EPTIPL, LoL and the SC2 community - Page 4
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CaptainPlatypus
United States852 Posts
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coolcrimefighter
United States378 Posts
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Tektos
Australia1321 Posts
On October 10 2011 13:15 coolcrimefighter wrote: are sc2 players really complaining about a game because its too casual and requires no skill? BW elitism? They are complaining that they didn't get to watch (or at least had to wait for a significant portion of time to watch) the two most important games of the tournament because IGN decided they wanted to stream a completely different game for a while, delaying the finals. | ||
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Deleted User 3420
24492 Posts
On October 10 2011 13:07 CaptainPlatypus wrote: First of all, the complaints were mainly about scheduling and (later) lag, not LoL itself. Secondly, no offense to competitive LoL players, but it really doesn't involve as much skill as other competitive games. It has less depth (and balance) than SC2, than DotA, than Street Fighter, than just about any ESPORT, and that's somewhat by design. So while I agree with you that the community's attitude was pretty bad, and that's regrettable and worthy of discussion, I think the "and it's totally unjustified" half of the statement you're making is, well, totally unjustified. I don't know why im arguing this but you're completely wrong. How much skill it takes to be good at something that involves direct competition with an opponent is based upon the skill of your opponents. And LoL has plenty of depth anyways, actually. This is coming from someone who has played lots of LoL, played sc2 at a fairly high level, and played BROODWAR at a very high level. | ||
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Kitkatzy
United States213 Posts
On October 10 2011 12:14 Phemtos wrote: competitive LoL remind me of competitive world of warcraft arena. basically it's a joke. This. Sadly I was a competitive WoW arena player between sc1 and sc2  .I was just really bothered by how long of a break Lucky had between his match and the finals compared to Stephano who had about a 2 minute break. This occurred as a direct result of the completely poor scheduling of the LoL(aptly named) finals. | ||
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ThyHate
240 Posts
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Endymion
United States3701 Posts
On October 10 2011 14:07 travis wrote: I don't know why im arguing this but you're completely wrong. How much skill it takes to be good at something that involves direct competition with an opponent is based upon the skill of your opponents. And LoL has plenty of depth anyways, actually. This is coming from someone who has played lots of LoL, played sc2 at a fairly high level, and played BROODWAR at a very high level. too bad broadwarz didn't take any skill, it was all 1a, you could only select 1 building because that's all you needed to macro off of 5 bases. destiny > savior and july | ||
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Phemtos
Canada163 Posts
On October 10 2011 14:07 travis wrote: I don't know why im arguing this but you're completely wrong. How much skill it takes to be good at something that involves direct competition with an opponent is based upon the skill of your opponents. And LoL has plenty of depth anyways, actually. This is coming from someone who has played lots of LoL, played sc2 at a fairly high level, and played BROODWAR at a very high level. LoL has little to no competitive scene compared to Dota 2. Also the depth doesn't say much about the game in it's competitive scene. There are plenty of RTS game that have more depth then SC2/BW, but that doesn't mean they would make a better competitive esport game. Basically LoL is a dumb down version of the original game that lack the real competitive backbone that Dota 2 has. Dota 2 has the Chinese players, the Ukrainian, the Russians who are the real hardcore players that are MUCH more competitive then anybody that play in the LoL scene. Just like SSF4 has the japanese and SC has the koreans hence why the game will never be considered a real esport game especially when dota 2 is out and Riot knows that. | ||
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Deleted User 3420
24492 Posts
I don't actually know how big the pro dota scene is but that shit has been out for like 9 years or something and LoL has been around for what? 2? if that? | ||
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Phemtos
Canada163 Posts
On October 10 2011 14:50 travis wrote: There was just a tournament in china with multiple good chinese teams in it, one was in the finals. There are multiple professional LoL teams. I don't actually know how big the pro dota scene is but that shit has been out for like 9 years or something and LoL has been around for what? 2? if that? I'm sure some of these teams might be playing LoL for now but I can guarantee you that they will all be playing Dota 2 when it's finally released. | ||
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Deleted User 3420
24492 Posts
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Enki
United States2548 Posts
On October 10 2011 13:15 coolcrimefighter wrote: are sc2 players really complaining about a game because its too casual and requires no skill? I personally find it very boring to watch, most of the time you are watching people just farm. It's just somewhat bad from a spectators point of view. And yes I have played alot of LoL. I do it when I want a break from sc2 and can take things less seriously. | ||
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Eppa!
Sweden4641 Posts
On October 10 2011 14:46 Phemtos wrote: LoL has little to no competitive scene compared to Dota 2. Also the depth doesn't say much about the game in it's competitive scene. There are plenty of RTS game that have more depth then SC2/BW, but that doesn't mean they would make a better competitive esport game. Basically LoL is a dumb down version of the original game that lack the real competitive backbone that Dota 2 has. Dota 2 has the Chinese players, the Ukrainian, the Russians who are the real hardcore players that are MUCH more competitive then anybody that play in the LoL scene. Just like SSF4 has the japanese and SC has the koreans hence why the game will never be considered a real esport game especially when dota 2 is out and Riot knows that. At IEM in China this year more people went to watch LoL than SC2. If viewers are not the backbone of an esports nothing is. | ||
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Phemtos
Canada163 Posts
On October 10 2011 15:11 Eppa! wrote: At IEM in China this year more people went to watch LoL than SC2. If viewers are not the backbone of an esports nothing is. Did you not read what I said? MOBA is huge in China. LoL was the only moba game at IEM china so obviously people went to watch that. But guess what these same people will be watching next year over LoL? Dota 2. Also they still don't have that backbone competitive scene that I am talking about. I never said anything about their viewership. I know LoL bring alot of numbers but Dota 2 bring even more. | ||
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I_Love_Bacon
United States5765 Posts
I think it's time to stop complaining like children just because something isn't entirely focused on sc2. There are plenty and plenty of streams and tournies that cater only to sc2 fans. Watch those if you get so easily miffed at seeing any game other than sc2. If you give the game a chance and you don't like it, that's fine. But bitching and complaining only makes the sc2 community look like children. | ||
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Kenpachi
United States9908 Posts
On October 10 2011 13:15 coolcrimefighter wrote: are sc2 players really complaining about a game because its too casual and requires no skill? its quite ironic. History repeats itself | ||
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Kanil
United States1713 Posts
StarCraft players are willing to argue over whether StarCraft should be an esport due to the presence or lack thereof of the number 2. If we can't even tolerate ourselves, how can you expect us to tolerate someone else? | ||
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Bayyne
United States1967 Posts
If you were surprised that LoL was on the line-up to be shown in between the games, then that's your fault for not checking the schedule. Everyone was put on notice regarding that. If you don't agree with IGN scheduling the event the way it did, then that is perfectly fine. There are proper channels to voice your complains regarding that. Talking shit to other gaming communities? Nah. We don't need asshats mouthing off to other people about how SC2 > all. And if you want to be the rebellious kind and say, "fuck that, I can say whatever I want whenever I want.". Great! You still look like a jackass. | ||
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Eppa!
Sweden4641 Posts
On October 10 2011 15:29 Phemtos wrote: Did you not read what I said? MOBA is huge in China. LoL was the only moba game at IEM china so obviously people went to watch that. But guess what these same people will be watching next year over LoL? Dota 2. Also they still don't have that backbone competitive scene that I am talking about. I never said anything about their viewership. I know LoL bring alot of numbers but Dota 2 bring even more. So Chines people went to IEM then chose lol rather than seeing lol being played at IEM then going to watch it? What is this so called competitive backbone? History? Does that make it impossible to coexist? Just because football has more history means that american football can't exist. Also arguably the key factor of a game is its popularity. Not how hardcore it is. What people need to understand is what makes this history which is: 1. Replayability 2. Access DotA was free BW was free CS 1.6 was free Fighters where available in arcades Maybe you are right. SC2 and LoL have no right to call themselves ESPORTS as they do not have the "competitive backbone" of BW and DotA. | ||
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bokchoi
Korea (South)9498 Posts
On October 10 2011 16:05 Eppa! wrote: So Chines people went to IEM then chose lol rather than seeing lol being played at IEM then going to watch it? What is this so called competitive backbone? History? Does that make it impossible to coexist? Just because football has more history means that american football can't exist. Also arguably the key factor of a game is its popularity. Not how hardcore it is. What people need to understand is what makes this history which is: 1. Replayability 2. Access DotA was free BW was free CS 1.6 was free Fighters where available in arcades Maybe you are right. SC2 and LoL have no right to call themselves ESPORTS as they do not have the "competitive backbone" of BW and DotA. Wait... BW was free? Somebody stole my money then. Curse you Blizzard. In all seriousness, iCCup, WGT, PGT, etc. were all illegal and if BW wasn't so old and dead (outside of Korea) by the time they rolled around Blizzard would've done something about it. I was actually surprised that Blizzard did nothing about iCCup when they went after KeSPA. | ||
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