• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 06:17
CET 11:17
KST 19:17
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
ByuL: The Forgotten Master of ZvT29Behind the Blue - Team Liquid History Book19Clem wins HomeStory Cup 289HomeStory Cup 28 - Info & Preview13Rongyi Cup S3 - Preview & Info8
Community News
Blizzard Classic Cup - Tastosis announced as captains10Weekly Cups (March 2-8): ByuN overcomes PvT block4GSL CK - New online series18BSL Season 224Vitality ends partnership with ONSYDE20
StarCraft 2
General
Blizzard Classic Cup - Tastosis announced as captains https://www.facebook.com/OptiJoint.Official/ GSL CK - New online series Weekly Cups (March 2-8): ByuN overcomes PvT block Weekly Cups (Feb 23-Mar 1): herO doubles, 2v2 bonanza
Tourneys
https://www.facebook.com/SpyFocusMiniWifiCamera/ [GSL CK] Team Maru vs. Team herO WardiTV Team League Season 10 Master Swan Open (Global Bronze-Master 2) RSL Season 4 announced for March-April
Strategy
Custom Maps
Publishing has been re-enabled! [Feb 24th 2026] Map Editor closed ?
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 516 Specter of Death Mutation # 515 Together Forever Mutation # 514 Ulnar New Year
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion Are you ready for ASL 21? Hype VIDEO ASL21 General Discussion Gypsy to Korea BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues IPSL Spring 2026 is here! ASL Season 21 Qualifiers March 7-8 BWCL Season 64 Announcement
Strategy
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Soma's 9 hatch build from ASL Game 2 Fighting Spirit mining rates Zealot bombing is no longer popular?
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread PC Games Sales Thread Path of Exile No Man's Sky (PS4 and PC) Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion The Story of Wings Gaming
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
Five o'clock TL Mafia Mafia Game Mode Feedback/Ideas Vanilla Mini Mafia TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
Russo-Ukrainian War Thread US Politics Mega-thread Mexico's Drug War Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine YouTube Thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [Manga] One Piece
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion General nutrition recommendations Cricket [SPORT] TL MMA Pick'em Pool 2013
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Laptop capable of using Photoshop Lightroom?
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Iranian anarchists: organize…
XenOsky
FS++
Kraekkling
Shocked by a laser…
Spydermine0240
Gaming-Related Deaths
TrAiDoS
Unintentional protectionism…
Uldridge
ASL S21 English Commentary…
namkraft
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 1546 users

TvZ makes me want to quit SC2 - Page 2

Blogs > DNB
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 Next All
Pulimuli
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
Sweden2766 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-21 19:34:58
June 21 2011 19:33 GMT
#21
On June 22 2011 03:08 zawk9 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 22 2011 02:57 TheSubtleArt wrote:
I basically quit Brood War cause I couldn't play TvP lol. I'd literally beat more Protoss in BW offracing as Zerg than I would main racing as Terran, it was that bad >_<.

Anyway, cheer up, focus on improving, watch pro reps, and use some ghosts : D.

On June 22 2011 02:43 KawaiiRice wrote:
Play ZvT against a friend and you will be QQ'ing just as hard about how bad zerg units are. 3-3 marines just stand there and laugh at your 35 hp zerglings and 1 tank shot explodes 200 supply of banelings.
Just get over it and play to improve, you have a poisonous mindset that isn't helping you in the slightest bit.
gl dewd.


Listen to KR, he's basically a master of TvZ lol


Anyone who complains about any matchup in SC2 should be forced to play TvP in Brood War. That should set them straight :p


tbh i feel TvP in BW is easier than TvZ in SC2 ^^ but thats probably just me

Lategame TvZ is hard as hell
TheSubtleArt
Profile Joined May 2011
Canada2527 Posts
June 21 2011 19:44 GMT
#22
On June 22 2011 03:22 lyAsakura wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 22 2011 03:08 zawk9 wrote:
On June 22 2011 02:57 TheSubtleArt wrote:
I basically quit Brood War cause I couldn't play TvP lol. I'd literally beat more Protoss in BW offracing as Zerg than I would main racing as Terran, it was that bad >_<.

Anyway, cheer up, focus on improving, watch pro reps, and use some ghosts : D.

On June 22 2011 02:43 KawaiiRice wrote:
Play ZvT against a friend and you will be QQ'ing just as hard about how bad zerg units are. 3-3 marines just stand there and laugh at your 35 hp zerglings and 1 tank shot explodes 200 supply of banelings.
Just get over it and play to improve, you have a poisonous mindset that isn't helping you in the slightest bit.
gl dewd.


Listen to KR, he's basically a master of TvZ lol


Anyone who complains about any matchup in SC2 should be forced to play TvP in Brood War. That should set them straight :p


TvP is cancer.. :z

"Aaah I've finally got him n-" *6 carriers* ~_~
Dodge arrows
koreasilver
Profile Blog Joined June 2008
9109 Posts
June 21 2011 19:48 GMT
#23
On June 22 2011 04:44 TheSubtleArt wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 22 2011 03:22 lyAsakura wrote:
On June 22 2011 03:08 zawk9 wrote:
On June 22 2011 02:57 TheSubtleArt wrote:
I basically quit Brood War cause I couldn't play TvP lol. I'd literally beat more Protoss in BW offracing as Zerg than I would main racing as Terran, it was that bad >_<.

Anyway, cheer up, focus on improving, watch pro reps, and use some ghosts : D.

On June 22 2011 02:43 KawaiiRice wrote:
Play ZvT against a friend and you will be QQ'ing just as hard about how bad zerg units are. 3-3 marines just stand there and laugh at your 35 hp zerglings and 1 tank shot explodes 200 supply of banelings.
Just get over it and play to improve, you have a poisonous mindset that isn't helping you in the slightest bit.
gl dewd.


Listen to KR, he's basically a master of TvZ lol


Anyone who complains about any matchup in SC2 should be forced to play TvP in Brood War. That should set them straight :p


TvP is cancer.. :z

"Aaah I've finally got him n-" *6 carriers* ~_~

This is how I won all my offrace PvTs.

3base arbs -> ??????? i DUNNO what the f I'm doing -> 4-5 base put down like 4 stargates because my macro is bad

and then I'll win or lose depending on how bad my Terran opponent is.
qdenser
Profile Joined September 2010
Canada133 Posts
June 21 2011 19:59 GMT
#24
the solution of course is to play ZvT
BW is still out there and a lots of people still watch it. SC2 is a different game and different people. Please go back to BW if you think sc2 is not suited for you - Dustin Browder
MyLastSerenade
Profile Joined February 2010
Germany710 Posts
June 21 2011 20:13 GMT
#25
i got the same problem.... most of my zerg opponents go blind 3 queens 2 spine and i cant do enough damage with my helions, then he just get´s his 3rd, because he knows that i cant do more preassure without at least 3 tanks and mass marine/medivac and from then on i get rolled everytime :/
zhurai
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
United States5660 Posts
June 21 2011 20:28 GMT
#26
On June 22 2011 05:13 MyLastSerenade wrote:
i got the same problem.... most of my zerg opponents go blind 3 queens 2 spine and i cant do enough damage with my helions, then he just get´s his 3rd, because he knows that i cant do more preassure without at least 3 tanks and mass marine/medivac and from then on i get rolled everytime :/

well... if you have a walloff with 1rax 2 depot, it's most likely either a FE or a hellion build anyways.....and if they scout that you went 1rax -> gas, it's definitely (to a zerg's eyes) a hellion build. so no it isn't really "blind".
Twitter: @zhurai | Site: http://zhurai.com
Snowbear
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Korea (South)1925 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-21 20:47:12
June 21 2011 20:45 GMT
#27
I got the exact same problem as you. I know TvZ is balanced, but it feels impossible to beat lategame zerg. Hive + infestor (especially broodlord + infestor) is so strong and hard to beat. It would be nice if terran had a good tier 3 unit. Another problem against zerg is scouting. Is he droning? Is he making 30 lings? If you think he is droning, and you attack with 15 marines, and he has alot of zerglings, then you lose those and you are behind imo, since your next push is delayed.

I played only TvP in BW because I enjoyed how hard it was (D+ level), but it felt possible. TvZ feels alot more harder and alot more impossible.

Good luck with tvz. Play it alot, try to find some zerg practice partner and get your gamesense up. Gamesense (knowing when to attack the zerg, knowing when to expand, etc) is very important in TvZ (imo).
Bortlett
Profile Joined October 2010
United States302 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-21 20:58:27
June 21 2011 20:57 GMT
#28
TvZ is by far my most volatile matchup. I'm either winning every single game or losing every single game, there's no in between (I'm in diamond).

I do early reactor hellion harrass into a 3 tank push around the 10-11 minute mark. That push makes or breaks the game for me - if it doesn't do enough damage, I will lose most of the time. I don't often win with that push, but I need to force my opponent to invest a lot into killing it.

When broodlords are out, it's over. I need to have vikings out when broodlords are done and I often don't.

Drops are really effective. You don't have to do double drops, but a drop while you're attacking with your main force can do a lot of damage.

You definitely can't just sit back and macro the whole game. You'll get crushed.

Good luck!
TheSubtleArt
Profile Joined May 2011
Canada2527 Posts
June 21 2011 21:04 GMT
#29
On June 22 2011 04:59 qdenser wrote:
the solution of course is to play ZvT

And realize the matchup is just as annoying from a Zerg perspective lol.

It's actualyl a good idea though, you'll learn what's difficult to deal with as Zerg, when to push out, where to drop, when to run hellions in vs when not to, how effective pushing while dropping is, etc, just by experiencing the pain yourself.
Dodge arrows
TheSubtleArt
Profile Joined May 2011
Canada2527 Posts
June 21 2011 21:08 GMT
#30
On June 22 2011 04:48 koreasilver wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 22 2011 04:44 TheSubtleArt wrote:
On June 22 2011 03:22 lyAsakura wrote:
On June 22 2011 03:08 zawk9 wrote:
On June 22 2011 02:57 TheSubtleArt wrote:
I basically quit Brood War cause I couldn't play TvP lol. I'd literally beat more Protoss in BW offracing as Zerg than I would main racing as Terran, it was that bad >_<.

Anyway, cheer up, focus on improving, watch pro reps, and use some ghosts : D.

On June 22 2011 02:43 KawaiiRice wrote:
Play ZvT against a friend and you will be QQ'ing just as hard about how bad zerg units are. 3-3 marines just stand there and laugh at your 35 hp zerglings and 1 tank shot explodes 200 supply of banelings.
Just get over it and play to improve, you have a poisonous mindset that isn't helping you in the slightest bit.
gl dewd.


Listen to KR, he's basically a master of TvZ lol


Anyone who complains about any matchup in SC2 should be forced to play TvP in Brood War. That should set them straight :p


TvP is cancer.. :z

"Aaah I've finally got him n-" *6 carriers* ~_~

This is how I won all my offrace PvTs.

3base arbs -> ??????? i DUNNO what the f I'm doing -> 4-5 base put down like 4 stargates because my macro is bad

and then I'll win or lose depending on how bad my Terran opponent is.

Lol DT drops, recalls, carrier transitions, shuttle bombs, and reavers microed by koreans....so obnoxious >_<
Dodge arrows
RmoteCntrld
Profile Joined June 2010
United States596 Posts
June 21 2011 21:13 GMT
#31
Snipe tech with drops over and over and over
OmniEulogy
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
Canada6598 Posts
June 21 2011 21:30 GMT
#32
On June 22 2011 06:13 RmoteCntrld wrote:
Snipe tech with drops over and over and over


worked for MMA? Its simple too, just fly the medivac through the muta swarm unscathed, then land next to the tech and kill it before they notice.......... lol easy right? xD
LiquidDota Staff
DNB
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Finland995 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-28 23:55:36
June 28 2011 23:48 GMT
#33
This is it... I just can't improve my TvZ, it feels like if I don't have 200 apm with perfect double drops while slowpushing with tanks and splitting marines at the exact timing, I lose to a zerg who just masses lings banelings mutas and A-moves into me. I don't know if I should even continue playing SC2 if I can't enjoy TvZ... I've posted several replays into teamliquid but the answer is same: "You must have godlike multitasking and perfect micro and gamesense, terran noob". I'm not MMA, I'm not Flash, I'm just an ordinary gamer with limited skill...
This is QQ post, yes, but I've the only times I can win zerg if they make some very stupid mistakes, and even then I get insults from them how my race is somehow extremely overpowered. Who wants to play like that..?
LuckyFool
Profile Blog Joined June 2007
United States9015 Posts
June 29 2011 00:28 GMT
#34
On June 22 2011 06:30 OmniEulogy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 22 2011 06:13 RmoteCntrld wrote:
Snipe tech with drops over and over and over


worked for MMA? Its simple too, just fly the medivac through the muta swarm unscathed, then land next to the tech and kill it before they notice.......... lol easy right? xD


mma has superhuman medivacs with speedupgrades. normal humans medivacs die to mutas.
knyttym
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
United States5797 Posts
June 29 2011 00:37 GMT
#35
TvZ is basically pure execution at this point. Execution takes mass gaming. One thing you learn from watching korean tvz is if you aren't dropping you are wasting time. If your drop gets picked off by mutas, do double drops. If double drop doesn't work, use another marine task force to attack while double dropping. For an example, watch slayersdragon's stream. There are many games where his drop just keep dying but eventually he breaks through. It takes just one successful drop out of a dozen plus to turn the tide.
Archvil3
Profile Joined September 2010
Denmark989 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-29 00:59:22
June 29 2011 00:58 GMT
#36
TvZ as I see it ... is overall very balanced and execution and skill is a huge factor through the match.

It begins heavily terran favored where the terran in almost every aspect got the upper hand. We, the zerg, have learned to deal with it though. It did take awhile, it did require a few patches and a lot of zerg tears but any experienced zerg have learned to deal with the first 10 minutes of every matchup. We struggle but we survive. It is up to the terran to do the damage though. The stronger the zerg enters the midgame the harder it is for the terran. No excuses though, you have every oppertunity to wound the zerg.

As we enter the midgame I find it to be the most skillbased and fun matchup. Lots of multitasking is required from both sides and you are promptly rewarded for your horrasment whether that be mutas or dropships while at the same time errors can be critical. Again this apply to both the zerg and the terran. Skill, not race, dominates the midgame.

Lategame, if the zerg is in a powerfull position where they stop droning, stop teching and only replenish armies continualy and they are at least 1 base up on the terran, the game turns into the zergs favor. It's pretty tough to deal with but I think the terran had every opertunity to end the game or delay and prevent this scenario.

Instead of working on your lategame when it's pretty much checkmate, work on everything up to that point. Be more relentless in your horassment. Hurt the zerg. Dont let them get that position cause this is when the swarm is taking over!
Let thy speech be better than silence, or be silent.
Zinjil
Profile Joined February 2011
United States166 Posts
June 29 2011 02:33 GMT
#37
I see that many people have told you this same thing, but I'll reiterate: ZvT is insanely stressful for zerg players too, the entire way through the game seems like walking a frayed tightrope over a pool of lava as you have to know scouting patterns that don't get your overlords killed, timings for every stupid 2-rax 4-rax 7-rax thing that equally frustrated terrans will throw out, and be constantly worried about marine drops, banshees, blue flame hellions, and (less now) reapers, all the while having to greedily pump drones to stay on equal footing with an enemy who it feels is perfectly capable of playing a base down for a while, then it all comes down to the tank/marine/medivac/couple of thors push midgame that you have to control perfectly against or your entire army will explode in showers of gore in a couple seconds.

Basically my point is that terrans should go into the game with the mindset my mom always told me to have when dealing with animals: "Remember, they're just as scared of you as you are of them. Be confident and authoritative and you'll be fine".
Fr33t
Profile Joined June 2008
United States1128 Posts
June 29 2011 21:46 GMT
#38
Done, today is the day I quit SC2 because of TvZ
"Wow you could literally transport Lomo's face to a girl and the result would be pretty deceptive."
rei
Profile Blog Joined October 2002
United States3594 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-06-29 22:59:50
June 29 2011 22:44 GMT
#39
It is always the player and never the race/match up that decides winning and losing. Only thing someone can be frustrated at when losing is themselves. Not the map, not the match up, not the balancing, not the cheesing opponent, but themselves.

Here is something that helps ppl to get into the right mind set when playing sc2.

Fake arrogant is from insecurity, it looks something like this, "i'm so much better than X, if not for Y there is no way I will lose ever" Then hides behind this Ego and never improve on anything, because he thinks there is nothing should be needed to work on since he's the best.

Real arrogant looks like this "I'm so good, it doesn't matter what kinds of advantage you have i will own you with all the odds stack against me." And when someone with real arrogant loses, he will go back to the drawing board to make sure he doesn't lose the same way again and come back again the next day to insert his arrogance into his victims. He will let his pwnage do the talking.

usually the truly arrogant one are playing random and announce their race each game, and if you manage to take a game off him in one particular match up, he will re-match you with that match up in order to show you you can't even have a positive win ratio with one of his 9 match ups. In his mind it is not ok to even lose out on a single match up.

When someone with real arrogance meets someone spouting fake arrogant, they will challenge them to 1vs1 in the mirror match up with a one worker handicap, and proceed to try their hardest to win.

Now that is insufferable arrogance.
GET OUT OF MY BASE CHILL
Sadistx
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
Zimbabwe5568 Posts
June 30 2011 00:07 GMT
#40
On June 29 2011 09:28 LuckyFool wrote:
Show nested quote +
On June 22 2011 06:30 OmniEulogy wrote:
On June 22 2011 06:13 RmoteCntrld wrote:
Snipe tech with drops over and over and over


worked for MMA? Its simple too, just fly the medivac through the muta swarm unscathed, then land next to the tech and kill it before they notice.......... lol easy right? xD


mma has superhuman medivacs with speedupgrades. normal humans medivacs die to mutas.


I clicked on your blog looking for TvZ rage and surprise surprise it's the last thing. June 11th :D
Prev 1 2 3 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
The PondCast
10:00
Episode 85
CranKy Ducklings10
LiquipediaDiscussion
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ProTech10
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 33052
Jaedong 1274
Soma 602
actioN 357
BeSt 303
sSak 151
Sharp 149
EffOrt 112
Rush 109
Mini 94
[ Show more ]
Pusan 91
ToSsGirL 56
ZerO 50
Backho 40
sorry 36
Larva 34
Bale 29
Last 29
NaDa 22
NotJumperer 10
Terrorterran 3
Dota 2
XaKoH 350
NeuroSwarm94
League of Legends
JimRising 569
Counter-Strike
olofmeister1445
shoxiejesuss804
m0e_tv478
allub223
edward54
Super Smash Bros
Mew2King98
Other Games
singsing940
Liquid`RaSZi640
ceh9612
crisheroes141
ZerO(Twitch)5
Organizations
Dota 2
PGL Dota 2 - Main Stream11472
Other Games
gamesdonequick663
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 16 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• Berry_CruncH294
• StrangeGG 53
• LUISG 35
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP5
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos1431
• Stunt538
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Team League
1h 44m
Replay Cast
13h 44m
Replay Cast
1d 13h
CranKy Ducklings
1d 23h
RSL Revival
1d 23h
WardiTV Team League
2 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
Patches Events
2 days
BSL
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
[ Show More ]
RSL Revival
2 days
WardiTV Team League
3 days
BSL
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Replay Cast
3 days
Wardi Open
4 days
Monday Night Weeklies
4 days
WardiTV Team League
5 days
GSL
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-03-11
WardiTV Winter 2026
Underdog Cup #3

Ongoing

KCM Race Survival 2026 Season 1
Jeongseon Sooper Cup
BSL Season 22
RSL Revival: Season 4
Nations Cup 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Stage 1&2
PGL Cluj-Napoca 2026
IEM Kraków 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter 2026
BLAST Bounty Winter Qual

Upcoming

CSL Elite League 2026
ASL Season 21
Acropolis #4 - TS6
2026 Changsha Offline CUP
Acropolis #4
IPSL Spring 2026
CSLAN 4
HSC XXIX
uThermal 2v2 2026 Main Event
Bellum Gens Elite Stara Zagora 2026
NationLESS Cup
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026
CCT Season 3 Global Finals
IEM Rio 2026
PGL Bucharest 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 1
BLAST Open Spring 2026
ESL Pro League S23 Finals
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.