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Active: 33131 users

Dating a girl with a child?

Blogs > sc4k
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sc4k
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United Kingdom5454 Posts
February 16 2011 11:15 GMT
#1
I hate girl blogs and hate writing/ reading them. Unless there is an amusing segue into some sort of pokemon joke. But I need some opinions and don't care who they're from. I met a girl who's pretty awesome, she's pretty good-looking, pretty intelligent, she has a great music taste and has even toured with some of my favourite metal bands like Nile and Decapitated. But she has a 2 year old kid. He's a nice little chap but I'm only 22 (she's 24). In our country you get supported immensely by the government, and she has a pretty good money situation. I just don't know if I should be getting involved with a girl who if I want to take her out she needs to arrange a babysitter...

Also, she's involved in retarded student protests and underground activity, something I think very low of, but I discussed her politics and she really has no good reasons for doing it, she's not an idiot. She'll probably have stopped it in a year's time anyway.

So sorry there isn't a pokemon related punchline 'cos this is an actual question, but I'll leave you with this funny picture to make up for it:

+ Show Spoiler +
[image loading]



Wolf
Profile Blog Joined April 2010
Korea (South)3290 Posts
February 16 2011 11:17 GMT
#2
Tough call. I wouldn't get involved.
Commentatorhttp://twitter.com/proxywolf
TL+ Member
Tony Campolo
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
New Zealand364 Posts
February 16 2011 11:19 GMT
#3
If she's into feminist stuff you're fucked (financially) - you don't want to be paying child support somewhere down the line for one that's not yours. Watch the movie Blue Valentine. She'll always have the kid as a reminder of the alpha male who fucked her, and as time wears on she'll grow disinterested in you and long for the one who got away.
While you were sleeping last night, 30,000 kids died of starvation or diseases related to malnutrition.
aidnai
Profile Joined January 2010
United States1159 Posts
February 16 2011 11:22 GMT
#4
it takes a lot of maturity man. If she's got a kid and she's dating, she (hopefully) is looking for a more serious relationship, possibly someone to be a father type figure or something. If that's not what you're looking for, I'd say don't string her along. Just man up, initiate conversation about what you both are looking for, if it doesn't line up or make sense for you to be dating, don't do it.
underscore
Profile Joined August 2009
252 Posts
February 16 2011 11:33 GMT
#5
Don't do it, for her sake. She already got a child doesn't need a 2nd (you).
anatem
Profile Joined September 2010
Romania1369 Posts
February 16 2011 11:36 GMT
#6
you're too young, and judging from the way you outlined the context, not mature enough for this kind of relationship. move on, and find someone with a less complicated and demanding situation, for both your sakes.
'Tis with our Judgements as our Watches, none / Go just alike, yet each believes his own.
Divinek
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
Canada4045 Posts
February 16 2011 11:37 GMT
#7
If you really wanna be with someone it shouldn't matter etc. But if you're here asking in the first place it probably isnt a good idea if you have that kind of doubt. It just looks like you're looking for an excuse to not do it, or some wonderful success story that doesn't apply in your situation.
Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.
Oh goodness me, FOX tv where do you get your sight? Can't you keep track, the puck is black. That's why the ice is white.
sc4k
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United Kingdom5454 Posts
February 16 2011 11:46 GMT
#8
I appreciate the advice guys, I'm just looking for some perspectives on the matter. I don't think you can ever be 100% sure of anything.
amd098
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Korea (North)1366 Posts
February 16 2011 12:06 GMT
#9
What I think you should look at, is if you are ready for a serious relationship. She isnt just looking for a boyfriend for a short time, she wants someone she can settle down with and raise a kid. You are not just dating her, you are also going to be getting involved in her kid's life as well. If you are not ready or able to handle that, then its probably best not to go out with her.

But if you are, and things work out for you, she would stick with you for a very long time. She might be more willing to stay and make things work instead of giving up as it would have an effect on her son, so she might be more committed to the relationship than some other women.

My friend had a kid with a girl at 18. Now he is 33 and married to that girl. I've never seen anyone so happy as the two of them, he realized that he is now responsible, and he went through school and got his CPA & MBA and makes a TON of money. He's a great dad, but he would never have gone through college he said if he did not have a daughter to support.

I guess, its just a difference of what the two of you want in a relationship. If you just want someone temporarily, and she wants someone to settle down with, then its best you rethink it through.
North Korea is best Korea!
Silentness
Profile Blog Joined August 2009
United States2821 Posts
February 16 2011 12:09 GMT
#10
uhh I've dated 2 girls with a kid... DONT DO IT!

It might of been 3 girls, but I'm not 100% sure the 3rd girl had a kid or not... she was probably hiding him/her from me.

Trust me the kid will come first over you. This may not seem like a bad thing, but eventually it might become tedious.
GL HF... YOLO..lololollol.
legatus legionis
Profile Joined October 2010
Netherlands559 Posts
February 16 2011 12:11 GMT
#11
I would totally go for it. You can always bail out, it's no problem at all. And you will get see what her being so young with a child is like. I would say that's very interesting. It seems you don't really respect her and I would probably feel the same.
I don't understand this: "she really has no good reasons for doing it, she's not an idiot". Isn't she an idiot because she doesn't have any good reasons?
Anyway, if you keep it minor for now, are sure you won't get sucked in and become accountable for anything, then I would atleast test the waters. glhf
Jathin
Profile Blog Joined February 2005
United States3505 Posts
February 16 2011 12:31 GMT
#12
--- Nuked ---
meegrean
Profile Joined May 2008
Thailand7699 Posts
February 16 2011 12:43 GMT
#13
I personally wouldn't date a girl with a child unless I was 30 or 40 something years old and desperate and lonely. I don't think you can handle the burden just yet.
Brood War loyalist
nttea
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
Sweden4353 Posts
February 16 2011 12:45 GMT
#14
I'd say go for it, there is nothing forcing you to stay around longer than you want to anyway.
Servius_Fulvius
Profile Joined August 2009
United States947 Posts
February 16 2011 12:54 GMT
#15
On February 16 2011 21:09 Silentness wrote:
Trust me the kid will come first over you. This may not seem like a bad thing, but eventually it might become tedious.


This is the only downside to the situation IF you consider it a downside. You could view it one of two ways: she was/is irresponsible enough to get pregnant from an old relationship/hookup OR having a child forces her to grow up in many ways and you could date a girl who's years beyond the typical 20-25-year-old age group.

But hey, if you like her go for it and see how it works out
quirinus
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
Croatia2489 Posts
February 16 2011 13:06 GMT
#16
Don't get involved. (unless you absolutely know what you're doing)

Kids are huge thing. Parents don't have time for anything else, and the kid is the first thing over everything. If you don't have any experience with kids, don't do it. Hell, even if you do, stay away. xD
All candles lit within him, and there was purity. | First auto-promoted BW LP editor.
JoFu
Profile Joined May 2010
United States25 Posts
February 16 2011 13:21 GMT
#17
I'm surprised you're not more turned off by this:
"Also, she's involved in retarded student protests and underground activity, something I think very low of, but I discussed her politics and she really has no good reasons for doing it, she's not an idiot. She'll probably have stopped it in a year's time anyway."

Loving how much "stay the fuck away from women with kids" I'm seeing. I guess if you really need "all of her attention all of the time", then this is a bad call. Really, I don't see a problem with it. Yeah, it may get complicated having to get a babysitter, but it makes that time seem more special. I dated a girl who had to take care of her 3 sisters and little brother every Friday and Saturday night because her parents were more social than she was, apparently. It was actually kind of fun, and you wind up looking like a pro every night when they all get put to bed having dealt with all of that. And needless to say, that pays off very well for you.
wut
Catch]22
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Sweden2683 Posts
February 16 2011 13:42 GMT
#18
Listen to your boner.
Sephy90
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United States1785 Posts
February 16 2011 13:59 GMT
#19
On February 16 2011 22:21 JoFu wrote:
I'm surprised you're not more turned off by this:
"Also, she's involved in retarded student protests and underground activity, something I think very low of, but I discussed her politics and she really has no good reasons for doing it, she's not an idiot. She'll probably have stopped it in a year's time anyway."

Loving how much "stay the fuck away from women with kids" I'm seeing. I guess if you really need "all of her attention all of the time", then this is a bad call. Really, I don't see a problem with it. Yeah, it may get complicated having to get a babysitter, but it makes that time seem more special. I dated a girl who had to take care of her 3 sisters and little brother every Friday and Saturday night because her parents were more social than she was, apparently. It was actually kind of fun, and you wind up looking like a pro every night when they all get put to bed having dealt with all of that. And needless to say, that pays off very well for you.

Dating a single mom is way different than dating a girl who had to take care of her siblings only 2 times out of the week yo. That might've seemed like nothing to you but being a single parent is full-time job and it might get annoying that you don't get as much time with her as you want. Sure at first you don't mind but over the course of time you'll probably get tired of it.

OP Since you sound kind of hesitant you should forget about her. You say she's awesome but come on you should know there are other awesome girls out there ^_^. Also I said you sound hesitant but it seems like you want to give this a shot so if you feel like you should then do it but just don't get yourself hurt ^_^. Again my advice is stay away.
"So I turned the lights off at night and practiced by myself"
DoubleZee
Profile Joined July 2010
Canada556 Posts
February 16 2011 14:10 GMT
#20
MILF? Hit it and quit it. You're too young to have a (step)child.
Just think of how stupid the average person is, and then realize half of them are even stupider!
bonifaceviii
Profile Joined May 2010
Canada2890 Posts
February 16 2011 14:13 GMT
#21
If you already have doubts, don't do it. The doubts are not going to go away.
Stay a while and listen || http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=354018
telfire
Profile Joined May 2010
United States415 Posts
February 16 2011 14:35 GMT
#22
For me personally there is no way I'm at a point in life to become a father. That's like, instant life change, no more time for StarCraft, etc. It's really massive.
mucker
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
United States1120 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-16 15:24:21
February 16 2011 15:22 GMT
#23
I wouldn't want to generalize too much but here's my experience. The situation was different from the OP's, the girl I dated was 27 and her kid was 9 and she worked quite a bit too.

I dated her for about 5 months a couple years ago. I liked her quite a bit but the situation got tiresome really fast. If the kid isn't her top priority then she's a shitty person and you're not going to want to be with her anyways. It was tough, however, dating someone and being low on her priority list. I basically couldn't be spontaneous, I had to call at certain times, I couldn't just show up or spring plans on her on a whim, little weekend getaways were usually out of the question, we couldn't stay out all night when we did go out, etc.

After the inital 'wow we like each other!' getting to know one another funtimes it started to feel a little one sided. I was basically on call in the event that a situation would arise where we could spend some time together and started to restrict my social life, rarely making plans in advance with my friends. I had to make her a super high priority for it to work. It became clear that our lives just didn't fit together. I started feeling bad anytime I was out having fun or doing something interesting because next time I'd talk to her and she would never have any fun stories to share.

In the end she made it clear that the next progression for the relationship would be for the kid to become a bigger part of it. The three of us doing things together on the weekend, me hanging out there and playing with the kid for an evening rather than her and I going out, etc. The kid was cute and all but that was totally not what I wanted my life to be like. It was over pretty quickly after that.

It's supposed to be automatic but actually you have to press this button.
StorkHwaiting
Profile Blog Joined October 2009
United States3465 Posts
February 16 2011 15:29 GMT
#24
lol it says she's intelligent, but then goes on to say a lot of things that kind of suggest she's anything but intelligent.
sc4k
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United Kingdom5454 Posts
February 16 2011 15:30 GMT
#25
Thanks Mucker, that was really useful...thanks for everyone else. I see the objections that are coming up. Might take me a while to make a decision!
Thrill
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
2599 Posts
February 16 2011 16:21 GMT
#26
A metal roadie chick with a kid who's "pretty" everything?

Dream come true!

Then again, if you step in; you might be raising the offspring of one of your metal idols, never know!
QuanticHawk
Profile Blog Joined May 2007
United States32045 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-16 16:34:07
February 16 2011 16:33 GMT
#27
Something you think very low of???

More retarded: Student protests and 'underground activities' (whatever the fuck that is) or

[image loading]
decisions, decisions

PROFESSIONAL GAMER - SEND ME OFFERS TO JOIN YOUR TEAM - USA USA USA
xarthaz
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
1704 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-16 16:39:13
February 16 2011 16:39 GMT
#28
The child always comes first to woman, thats the big thing to consider
Aah thats the stuff..
amd098
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Korea (North)1366 Posts
February 16 2011 16:43 GMT
#29
If you bond with the child she will be closer to you as well though. She wouldn't think of anyone else as they might not be as nice to her kid.
North Korea is best Korea!
thehorsebecomesking
Profile Joined February 2011
189 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-16 23:49:18
February 16 2011 18:44 GMT
#30
On February 16 2011 20:19 Tony Campolo wrote:
If she's into feminist stuff you're fucked (financially) - you don't want to be paying child support somewhere down the line for one that's not yours. Watch the movie Blue Valentine. She'll always have the kid as a reminder of the alpha male who fucked her, and as time wears on she'll grow disinterested in you and long for the one who got away.


this has to be the funniest thing ive read all day. if you wish to use queer terms then 'alpha male' would actually be the guy who isnt afraid to get with her even though she has a kid

On February 16 2011 20:33 underscore wrote:
Don't do it, for her sake. She already got a child doesn't need a 2nd (you).


ahaha well played sir, well played

i am dating someone who has a child, its a different situation because her kid isnt with her right now. but to be honest with you this relationship is the best and deepest i've ever had. so by all means dont let her kid discourage you
NuKedUFirst
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
Canada3139 Posts
February 16 2011 20:53 GMT
#31
get some.

No but seriously, I hate kids so I probably wouldn't but if you don't mind kids and like responsibility go for it, I mean, you said she is pretty awesome right? As for politics, I don't see why people need to get involved in other peoples politics.
FrostedMiniWeet wrote: I like winning because it validates all the bloody time I waste playing SC2.
D10
Profile Blog Joined December 2007
Brazil3409 Posts
February 16 2011 21:18 GMT
#32
Sounds excelent, hit it, raise her kid to be either an elite fighter or an elite progammer and make profit
" We are not humans having spiritual experiences. - We are spirits having human experiences." - Pierre Teilhard de Chardin
SpoR
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States1542 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-16 22:13:47
February 16 2011 22:10 GMT
#33
On February 16 2011 20:22 aidnai wrote:
it takes a lot of maturity man. If she's got a kid and she's dating, she (hopefully) is looking for a more serious relationship, possibly someone to be a father type figure or something. If that's not what you're looking for, I'd say don't string her along. Just man up, initiate conversation about what you both are looking for, if it doesn't line up or make sense for you to be dating, don't do it.

not always true actually. I know lots of girls that have kids and they don't know what the fuck they want. I mean they had a kid and their life was unstable, what makes you think that would change them?
No offense to OP girl or women in general, but I think you have to be pretty stupid to have a kid when you don't want one to begin with/or do want one but are not stable (with a guy you're not 150% sure is going to stay and be a good relationship/father). I may just be an asshole though because I am biased.
A man is what he thinks about all day long.
FakePlasticLove
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
United States357 Posts
February 16 2011 22:18 GMT
#34
Yeah go watch Blue Valentine with her.
All walls are great if the roof doesn't fall
Sleight
Profile Blog Joined May 2009
2471 Posts
February 17 2011 01:50 GMT
#35
I didn't quite understand why there was a problem in the first place. If you don't want to be responsible for helping raise a kid and improving his life, then don't get involved. If you like her and enjoy the idea of helping someone grow up with love and support, then do that.

Don't let it be a dilemma. Just decide what you feel comfortable with.
One Love
palanq
Profile Blog Joined December 2004
United States761 Posts
February 17 2011 02:51 GMT
#36
so you (1) don't want to get involved with her 2 yr old child and (2) don't respect her because of these dumb protest things. what she has going for her is (1) looks (presumably) and (2) good taste in music?

sounds like a bad deal.
time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana
lastmotion
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
368 Posts
February 17 2011 03:01 GMT
#37
On February 17 2011 07:18 FakePlasticLove wrote:
Yeah go watch Blue Valentine with her.


This. lol
Hidden_MotiveS
Profile Blog Joined February 2010
Canada2562 Posts
February 17 2011 08:27 GMT
#38
On February 16 2011 20:15 sc4k wrote:
I met a girl who's pretty awesome, she's pretty good-looking, pretty intelligent, she has a great music taste and has even toured with some of my favourite metal bands like Nile and Decapitated. But she has a 2 year old kid.

She can't be that intelligent if she listens to metal, goes to tours(first thing that came to my mind is she got knocked up at one), and is a single mother(imagery of her doing douchebag men). You make her into an idealization.

In our country you get supported immensely by the government, and she has a pretty good money situation.

Cool, but money shouldn't be the big issue if you know you love this girl.

I just don't know if I should be getting involved with a girl who if I want to take her out she needs to arrange a babysitter...

If you really are bothered with this girl getting a babysitter, you're not ready for this commitment.

Also, she's involved in retarded student protests and underground activity, something I think very low of, but I discussed her politics and she really has no good reasons for doing it, she's not an idiot. She'll probably have stopped it in a year's time anyway.

How can you be sure she'll have stopped in a year?

Were I in your situation, I'd have a tough time making the decision too. I may sound critical of the relationship, but that's only because I'm an outsider, I don't love this girl, and I'm making objective comments.
thehorsebecomesking
Profile Joined February 2011
189 Posts
February 17 2011 08:41 GMT
#39
On February 17 2011 12:01 lastmotion wrote:
Show nested quote +
On February 17 2011 07:18 FakePlasticLove wrote:
Yeah go watch Blue Valentine with her.


This. lol


believe it or not this thread made me watch it. great movie, made my gf sad for a bit. i think shes really worried about the future of our relationship so it was actually great for us to watch together
Zim23
Profile Joined August 2010
United States1681 Posts
Last Edited: 2011-02-17 08:58:57
February 17 2011 08:58 GMT
#40
Find out about the baby daddy situation, naw mean??? If there is even 1 ounce of drama bail or hit it and then proceed to quit it.
Do an arranged marriage if she's not completely minging, and don't worry about dancing, get a go-kart, cheers.
DoctorHelvetica
Profile Blog Joined July 2008
United States15034 Posts
February 17 2011 09:03 GMT
#41
what's her sign?
RIP Aaliyah
Firereaver
Profile Blog Joined October 2010
India1701 Posts
February 17 2011 09:07 GMT
#42
If you were older and more mature then probably yes... But the situation as it is - NOO WAYY!!
And please dont hit it and quit it like the majority of idiots will suggest here... Shes already probably got enuff shit in her past and present life to handle without more from you.
My 2 cents.

"They drone drone drone , me win" - JangMinChul(Iron/oGsMC)
Fen
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
Australia1848 Posts
February 17 2011 09:19 GMT
#43
Are you ready to have kids of your own?

If no, then don't bother. If yes, then consider how you feel about raising someone elses child.

Single mothers are either looking for a random hookup or a father for their child. Seeing as you're considering dating her, then its obviously not a random hookup. So by dating her, you are also accepting the role of being the father to that child, because as you get more and more involved with each other, that is what you will be expected to do.
Rekrul
Profile Blog Joined November 2002
Korea (South)17174 Posts
February 17 2011 09:39 GMT
#44
DON'T
why so 진지해?
Kickboxer
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Slovenia1308 Posts
February 19 2011 10:43 GMT
#45
Taking care of another man's kid is the ultimate Darwinian failure :p

I might sound like a total prick, but that's the one situation in life I'd never, ever get into.

Hell, for the bohemian twenty-something nerd it sucks enough to have your own kid!

A friend of mine had his not long ago and he's basically disappeared off the face of the world.
jacen
Profile Blog Joined April 2004
Austria3644 Posts
February 19 2011 12:35 GMT
#46
On February 17 2011 18:39 Rekrul wrote:
DON'T


Spokem like a boss!
And true too.
(micronesia) lol we aren't going to just permban you (micronesia) "we" excludes Jinro
thesideshow
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
930 Posts
February 19 2011 13:51 GMT
#47
If you have to ask, you're not ready for it. Don't do it!
OGS:levelchange
Never.Die
Profile Joined March 2010
Japan189 Posts
February 19 2011 14:31 GMT
#48
Yeah just sex her up whenever you feel like it. Make it something that's no strings attached. Something on the side.
tonight
Profile Blog Joined November 2006
United States11130 Posts
February 19 2011 14:38 GMT
#49
I dated a girl with a kid sometime ago. I didn't care at first, but it gets weird going over there and having him wanting to hangout and start asking for me. In the end that's why I had to end it. I wasn't ready to be a dad figure to anyone.
if I come without a thing, then I come with all I need @tonightsend
kellymilkies
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Singapore1393 Posts
February 20 2011 04:18 GMT
#50
If you are not going to be serious don't do it. It will hurt not only her when you guys end it but also the Child which is really a bad situation if that happens.

Good luck with whatever you decide. Unless you are ready to go for a long term relationship I suggest you guys just stay as friend. Think of the kid.
Be the change you wish to see in the world ^-^V //
Torenhire
Profile Blog Joined April 2009
United States11681 Posts
February 20 2011 04:21 GMT
#51
On February 17 2011 18:39 Rekrul wrote:
DON'T


This should be the only reply you read in the thread, sc4k :D

also welcome back
SirJolt: Well maybe if you weren't so big and stupid, it wouldn't have hit you.
AlphaWhale
Profile Joined December 2010
Australia328 Posts
February 20 2011 06:32 GMT
#52
On February 16 2011 21:09 Silentness wrote:
Trust me the kid will come first over you. This may not seem like a bad thing, but eventually it might become tedious.


Unless the woman is a bronze league mother, the child will always come first - even if it's both of yours.
The icon for diamond league is actually a sapphire.
MetalMarine
Profile Joined June 2007
United States1559 Posts
February 20 2011 06:58 GMT
#53
Opposite of Nike... DON'T do it...
CapnAmerica
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
United States508 Posts
February 20 2011 07:30 GMT
#54
If you even have to ask yourself and you aren't sure at 22, that's pretty much 100% don't do it.

You never want to take a huge step like that without thinking it through first. Having a girlfriend is one thing, having a kid is another (and if you are committed to the relationship, they will become your kid). If you don't feel comfortable, give yourself more time to do your own thing. It's better to discover someone who fits perfectly for you somewhere down the line than to be sitting in your bedroom wanting to kill yourself because you're fed up with the kid's nagging.
After all this time, I still haven't figured out the correlation between sexual orientation and beating an unprepared opponent. Are homosexuals the next koreans? Many players seem to think it's an unfair advantage. - pandaburn
kNightLite
Profile Blog Joined December 2010
United States408 Posts
February 20 2011 08:21 GMT
#55
I think much it depends upon whether you want to be a surrogate father. Because even if you don't fill that role in the beginning of the relationship, you must face it eventually should the relationship get serious.

As long as you're cool with the surrogate father thing, I say give it a chance. Who knows, you may end up loving the kid just as much as the girl. You won't know until you try.

However if you're not comfortable with the surrogate father thing, then you need to be up-front about that with the mother and establish some boundaries. The last thing you want to do is set up false expectations.
Rabbitmaster
Profile Joined August 2010
1357 Posts
February 20 2011 11:35 GMT
#56
On February 16 2011 20:33 underscore wrote:
Don't do it, for her sake. She already got a child doesn't need a 2nd (you).

This, and no offense.
God is dead.
sc4k
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United Kingdom5454 Posts
February 23 2011 17:59 GMT
#57
Alright chaps, I decided not to do it.
Torte de Lini
Profile Blog Joined September 2010
Germany38463 Posts
February 23 2011 18:01 GMT
#58
To be honest... it wasn't that hard of a decision for others to make. You guys were clearly on different stages of experience, life and baby-making.
https://twitter.com/#!/TorteDeLini (@TorteDeLini)
sc4k
Profile Blog Joined January 2010
United Kingdom5454 Posts
February 23 2011 18:14 GMT
#59
Yep, not hard for others. It was quite hard for me though!
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