EPThelp my essay. college kid failing :O - Page 2
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Navane
Netherlands2748 Posts
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xbankx
703 Posts
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kakaman
United States1576 Posts
At this point, maybe you should take some time to reflect on what you actually want to do, because it doesn't seem like you have a work ethic to be an engineer (not to mean, I don't have what it takes to be an engineer either). Maybe if you attach this video, it'll help somewhat: | ||
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Sotamursu
Finland612 Posts
On January 02 2011 07:22 Empyrean wrote: Actually, I do believe it to be true. I probably should have been more clear; what I meant to compare were current students at Finnish and American universities. Just take a look at how many people in the United States - in well respected public universities, no less - can't seem to figure out the difference between its/it's, you're/your, etc. People from American universities may be able to speak English "better" in the sense that they are more familiar with colloquialisms and conventions of spoken English, but this is a consequence of English being their first spoken language. When it comes to written English, I have no doubt that the average level of Finns in college is greater than that of Americans. I have to agree with this. I can write better than speak english. A lot of people here share the same problem, if you can call it that. We have to read and write almost on a daily basis, but I rarely get the chance to speak english. This has led to me having a really weird accent. But in my opinion, it's easier to learn to speak better english than to write it. I think it's sort of funny and sad that even though we don't have to pay for college, the level of education is still higher. | ||
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Hidden_MotiveS
Canada2562 Posts
To just be a bit more specific, I would request a biweekly meeting with Lindner or Mayhew. Normally I would just say to use your own voice and grammar to make your essay sound a bit more sincere, more like you... but you've made numerous grammatical mistakes in this revision. I don't want to comment on whether you're cut out to be an engineer or not since I don't know you. I wasted a lot of time in Engineering first year. I didn't get in probation, but I failed a course. What I found useful was getting into a study group second year. I think my fear of letting down myself, in front of others, drove me to work harder. That and they kept me on track. Engineering is still hard. I still have to hope that I passed all my courses instead of knowing it, but I'm dedicating practically every waking hour to this fucked up major. | ||
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tryummm
774 Posts
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tryummm
774 Posts
On January 02 2011 07:37 [Eternal]Phoenix wrote: Engineers are some of the best and worst writers. It can go either way. However, that largely is dependent on whether they're smart or just really hard working. But outside of engineering, the writing is actually worse - borderline illiterate. I'm an engineer and while I'm not an incredible writer it completely boggles my mind when I read peoples' writing. I swear it must be a result of extremely low standards in high schools or just a general lack of proper instruction, because nobody can write well. As for the OP, if you can't put down on paper in 1 sentence why you should stay, you shouldn't. From what I can tell, you lack the maturity to appreciate the importance of discipline in studies. I don't want to be an ass, but you have no business in a serious major like engineering. Go get a job and work for a few years until you're ready. Do not by any means consider taking a retarded major like communications because it's easy. You will just waste time/money and end up with the same poor job options as if you went straight into the workforce. Now if you truly believe you can do this, then explain in 1 sentence why they should let you stay. I cannot stress how important it is to make your essay 1 very brief and succinct reason, and then you can just support it, or explain what you've learned from your mistakes. If you just meander you'll never get approved. Why are you telling him to get a job? First of all, that's the absolute worst way to make money. The idea of getting a job originates from before the industrial revolution and it does not work well in today's economy. 1% of the population make 95% of all the money. This 1% of the population do not have 9-5 jobs. I would suggest that the OP no matter how smart he is currently is, has an absolutely perfect memory. It currently isn't being expressed because of paradigms (habits programmed in the subconscious mind) that came from past generations in his family and the people around him. If he simply changes the programming and develops his memory, imagination, intuition, will, desire, etc...he can major in engineering or any major he wants. Maybe instead of looking at looking at why people can't do something you should spend some time looking at why they can do something. Majoring in engineering really isn't that impressive, just look at how many people have done it. The issue here is perception. | ||
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heroyi
United States1064 Posts
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[Eternal]Phoenix
United States333 Posts
On January 02 2011 13:02 tryummm wrote: Why are you telling him to get a job? First of all, that's the absolute worst way to make money. The idea of getting a job originates from before the industrial revolution and it does not work well in today's economy. 1% of the population make 95% of all the money. This 1% of the population do not have 9-5 jobs. I would suggest that the OP no matter how smart he is currently is, has an absolutely perfect memory. It currently isn't being expressed because of paradigms (habits programmed in the subconscious mind) that came from past generations in his family and the people around him. If he simply changes the programming and develops his memory, imagination, intuition, will, desire, etc...he can major in engineering or any major he wants. Maybe instead of looking at looking at why people can't do something you should spend some time looking at why they can do something. Majoring in engineering really isn't that impressive, just look at how many people have done it. The issue here is perception. Yes and he can learn how to fly and join the unicorns in gumdrop land. You shouldn't be allowed to post here. | ||
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Half
United States2554 Posts
edit: And I don't mean that as a quip about your poor writing just for lulzys. Part of succeeding is recognizing and working to amend your weaknesses, not just pretending its "alright", or that it can be ignored. | ||
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HULKAMANIA
United States1219 Posts
I. What's your deadline? If we know how long you have to turn this in, we know how long we have available to whip your essay into shape. I'm on a break from school. I am willing to devote a considerable amount of time to helping you avoid engineering-school expulsion, but let's get real here and put this shit on a timeline. II. What got you into this situation in the first place? We need specifics. You say that what got you into a fix with your department was that you "screwed up in college." You've also said that your advisors want you to put a "huge emphasis" on the tangible changes that you have made to obviate similar screw-ups in the future. It's hard for us to help you articulate those changes if we don't know what your changing out of and what you intend to change into. Details, details, details. III. What's your thesis? Right now your essay would not convince me. I think you sound like some guy in the middle of an airplane crash making a deal with God. You'll give your whole paycheck to charity; you'll quit beating your wife; you'll kick the porn habit; etc. etc. As a professor, I don't put much stock in the promises of a desperate student, and I doubt yours will either. A good persuasive essay will read less like a laundry list and more like an argument (an argument that certain items from your list will support but not an argument that your list will entirely comprise). A search for a thesis will go back to item II. Your thesis must communicate what change you have undergone. The rest of your essay must evidence that change. IV. Forget about grammar, syntax, and punctuation for now. Any competent editor will be able to correct all that bullshit in a once-over. It's small beans. Right now you need to fix your eyes upon the big picture. You need to worry about what you can say that will save your ass. So table the proofreading for now, and work on getting some thought on paper that's quality enough to warrant proofreading. | ||
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heroyi
United States1064 Posts
48hrs effectivily II. What got you into this situation in the first place? arrogance. I thought I could do the bare minimum work (skip online hw, skip lectures, cram for exams etc.) and slide by my classes. Obviously I cannot. unmotivated. At least that is what everyone is telling me :/ Had no agenda. III. What's your thesis? Honestly your response is conflicting with what others have said :/. But i trust you more. Anyway what they want to know is what has changed about me (to see if I am really sincere about this). They stated that, "The question to be answered is what is different now relative to the last terms. Tangible changes must occur or else there is no reason to expect a different result." So my strategy was looking: unmotivated/arrogance--> wellness center to gain some insight as to why. lazy/not doing work---->rest of the argument (friend checking on schedule, academic recovery program etc.) | ||
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Ilikestarcraft
Korea (South)17727 Posts
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HULKAMANIA
United States1219 Posts
I also like your explanation of your failures thus far. The word "arrogance" might be a bit cliched, but I think I'm with you as far as what you're saying. So let's brainstorm into articulating your original problem as clearly as possible. My guess is this: you're a naturally intelligent student. In high school you found that you could do the bare minimum and still get the grades. Your laziness in the classroom produced very little backwards drag on your academic progress. But in college those same academic habits have eventuated in the crisis you're now experiencing. That's just my guess. It happens to a lot of smart kids during the transition into their college majors. The point is that a clearly stated problem like that basically generates your thesis for you. Your thesis is that your poor study habits have hitherto produced no consequences. This current unpleasantness has taught you, however, has painfully taught you that poor study habits do have consequences in a higher education environment. That's what you've learned. You, because of your genuine love for engineering and your genuine desire to continue in the program, would like the opportunity to demonstrate that you have learned that lesson. That's the change. Then you can proceed to outline the concrete plans you have to demonstrate your lesson learned. But we'll worry about support later. First let's put a good intro paragraph on paper that culminates in a good thesis statement, however different from or similar to the one I've just written it is. (A note on style: I would think about this as a personal letter to a social superior, which it is. Be direct. Be plainly spoken. Be respectful. You want to state your case without resorting to either sentimentality or impersonality. Imagine you're addressing a judge. You want to acknowledge that you've done wrong in such a way that doesn't invite further punishment.) | ||
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n.DieJokes
United States3443 Posts
On January 02 2011 07:22 Empyrean wrote: Actually, I do believe it to be true. I probably should have been more clear; what I meant to compare were current students at Finnish and American universities. Just take a look at how many people in the United States - in well respected public universities, no less - can't seem to figure out the difference between its/it's, you're/your, etc. People from American universities may be able to speak English "better" in the sense that they are more familiar with colloquialisms and conventions of spoken English, but this is a consequence of English being their first spoken language. When it comes to written English, I have no doubt that the average level of Finns in college is greater than that of Americans. I don't like this kind of argument... I can't really prove or disprove your claim but I think your sampling is biased. The Fins on this site are here because they are comfortable with the language and proactive with their grammar. You have a wider spectrum of American posters and the bad stands out. | ||
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heroyi
United States1064 Posts
On January 02 2011 15:37 HULKAMANIA wrote: 48 hours, excellent. We can work with this. I also like your explanation of your failures thus far. The word "arrogance" might be a bit cliched, but I think I'm with you as far as what you're saying. So let's brainstorm into articulating your original problem as clearly as possible. My guess is this: you're a naturally intelligent student. In high school you found that you could do the bare minimum and still get the grades. Your laziness in the classroom produced very little backwards drag on your academic progress. But in college those same academic habits have eventuated in the crisis you're now experiencing. That's just my guess. It happens to a lot of smart kids during the transition into their college majors. The point is that a clearly stated problem like that basically generates your thesis for you. Your thesis is that your poor study habits have hitherto produced no consequences. This current unpleasantness has taught you, however, has painfully taught you that poor study habits do have consequences in a higher education environment. That's what you've learned. You, because of your genuine love for engineering and your genuine desire to continue in the program, would like the opportunity to demonstrate that you have learned that lesson. That's the change. Then you can proceed to outline the concrete plans you have to demonstrate your lesson learned. But we'll worry about support later. First let's put a good intro paragraph on paper that culminates in a good thesis statement, however different from or similar to the one I've just written it is. (A note on style: I would think about this as a personal letter to a social superior, which it is. Be direct. Be plainly spoken. Be respectful. You want to state your case without resorting to either sentimentality or impersonality. Imagine you're addressing a judge. You want to acknowledge that you've done wrong in such a way that doesn't invite further punishment.) I write this as a plea that you allow me to stay and continue my education in the College of Engineering. For the past year and a half I've made bad choices that have led me to this situation.The reason for such poor choices were simply because of my poor study habits. In my high school I was able to do the bare minimum yet still receive satisfactory grades. During that time, my poor study habit produced no consequences. However, I painfully see that now my poor study habits do have consequences in higher levels of education. Despite the the consequences of my actions, I still wish to be an engineer. I ask that you allow me to stay give me the opportunity to demonstrate I have learned my lesson. ? | ||
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419
Russian Federation3631 Posts
I don't know much about how college works in the states, but don't these places have any decent standards? In a word, no. In several words, blame the excessive devaluation of the college degree in the American workplace. Actually, I do believe it to be true. I probably should have been more clear; what I meant to compare were current students at Finnish and American universities. Just take a look at how many people in the United States - in well respected public universities, no less - can't seem to figure out the difference between its/it's, you're/your, etc. People from American universities may be able to speak English "better" in the sense that they are more familiar with colloquialisms and conventions of spoken English, but this is a consequence of English being their first spoken language. When it comes to written English, I have no doubt that the average level of Finns in college is greater than that of Americans. So basically you're proposing some measure of English competence for which no reliable metric exists, and then claiming that Finns have a higher English competence on average based on this standard? Whether your conclusion is true or not (you're probably right, I'll give you that), it is still unwarranted. --- So to contribute: A. Listen to HULKMANIA, he knows what he's talking about B. I want to pursue this major because the idea and concept is based on who I am. I love solving problems by critical thinking and doing so in innovative ways. This is quite literally the worst way to go about expressing your love for engineering. Do you have any specific interests in mind? | ||
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Djzapz
Canada10681 Posts
This is quite literally the worst way to go about expressing your love for engineering. Do you have any specific interests in mind? Yeah I agree. A large portion of engineering is adapting something that's been done before with nothing fancy. Make sure this structure lasts under 4 feet of snow, push that paper. Most engineers won't do much innovation in their career, and I can think of a few who don't use critical thinking very much. | ||
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HULKAMANIA
United States1219 Posts
On January 02 2011 16:29 heroyi wrote: I write this as a plea that you allow me to stay and continue my education in the College of Engineering. For the past year and a half I've made bad choices that have led me to this situation.The reason for such poor choices were simply because of my poor study habits. In my high school I was able to do the bare minimum yet still receive satisfactory grades. During that time, my poor study habit produced no consequences. However, I painfully see that now my poor study habits do have consequences in higher levels of education. Despite the the consequences of my actions, I still wish to be an engineer. I ask that you allow me to stay give me the opportunity to demonstrate I have learned my lesson. ? Excellent. We're getting somewhere now. This is good raw material. Let's work on refining it. First of all, I would like to see you write more like you talk. I don't mean that you should include slang, informalities, etc. etc. What I mean is that you should conceptualize of writing as just another means of getting a point across, a means a simple as a phone call or a chat over coffee. Imagine that you are sitting across the desk from the person to whom you're delivering this essay. How would you communicate your point to him or her? What steps would you have to take, what would you have to say, in order to make sure that point gets across? If you think about writing in terms of a conversation (albeit a slightly more formal one in most cases), it will do wonders for removing the choppiness and artificiality (and thus the implied insincerity) from your prose. So let's reimagine this first paragraph like you're just sitting there explaining yourself. Here's something along the lines of what I would write: I am writing this essay in order request that I be allowed to continue my education in the College of Engineering. The reason that I have to make this request is because I have, so far, shown an unacceptable level of involvement in my classes and consistently earned unacceptably low grades. I haven't always had such problems with my schoolwork, though. In high school, I made excellent grades. I did not study very much. I did not pay much attention in class. I spent my time outside of school playing video games and socializing. And yet I made the grades because I was intelligent enough to succeed in spite of my bad academic habits. I had no idea, in fact, that my habits were so lacking. Those habits got me results. And, when I came to college, I just assumed that what I had always done would continue to work for me. Needless to say, I was wrong. insert specifics about why you want to study engineering here. talk about what the major means to you I am writing this essay because it would be devastating to me to have to give up on my engineering aspirations because of bad habits that I, in my immaturity, carried over from high school.The past few weeks? few years? few semesters? have shown me what sort of effort higher education demands and it is a lot more effort than I have put in so far. But I have learned that lesson. I now understand that college is hard work, that it demands more sacrifice and longer hours than I had given it credit for. And so what I am asking is that you give me the opportunity to demonstrate to you that I have learned that lesson and that I won't repeat the same mistakes I have made up to this point. I am taking all of these precautions... continue rest of essay here OK so obviously that's not how you would write it. And I don't recommend you copying that word for word (especially if the person reading it is familiar with your writing). But that's kind of the pace you need to shoot for. You need to give yourself time to explain yourself, your investment in engineering, and your recent epiphanies about college life. You need to communicate that you've given this a lot of thought and that you know what you're talking about. Write out what you're thinking. Also trust your voice. You know your situation better than anyone. You (of everyone here at teamliquid at least) know the person to whom you're appealing better than anyone else. Take this outline I've written and make it your own. You've got the insight for the job. And like I said: don't worry about making everything perfect. Don't even worry about making everything grammatical. I've got your back where that is concerned. Just make sure everything says what you want to say. I would go ahead an write out another draft of the whole essay if you finish the intro tonight and still have the energy. I am going to bed, but I will check back in when I am up and about tomorrow. Just remember that everything you mentioned in the first post of this thread is good evidence that you have learned your lesson and that you don't plan on making those mistakes again but it's all just that--evidence. The real key to this essay is the point that evidence must support. The real key to this essay is convincing your reader that you've learned from this hard knock and that you've matured because of it. That's, I'm willing to bet at least, the change they're looking for. | ||
Empyrean
16986 Posts
On January 02 2011 16:10 n.DieJokes wrote: I don't like this kind of argument... I can't really prove or disprove your claim but I think your sampling is biased. The Fins on this site are here because they are comfortable with the language and proactive with their grammar. You have a wider spectrum of American posters and the bad stands out. I'm not talking about TL users, I'm talking about college students in general. My assertion is that Finnish college students have a better grasp of the English language than do Americans. I base this on the fact that they are taught good English from a young age, English is very popular in the Scandinavian countries, and the fact that the vast majority of American college students have no business being in higher education, and should instead stop wasting their time and money and enroll in trade school or enter into the job market. Not to derail this thread, because HULKAMANIA's doing a wonderful job helping out the OP, but I think that a major problem plaguing the United States is a strange sense of entitlement to higher education. You have people who think they're cut out for a journalism degree at some random, no-name school who aren't able to differentiate direct objects from indirect objects. A college education should be reserved for those who demonstrate an aptitude and a love for learning, not for just any high school grad who goes on to college because it's somehow "expected" of them. I understand that much of this problem is ingrained in the fact that it's virtually impossible to get a decent job nowadays without a college education; a collegiate degree has become the new high school diploma, and all it results in is legions of communications majors graduating every year, on track to become the baristas and janitors of tomorrow. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I feel that the Finns don't have this bizarre notion that a collegiate degree is the birthright of every citizen. I am fully convinced that if you compare the mean level of English aptitude (I'm defining this as reading comprehension, writing skills, mastery of English usage/conventions, and oral communication) between Finnish college students and American students, you'll find the Finns easily outclass the Americans. EDIT: This is actually quite an interesting discussion. I'm going to open a thread tomorrow in the General Forum where we can discuss this further, since it's now four am and I'd really like to go to sleep >_> EDIT2: To the OP, if you do manage to be readmitted to school, I'd make sure to work hard and exercise some self-control in order to focus on your studies. College isn't something to be taken lightly; you may have been a star student at your high school, but at the university level, you're just another nameless face in the crowd. I ended up quitting Starcraft in college, and ended up having a higher GPA than I did in high school. Many people, from your parents to HULKAMANIA, have invested money and time in order to help you succeed. To fall back into your old habits would be doing a disservice not only to them, but to yourself. | ||
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