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I preface this post by saying that I've been seeing doctors and have tried a variety of over-the-counter and prescription sleep medication, but am simply looking for alternative ideas from you fine people.
I sleep very irregularly. Sometimes I sleep for 3 hours, other times for 14, and often times not at all.
The doctor says much of this has to do with clinical depression, but I'm on my third trial medication, and that stuff takes of weening on/off doses to see if they work. First it was Paxil, then it was Prozac and now it's Effexor, all of which have drowsiness as a side effect but don't seem to make me tired.
I've tried the old tricks- Read a book in a different room for 30 minutes, run a few laps around your house, take a warm shower, drink a glass of milk, etc. They work on rare occasion, but when I discover I'm still awake at 2am and have to wake up at 5, it's almost not worth trying to sleep anyway.
I'm open to any ideas. Usually I just get Starbucks in the morning if I've encountered a sleepless night, but you can imagine that may be an expensive alternative (and maybe screwing my sleep up even more.) I'm not pulling my hair out or anything, thankfully- I can operate pretty well when I'm tired- I just wish it wasn't so.
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I had similar problems,I had then consulted a doctor and i was told that i have a anxiety disorder/depression/mood disorder. all of this was affecting my sleeping in one way or ther other. i strongly suggest you speak with a doctor asap.
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United States24698 Posts
Most doctors can't help you with this issue. Most people shouldn't use medication to improve their sleep in the long run.
I wrote a guide on this topic a while back that I received a lot of positive feedback on. I still get messages to this day from people telling me it greatly improved their sleep without the use of medicine, supplements, or major lifestyle changes. I strongly recommend you read this.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=95375
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@footymd - Reading must be hard 
@Micro - reading now :O
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I just masturbate on my bed, pee, and sleep. But I used to have a regular sleep cycle before midterm season.
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Lol, I have extremely erratic sleep, tried everything and nothing works.
except disconnecting my internet....then I get bored and go to sleep at normal times.
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Oh just to give a bit of perspective, in high school and college I had a lot of sleeping issue... name them I probably had them.
When I started working for real it was becoming a major issue... for example, I wrote a blog about how I was worried I would fall asleep at the wheel in the morning:
http://www.teamliquid.net/blogs/viewblog.php?id=61025
Then I read a book 'say goodnight to insomnia' where I learned about ways to improve your sleep. I am now fairly energetic in the morning (no coffee required) and getting reasonable amounts of sleep. My guide is based on that book, which was written by one of the few published people on the topic who actually seems to know what he's talking about.
There's tons of information about sleep that is completely misinformed unfortunately. Just reading my guide to correct some misconceptions alone can result in somewhat improved sleep.
On November 03 2010 16:06 sob3k wrote:
Lol, I have extremely erratic sleep, tried everything and nothing works.
except disconnecting my internet....then I get bored and go to sleep at normal times.
Yeah it's pretty easy to just remained engaged in browsing the web until late at night... and this is one behavior your have to work on specifically until you develop better habits which allow you to go asleep right after using your computer.
I've learned I can't go to bed right after playing a game of sc2 but I can right after doing certain other things on my computer like watching an episode of something. It all depends on the individual.
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On November 03 2010 15:58 Nokarot wrote:
I preface this post by saying that I've been seeing doctors and have tried a variety of over-the-counter and prescription sleep medication, but am simply looking for alternative ideas from you fine people.
I sleep very irregularly. Sometimes I sleep for 3 hours, other times for 14, and often times not at all.
The doctor says much of this has to do with clinical depression, but I'm on my third trial medication, and that stuff takes of weening on/off doses to see if they work. First it was Paxil, then it was Prozac and now it's Effexor, all of which have drowsiness as a side effect but don't seem to make me tired.
I've tried the old tricks- Read a book in a different room for 30 minutes, run a few laps around your house, take a warm shower, drink a glass of milk, etc. They work on rare occasion, but when I discover I'm still awake at 2am and have to wake up at 5, it's almost not worth trying to sleep anyway.
I'm open to any ideas. Usually I just get Starbucks in the morning if I've encountered a sleepless night, but you can imagine that may be an expensive alternative (and maybe screwing my sleep up even more.) I'm not pulling my hair out or anything, thankfully- I can operate pretty well when I'm tired- I just wish it wasn't so.
I also went on Paxil, and then Prozac, and then more Prozac, and then more Prozac, and then Prozac with Seroquel, and then Prozac with more Seroquel. My sleep never improved, and depression only improved for the first week of each dosage change. Drug tolerance sucks.
As far as your sleep goes, I recommend taking a few nights and really dedicating yourself to trying to sleep.
Keep the lights low/off when the sun goes down. Take a warm bath, and then lie down and watch a relaxing movie that you've seen before. Something like A River Runs Through It. Personally, the anime "Mushishi" I find is highly relaxing and helped me sleep. Take some melatonin, as well. Make sure there are no little LEDS or illuminated clocks in your bedroom, and if there are, turn them off or throw clothes over them.
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There's a fine kind of herbs that at least helped my sleep issues. I'll leave it at that.
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On November 03 2010 16:15 Zerokaiser wrote:
As far as your sleep goes, I recommend taking a few nights and really dedicating yourself to trying to sleep.
Keep the lights low/off when the sun goes down. Take a warm bath, and then lie down and watch a relaxing movie that you've seen before. Something like A River Runs Through It. Personally, the anime "Mushishi" I find is highly relaxing and helped me sleep. Take some melatonin, as well. Make sure there are no little LEDS or illuminated clocks in your bedroom, and if there are, turn them off or throw clothes over them. I edited out the first thing you said, but in general I should point out that people who have issues other than sleep-specific ones often need to treat those before their sleep will improve (emotional issues that aren't caused by lack of sleep, physical problems making it hard to sleep, etc).
To respond to some of your suggestions I just want to offer an alternate: I recommend against lying down and watching something, since it's easy for you to associate lying down with wakefulness. Also I don't suggest taking melatonin in your quest to correct your sleeping problems. On the other hand, every suggestion I or someone else makes can be good or bad depending on the person.... sleep is all about figuring out what works for you.
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try some weed. once u get past the high stage, u feel rly tired and hopefully that will get u to sleep. i know its illegal, but i believe that the drugs u have been taking are causing ur sleeping issues. its well documented, although rejected by the government, that weed treats over 200 known medical problems, maybe even the stuff that u needed those pills for
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i wouldn't take those drugs if i were you... but that's just me.
what i find works best to go to sleep is attempt to wake induce lucid dream. i always fail but it puts me right to sleep lol.
just lay there and don't move. seriously don't move at all and look into you eyelids eventually you will see images. watch these images like the awesome trip they are until you fall asleep. if you are still having trouble sleeping, luckily you haven't moved for 1 hour or so. so you don't feel very comfortable. now move into the most comfortable position you can maneuver into. what i find is after not moving my body is asleepish or something and it feels so damn good to change into some new position. doesn't that feel great? oh god it does this new position so primo. now repeat.
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On November 03 2010 16:22 ulszz wrote:
i wouldn't take those drugs if i were you... but that's just me.
what i find works best to go to sleep is attempt to wake induce lucid dream. i always fail but it puts me right to sleep lol.
just lay there and don't move. seriously don't move at all and look into you eyelids eventually you will see images. watch these images like the awesome trip they are until you fall asleep. if you are still having trouble sleeping, luckily you haven't moved for 1 hour or so. so you don't feel very comfortable. now move into the most comfortable position you can maneuver into. what i find is after not moving my body is asleepish or something and it feels so damn good to change into some new position. doesn't that feel great? oh god it does this new position so primo. now repeat.
i actually do this all the time. prob is that when im laying in bed, my mind just doesnt stop racing. its especially hard to achieve a state where my brain isnt thinking anything at all. surprisingly, if i put listen to something thats not music, i can sleep in under 30 min.
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On November 03 2010 16:18 micronesia wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2010 16:15 Zerokaiser wrote:
As far as your sleep goes, I recommend taking a few nights and really dedicating yourself to trying to sleep.
Keep the lights low/off when the sun goes down. Take a warm bath, and then lie down and watch a relaxing movie that you've seen before. Something like A River Runs Through It. Personally, the anime "Mushishi" I find is highly relaxing and helped me sleep. Take some melatonin, as well. Make sure there are no little LEDS or illuminated clocks in your bedroom, and if there are, turn them off or throw clothes over them. I edited out the first thing you said, but in general I should point out that people who have issues other than sleep-specific ones often need to treat those before their sleep will improve (emotional issues that aren't caused by lack of sleep, physical problems making it hard to sleep, etc). To respond to some of your suggestions I just want to offer an alternate: I recommend against lying down and watching something, since it's easy for you to associate lying down with wakefulness. Also I don't suggest taking melatonin in your quest to correct your sleeping problems. On the other hand, every suggestion I or someone else makes can be good or bad depending on the person.... sleep is all about figuring out what works for you.
I agree that treating the underlying condition is the most important thing, but for people struggling with chronic depression finding a trick to get them a good night's sleep now and then is fucking invaluable.
Insomnia and depression feed eachother. If you can fix one, the other becomes a lot easier to manage.
As far as associating lying down with sleep, I know there's evidence to support that. Personally, it doesn't bother me at all. Again, the "lying down for a movie" as I recommended is intended to occur late at night, after a bath and the lights have been down for a while and you've been relaxing.
********* DRASTIC AND AWESOME OPTION BELOW **********
About 6 months ago, before I graduated highschool, I went on a polyphasic sleep cycle (AKA the Uberman sleep cycle).
Take a 20-minute nap every 4 hours.
The idea behind the Uberman is that by forcing yourself to take such short naps, your brain learns to go straight into REM sleep. Instead of 8 hours of all 5 sleep stages, 1.5 hours of REM sleep, you get 2 hours of solid REM sleep.
Of course, there's downsides and obvious drawbacks to this...But as far as wakefulness goes, it does work if you have the lifestyle that can support it. By no means do I recommend it, but, if you're interested you should do some reading. There's a lot of information online.
PS: I quit the Uberman after 3 weeks because my parents got tired of me being awake all the time. Besides, I don't have enough of a life to fill 22 hours a day.
PPS: You say background noise works well. Do you sleep well during storms? I recommend trying to fall asleep to a fan or some other white noise, if not just a soundtrack of rain.
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I don't see any advantage to that nap every four hours plan since it's not at all adaptable to a change in lifestyle (even in the day to day sense). Ideally someone can change their lifestyle on a day to day basis and still bounce right back with their sleep within a couple of days.
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Some of these.. stranger suggestions aside, I do think depression is my major underlying problem that I need to get help with first. Don't really have the mental stamina to read that whole guide at this moment, micro, but it certainly looks interesting thus far.
Unfortunately, tonight is one of these nights. Right now its 3:30 and I leave for school at 6:00. Was laying in bed restless between 11-3. I think I'm just going to watch something and attempt to be productive this morning, rest up out of sleep deprivation tonight, and try to finish reading that guide on Thursday.
Edit: I've always fallen asleep with a fan running for as long as I remember, Kaiser, but it doesn't really help with my current problems. 'Uberman' doesn't sound very appealing to me, but its interesting nontheless.
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On November 03 2010 16:33 micronesia wrote:
I don't see any advantage to that nap every four hours plan since it's not at all adaptable to a change in lifestyle (even in the day to day sense). Ideally someone can change their lifestyle on a day to day basis and still bounce right back with their sleep within a couple of days.
Yeah, that's one of the huge problems. If you get in a situation where you can't sneak away for 20 minutes, missing that nap REALLY fucks you up, a lot more than missing 2 hours of sleep would.
Uberman is really ideal for...somebody like an online poker pro. The type of person who can get up and do his thing on his own time whenever he wants to without it impacting his job.
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well, do something that wont get u depressed. and get off those meds like seriously.
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On November 03 2010 16:37 Lightswarm wrote:
well, do something that wont get u depressed. and get off those meds like seriously.
Aside from the OTC sleeping pill (Unisom, non-addictive apparently) that's really not going to happen. My depression is a long winded problem for perhaps another blog post. Rest assured, the cure to clinical depression isn't "do something that isn't depressing"- there are chemical imbalances that need to be fixed, lifestyle choices that need to be altered, etc etc.
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On November 03 2010 16:33 micronesia wrote:
I don't see any advantage to that nap every four hours plan since it's not at all adaptable to a change in lifestyle (even in the day to day sense). Ideally someone can change their lifestyle on a day to day basis and still bounce right back with their sleep within a couple of days.
Uberman style sleep cycles were developed for military application, trying to get the most alertness out of troops on the least downtime is obviously big for them. For everyone not in combat its really a shitty way to sleep, plus its pretty uncomfortable and it can cause depression after extended use.
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On November 03 2010 16:04 micronesia wrote:Most doctors can't help you with this issue. Most people shouldn't use medication to improve their sleep in the long run. I wrote a guide on this topic a while back that I received a lot of positive feedback on. I still get messages to this day from people telling me it greatly improved their sleep without the use of medicine, supplements, or major lifestyle changes. I strongly recommend you read this. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=95375
Hey, I was skimming through that guide and I noticed this part particularly:
Do a lot of people on tl have Delayed Phase Disorder?
Probably. Delayed Phase Disorder is the tendency to be unable to fall asleep until 3am or 4am, but then get a good 7-8 hours of sleep. The opposite can also occur where you have trouble staying awake past 8pm (elderly people for example). These problems can be treated with artificial bright-light boxes that simulate the sun and adjust your body temperature cycle to a more appropriate time. However, bright-light boxes are not required. This is especially true on bright mornings where you can go outside in order to jump-start your wakefulness system (just don't wear sunglasses).
I can definitely relate to this symptom, but I live in a dorm on ground floor, so I usually keep my blinds shut 24/7. Do you think that leaving them open at night so that sun can shine through in the morning would noticeably help my sleeping pattern?
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Smoking weed helps a lot. Doing sports helps a lot too. After both (sport after class/work + weed before sleeping) you will have a good natural sleep. Stop taking that chemical shit.
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I use the program F.lux which changes your display settings depending on the time of day. It might just be a placebo type thing but I feel like it's helped me sleep better. I feel like my eyes get less strained using it too.
The theory is that an excessively bright screen at night will trick your brain into thinking it's still daytime. Could be bullshit but i'm happy to use it.
EDIT: Also don't do weed just to get to sleep ala ^that^ guy.
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when I discover I'm still awake at 2am and have to wake up at 5, it's almost not worth trying to sleep anyway.
I'd like to point out that this isn't the correct way of thinking if you want to improve your sleep. In order to ever get a good sleep schedule you have to respect when it is time to sleep, and when it is time to wake. "Respect" is the key word there. That means pick a bedtime (yes, a bedtime) for your weeknights and weekends, and start getting ready for bed a set time in advance (developing some sort of routine, whether this includes a shower or something else you have found helpful, is very important). Good luck with everything man
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On November 03 2010 17:03 gogogadgetflow wrote:Show nested quote + when I discover I'm still awake at 2am and have to wake up at 5, it's almost not worth trying to sleep anyway. I'd like to point out that this isn't the correct way of thinking if you want to improve your sleep. In order to ever get a good sleep schedule you have to respect when it is time to sleep, and when it is time to wake. "Respect" is the key word there. That means pick a bedtime (yes, a bedtime) for your weeknights and weekends, and start getting ready for bed a set time in advance (developing some sort of routine, whether this includes a shower or something else you have found helpful, is very important). Good luck with everything man
Most important is that you don't let a mistake, or missing a time affect you... it's all about attitude. If you are worried, you don't sleep.
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On November 03 2010 16:59 endy wrote:
Smoking weed helps a lot. Doing sports helps a lot too. After both (sport after class/work + weed before sleeping) you will have a good natural sleep. Stop taking that chemical shit.
Bolded for wat.
I think you mean do different chemical shit...
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Have this same issue. Without bright sunlight during the day, I can't fall asleep at night, and then end up just being tired all day. But there isn't much I can do about that until I graduate. Fucking east coast.
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United States24698 Posts
On November 03 2010 16:45 Treeplant wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2010 16:04 micronesia wrote:Most doctors can't help you with this issue. Most people shouldn't use medication to improve their sleep in the long run. I wrote a guide on this topic a while back that I received a lot of positive feedback on. I still get messages to this day from people telling me it greatly improved their sleep without the use of medicine, supplements, or major lifestyle changes. I strongly recommend you read this. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=95375 Hey, I was skimming through that guide and I noticed this part particularly: Show nested quote +
Do a lot of people on tl have Delayed Phase Disorder?
Probably. Delayed Phase Disorder is the tendency to be unable to fall asleep until 3am or 4am, but then get a good 7-8 hours of sleep. The opposite can also occur where you have trouble staying awake past 8pm (elderly people for example). These problems can be treated with artificial bright-light boxes that simulate the sun and adjust your body temperature cycle to a more appropriate time. However, bright-light boxes are not required. This is especially true on bright mornings where you can go outside in order to jump-start your wakefulness system (just don't wear sunglasses).
I can definitely relate to this symptom, but I live in a dorm on ground floor, so I usually keep my blinds shut 24/7. Do you think that leaving them open at night so that sun can shine through in the morning would noticeably help my sleeping pattern?
You can try it but definitely don't count on it. As I said earlier it's all about what works for you.
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i sleep 6-7 hours every night. i know this because i've monitored it for the past 1 1/2 years--every night, every nap.
i dont take any medication, no tricks. i just keep away from caffeine 6hrs and food at 2hrs before sleep which is typically 2130-2200. i dont do any work/study/exercise 30 minutes before, just the ritual of brushing my teeth, taking a shower at 85 degrees fahrenheit and half a cup of water. total darkness and it a absolutely dead flat silent -no fans no airconditioning.
also i sleep on a thin plastic mat over a wooden floor, no blanket or pillows.
i take naps everyday at around +07h30m after waking up
absolutely no alarms, if i have to wake up at a specific time i just force sleep 7hrs prior.
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On November 03 2010 17:12 sob3k wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2010 16:59 endy wrote:
Smoking weed helps a lot. Doing sports helps a lot too. After both (sport after class/work + weed before sleeping) you will have a good natural sleep. Stop taking that chemical shit. Bolded for wat. I think you mean do different chemical shit...
Well yeah, but I do believe that the antidepressants he tried can have a lot more unpleasant side effects than weed. I've solved my insomnia issues by doing sports and smoking some pot, and I think it's overall a better solution than taking strong antidepressants.
I'm not saying weed is a universal remedy, it's obviously not good to smoke pot, but OP asked for opinions, and that worked well for me.
If he's looking for a long term solution, he should try to understand why he's depressed and do something about it. Medicine is usually more like a temporary fix. An analogy would be : if you have a constant flu because you don't wear any clothes in winter, sure you can take aspirin to reduce the fever and fix the headache, but wearing warm clothes would be the real solution.
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i had a buddy in college who swore on jerking off just before sleep --every night at 2130-- and get 7-7 1/2 hours.
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United States24698 Posts
This has absolutely nothing to do with the problems of the OP or anyone else in this thread. We are basically talking about insomnia... people who have too much work to sleep are not insomniacs.
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I ahve very similar problems on and off. Currently in a really bad state but if I'm lucky it'll be resolved this afternoon and after that climb back to normal pretty soon.
Also was on Effexor for a couple of months in the past (before TL) and boy did it suck. Or well I dont really remember much of that time and I really mean that. When I went off it was like a black hole in my memory. Feeling is really similar to when you drink too much and some parts people can fill in the blanks. Like "you went to that competition" and you kinda remember that part. The scary thing it's not last night that need some filling in it's several months.
Probably wont happend to you so good luck fixing your depression.
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On November 03 2010 17:40 Eatme wrote:
I ahve very similar problems on and off. Currently in a really bad state but if I'm lucky it'll be resolved this afternoon and after that climb back to normal pretty soon.
Also was on Effexor for a couple of months in the past (before TL) and boy did it suck. Or well I dont really remember much of that time and I really mean that. When I went off it was like a black hole in my memory. Feeling is really similar to when you drink too much and some parts people can fill in the blanks. Like "you went to that competition" and you kinda remember that part. The scary thing it's not last night that need some filling in it's several months.
Probably wont happend to you so good luck fixing your depression.
Wow, that's actually pretty crazy. Only thing that could make this more crazy is if you signed all of your posts using this format:
micronesia out
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I don't know if I have a sleeping issue or not. The Delayed Phase Disorder sound like what I have where I can't get to sleep until 3am sometimes 5am. But that may have been from staying up for things like the GSL. Half the time though I would just crash at around 4 anyways and miss the GSL.
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I appreciate the advice, everyone, but lets please drop this whole weed idea. I recognize that it may be helpful, and I'm not joining either side in the legalization debate, but I'm looking for legal options. I know I said "any advice" but I assumed this went without saying
On November 03 2010 17:40 Eatme wrote:
I ahve very similar problems on and off. Currently in a really bad state but if I'm lucky it'll be resolved this afternoon and after that climb back to normal pretty soon.
Also was on Effexor for a couple of months in the past (before TL) and boy did it suck. Or well I dont really remember much of that time and I really mean that. When I went off it was like a black hole in my memory. Feeling is really similar to when you drink too much and some parts people can fill in the blanks. Like "you went to that competition" and you kinda remember that part. The scary thing it's not last night that need some filling in it's several months.
Probably wont happend to you so good luck fixing your depression.
The thing that I've heard time and time again about antidepressant medications is that they are fairly random. No tests are available, to my knowledge, to determine which medication works for which person. So many different kinds exist because some of them will increase or decrease certain neurotransmitters in your body, but which kind you need (and how much you need) can't be distinguished beforehand.
Just about every antidepressant seems to have the possible side effect of "can increase the risk of wanting to cause yourself harm" and/or tons of other stuff, delusions and memory loss included. It's an unfortunate risk that affects a very small amount of people, but a necessary one sometimes. In my case, it definitely is. I hope to not have to go through what you have, though.
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On November 03 2010 18:15 micronesia wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2010 17:40 Eatme wrote:
I ahve very similar problems on and off. Currently in a really bad state but if I'm lucky it'll be resolved this afternoon and after that climb back to normal pretty soon.
Also was on Effexor for a couple of months in the past (before TL) and boy did it suck. Or well I dont really remember much of that time and I really mean that. When I went off it was like a black hole in my memory. Feeling is really similar to when you drink too much and some parts people can fill in the blanks. Like "you went to that competition" and you kinda remember that part. The scary thing it's not last night that need some filling in it's several months.
Probably wont happend to you so good luck fixing your depression. Wow, that's actually pretty crazy. Only thing that could make this more crazy is if you signed all of your posts using this format:
micronesia out
sorry. not on topic. but this is pure gold.
back on topic... i find i do not sleep because I have something i need to do, but I keep putting it off. It is currently 3 am, and i have only covered half of my exam material that i take in 5 hours
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Have you tried working out before going to bed, or sometime during the day? Working out helps on irregular sleep, but also most importantly it is AS effective as medication for depression, unless you got the really serious one. Bipolar or unipolar cant remember which one is the most serious.
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Problem: Lack of sleep, irregular sleeping.
Solution: Evening jogging and a bottle of tasty beer before going to bed.
Benefits: If you won't sleep well after this, then you are officially a zombie.
Drawbacks: You will probably feel like shit after waking up at morning, meh.
Evaluation: Try it.
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United States24698 Posts
On November 03 2010 19:12 imreker wrote:
Problem: Lack of sleep, irregular sleeping.
Solution: Evening jogging and a bottle of tasty beer before going to bed.
Benefits: If you won't sleep well after this, then you are officialy a zombie.
Drawbacks: You will probably feel like shit after waking up at morning, meh.
Evaluation: Try it.
Haha.
Running will work better for some people than others.
Also alcohol is not a long-term solution :p
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I can realte to this pretty well, had my share of sleeping problems on and off, mostly when i was depressed. Now I work and is no longer depressed and pretty hard-core about when to get to bed. Works okay. Biggest problem is my GF, when i am in bed or preparing for bed i do NOT want to discuss "important" things that we have to decide or think about. All i want to do is relax, she is the opposite, she loves to hit me with som heavy loaded topic just as i climb into bed.
Like "What if i am pregnant?", "I dont know what to do about my job", "I think we should get a pet, do you want cat or dog?", "Do you have everything planned for the party 3 months from now?", "I think you play to much on your computer instead of watching Paradise Hotel with me"...
I do "mental exercises" to get to sleep, and they basicly revolve around focusing away from RL-issues, for exemple i read a lot and is usually in the middle of some book so i play out scenarios with the characters and how i would have preferred things to go instead of how it was written. It relaxes me, makes me forget about IRL shit that stresses me.
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I feel you OP, been having the same for a few years.
Sometimes you go almost a week without sleeping othertimes you want to sleep the whole week.
Productivity ~0 %
I´m not on medication though, probably should be.
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Guaranteed long term computer use is the cause. When it's late the radiation from the monitor and long periods of less blinking/alertness keep you awake and stimulated when your body should be resting. Your tricking yourself to thinking it's day time. Try to stop using the computer 12-10 or so hours before you have to wake up for tomorrow, just lay around, maybe watch some bad movies from a tv thats not too big/close to brighten up the whole room etc.
Lately I've been having crazy sleep too, I think it's party because GSL, My gf wanting space/stressing me out, and the fact that I need to get my shit together and get reemployed.
Most of the time imho, depression, anxiety, etc. are overdiagnosed and treated. Sometimes all you really need, and you probably know it yourself, is that you need to get out and be proactive with your life instead of doing the same old routine you've grown accustomed to. You may hate that idea too, but at least just try new things all the time and mix it up or be forever bored/'depressed' and taking drugs that don't really help the problem, but mask it instead.
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go to selfmedication groups for cancer and other fucked up diseases. Develop a second, bad-ass personality that gets all the chicks laid, builds a revolutionary army of merciless adherents who beat each other up regularly, without even knowing it. Blackmail your boss to pay you without showing up at work by beating up yourself and making it look like as if he did it. Shoot your self in the head. Win.
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On November 03 2010 16:26 Lightswarm wrote:Show nested quote +On November 03 2010 16:22 ulszz wrote:
i wouldn't take those drugs if i were you... but that's just me.
what i find works best to go to sleep is attempt to wake induce lucid dream. i always fail but it puts me right to sleep lol.
just lay there and don't move. seriously don't move at all and look into you eyelids eventually you will see images. watch these images like the awesome trip they are until you fall asleep. if you are still having trouble sleeping, luckily you haven't moved for 1 hour or so. so you don't feel very comfortable. now move into the most comfortable position you can maneuver into. what i find is after not moving my body is asleepish or something and it feels so damn good to change into some new position. doesn't that feel great? oh god it does this new position so primo. now repeat. i actually do this all the time. prob is that when im laying in bed, my mind just doesnt stop racing. its especially hard to achieve a state where my brain isnt thinking anything at all. surprisingly, if i put listen to something thats not music, i can sleep in under 30 min.
I'm a bit strange but I find listening to Korean commentators on BW extremely relaxing (I'm guessing it just distracts my brain though). If I am in bed while listening to it I fall asleep within 10 mins more often than not. I've tried movies/other TV shows but anything in english that I can understand keeps me awake. Korean BW is the secret sauce!
If you are having trouble getting to sleep, why not try a 45 minute TvT?
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On November 03 2010 15:58 Nokarot wrote:
I preface this post by saying that I've been seeing doctors and have tried a variety of over-the-counter and prescription sleep medication, but am simply looking for alternative ideas from you fine people.
I sleep very irregularly. Sometimes I sleep for 3 hours, other times for 14, and often times not at all.
The doctor says much of this has to do with clinical depression, but I'm on my third trial medication, and that stuff takes of weening on/off doses to see if they work. First it was Paxil, then it was Prozac and now it's Effexor, all of which have drowsiness as a side effect but don't seem to make me tired.
I've tried the old tricks- Read a book in a different room for 30 minutes, run a few laps around your house, take a warm shower, drink a glass of milk, etc. They work on rare occasion, but when I discover I'm still awake at 2am and have to wake up at 5, it's almost not worth trying to sleep anyway.
I'm open to any ideas. Usually I just get Starbucks in the morning if I've encountered a sleepless night, but you can imagine that may be an expensive alternative (and maybe screwing my sleep up even more.) I'm not pulling my hair out or anything, thankfully- I can operate pretty well when I'm tired- I just wish it wasn't so.
I can tell you now that reading a book is not going to help you sleep. If you want to sleep you need to do something that makes your brain work less, not more. Working out is good, though you should do that 1-2 hours BEFORE you want to sleep, because by that time your body will begin to slow down since your adrenaline and blood flow have slowed so much. A warm shower might help, it depends on the ambient temperature of where you live. Glass of milk I have never heard of personally. When do you take your meds and in what dose? Also, I hope you dont drink while you take those, since that may be the reason you can't sleep.
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Ironic I see this blog entry. I always had a random sleep pattern, but a few days ago it got really bad: I wake up after 2..3 hours of sleep, and can't fall asleep for quite a long time. Today I slept 3+2+1 hours, and quite obviously, I'm way more of a zombie than if I slept 6.
Anyway, when I was biking for ~2 hours a day, I had no problem falling asleep. Also, reading a calculus textbook can help before sleeping. Don't take it seriously though, when I was studying for my Calculus 3 finals, it worked quite bad, I was watching the ceiling for 8 hours straight without falling asleep.
+ Show Spoiler +On November 03 2010 20:45 polarwolf wrote:
go to selfmedication groups for cancer and other fucked up diseases. Develop a second, bad-ass personality that gets all the chicks laid, builds a revolutionary army of merciless adherents who beat each other up regularly, without even knowing it. Blackmail your boss to pay you without showing up at work by beating up yourself and making it look like as if he did it. Shoot your self in the head. Win. Hahahaha nice man! Do this! Thoguh, do you need to hug with a fat guy with bitchtits as well?
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Lie in bed while watching a boring movie on your laptop beside your bed, it should work!
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Just a bit of an aside for those suggesting illicit drug use: MAOIs and SSRIs are known to have strong and, in some cases, very dangerous interactions with other psychoactive compounds. The interactions with the cannabinoids in weed may not be particularly dangerous or problematic (i do not know specifically), but if you are on any sort of antidepressant, it would be a good idea to forgo use of other psychoactives until you have talked to a doctor about potential interactions.
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work out more, preferably more than 2 hours before you sleep. If you workout too late / too close to your sleep time, you are more likely to stay awake. But say you want to sleep at midnight, do a hard workout at 8pm/830pm. finish around 9:30/10.
eat regularly and eat more healthily. drink a lot of water during the day.
also, don't take naps during the day.
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Personal recommendation is weed and masturbating, lol.
Insomnia sucks though, t.t; Best of luck
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Do you work out at all or taken up a job where you've been "stimulated" physically?
It is well known in the bodybuilding community (or even people who just started doing extreme physical work for health issues or for work), that heavy stress on the physical body can actually cause something in your brain to be irregular and make you sleepless.
Well I'm not sure if it's in the brain, but it's somewhere.. lol.
I was reading articles on it and tests were done by American universities so it's not just some exercise myth. I can provide links if you want but to be honest, I'm pretty lazy right now.
Anyway;
Most people think that after working out hard, you'll get tired and fall asleep. But once you go pass a certain point and too much stress on the body depending on your fitness can have a negative effect and although you're being healthy; it's releasing or messing up some chemical in your body/brain that helps regulate sleep. So people who have been up early; eating healthy and working out hard might not be able to sleep at night. Getting maybe only 1... or 2 hours...
It's really frustrating; It happened to me. That's why I've been pushing back working out. It was causing more harm than good. Taking away my sleep. Making me depressed and frustrated.
Once I stopped working out too hard; I slept like a fucking baby.
EDIT* Check spoiler for remedy
+ Show Spoiler +I heard smoking a couple of joints really work. Better than sleeping pills.
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medical marijuana with a high indica percentage, a kush or something like it. you'll be set.
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Wow man didn't know your sleeping problem was this deep ;o ill punch the guy that snored in the room the next time i see him ;D
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At school so I don't have time to read and reply to everything, but I thank everyone for their ideas. I feel like some of you guys are messing with me (computer causing eye radiation? cmon now) but I appreciate the ideas nonetheless.
On November 03 2010 21:02 vek wrote:If you are having trouble getting to sleep, why not try a 45 minute TvT?
Ha. A lot of the ideas people have been offering me haven't sounded really plausible for me, but this one rings true. SC1 TvT might work. SC2 TvTs kind of excite me.
On November 04 2010 01:31 Haemonculus wrote:
Personal recommendation is weed and masturbating, lol.
Insomnia sucks though, t.t; Best of luck
I've never smoked weed, but it seems like mixing those two might be hard? Anyways, hot.
On November 04 2010 03:24 wonkman wrote:
Wow man didn't know your sleeping problem was this deep ;o ill punch the guy that snored in the room the next time i see him ;D
Yeah man, I told you. Stared at the ceiling for 3 hours that night, went to the hotel lobby and read an entire 400 page book before coming back up to the room to steal 2 hours of sleep before breakfast and going back to MLG. That was a rough night o.o
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...personally I have a bad sleep pattern cause I've been staying up to watch the GSL live > _ ~''
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United States24698 Posts
On November 04 2010 04:19 Nokarot wrote:
At school so I don't have time to read and reply to everything, but I thank everyone for their ideas. I feel like some of you guys are messing with me (computer causing eye radiation? cmon now) but I appreciate the ideas nonetheless.
He just meant the light from the monitor keeping you awake... visible light is technically radiation.
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On November 04 2010 04:44 micronesia wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2010 04:19 Nokarot wrote:
At school so I don't have time to read and reply to everything, but I thank everyone for their ideas. I feel like some of you guys are messing with me (computer causing eye radiation? cmon now) but I appreciate the ideas nonetheless. He just meant the light from the monitor keeping you awake... visible light is technically radiation.
Technically, yes, but it's certainly not a cause for [my] sleep deprivation. Not to say I shouldn't maybe spend some time away from the computer more often, but there are nights (occasionally) where I absolutely pass out after a 10 hour session online or something.
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Yea sorry about my post, i must have been really tired.
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United States24698 Posts
On November 04 2010 07:11 Nokarot wrote:Show nested quote +On November 04 2010 04:44 micronesia wrote:On November 04 2010 04:19 Nokarot wrote:
At school so I don't have time to read and reply to everything, but I thank everyone for their ideas. I feel like some of you guys are messing with me (computer causing eye radiation? cmon now) but I appreciate the ideas nonetheless. He just meant the light from the monitor keeping you awake... visible light is technically radiation. Technically, yes, but it's certainly not a cause for [my] sleep deprivation. Not to say I shouldn't maybe spend some time away from the computer more often, but there are nights (occasionally) where I absolutely pass out after a 10 hour session online or something.
I don't think that's sufficient evidence for a claim that the light from computer monitors doesn't influence your insomnia.
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These sleep issues have not arisen during any recent prolonged exposure to a computer. My eyes are not the reason I can't sleep. Maybe there is some minuet influence, but mind you, my post was initially in response to someone "guaranteeing" that my insomnia was caused solely by computer radiation. There may be no evidence to say computer lights don't influence me, but there is no evidence to say that they do, let alone are solely responsible, either.
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EPT
