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I've had sleeping troubles since high school. I've racked up a massive sleep deficit, and rarely get a good night of sleep 1 or 2 days out of a week. I've gone to doctors and my school's student health center. Neither of them helped me a wink.
I got in bed at 11:30. I tossed and turned, feeling really tired but not being able to fall asleep until 1:30 when I got out of bed and decided to listen to something boring. I figured I'd fall asleep eventually, but that doesn't look like its happening tonight.
This sleeping thing is affecting my grades. I might lose a scholarship I need next semester because I often can't wake up for class, or I'm so out of it in class that its just not worth it.
I googled "sleep troubles" and came across this:
Hi. I am a 28 year old girl from Nottingham, England. I have had trouble sleeping since I was about 18. I am awake at night and very tired in the day. I just can't wait up at all. At the end of the day, I go home exhausted but then at 10.00 I seem to wake up! This is so annoying. In the end, I get tearful. I also have nightmares and think there is a ghost in my bedroom for which I keep switching the light on and looking round my room. I get headaches and feel and look terrible all day. I also have anxiety too. I have heard about lightboxes being able to help sleep disorders also something to do with cortisone levels. Could you enlighten me on this? Is there any alternative health treatments worth investigating e.g. hypnotherapy, herbs etc etc.
This is me. This is my exact problem. And it was answered by this:
Hi Jo,
This sounds like delayed sleep phase syndrome, and that's what the light boxes are used for. Another possibility that might help you is the food supplement melatonin, but I don't know if it's available in Great Britain or not. It's sold in health food stores and drugstores in the U.S., but here in Canada, where I live, it isn't available.
More info (from wiki):
+ Show Spoiler +Delayed sleep-phase syndrome (DSPS), also known as delayed sleep-phase disorder (DSPD) or delayed sleep-phase type (DSPT), is a circadian rhythm sleep disorder, a chronic disorder of the timing of sleep, peak period of alertness, core body temperature, hormonal and other daily rhythms relative to societal norms. People with DSPS tend to fall asleep some hours after midnight and have difficulty waking up in the morning.
Often, people with the disorder report that they cannot sleep until early morning, but fall asleep at about the same time every "night". Unless they have another sleep disorder such as sleep apnea in addition to DSPS, patients can sleep well and have a normal need for sleep. Therefore, they find it very difficult to wake up in time for a typical school or work day. If, however, they are allowed to follow their own schedules, e.g. sleeping from 4 a.m. to noon, they sleep soundly, awaken spontaneously, and do not experience excessive daytime sleepiness.
The syndrome usually develops in early childhood or adolescence. An adolescent version disappears in adolescence or early adulthood; otherwise it is a lifelong condition. Depending on the severity, it can be to a greater or lesser degree treatable. Prevalence among adults, equally distributed among women and men, is approximately 0.15% or three in 2000.
DSPS was first formally described in 1981 by Dr. Elliot D. Weitzman and others at Montefiore Medical Center. It is responsible for 7–10% of patient complaints of chronic insomnia. However, as few doctors are aware of its existence, it often goes untreated or is treated inappropriately; DSPS is frequently misdiagnosed as primary insomnia or as a psychiatric condition.
In addition to this, also find food disgusting in the mornings, but not all mornings.
I need help. I need to fix this. It is literally turning me into an emotionless robot, and I'm starting to have thoughts that I can't control (really nasty ones). I find myself laughing less, being less happy and more negative (despite a too-optimistic outlook). The world doesn't operate on my schedule (except for breaks).
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Marijuana. A bowl a half hour or so before bedtime will have you ready to go to sleep when you want to.
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It use to take me like 2 hours to fall asleep. Then i realized im just a night person and cant go to bed at 10 or 11 pm like most people. Then i started going to bed at like 4-6 am. Sleep like a baby. I work swing shift so it all works out. I also find food gross for the first 3 hours or so after i get up.
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do you exercise? I sometimes have trouble sleeping but once I started swimming 30-40 minutes every two days I found it was easier for me to fall asleep
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Ghermination is correct again with his earthy street-smart wisdom.
One joint will do, make sure it doesn't make you too paranoid to sleep though.
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reading into the description kinda describes me. For instance i went to bed at 4 last night, woke up at 10, went to class, worked all day, and lifted at around 9. here i am at 4 am still really awake, but i'll be super tired again at 10 when i wake up and for a few hours after until i work out or take a nap. Also, some times i'll be super tired around 9-10 and then be wide awake by the time i want to go to sleep. I wouldn't say it's ever adversely affected me, its just annoying that it takes ~1 hour to go to sleep if i don't stay up really late. also if i sleep from like 5-12 i'll be alert and not groggy or anything but if i sleep like 2-10 i'll still be really tired when i wake up.
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I'd have to agree with lazz here. I know you said you exercise some, but maybe it isn't enough? If you're restless at night, you should burn more energy in daytime. Run, swim, play sports, any activity with tiring physical exercise should help. If it wont work, I think you should seek professional help again, despite it didn't help you the first time. Maybe ask your parents to take you to a real clinic, not just a doctor. Maybe go to a psychiatrist also, not to say you're crazy or anything like that, but this problem might have a psychological background.
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this may be an extreme but it does help me. Just pull an all nighter one time and don't take any naps the next day. By that night you should be exhausted. Then you should be able to sleep by midnight. After that exercise everyday a little before dinner. This will take enough energy out of you so you can fall asleep at a decent time.
This essentially resets my internal clock. hope it helps!
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Baltimore, USA22251 Posts
I'm almost positive you don't have sort've disorder; you're probably just a fucking young person. 
Everyone knows we procrastinate with everything, including going to sleep... one of the biggest causes of insomnia is irregular sleep patterns. If you mess with your body's internal clock at all (ie, stay up late to party on the weekend, or even just stay up late random weeknights playing video games or watching starcraft matches) you're going to suffer these symptoms.
I would recommend...
For the next week or two, document your sleep patterns. Write down when you start to feel tired, when you actually go to sleep (estimating, obviously ^_^) the time you wake up, and how you feel when you wake up the next day. Try to adhere very strictly to the same 'go to bed' time every night you can, even weekends. After just a few days/weeks, I can almost guarantee you'll see a huge improvement.
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exercise before you sleep. sweat hard, take a shower and youll be snoozing
what is your current lifestyle like? do you sit in front of the computer all day?
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Oh god it is 5am and I am watching Hite lose lose lose. TT
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I will honestly tell you this.. I was just like you before I started smoking weed. Yesterday.. the first thing I did when I got home was get high ( low tolerance ) and then as soon as it hit 8 I fell asleep. I woke up at 5:30 better then ever! I really suggest smoking weed, but if you dislike that whole idea I'm just saying, its just a suggestion. =D
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Don't listen to the idiots telling you to smoke to sleep.
Couple things about weed sleep... I know better than the idiots saying to smoke it.
You don't dream very well on weed. I enjoy the dreaming.
It's not a very refreshing sleep and the morning after is often groggy, especially close to bed time.
(I'm assuming you can't schedule a full 9 hours into your sleep daily, it's usually how it is)
Get a bottle of melatonin if things get really bad.
Melatonin is supposed to some fuckn miracle in a pill anyways. Something about health benefits here and there, some anti cancer anti aging super duper life bonus 1up!
I actually use melatonin time to time and uh.. nice lucid dreams! weeee
And it definitely works, although at one point I was up to 15gs (recommended 5g) to have effect.
You do build up tolerance but first time users should have no problem getting drowsy.
It's not habit forming, you just build tolerance to it. But yeah, I'm +1 for melatonin..
Go to CVS, pick up the blue bottle of Extra Strength Melatonin. Thank me later.
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Canada5565 Posts
On December 08 2009 16:34 ghermination wrote:
Marijuana. A bowl a half hour or so before bedtime will have you ready to go to sleep when you want to.
if he doesn't already smoke, for sure.
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I went to bed at 11PM
I laid in bed in the dark, eyes closed until 7AM
I got less than 3 hours of actual sleep
this is standard
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I'd have to agree on ETT on this one. Habits play a huge part in sleep patterns. Just look at me now. After a couple of days staying up ludicrously late because of procrastination, I am now effectively nocturnal with around 5-6 hours of sleep a day.
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On December 08 2009 23:09 fusionsdf wrote:
I went to bed at 11PM
I laid in bed in the dark, eyes closed until 7AM
I got less than 3 hours of actual sleep
this is standard
loooooooooooooooool
u guys suck so bad
I can't imagine my life without good sleep, i love it so much.
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I use Melatonin whenever I want to get my sleep cycle back into sync. It's great never fails 
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Sleep rocks, but yeah if you really wanna get good at sleeping, exercise your ass off, then at like 9pm smoke some weed. You'll be out like a light.
And to whoever said that weed sleep isnt good, that's very not true. I used to smoke weed every night and I slept like a brick. It was lovely.
Or, if you don't like weed, do what ETT said.
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Used to have this problem, then i started exercising, and it dissapeared, recently I stopped exercising, and it's back, guess what I'm going to do this week.
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Go back to the doctor and tell them they're advice didn't work or what you've written here...basically full disclosure. They have no other advice? Then visit another doctor.
Wiki/online gaming forum is not the answer to your problems...
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On December 08 2009 22:13 SuperJongMan wrote:
Don't listen to the idiots telling you to smoke to sleep.
Couple things about weed sleep... I know better than the idiots saying to smoke it.
You don't dream very well on weed. I enjoy the dreaming.
It's not a very refreshing sleep and the morning after is often groggy, especially close to bed time.
(I'm assuming you can't schedule a full 9 hours into your sleep daily, it's usually how it is)
Get a bottle of melatonin if things get really bad.
Melatonin is supposed to some fuckn miracle in a pill anyways. Something about health benefits here and there, some anti cancer anti aging super duper life bonus 1up!
I actually use melatonin time to time and uh.. nice lucid dreams! weeee
And it definitely works, although at one point I was up to 15gs (recommended 5g) to have effect.
You do build up tolerance but first time users should have no problem getting drowsy.
It's not habit forming, you just build tolerance to it. But yeah, I'm +1 for melatonin..
Go to CVS, pick up the blue bottle of Extra Strength Melatonin. Thank me later.
Because you know more about marijuana than me right :V
But in all seriousness melatonin is a much better way to get to sleep. I was on 10mg of it for the longest time before i realized that it made it quite hard for me to get up in the morning, marijuana has never done that.
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Please grand master stoner man, don't shit up this poor sleep deprived soul's blog.
And yes, I obviously do know more because I'm not recommending it as a sleep aid.
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Crap, I think I'm having similar symptoms but I feel like I'm still in control if I fix some habits.
OP, do you feel like there's nothing you can do to fix it?
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Alright, I'm not sure about the thread starter but the symptoms of delayed sleep phase syndrome is common in everyone. You can't sleep right away when you lie down on bed + finding food gross in the morning does not equal delayed sleep phase syndrome. If it was, everyone would be diagnosed with this. These are just common symptoms in everyone pretty much.
I know that for adolescents, the reason why they cant sleep early is because of changed circadian rhythm. I'm not trying to disprove anyone, I'm just simply informing that just because of some matching symptoms does not make you victim of this syndrome. It's something like medical students' disease.
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On December 09 2009 07:42 BanZu wrote:
Crap, I think I'm having similar symptoms but I feel like I'm still in control if I fix some habits.
OP, do you feel like there's nothing you can do to fix it?
not OP, but there is nothing I can really do about it. Doctor says its a result of "panic disorder caused by gender dysphoria." Currently taking paxil/clonazepam (which I use as a sedative/immediate panic attack solver since it acts in about an hour, has a half-life of like 12 hours, and is usually ok at helping me sleep).
But even taking a clonazepam before bed is no guarantee I'll get sleep, it just helps. Exercising is the same thing (and with the cold weather its really easy to get sick from running in the cold) - it helps but is not even close to a guarantee.
Those of you who can sleep whenever you want, glory in it. Believe me, you don't fully appreciate sleep until you go without for long periods of time.
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Wow I've been having the same problems. My mom has been recommending me melatonin but I never really looked into it, I went down to walmart and checked but they didnt have any.
Are there any major drug stores in canada that carry it? Shoppers drug mart, etc?
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Marijuana will easily get you to fall asleep. Smoke some indica.
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On December 08 2009 18:13 EvilTeletubby wrote:I'm almost positive you don't have sort've disorder; you're probably just a fucking young person. Everyone knows we procrastinate with everything, including going to sleep... one of the biggest causes of insomnia is irregular sleep patterns. If you mess with your body's internal clock at all (ie, stay up late to party on the weekend, or even just stay up late random weeknights playing video games or watching starcraft matches) you're going to suffer these symptoms. I would recommend... For the next week or two, document your sleep patterns. Write down when you start to feel tired, when you actually go to sleep (estimating, obviously ^_^) the time you wake up, and how you feel when you wake up the next day. Try to adhere very strictly to the same 'go to bed' time every night you can, even weekends. After just a few days/weeks, I can almost guarantee you'll see a huge improvement.
speak of the devil. i printed out sleep schedule recorder from wikipedia last night.
ill do this
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Baltimore, USA22251 Posts
On December 09 2009 12:03 jimminy_kriket wrote:
Wow I've been having the same problems. My mom has been recommending me melatonin but I never really looked into it, I went down to walmart and checked but they didnt have any.
Are there any major drug stores in canada that carry it? Shoppers drug mart, etc?
Christ, drugs are not the fucking answer T_T
Over the counter stuff, recreational stuff, whatever, it's not the answer...
Discipline is... getting regular sleep, at the exact same time every single night, will prevent all these problems, virtually guaranteed. What's causing this is lifestyle choices, not some obscure disorder with really vague and commonplace symptoms. 
KTT - wish you the best, ignore pretty much anyone recommending drugs as the primary solution. 
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This happened to me, my apartment generally keeps a weird schedule with my roommates sometimes staying up really late and sometimes going to bed early. I can't sleep when people are talking I ended up getting only one or two hours of sleep for a couple days. It really makes you start to go insane after a night or two. The worst part is when you begin to drift off and then you think "yes finally" and the thought jolts you awake.. fuuuuuu
The best thing to do really is to try and keep a regular schedule. Eating also plays a big part in determining your sleep cycle.. try not to eat anything right before bed.
edit: also I found that it helps to keep all the lights on until I go to bed. Using the computer in a dark room is really bad because your body can't tell if it's time to sleep or not. If you keep your room really bright until you go to bed, then your body knows you arent fucking around and it's time to shut down.
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I'm averaging 4 hours of sleep/night for the last three days.
Can't sleep before 3 am -.-
Also i can't eat when i wake up.
I blame comp and exams for my terrible sleep schedule. It isn't my fault !
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Yeah I'm a night person. I usually sleep at 1-3am naturally but after swim season started I'm falling asleep at my desk by 1:30am... Exercise hardcore everyday and you'll be exhausted at night.
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It's 6 am, I have a bunch of shit to do tommorow (well, today), and I still haven't fallen asleep. :/
I think this problem is quite universal over the college demographic.
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God, will you jerkoffs stop prescribing marijuana for every single medical ailment on earth?
I mean I'm willing to accept that it is not a very damaging recreational drug, but when I see the amount of stupidity like on those posts, I beg to differ.
To the O.P. I think this is rather common in youngsters. I'd recommend either buying a light box (Getting the sun on your face helps you wake up, as well as smelling the morning air) Or reading micronesia's sleep guide.
Exercise would be really good too, like having a real good reason to wake up would be to do your 1 hour exercise at 6 am or something and you would be tired as you are supposed to be at 9 or 10pm.
If you just lack the balls to change (because I honestly think this is just a combination of laziness, indifference, etc.) Then reschedule your school to later hours, possibly night hours.
I fixed my problem basing myself on micronesia's guide to be honest. It's just psychological.
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Just sleep when you feel like it, problem solved.
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Roffles
Pitcairn19291 Posts
On December 09 2009 17:17 Boblion wrote:
I'm averaging 4 hours of sleep/night for the last three days.
Can't sleep before 3 am -.-
Also i can't eat when i wake up.
I blame comp and exams for my terrible sleep schedule. It isn't my fault !
My sleep schedule is so fucked up. Since I can't study when I'm tired, I take like 2-3 hour naps at like the most random times in the day.
Fuck exams.
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On December 08 2009 17:11 ShaperofDreams wrote:
Ghermination is correct again with his earthy street-smart wisdom.
One joint will do, make sure it doesn't make you too paranoid to sleep though.
Yea you have to wait for the high to wear off of you will see crazy shit when you close your eyes and not be able to sleep very well. When it wears off you drop right off though
This is not a very good idea though because its really hard to wake up the next morning.
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On December 10 2009 02:05 Roffles wrote:Show nested quote +On December 09 2009 17:17 Boblion wrote:
I'm averaging 4 hours of sleep/night for the last three days.
Can't sleep before 3 am -.-
Also i can't eat when i wake up.
I blame comp and exams for my terrible sleep schedule. It isn't my fault ! My sleep schedule is so fucked up. Since I can't study when I'm tired, I take like 2-3 hour naps at like the most random times in the day. Fuck exams.
Yea same for m. My problem is that i'm sometimes even more tired after a nap than before. So hard to wake up and start to study after ...
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Point of Clarification:
On two separate occasions in the last 6 months, I've gone to bed at 10 pm and woken up at 630 am for two week stretches. This really didn't help. I'd exercise myself to exhaustion (1 session in the morning 1 before dinner) every other day and do light exercises in between. I'd eat vegetables (like celery. who the fuck eats celery) and fruits and avoid anything -ogenated (except sundays). I would strive to be as healthy as I could.
I set up my sleep environment to be as beneficial as possible. I wouldn't be able to fall asleep, commonly till 4 am. On nights when I would fall asleep on time (after my 4am nights) I would wake up groggy as hell.
ive got bigass bags under my eyes now I've never noticed before. 2 more weeks till christmas vacation
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On December 08 2009 19:18 JohnColtrane wrote:
exercise before you sleep. sweat hard, take a shower and youll be snoozing
what is your current lifestyle like? do you sit in front of the computer all day?
that is against logic...
when you exercise your body temperature goes up and your blood flow is higher... when you go to sleep is totally the opposite... if you do this 1hour before sleeping it is guaranteed that you wont have sleep for a little while until your body cools down.
The recommended time for exercises is in the morning when you wake up.
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EPT
