|
Hey guys,
I'm a Silver level Terran player on the NA server and Bronze on the SEA server. I was playing a game against a Protoss player on the NA server and basically I feel like I macroed pretty well. Non stop SCV production, expanding every 5sh minutes, minerals below 250 95% of the time (except when saving for a Command Centre or maxed out), was not supply blocked etc. Eventually I got up to 4 bases versing a 2 base protoss. I pushed at the 14 minute mark with about 110 marines (with the rest of my supply tied up in workers). He destroyed my push and proceeded to destroy me. I had a food lead for the whole game and when I was maxed I had about an 80 food lead.
So the point is, does this game illustrate why simply just macroing better and just 'a clicking' cannot get you to platinum league? I feel like I've been fed this fantasy that just producing SCVs and units and keeping money low will guarantee an automatic promotion into at least platinum if not diamond.
Cheers
PS: Here is the obligatory replay for you guys to ridicule -
http://www.mediafire.com/?8my8qzjn03n3m1p
 
|
Don't make pure marines. brb watching replay
You took 0 gasses in a 16 minute game. You lost because you didn't have even the most basic upgrades. Stim, Combat Shields, Marauders, upgraded bio, vikings, medivacs, ghosts- all staple units/upgrades of TvP and all of them require gas.
|
Zurich15365 Posts
So you lost one game? The "just macro better myth" doesn't guarantee you to get to Platinum without losing a single game. But yes, generally you should advance to at least Platinum by just macroing and a-moving. It will just take longer if you do things like making marines only against Protoss.
|
Thank you kind sir. But it's not just this game, I've lost against banelings and siege tanks too. I feel like I've hit a wall.
|
The macro better saying is just a somewhat guideline to getting better/improving your play. It is usually the most common problem among sc2 players.
Obviously if you macro'ed really well but still lost then it's probably not a macro problem but rather something else.
Maybe mechanics? positioning? Unit comps (lol pure marine)?
Please don't expect to get into diamond/plat by a moving after your maxed.
Chances are that they might be maxed as well/have better stuff
|
I'm assuming "don't blindly follow gross oversimplifications on how to play", "don't be stupid", "have a better unit composition", and "seriously, don't be stupid" are also parts of getting promoted...
|
So After watching the replay...I have to ask...when did u plan on getting gas?
|
Seriously though 0 gas and you're asking about axioms you read on the forum. That is hilarious. When I loaded the replay.. I don't know, I was expecting you to have like 1-0 upgrades, stim but not combat shields, a lot of medivacs and he just got off really good force fields and had early fast colossus.
That's .. just wow. Yeah, you need gas.
|
oh my i got trolled by downloading that replay ~~;
|
I can't tell if this guy is being funny...
|
it's not a myth
macro goes far deeper than just keeping your money spent, it's also about having a tight build that lets you get tech and certain upgrades faster than your opponent because you're spending money more efficiently
bomber's banshee builds are a good example, he has exactly enough to get an expand without a single hiccup in building/banshee production anywhere, there's no weird delay in his cloak variant
so sorry but literally making nothing but marines doesn't qualify as good macro because you're ignoring 85% of the game
if you are talking about destiny's famous rant about bad players, he said that the reason players couldn't make masters was mechanics, which also includes controlling your army well
|
So this is what goes on in Bronze and Silver leagues 
|
are you trolling? you never even made a refinery, have 14 barracks, and complain that you get destroyed by colossus?
|
I dunno, I guess my inspiration was drawn from a mixture to prove this simplistic advice wrong and also Halby's mineral drill where he really simplifies it down to macro ONLY!
|
Removed for lack of relevance...and from embarrassment
|
On December 27 2011 18:13 ReketSomething wrote:
I can't tell if this guy is being funny...
On December 27 2011 18:13 Dark.Carnival wrote:
oh my i got trolled by downloading that replay ~~;
On December 27 2011 18:18 TG Manny wrote:
Things to note: (and I didn't watch rep)
Mauraders are a good bet to make in TvP
Upgrades are very important in all MUs, but Terran bio is one of the best unit comps for upgrade-based builds. +1 damage per marine shooting per shot results in a big spike in DPS, for just a 100/100 upgrade.
Medivacs make win-drops make bigger win.
Toss late-game is scary with collosus, templar, and lots of gateways. Terran winning windows usually hit as toss is weakest from their tech investments, 8-11 minutes. The more you can cost effectively trade armies, the better. (toss tech can't stand well on their own, they must have a deathball around 'em to keep alive and effective.
Macroing isn't just keeping your buildings busy but it can also involve making the right stuff. If I am zerg playing infestor/BL late game against a bio+ghosts army that is SUPER scary so I lower my tech choices to muta until I can handle drops and funnel the terran into my BL ball and keep him from getting a lot of vikings. Zerg is the most obvious choice where you make the wrong stuff and you lose, but the same can be said of any MU.
Macroing harder, imo, refers to keeping production up, not getting supply blocked, etc. Macroing better means responding to what you scout (!!!) and making the right units to abuse weaknesses. You claim to have macro'd hard but if you're on 110 marines and 90 workers you did not macro well. terran cuts SCVs at 60 for mules to make up economy and free up space for army and marines are good on their own but need supportive units to keep alive. Back to zerg reference, if I have 100 banelings going for 100 marines, banelings win (except against Marine King Prime and MorroW etc etc....gods of the split) 100 banelings going for 76 marines and 7 tanks, marines win with minimal losses. Both situations require macroing HARD but the second macro's better (sees no teching from zerg or low on gas zerg with a lot of lings and not much of anything else)
I think this is at least part of the reason why it's a good idea to always download the replay lol
|
On December 27 2011 18:16 inbox24 wrote:
I dunno, I guess my inspiration was drawn from a mixture to prove this simplistic advice wrong and also Halby's mineral drill where he really simplifies it down to macro ONLY!
if you a-move 0-0 marines with no combat shields or stim into like 3 colossus with range with sentry support, i think you have a much larger problem. and you can actually win with only marines in that league with good bunker placement.
|
1. You didn't split your workers
2. You waited 5 seconds before you ordered your workers to mine
3. @2mins and 9 seconds you didn't build workers for like a full 10 seconds
4. You didn't scout your opponent for 7.5mins. This is a cardinal sin.
5. Not attacking until 14minutes with a pure marine force.
Number 5 is the most important. That's an example of bronze level decisionmaking. You are better than that.
Yes you can go a macro style with just marines but you have to be agressive. You have to keep forcing army trades otherwise your opponent will tech up and slaughter your marines with AOE damage dealers (eg collosi).
If your are going to play passive on the other hand then you need to at least keep up with his tech, in which case you should scout regularly to make sure you can coutner his forces.
And finally, I know you probably think macro sucks. And your game is an example that it is not the be all and end all of starcraft. But it is important and the reason why other posters put such emphasis on it is not because having good macro will instantly promote you to masters, but because it is the easiest aspect in your gameplay to improve on.
It is far easier to train yourself to build a worker ever 17seconds and not get supply blocked than it is to train your eye to correclty judge whether you should engage an enemy force or not. And it is far easier to get yourself promoted from such improvements as a result.
|
There's no skill level at which macroing better doesn't benefit you.
|
On December 27 2011 18:16 inbox24 wrote:
I dunno, I guess my inspiration was drawn from a mixture to prove this simplistic advice wrong and also Halby's mineral drill where he really simplifies it down to macro ONLY!
I've watched that video and while it's kinda cool, you need to realize that it is meant as a crutch for people with bad macro to play a passable game. It's not actually a good build, it's just a way for people that can't actually play the game to put up a decent effort.
I'm sure if you were actually a masters player, you could do a no-gas build up to maybe platinum or higher perhaps, but seeing as how that's not the case for you, the mineral drill is only meant to allow you to become comfortable with the game to the point that you are able to actually use the rest of the game besides barracks and marines and depots and OC's.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
