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On November 08 2010 17:40 Loanshark wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2010 16:50 ZlaSHeR wrote:1.6 is still the most competitive FPS around, Quake Live is right there as 1b. After that, not much. On November 08 2010 10:18 vica wrote:
Quake skills do not correspond to Counter Strike skills. It takes a while for you to learn how burst works. Sniping may be easier however, but that sometimes depends simply on reflexes. CS1.6 is easily the most skill oriented first person shooter. Combat Arms is nothing. CS:S has larger and more obvious hitboxes, while the bullets don't go in straight lines all the time. It is very confusing. You couldn't be more wrong. I've played both at extremely high levels and can tell you that 1.6 is focused on setups and strats. Quake is a mind game, you have to keep 10 different timers in your head for respawns of mega, red, yellows, shields, weapons, ammo's, the position of your enemy and his progression, using sound to your advantage, positioning, quicker reactions, everything about CS is much more skill based than CS. Yeah I would say that skill-wise Quake is much harder. Doesn't take long to learn how to shoot properly in CS and then you've pretty got the entire skill portion down.
Back in the day, when Fatal1ty was still the FPS god, he switched over to Counter Strike for a while and he was pretty fucking amazing, probably the best CS player around despite only switching to it for shits and giggles
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On November 09 2010 02:14 h3r1n6 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 09 2010 01:13 Kralic wrote:
Skill wise it was the Quake & source engines you could abuse the shit out of them and it was considered skill. You sound so negative there. That's similar to saying for BW, skill wise it was about abusing bugs like muta stacking, hold lurkers and generally working your way around the poor unit ai and it was considered skill.
No nothing negative about it, you had to know what to do to abuse them. Of course aiming is a good skill to have but that is kind of a given. 
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On November 09 2010 03:01 Kralic wrote:Show nested quote +On November 09 2010 02:14 h3r1n6 wrote:On November 09 2010 01:13 Kralic wrote:
Skill wise it was the Quake & source engines you could abuse the shit out of them and it was considered skill. You sound so negative there. That's similar to saying for BW, skill wise it was about abusing bugs like muta stacking, hold lurkers and generally working your way around the poor unit ai and it was considered skill. No nothing negative about it, you had to know what to do to abuse them. Of course aiming is a good skill to have but that is kind of a given.
Since I got into BW, I apply the term mechanics for FPS as well, which includes aim and movement.
Anyway, I guess I read something into it that you didn't intend to say.
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On November 09 2010 02:47 GeneralStan wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2010 17:40 Loanshark wrote:On November 08 2010 16:50 ZlaSHeR wrote:1.6 is still the most competitive FPS around, Quake Live is right there as 1b. After that, not much. On November 08 2010 10:18 vica wrote:
Quake skills do not correspond to Counter Strike skills. It takes a while for you to learn how burst works. Sniping may be easier however, but that sometimes depends simply on reflexes. CS1.6 is easily the most skill oriented first person shooter. Combat Arms is nothing. CS:S has larger and more obvious hitboxes, while the bullets don't go in straight lines all the time. It is very confusing. You couldn't be more wrong. I've played both at extremely high levels and can tell you that 1.6 is focused on setups and strats. Quake is a mind game, you have to keep 10 different timers in your head for respawns of mega, red, yellows, shields, weapons, ammo's, the position of your enemy and his progression, using sound to your advantage, positioning, quicker reactions, everything about CS is much more skill based than CS. Yeah I would say that skill-wise Quake is much harder. Doesn't take long to learn how to shoot properly in CS and then you've pretty got the entire skill portion down. Back in the day, when Fatal1ty was still the FPS god, he switched over to Counter Strike for a while and he was pretty fucking amazing, probably the best CS player around despite only switching to it for shits and giggles
This is actually completely wrong. He was good but definitely no where near one of the best.
Furthermore, LoanShark, there is no team dynamic in Quake, which you seem to be forgetting. Learning how to noscope, wall spam, prefire, and control recoil properly are not easy, but that's not the hard part. Team chemistry and experience are far more valuable and is what sets apart the best from the rest.
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Anybody else played Wolfestein: Enemy Territory ?
Its objective and team based, its not as fast paced as Quake neither as slow paced as CS just the right pace and it had great maps. Very polished game overall.
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Don't mean to put it down or anything but i can't see TF2 being a high level game
i may be completely wrong and if it is im sorry, but i didn't enjoy it much at all since there was no stand, or all around good champion, preferably with just an automatic weapon or so. Everyone has some weird weapon that only works in certain situations.
however, sniping was fun since i thought headshots we're easy :D.. guess i just couldn't really get into it D:
Counter Strike Source like other people have suggested is quite the challenge. i'd go for that
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On November 09 2010 04:44 Asdkmoga wrote:
Don't mean to put it down or anything but i can't see TF2 being a high level game
i may be completely wrong and if it is im sorry, but i didn't enjoy it much at all since there was no stand, or all around good champion, preferably with just an automatic weapon or so. Everyone has some weird weapon that only works in certain situations.
however, sniping was fun since i thought headshots we're easy :D.. guess i just couldn't really get into it D:
Counter Strike Source like other people have suggested is quite the challenge. i'd go for that
Competitive scouts and soldiers are ridiculous, but by far the best one would be C.S 1.6. The problem with COD4 is the weapons are so easy to use and control, theres nothing to it.
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On November 08 2010 09:23 BrowneY wrote:
Counter-strike Source or 1.6? Im thinkin 1.6, but I've heard Counter Strike Source has a bigger community...
Community is bigger, but..
I hope no one's posted about this, but yeah, haha.
Counter Strike is pretty much died for competitive play. Barely any teams scrim, and about half the teams have hackers on them.
The other half are insanely good.
I only scrim now for the lulz and if i'm really bored. It's not really worth it to try and get competitive on CS unless they actually do plan to release a new one, or do better updates.
The community is about 1/3 the size it used to be as well. :[
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I didn't read the entire thread so some of what I'm about to say is probably just a recap of what has been said already. But that being said it depends on what you are looking for. The two FPS that require the most skill are CS and Quake Live by far but it depends on what kind of game you are looking for. CS is all hitscan and a slow-paced FPS compared to other games. It has the largest competitive community and has been around the longest so you'll find no trouble finding a team to get started with.
Quake Live is the fastest paced FPS out there (Warsow doesn't really count since not many people play the game) but it has a weak community outside of Europe. You won't find much competition or LANs for QL in Canada/America but the community that does exist has people of all skill levels. This game has the smallest competitive community in North America since it has no league play or cups for people who aren't professional level.
TF2 is a mix of both games. Most people will say that it's just a pub game but the competitive community in North America is larger than that of Quake Live but significantly smaller than CS (no other games other than SC really compare to CS in the western world). I myself prefer faster paced games and QL fit me perfectly but I stopped playing because of the near nonexistent community (again, talking about America here). TF2 is extremely fun and has it's own leagues, the biggest being ESEA with cash prizes and CEVO although most people don't really care much about CEVO nowadays. Competitive TF2 is played with teams of 6 and certain class limits. The game is really fun and lots of former Quake players are now the top TF2 players if that says anything about the games. There's always scrims to find starting around 9 eastern time.
I am biased to TF2 since I love the game and I recommend you try it out
EDIT: I wanted to add that NO ONE in any of the communities plays the game because people think its the most skilled and best game out there. No one tries to get good at the game to make money like Starcraft. The professional CS and Quake players have been playing since the game came out (for Quake players it would be Quake 3/4). People all play because they love the game and just wanna have fun while moving up in skill at the same time
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On November 09 2010 03:33 javy925 wrote:Show nested quote +On November 09 2010 02:47 GeneralStan wrote:On November 08 2010 17:40 Loanshark wrote:On November 08 2010 16:50 ZlaSHeR wrote:1.6 is still the most competitive FPS around, Quake Live is right there as 1b. After that, not much. On November 08 2010 10:18 vica wrote:
Quake skills do not correspond to Counter Strike skills. It takes a while for you to learn how burst works. Sniping may be easier however, but that sometimes depends simply on reflexes. CS1.6 is easily the most skill oriented first person shooter. Combat Arms is nothing. CS:S has larger and more obvious hitboxes, while the bullets don't go in straight lines all the time. It is very confusing. You couldn't be more wrong. I've played both at extremely high levels and can tell you that 1.6 is focused on setups and strats. Quake is a mind game, you have to keep 10 different timers in your head for respawns of mega, red, yellows, shields, weapons, ammo's, the position of your enemy and his progression, using sound to your advantage, positioning, quicker reactions, everything about CS is much more skill based than CS. Yeah I would say that skill-wise Quake is much harder. Doesn't take long to learn how to shoot properly in CS and then you've pretty got the entire skill portion down. Back in the day, when Fatal1ty was still the FPS god, he switched over to Counter Strike for a while and he was pretty fucking amazing, probably the best CS player around despite only switching to it for shits and giggles This is actually completely wrong. He was good but definitely no where near one of the best. Furthermore, LoanShark, there is no team dynamic in Quake, which you seem to be forgetting. Learning how to noscope, wall spam, prefire, and control recoil properly are not easy, but that's not the hard part. Team chemistry and experience are far more valuable and is what sets apart the best from the rest.
team chemistry can just be there though. i've played on enough teams and won enough divisions with pugs and/or ringers to know that.
edit: nothing to do with 1.6 or quake, but cs:s is EZ PZ... if you've played any games besides 1.6 and have a good understanding of the basics of cs, source is one of the easiest games ever. the north american scene is non-existent/almost talentless though. there's probably 10-20 players who are really any good and still play it.
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On November 09 2010 02:47 GeneralStan wrote:Show nested quote +On November 08 2010 17:40 Loanshark wrote:On November 08 2010 16:50 ZlaSHeR wrote:1.6 is still the most competitive FPS around, Quake Live is right there as 1b. After that, not much. On November 08 2010 10:18 vica wrote:
Quake skills do not correspond to Counter Strike skills. It takes a while for you to learn how burst works. Sniping may be easier however, but that sometimes depends simply on reflexes. CS1.6 is easily the most skill oriented first person shooter. Combat Arms is nothing. CS:S has larger and more obvious hitboxes, while the bullets don't go in straight lines all the time. It is very confusing. You couldn't be more wrong. I've played both at extremely high levels and can tell you that 1.6 is focused on setups and strats. Quake is a mind game, you have to keep 10 different timers in your head for respawns of mega, red, yellows, shields, weapons, ammo's, the position of your enemy and his progression, using sound to your advantage, positioning, quicker reactions, everything about CS is much more skill based than CS. Yeah I would say that skill-wise Quake is much harder. Doesn't take long to learn how to shoot properly in CS and then you've pretty got the entire skill portion down. Back in the day, when Fatal1ty was still the FPS god, he switched over to Counter Strike for a while and he was pretty fucking amazing, probably the best CS player around despite only switching to it for shits and giggles
You have no idea what you are talking about. We laughed Fatal1ty out of the CS community within like three weeks. Quake and CS have little in common. That's like comparing StarCraft to DoTA.
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I'm currently going through Quake Live and Team Fortress 2. Retrying Quake Live, and TF2 seems extremely team oriented. Are there any other suggestions?
Going to be purchasing CS1.6 soon.
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Quake Live is totally awesome, i think its one of the highest skilled FPS games out there, you need to have so much map awareness, have lightning fast reflex, good predicition skills, a good judgement of time in your head (for respawning of armours etc.)
all around the best game to get into competetively imo.
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Counter strike definitely... still has a lot of betting matches here in our islands.
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EPT
