all that does is leave you with a feeling of un-accomplishment and you are more likely to do it again. Once you push past this wall you will find renewed interest to keep going. I can relate with so much of the stuff you just said. Many a time have I said "This... This is the one I'm going to finish!". But it never is... At least my current project is going smoothly so far. Wonder how long that'll last. LOL I have echoed that exact same quote in my head about 100 times :< These days I realise that things are much more time consuming than they seem on the surface, so I've been doing much simpler stuff although not exactly oriented around games, like writing open-source libraries for ruby, and actually finishing them. What always bogged me down was assets, I spent hours looking for the right song or creating art-assets and then realise that I wanna do a 3D game because with my retarded logic I believe the whole process will be easier because animations are easier than drawing 2D frames, so I make a 3d engine, from scratch, and then realise I don't have the money to actually get decent 3d assets, so I start again, from scratch... in an entirely new language... because it seems easier... and I have a better idea for a game and that somehow justifies starting again from scratch in a new language. I guess the silver lining is that now I can program proficiently in 20 different languages but still. Sometimes I actually got a playable working prototype, built from scratch, and an engine people would actually much prefer over those on the market, but I'm just too lazy to release the code. I think game programming just causes you to become insane, you end up using some seriously twisted logic to justify some of your actions that you would never do if you just took a break for a while. Although all this was in my early teens, I'm a lot more realistic and disciplined now, but I still have 70+ original engines of unfinished projects from those times . How did you learn to make engines in your teens? :o I'm personally doing a ton of small side projects every now and then, but they are all pretty simple. Never done anything like a whole engine, I wouldn't even know where to start other than "Ok... here's some variables.. uhh.... yeah. About that engine...."
Well from 9 I was doing tutorials of VB6 cds and making point and click games (yeah I know it sucks but I didn't have internet back then and it was the only thing I had). Then started with mirage source near the very end of primary school after I had internet. I started editing the code and eventually figured out how it was made.
I was only allowed to use the computer on weekends so I would spend the entire week thinking up ideas, and then wake up at 7 every saturday/sunday morning, spend the entire day programming till late at night and leave my chair only for bare necessities, a lot of the time I wouldn't eat for the entire day.
So then I started making my own online rpg engines in VB6, they were terrible, but worth the experience. I knew how to write inefficient netcode and graphics operations, "paperdoll" was like the bees knees of 2d rpg engines back then so it made me really proud when I figured out how to do that. They were playable but a mere shadow of a full game, and mostly just mapeditor, netcode, audio and basic game mechanics. Basically people could log on and interact with other people, attack other people, and make maps and npcs .
Once I got to 15-16 I became an engine making machine, hell I never finished a game, but damn could I make a 2D engine from scratch fast. My character save files were no longer .INI files, Netcode used manipulated bits instead of strings, and my graphics code was hardware accelerated. I had about 50+ unfinished engines by that time, and was up to doing 2.5D engines using DirectX and vb6. Then I started learning how to write terrible Java code because OO was so hard to understand, but Jogl seemed really cool and allowed me to write 3d games for the browser so I was up to doing that.
Then I actually got to uni and took it really seriously, I read 10+ books on OO alone, and wrote a 56 page journal (I had to choose programming as an elective because I was in a business management course). Then I felt depressed because I spent 10 years learning only 10% of what I learned in 6 months.
I no longer had time to make the behemoth engines I did in the past though, probably one good thing about that though is that it has made me much more realistic and disciplined when I start programming projects, which has had the side effect of making me actually able to hit these milestones. These days I set my goal for very small prototypes, and then once I finish that ill do a little bit more, instead of "ok I want to remake Guild Wars, lets start with OpenGL". Its funny how the more limited your time is, the more you seem to get out of it.
Sorry I didn't mean to write my entire life story in someone else blog I only intended to write a paragraph at first, guess I'm really bored at work.
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Now that was a very interesting read. Most people told me to stick with small things first and eventually I would build up to things like big RPGs after lots of time. Thing is, while I know perfectly how to make these small things and know multiple languages now while feeling relatively adept at learning new languages I have yet to even know where to start with making something actually big and intensive with what I know.
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EPT
