EPTBe a contributor to e-sports not a negative cynic. - Page 2
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Kuni
Austria765 Posts
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MasterOfPuppets
Romania6942 Posts
On January 14 2013 00:52 Nimitz.no wrote: Starcraft is here to stay and I write this in frustration with the negative posts that occur from time to time in the forums. The latest one is "Is HOTS worth it". We all know it, so why do some people act like rats on a sinking ship when the ship is quite safe as it is. So you do not entertain, even for a single second, the possibility that some of us do not agree with direction in which HotS is heading? Are we not allowed to have an opinion of our own with regards to what games we choose to buy, play and support? Fair enough, I guess this is your first step in how to be a contributor to "e-sports". Moving right along... On January 14 2013 00:52 Nimitz.no wrote: This is why: When you ask this question and talk constant about how SC2 has no future you contribute to limit the immediate growth of e-sports. Yes you are outright hurting the community you love. I'm fairly sure this "community you love" you speak of has existed long before SC2 and will probably exist after it as well. And I would have maintained the same position even without TL picking up a DotA 2 team and investing time and effort into that particular game. But this is just a nitpick. Moving on... On January 14 2013 00:52 Nimitz.no wrote: Talking and discussing the direction of the game to help Blizzard take the right decisions and other players to improve their play are all good and well. However the constant whine about the game itself as in having no place in e-sports, it is just plain destructive. So what you are saying is that we should not give feedback to Blizzard to attempt to help them make the game that supposedly we love BETTER? For the enjoyment of both players and spectators? We should just the fuck up and let Blizzard do whatever they have in mind because that has turned out very well throughout the past 2 and a half years right? AM I RIGHT GUYS? (more on this later) Moving on... On January 14 2013 00:52 Nimitz.no wrote: Sponsors and players are reading this and making decisions based upon the public opinion. It is common knowledge that those who play and are happy doesn't make posts. It is the other half who does and by doing so dominate the media with destructive information, as mentioned before, limits the immediate growth. This can be compared to the stock-marked as well. Would you as a possible investor/buyer invest in stocks which are flooded with negative information ? the information is not from reliable sources but they are the only sources available to you. Personally I like to believe in meritocracy. That is to say, I will support the people and things that I believe deserve my support the most. On January 14 2013 00:52 Nimitz.no wrote: Again it is super to discuss tactic and strategy, but to attack the game itself in frustration based upon lack of success or balance issues you think is unfair, is not contributing to the community it is limiting it's immediate possibilities. I think there have been quite a few very well written articles/threads with regards to the design of the game from a purely objective standpoint, written by people that actually know better than most of the community. If you choose to accept hard facts and well-argumented points by people more experienced than you or I as "balance issues you think is unfair" then I suppose everyone should do so as well because otherwise we would be killing "e-sports". RIGHT? On we go... On January 14 2013 00:52 Nimitz.no wrote: The pro teams and players depend on sponsors to make a living and to entertain you. Show them the respect they deserve by contributing and not "pissing in the well" I'm pretty sure progamers do what they do because it provides financiary backup, because they are competitive and because they enjoy the game. Not necessarily all, but my point is that they're not our slaves in some virtual Colosseum where they live for our entertainment. It's nonsensical to try and make readers guilty because it's simply not true. And I'm pretty sure the thing that hurts sponsors a lot more is when random snobby, entitled asshats decide that some random worthless meaningless drama has offended them and they decide to tell the respective sponsor about it. And this particular vocal minority manages to send that sponsor a message to the effect of "the SC2 scene is full of whiny bipolar pussies who get riled up over nothing and threaten the safety of our investment. Better move on to something else." On January 14 2013 00:52 Nimitz.no wrote: So does SC2 have a future ? you all know the answer so the question itself is plain stupid. How do we make it grow and look brighter ? That is the real question. Fanboi ? yes of course I am a fan. I love it. So again, you say that in order to >be a contributor to "e-sports"< we should become mindless drones that don't care about the game we play, whether we enjoy playing or not, whether we enjoy watching it or not, whether we got our money's worth from buying it and just let Blizzard do whatever they please? Blizzard has no obligation to listen to us. But they claim that they very much do. However, their actions indicate the contrary as they are either refusing to at least attempt and experiment with the changes that the community agrees upon as being good, or they do so much much later when it's a non-issue (what with their new game coming out and what not). I find this to be a blatant, shameless hypocrisy. But hey, it doesn't matter that we are displeased. We should trust Blizzard. We should cherish Blizzard and their actions. Because what is a free will and educated opinions if by having them you hurt "e-sports"? -------------------------------- Shoot me. If this is what *you* understand by being a contributor to "e-sports" then I will have none of it. | ||
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Hider
Denmark9342 Posts
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Noocta
France12578 Posts
On January 14 2013 01:33 FLeK0 wrote: I just played too many blizzard games where the gamers' voice were ignored forever. I played almost every blizzard game since warcraft 2, I never felt they were ignoring people more than other company. On the contrary, they always were prime example of good communication and stuff. They are a bit slow, but Blizzard's a big firm now, It's understandable that they can be very slow. The only thing you can be sad about, is that Blizzard now is not the same guys that made Warcraft 3, Broodwar and Diablo2. The guys with the genius of that time are not part of the company anymore. | ||
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GodOfWarAReS
Germany105 Posts
wow thank you very much for this signature... your right... thanks!! will try to become the best player in the world now | ||
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Nimitz.no
Norway44 Posts
On January 14 2013 01:27 GodOfWarAReS wrote: eh i aggree with what your saying but if your really Nimitz ( eu gm protoss ) than your defenitly the wrong person to start a thread like this as your known to be really bad mannered. I am not. I am a plat Zerg but have always used this nick, since 1998 orso when i got into gaming. | ||
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Saechiis
Netherlands4989 Posts
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Nimitz.no
Norway44 Posts
On January 14 2013 01:38 Kuni wrote: If you don't care about esports, and believe it or not, there are people who don't give a damn about it and just enjoy playing videogames for what they are, there is no reason to artificially support it by faking activity, viewership, sympathy or anything else. Sure there are, however they don't just play the games and move on when it doesn't meet their demands anymore. (well some do) but the majority sticks around to flame and blame as if they wan't to prove that their decision to move on is the correct one. | ||
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Torte de Lini
Germany38463 Posts
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Iblis
904 Posts
I was a huge Warcraft 3 fan, and general blizzard products fan and the least I can say is that I'm not hype up for any of their current or future projects. I'm not even talking about way too high expectations or wanting a perfectly balanced and fun game, but when SC2 battlenet 2.0 has less features than Brood war or Warcraft 3 Battlenet I have a problem finding reasons to why this happened.(Clan support, custom channel at launch, shitty custom games interface, no rename feature, really?, etc) Blizzard doesn't even support the esport SC2 scene that much, they only get involved with some PR bullshit while they could use some ressources to do a ton. Every Blizzard product nowadays just keep contents back to be able to profit on it over a longer period of time. See Diablo 3, WoW and SC2 the week a product is launch an executive annouce that they are alreaady working on the next addon and that it is awesome. Diablo 3 was announced with PvP and nearly a year later still nothing to see except a shitty FFA/duel instance. You can only be disappointed so much until you lose trust on the company that was supposed to provide you with a service or good. I want to contribute and support esport. I'll do it for every other company that try and delivers something I think is good. In my opinion, Starcraft 2 is probably the best RTS today, but it's not a good product/service as a whole. TL DR: Esport yes, Blizzard not necessarily. | ||
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Nimitz.no
Norway44 Posts
On January 14 2013 01:44 Hider wrote: If you think stuff through, you would realize that the best thing could happen to Starcraft 2 is if the current design team of Blizzard got fired and replaced with someone competent. That won't happen if people keeps appreciating all the "great stuff they are doing", and buys the game no matter what. Yes maybe that is a solution, but i don't have opinion on this. I am definitely not saying that you should blindly praise what is bad. But suggesting what to change is way better that pure whining. | ||
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MasterOfPuppets
Romania6942 Posts
On January 14 2013 01:59 Saechiis wrote: Trying to change how others behave is a waste of time, focus on how you can change your own behavior to reflect your ideals. For instance, if you like Starcraft and it's community, make a post explaining how you like them and how it affects your life in a positive way. Instead you're trying to combat negativity with more negativity. He doesn't want this, all he wants is a high horse from which to preach to people why they're stupid in the righteous cause of "e-sports". Either that or he's truly oblivious to how things work an reality in general. I would still think the former rather than the latter, since he did not even attempt to bring up some semblance of an argument in response to my decently-written (I believe) post. Or maybe he really just doesn't know what he's talking about. | ||
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Penecks
United States600 Posts
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Nimitz.no
Norway44 Posts
On January 14 2013 01:40 MasterOfPuppets wrote: So you do not entertain, even for a single second, the possibility that some of us do not agree with direction in which HotS is heading? Are we not allowed to have an opinion of our own with regards to what games we choose to buy, play and support? Fair enough, I guess this is your first step in how to be a contributor to "e-sports". Moving right along... I'm fairly sure this "community you love" you speak of has existed long before SC2 and will probably exist after it as well. And I would have maintained the same position even without TL picking up a DotA 2 team and investing time and effort into that particular game. But this is just a nitpick. Moving on... So what you are saying is that we should not give feedback to Blizzard to attempt to help them make the game that supposedly we love BETTER? For the enjoyment of both players and spectators? We should just the fuck up and let Blizzard do whatever they have in mind because that has turned out very well throughout the past 2 and a half years right? AM I RIGHT GUYS? (more on this later) Moving on... Personally I like to believe in meritocracy. That is to say, I will support the people and things that I believe deserve my support the most. I think there have been quite a few very well written articles/threads with regards to the design of the game from a purely objective standpoint, written by people that actually know better than most of the community. If you choose to accept hard facts and well-argumented points by people more experienced than you or I as "balance issues you think is unfair" then I suppose everyone should do so as well because otherwise we would be killing "e-sports". RIGHT? On we go... I'm pretty sure progamers do what they do because it provides financiary backup, because they are competitive and because they enjoy the game. Not necessarily all, but my point is that they're not our slaves in some virtual Colosseum where they live for our entertainment. It's nonsensical to try and make readers guilty because it's simply not true. And I'm pretty sure the thing that hurts sponsors a lot more is when random snobby, entitled asshats decide that some random worthless meaningless drama has offended them and they decide to tell the respective sponsor about it. And this particular vocal minority manages to send that sponsor a message to the effect of "the SC2 scene is full of whiny bipolar pussies who get riled up over nothing and threaten the safety of our investment. Better move on to something else." So again, you say that in order to >be a contributor to "e-sports"< we should become mindless drones that don't care about the game we play, whether we enjoy playing or not, whether we enjoy watching it or not, whether we got our money's worth from buying it and just let Blizzard do whatever they please? Blizzard has no obligation to listen to us. But they claim that they very much do. However, their actions indicate the contrary as they are either refusing to at least attempt and experiment with the changes that the community agrees upon as being good, or they do so much much later when it's a non-issue (what with their new game coming out and what not). I find this to be a blatant, shameless hypocrisy. But hey, it doesn't matter that we are displeased. We should trust Blizzard. We should cherish Blizzard and their actions. Because what is a free will and educated opinions if by having them you hurt "e-sports"? -------------------------------- Shoot me. If this is what *you* understand by being a contributor to "e-sports" then I will have none of it. The problem i have with answering this post is that you are not reading what i write and are putting opinions into my post that are not there. | ||
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Nimitz.no
Norway44 Posts
On January 14 2013 02:07 MasterOfPuppets wrote: He doesn't want this, all he wants is a high horse from which to preach to people why they're stupid in the righteous cause of "e-sports". Either that or he's truly oblivious to how things work an reality in general. I would still think the former rather than the latter, since he did not even attempt to bring up some semblance of an argument in response to my decently-written (I believe) post. Or maybe he really just doesn't know what he's talking about. Come on.. really ? yes I want e-sport to grow, don't you ? high horse.. really ? this is just a personal attack that i won't lower myself to spend much time on. | ||
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[F_]aths
Germany3947 Posts
On January 14 2013 02:04 Torte de Lini wrote: What if you already are and still have criticisms (like everyone else?) I think the OP isn't about that. It's about the whining, the extreme exaggeration of small gameplay or map or bnet service issues. There is some good criticism out there, but it is hard to get to it because it is often overshadowed by negative statements which do not contribute to actual criticism. | ||
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Nimitz.no
Norway44 Posts
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Sea_Food
Finland1612 Posts
Just a friendly reminder that sc2 is not a charity. Its a for profit industry. Let us talk about it how we like, not having to consider can the stock holders roll in a bigger pile of money. | ||
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MasterOfPuppets
Romania6942 Posts
On January 14 2013 02:24 Sea_Food wrote: If you need to make desprate post like this to encourage the community. to do work for free, to keep a 100 000 000 dollar game growing/alive then the game might aswell be dead. Keeping the game growing/alive should be mostly blizzards job because they are the ones who get the money from it. Next in line should be tournament organizers and pro teams because they also do it for profit. We the community are the people who dony get money from this, we pay for this, should now put in effort aswell to market this? Just a friendly reminder that sc2 is not a charity. Its a for profit industry. But... But Sea_Food... e-sports... but... the community! The game! Passion! /lol I agree with this very much, however it doesn't matter what we believe because -apparently- we didn't read the OP. Even though we did. lol. | ||
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Nimitz.no
Norway44 Posts
On January 14 2013 02:18 [F_]aths wrote: I think the OP isn't about that. It's about the whining, the extreme exaggeration of small gameplay or map or bnet service issues. There is some good criticism out there, but it is hard to get to it because it is often overshadowed by negative statements which do not contribute to actual criticism. Yes I tried to make this post about this topic, however i might come across as negative myself and for that I am sorry. | ||
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