EPTUS Politics Feedback Thread - Page 41
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
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IgnE
United States7684 Posts
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
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IgnE
United States7684 Posts
but yeah if you are going to post as often and as loquaciously as youve been posting id prefer if you kept it interesting. fresh is best. | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
Regarding your point that it's "aesthetically unfortunate but not a Godwin," I see little point in the distinction. The result is the same: the invocation of Hitler where not appropriate draws more attention to the use of Hitler than to the point being made. Even ChristianS seems to somewhat acknowledge that that was the case. | ||
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zlefin
United States7689 Posts
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IgnE
United States7684 Posts
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
On January 11 2017 03:14 IgnE wrote: with a heavy heart, friend legalord, i feel obliged to confess that you are acting more and more the rabid bulldog, surpassing even our friend kwizach While I don't disagree that perhaps this was not a matter that should have been brought in here and I should have instead have simply ignored it, your rather content-sparse commentary doesn't add anything here. In any case, unless ChristianS disagrees that it was in poor taste and was not a good way to make his point, there is nothing more to add and I will simply leave it at that. | ||
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opisska
Poland8852 Posts
 I have absolutely no idea why I am following this thread for 40 pages, but it somehow keeps being mildly entertaining. | ||
mustaju
Estonia4505 Posts
If this is out of line, I apologize, but I thought that bringing it up would be more constructive than just letting it hover over my future posts. | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
On January 11 2017 04:44 mustaju wrote: I don't really understand what legallord is even gaining from arguing, since I consider a lot of his posts as just dismissals with the commentary of the topic being "stupid" and/or not up to his specific standards. Consider that my way of saying, "I don't think any productive discussion on this topic can be had so I'm simply going to walk away." Though I might have trouble sticking to that decision in the face of something I perceive as really stupid like an absurd false equivalency being made. | ||
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mustaju
Estonia4505 Posts
On January 11 2017 04:47 LegalLord wrote: Consider that my way of saying, "I don't think any productive discussion on this topic can be had so I'm simply going to walk away." Is it true that no productive discussion can be had or are you just not capable of providing it? (There's also other options, of course, that elude me right now.) There's a major difference here, and it's the difference between being constructive and being unnecessarily dismissive. I don't think the former is true at all in most of the cases I have observed, others are welcome to disagree. | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
On January 11 2017 04:54 mustaju wrote: Is it true that no productive discussion can be had or are you just not capable of providing it? (There's also other options, of course, that elude me right now.) There's a major difference here, and it's the difference between being constructive and being unnecessarily dismissive. I don't think the former is true at all in most of the cases I have observed, others are welcome to disagree. More like, "I'm just not in the mood to discuss this" or "I've seen where this discussion leads, and I'm just not up for it." I've had my fair share of unrestrained idiocy from participating in the Ukraine thread, and I'm not eager to import some of the things that made that thread an irredeemable cesspool into one that already teeters on the edge of stupidity. | ||
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mustaju
Estonia4505 Posts
On January 11 2017 04:58 LegalLord wrote: More like, "I'm just not in the mood to discuss this" or "I've seen where this discussion leads, and I'm just not up for it." I've had my fair share of unrestrained idiocy from participating in the Ukraine thread, and I'm not eager to import some of the things that made that thread an irredeemable cesspool into one that already teeters on the edge of stupidity. Thank you for your reply. | ||
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ChristianS
United States3304 Posts
On January 11 2017 00:39 LegalLord wrote: The problem isn't the use of Hitler in general, as the giant strawman by farvacola above would suggest. It's that you invoked it really, really stupidly, in a way that trivializes the impact of the Nazis in a way that simply doesn't invite the comparison except by an absurd exaggeration: "Really convenient to say environmental coverage is just propaganda for an anti-fracking, pro-Russian-gas agenda because it was on RT." = "Really convenient to say that the Nazis are bad because of the Holocaust." And I'm sorry if you take it personally that such an attempt at a direct comparison between a question of whether some rather benign "propaganda" should be compared to defending Hitler is mocked and met with derision, but it absolutely should be. Your comparison is absolutely a Godwin in the sense that it trivializes the impact of the Nazis for the purpose of some really idiotic comparison. And no, it doesn't make it better that you clarify it after, the same way that if you start a conversation with "hey, I think Hitler wasn't that bad of a guy" isn't made better by anything you might say afterwards. What's bizarre here is that I don't think you even disagree with the point I was making. In an LL-like attitude, I'm inclined to think it should be patently obvious to everyone that an argument can be convenient and correct, or convenient and incorrect, or inconvenient but correct, or both inconvenient incorrect. They're unrelated. That's why I thought it was fine to dismiss the issue so quickly, because that point is so obvious it need not be pondered on too long. I didn't draw any moral equivalence between your argument and Nazi apologism; at most, I suggested a semantically similar argument could be made by a Nazi apologist, and that it would fall just as flat there as here. It certainly wasn't my intention to dismiss the significance of the moral abomination that was the Holocaust, but if anyone read it as me implying the Holocaust wasn't a big deal or something, I apologize for the misconception. That was not my intent. Of course, then you violate your own logic (perhaps ironically?) here: And no, it doesn't make it better that you clarify it after, the same way that if you start a conversation with "hey, I think Hitler wasn't that bad of a guy" isn't made better by anything you might say afterwards. Godwin? | ||
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LegalLord
United States13779 Posts
In any case, if we can agree that the analogy was unfortunate (and "how unfortunate" really isn't too worth debating), I will say that I disagree with the point you were making but that I also don't see a point to revive the discussion and we should leave it at that. | ||
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ChristianS
United States3304 Posts
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zlefin
United States7689 Posts
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/general/383301-us-politics-mega-thread?page=6585#131697 this is emblematic of the kind of problem posting xdaunt does. He posts something ridiculous, trolling, strawmanning, and insulting. and then it leads to other people getting actioned as they respond to it (magpie). sure, the people responding to it were also wrong in their response, but by not addressing the root problem of xdaunt post, because he's unreportable, it leads to a poor justice system. you still really need a system to better address violations by those with protection. because the current system does not work well, and leads to inadequate action. | ||
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IgnE
United States7684 Posts
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oBlade
United States6678 Posts
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