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I was in health class today and the teacher focused on life expectancy. She gave us a sheet of paper and on it were qualities of a person. Next to the quality was a number. One was to start at 76 and then add or subtract the numbers if a quality was met. The end number would be how long you would live. For example:
If you are a male -2
If you are a female +3
...
...
Etc. Etc.
The numbers aren't to be taken seriously, but the idea was there. Certain qualities in life would increase the life expectancy and certain qualities would do the opposite. She kept emphasizing how we should all focus on living longer.
Here's the thing though, health class also covers mental health. I argued that she shouldn't be promoting certain styles of life. There was a quality where if you lived in the city you would lose 3 years of your life. There were qualities where if you lived with another human being you would gain 2 years to your life. The teacher wanted everyone to live longer.
What if you love the city? What if you like to be alone and enjoy an empty house? While they may "take off years" of your life, you would be much happier in those years than if you were to do the opposite.
I say you should measure your life in happiness, not years. It's fine if health class wants to teach us to live longer, but health class shouldn't clearly state that one lifestyle is better than the other. It all depends on the person. I get teased at school because some kids know that I spend a lot of time on the computer. (These are just made up insults. The actual insults are a little more personal and would be time consuming to explain.)
"Ooh, you're gonna be fat!"
"What a loner!"
Does it matter? I love what I do. I could die at 40, but if I woke up every morning and knew that I was as happy as could be, I would be ok. I hope I got my point across. Thank you for reading. Cheers! 
 
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I feel this way as well. You don't want to die young, but living to be 100 would be kind of dumb if you spent the last 20 years not even knowing the names and faces of your family and friends.
Being old doesn't seem that great from what I've heard and seen living in an apartment building where most people are retired.
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Happiness is measured pretty accurately with money. If you don't have enough money to last until you die, you won't be happy. Leaving your children with no money leaves them with less happiness. So in summary: Make/steal/swindle lots of money. That gastric bypass or flight to Singapore is only a few grand away!
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The teacher is simply trying to explain that certain behaviors, character, social conditions, and other things do add up to have a long term effect on your life. Not only that, the relation is very quantifiable in raw numbers than the statement "Studies have shown that <action or trait> have <higher or lower> chance to <increase or decrease> <effect on your health>"
I doubt she was actively promoting certain life choices than to point out that in general, maximizing your general physical health leads to maximizing your life expectancy. To me, for her to say one should maximize life expectancy is an objective quantifiable goal for one to maximize your physical health, which certainly is not a bad suggestion.
Also, it's hard to quantify happiness and mental health in numbers, much less accept such quantities reflect them.
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Is it mentally healthy to intentionally be ignorant of and avoid reality?
It appears that you'd rather not discuss the statistical facts about life expectancy because it makes you uncomfortable; you want to maintain your comfort, therefore discussing reality is considered mentally unhealthy by you.
This is the natural reaction to anyone who comes face-to-face with reality. Instead of rejecting the information that was presented to you, I encourage you to embrace it. You don't have to come to any immediate conclusion about big life changes, but you should continuously, non-judgmentally, think about that class lesson over and over and over again, for years if need be, until you finally find an acceptable answer in yourself which doesn't automatically deny the cold truth.
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Please come back to the sGs skype group T.T
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Longevity is vastly overrated, but it depends on what kind of value you ascribe to life itself. For example, Christians love to ascribe positive value to life because of the whole 'being created in the image of god' thing; certain Buddhists on the other hand (to potentially oversimplify things) consider life to have negative value. A competing view would be the one that says life has neutral value and thus how good it is to be alive is all about adding up the value of the contents within that life. It's a view I subscribe to, so for me it's not about how much time or life you have, it's about what you do with that life.
So then we have to determine what the valuable things actually are that we can fill our lives with. This, on the other hand, requires an entire ethical theory, so it's quite a can of worms to open. If you ask me (and the majority of philosophers), feeling happy is enormously overrated and most claim it has very little to do with actual well-being aka 'happiness', so it's not as simple as saying 'oh I do whatever I want or whatever makes me feel good!'. Complex topics with no easy answers. As usual, I suggest reading Aristotle as a first primer.
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On March 02 2013 16:24 fight_or_flight wrote:
Is it mentally healthy to intentionally be ignorant of and avoid reality?
It appears that you'd rather not discuss the statistical facts about life expectancy because it makes you uncomfortable; you want to maintain your comfort, therefore discussing reality is considered mentally unhealthy by you.
This is the natural reaction to anyone who comes face-to-face with reality. Instead of rejecting the information that was presented to you, I encourage you to embrace it. You don't have to come to any immediate conclusion about big life changes, but you should continuously, non-judgmentally, think about that class lesson over and over and over again, for years if need be, until you finally find an acceptable answer in yourself which doesn't automatically deny the cold truth.
I'm not avoiding reality. I understand the concept that things will improve your lifespan. What I do disagree with is attempting to accomplish all of the things necessary to live to be 100 if you don't enjoy it. It's about finding that ratio that you are comfortable with. Eating healthy foods for the rest of your life might get you to live longer, but you can enjoy some fast food here and there. I argued with the teacher that she shouldn't be stating one lifestyle is better than the other. That is for the student to decide.
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On March 02 2013 18:02 ninazerg wrote:
Please come back to the sGs skype group T.T
Fine... Invite me? :3
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On March 02 2013 14:07 BirdKiller wrote:The teacher is simply trying to explain that certain behaviors, character, social conditions, and other things do add up to have a long term effect on your life. Not only that, the relation is very quantifiable in raw numbers than the statement "Studies have shown that <action or trait> have <higher or lower> chance to <increase or decrease> <effect on your health>" I doubt she was actively promoting certain life choices than to point out that in general, maximizing your general physical health leads to maximizing your life expectancy. To me, for her to say one should maximize life expectancy is an objective quantifiable goal for one to maximize your physical health, which certainly is not a bad suggestion. Also, it's hard to quantify happiness and mental health in numbers, much less accept such quantities reflect them.
It's hard to explain, but if you were in the class I was in, it would have been pretty obvious that she was correlating happiness to life span. There is no way of proving it. You weren't in the class. There is really nothing more I can do. :/ It was probably unintentional.
It's all about finding the ratio. How much time do you want to invest into eating healthy, exercising, etc.? It depends on the values of the person.
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On March 02 2013 19:47 Sauwelios wrote:
Longevity is vastly overrated, but it depends on what kind of value you ascribe to life itself. For example, Christians love to ascribe positive value to life because of the whole 'being created in the image of god' thing; certain Buddhists on the other hand (to potentially oversimplify things) consider life to have negative value. A competing view would be the one that says life has neutral value and thus how good it is to be alive is all about adding up the value of the contents within that life. It's a view I subscribe to, so for me it's not about how much time or life you have, it's about what you do with that life.
So then we have to determine what the valuable things actually are that we can fill our lives with. This, on the other hand, requires an entire ethical theory, so it's quite a can of worms to open. If you ask me (and the majority of philosophers), feeling happy is enormously overrated and most claim it has very little to do with actual well-being aka 'happiness', so it's not as simple as saying 'oh I do whatever I want or whatever makes me feel good!'. Complex topics with no easy answers. As usual, I suggest reading Aristotle as a first primer.
Ooooh... I like the way you think.... Thanks!
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On March 02 2013 23:25 sGs.FroZen wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2013 16:24 fight_or_flight wrote:
Is it mentally healthy to intentionally be ignorant of and avoid reality?
It appears that you'd rather not discuss the statistical facts about life expectancy because it makes you uncomfortable; you want to maintain your comfort, therefore discussing reality is considered mentally unhealthy by you.
This is the natural reaction to anyone who comes face-to-face with reality. Instead of rejecting the information that was presented to you, I encourage you to embrace it. You don't have to come to any immediate conclusion about big life changes, but you should continuously, non-judgmentally, think about that class lesson over and over and over again, for years if need be, until you finally find an acceptable answer in yourself which doesn't automatically deny the cold truth. I'm not avoiding reality. I understand the concept that things will improve your lifespan. What I do disagree with is attempting to accomplish all of the things necessary to live to be 100 if you don't enjoy it. It's about finding that ratio that you are comfortable with. Eating healthy foods for the rest of your life might get you to live longer, but you can enjoy some fast food here and there. I argued with the teacher that she shouldn't be stating one lifestyle is better than the other. That is for the student to decide.
On March 02 2013 23:26 sGs.FroZen wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2013 18:02 ninazerg wrote:
Please come back to the sGs skype group T.T Fine... Invite me? :3
On March 02 2013 23:30 sGs.FroZen wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2013 14:07 BirdKiller wrote:The teacher is simply trying to explain that certain behaviors, character, social conditions, and other things do add up to have a long term effect on your life. Not only that, the relation is very quantifiable in raw numbers than the statement "Studies have shown that <action or trait> have <higher or lower> chance to <increase or decrease> <effect on your health>" I doubt she was actively promoting certain life choices than to point out that in general, maximizing your general physical health leads to maximizing your life expectancy. To me, for her to say one should maximize life expectancy is an objective quantifiable goal for one to maximize your physical health, which certainly is not a bad suggestion. Also, it's hard to quantify happiness and mental health in numbers, much less accept such quantities reflect them. It's hard to explain, but if you were in the class I was in, it would have been pretty obvious that she was correlating happiness to life span. There is no way of proving it. You weren't in the class. There is really nothing more I can do. :/ It was probably unintentional. It's all about finding the ratio. How much time do you want to invest into eating healthy, exercising, etc.? It depends on the values of the person.
On March 02 2013 23:32 sGs.FroZen wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2013 19:47 Sauwelios wrote:
Longevity is vastly overrated, but it depends on what kind of value you ascribe to life itself. For example, Christians love to ascribe positive value to life because of the whole 'being created in the image of god' thing; certain Buddhists on the other hand (to potentially oversimplify things) consider life to have negative value. A competing view would be the one that says life has neutral value and thus how good it is to be alive is all about adding up the value of the contents within that life. It's a view I subscribe to, so for me it's not about how much time or life you have, it's about what you do with that life.
So then we have to determine what the valuable things actually are that we can fill our lives with. This, on the other hand, requires an entire ethical theory, so it's quite a can of worms to open. If you ask me (and the majority of philosophers), feeling happy is enormously overrated and most claim it has very little to do with actual well-being aka 'happiness', so it's not as simple as saying 'oh I do whatever I want or whatever makes me feel good!'. Complex topics with no easy answers. As usual, I suggest reading Aristotle as a first primer. Ooooh... I like the way you think.... Thanks!
multiquote! I personally think it is silly to try to estimate how long/quality of life someone lives when quality of life is subjective to the individual and no one can predict the future.
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The question on my mind is whether the teacher genuinely believes what she teaches. There is always the case that the teacher is simply reciting what the curriculum dictates without having any real opinion of her own. Teaching is job, just like working at a fast food restaurant is. You may not believe/enjoy what you do, but you want to get paid. This is probably very unlikely, as teachers who will argue with students usually enjoy their jobs and value/believe in what they do, but I just wanted to make sure we don't forget to look at the situation from the teacher's point of view. Or perhaps the teacher forgot the main goal of the lesson was to learn to think about the long term effects of what one does. She might have gotten caught up in the argument, not having prepared for a student to argue with her about it. Teachers are human too, and can be affected by the heat of an argument. I'm just adding some thoughts.
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Much of our society operates on the assumption that long life = better regardless of quality. Just look at the treatment of suicides, and the money spent on keeping people alive who are suffering terribly. It's good to question what your teachers teach. It goes unstated, but they are imparting to you societal values that, if you examine them, you may find that you reject. Open opposition is futile, but keep your judgments clear in your own mind. Examine critically before you believe or disbelieve things. Always hold your own beliefs to the same or greater scrutiny though, and change them as you gain experience.
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On March 12 2013 14:32 asbplane wrote:
The question on my mind is whether the teacher genuinely believes what she teaches. There is always the case that the teacher is simply reciting what the curriculum dictates without having any real opinion of her own. Teaching is job, just like working at a fast food restaurant is. You may not believe/enjoy what you do, but you want to get paid. This is probably very unlikely, as teachers who will argue with students usually enjoy their jobs and value/believe in what they do, but I just wanted to make sure we don't forget to look at the situation from the teacher's point of view. Or perhaps the teacher forgot the main goal of the lesson was to learn to think about the long term effects of what one does. She might have gotten caught up in the argument, not having prepared for a student to argue with her about it. Teachers are human too, and can be affected by the heat of an argument. I'm just adding some thoughts.
I may have messed up on conveying information. Does it matter what the teacher thinks? What I'm trying to say is that teachers shouldn't clearly state the same one lifestyle is better than the other for everyone. She can believe it or not.
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On March 02 2013 11:56 sGs.FroZen wrote:
I love what I do. I could die at 40, but if I woke up every morning and knew that I was as happy as could be, I would be ok. I hope I got my point across.
This is the main problem with being a teenager. Death and time are such foreign concepts to you. I wonder if you would think the same thing when you're 39.
That's the whole point of this health class. There are lifestyle choices that you make today that will affect you when you're 40 or 50. I know it seems like it's a long time away but trust me when I say this time passes by so much quicker when you get older. When I was in high school I probably thought the same thing as you that there are still so much time left until I'm 40 that it doesn't matter what happens to me then. I now think very differently and no I'm not ready to die.
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On March 15 2013 05:34 FryBender wrote:Show nested quote +On March 02 2013 11:56 sGs.FroZen wrote:
I love what I do. I could die at 40, but if I woke up every morning and knew that I was as happy as could be, I would be ok. I hope I got my point across. This is the main problem with being a teenager. Death and time are such foreign concepts to you. I wonder if you would think the same thing when you're 39. That's the whole point of this health class. There are lifestyle choices that you make today that will affect you when you're 40 or 50. I know it seems like it's a long time away but trust me when I say this time passes by so much quicker when you get older. When I was in high school I probably thought the same thing as you that there are still so much time left until I'm 40 that it doesn't matter what happens to me then. I now think very differently and no I'm not ready to die.
Yup. Just wait till you get a little older. 40 seems infinitely far away to a teenager.
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On March 15 2013 06:57 JackDT wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2013 05:34 FryBender wrote:On March 02 2013 11:56 sGs.FroZen wrote:
I love what I do. I could die at 40, but if I woke up every morning and knew that I was as happy as could be, I would be ok. I hope I got my point across. This is the main problem with being a teenager. Death and time are such foreign concepts to you. I wonder if you would think the same thing when you're 39. That's the whole point of this health class. There are lifestyle choices that you make today that will affect you when you're 40 or 50. I know it seems like it's a long time away but trust me when I say this time passes by so much quicker when you get older. When I was in high school I probably thought the same thing as you that there are still so much time left until I'm 40 that it doesn't matter what happens to me then. I now think very differently and no I'm not ready to die. Yup. Just wait till you get a little older. 40 seems infinitely far away to a teenager.
I said '40 years old' trying to emphasize how I could die at a young age, but as long as I was happy it was ok. You just explained why I chose that number. I don't know why you are trying to say that I don't grasp the concept of time...
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On March 15 2013 09:11 sGs.FroZen wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2013 06:57 JackDT wrote:On March 15 2013 05:34 FryBender wrote:On March 02 2013 11:56 sGs.FroZen wrote:
I love what I do. I could die at 40, but if I woke up every morning and knew that I was as happy as could be, I would be ok. I hope I got my point across. This is the main problem with being a teenager. Death and time are such foreign concepts to you. I wonder if you would think the same thing when you're 39. That's the whole point of this health class. There are lifestyle choices that you make today that will affect you when you're 40 or 50. I know it seems like it's a long time away but trust me when I say this time passes by so much quicker when you get older. When I was in high school I probably thought the same thing as you that there are still so much time left until I'm 40 that it doesn't matter what happens to me then. I now think very differently and no I'm not ready to die. Yup. Just wait till you get a little older. 40 seems infinitely far away to a teenager. I said '40 years old' trying to emphasize how I could die at a young age, but as long as I was happy it was ok. You just explained why I chose that number. I don't know why you are trying to say that I don't grasp the concept of time...
Because I thought exactly the same way when I was your age. I remember arguing with my mom when I was 15 or 16 saying the exact same thing that you said in this post. That being happy is the most important thing in life and that those suckers that work a 9-5 job and come home miserable are stupid and that if you enjoy being a beach bum then that's what you should be doing and working in a life-sucking corporate world (like my parents were doing and of course providing for me with that money) was the wrong way to live life. Who cares if I die when I'm 40, I'm going to be happy. I even told her the fisherman and the businessman parable:
+ Show Spoiler +
The businessman was at the pier of a small coastal Mexican village when a small boat with just one fisherman docked. Inside the small boat were several large yellowfin tuna. The businessman complimented the Mexican on the quality of his fish and asked how long it took to catch them. The Mexican replied only a little while.
The businessman then asked why he didn't stay out longer and catch more fish? The Mexican said he had enough to support his family's immediate needs. The businessman then asked, but what do you do with the rest of your time? The Mexican fisherman said, "I sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, take a siesta with my wife, Maria, stroll into the village each evening where I sip wine and play guitar with my amigos; I have a full and busy life, señor."
The businessman scoffed, "I am a Harvard MBA and I could help you. You should spend more time fishing and with the proceeds buy a bigger boat. With the proceeds from the bigger boat you could buy several boats; eventually you would have a fleet of fishing boats. Instead of selling your catch to a middleman, you would sell directly to the processor and eventually open your own cannery. You would control the product, processing and distribution. You would need to leave this small coastal fishing village and move to Mexico City, then LA and eventually New York City where you would run your expanding enterprise."
The Mexican fisherman asked, "But señor, how long will this all take?" To which the businessman replied, "15-20 years." "But what then, señor?" The businessman laughed and said, "That's the best part! When the time is right you would announce an IPO and sell your company stock to the public and become very rich. You would make millions." "Millions, señor? Then what?" The businessman said, "Then you would retire. Move to a small coastal fishing village where you would sleep late, fish a little, play with your kids, take a siesta with your wife, stroll to the village in the evenings where you could sip wine and play your guitar with your amigos."
The fisherman, still smiling, looked up and said, "Isn't that what I'm doing right now?"
-Author Unknown
and I thought I was so smart and that I got her. In the end my mom just smiled and said "we'll see".
Guess what I'm doing now. I'm working in the soul-sucking corporate world and am very happy and do not want to die when I'm 40 (which is coming up way quicker then I'd like to admit). In the end I know it's useless to convince you and you'll have to learn and figure these things out on your own. Just know this, if you happen to come upon this thread in about 15 years I guarantee you'll find it funny and heartwarming.
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On March 15 2013 23:31 FryBender wrote:Show nested quote +On March 15 2013 09:11 sGs.FroZen wrote:On March 15 2013 06:57 JackDT wrote:On March 15 2013 05:34 FryBender wrote:On March 02 2013 11:56 sGs.FroZen wrote:
I love what I do. I could die at 40, but if I woke up every morning and knew that I was as happy as could be, I would be ok. I hope I got my point across. This is the main problem with being a teenager. Death and time are such foreign concepts to you. I wonder if you would think the same thing when you're 39. That's the whole point of this health class. There are lifestyle choices that you make today that will affect you when you're 40 or 50. I know it seems like it's a long time away but trust me when I say this time passes by so much quicker when you get older. When I was in high school I probably thought the same thing as you that there are still so much time left until I'm 40 that it doesn't matter what happens to me then. I now think very differently and no I'm not ready to die. Yup. Just wait till you get a little older. 40 seems infinitely far away to a teenager. I said '40 years old' trying to emphasize how I could die at a young age, but as long as I was happy it was ok. You just explained why I chose that number. I don't know why you are trying to say that I don't grasp the concept of time... Because I thought exactly the same way when I was your age. I remember arguing with my mom when I was 15 or 16 saying the exact same thing that you said in this post. That being happy is the most important thing in life and that those suckers that work a 9-5 job and come home miserable are stupid and that if you enjoy being a beach bum then that's what you should be doing and working in a life-sucking corporate world (like my parents were doing and of course providing for me with that money) was the wrong way to live life. Who cares if I die when I'm 40, I'm going to be happy. I even told her the fisherman and the businessman parable: + Show Spoiler +
The businessman was at the pier of a small coastal Mexican village when a small boat with just one fisherman docked. Inside the small boat were several large yellowfin tuna. The businessman complimented the Mexican on the quality of his fish and asked how long it took to catch them. The Mexican replied only a little while.
The businessman then asked why he didn't stay out longer and catch more fish? The Mexican said he had enough to support his family's immediate needs. The businessman then asked, but what do you do with the rest of your time? The Mexican fisherman said, "I sleep late, fish a little, play with my children, take a siesta with my wife, Maria, stroll into the village each evening where I sip wine and play guitar with my amigos; I have a full and busy life, señor."
The businessman scoffed, "I am a Harvard MBA and I could help you. You should spend more time fishing and with the proceeds buy a bigger boat. With the proceeds from the bigger boat you could buy several boats; eventually you would have a fleet of fishing boats. Instead of selling your catch to a middleman, you would sell directly to the processor and eventually open your own cannery. You would control the product, processing and distribution. You would need to leave this small coastal fishing village and move to Mexico City, then LA and eventually New York City where you would run your expanding enterprise."
The Mexican fisherman asked, "But señor, how long will this all take?" To which the businessman replied, "15-20 years." "But what then, señor?" The businessman laughed and said, "That's the best part! When the time is right you would announce an IPO and sell your company stock to the public and become very rich. You would make millions." "Millions, señor? Then what?" The businessman said, "Then you would retire. Move to a small coastal fishing village where you would sleep late, fish a little, play with your kids, take a siesta with your wife, stroll to the village in the evenings where you could sip wine and play your guitar with your amigos."
The fisherman, still smiling, looked up and said, "Isn't that what I'm doing right now?"
-Author Unknown
and I thought I was so smart and that I got her. In the end my mom just smiled and said "we'll see". Guess what I'm doing now. I'm working in the soul-sucking corporate world and am very happy and do not want to die when I'm 40 (which is coming up way quicker then I'd like to admit). In the end I know it's useless to convince you and you'll have to learn and figure these things out on your own. Just know this, if you happen to come upon this thread in about 15 years I guarantee you'll find it funny and heartwarming.
I see your point. It was my mistake for mistaking what we were disagreeing about.
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EPT
