EPTI have less time than usual though so don't expect spam posting Curu!
TL Mafia LII: JubJub Mafia
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Curu
Canada2817 Posts
I have less time than usual though so don't expect spam posting Curu! | ||
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Curu
Canada2817 Posts
More reason not to rely on blues to win the game! | ||
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I would suggest everyone keeping at least 1 PM target unused for now so if we get a confirmed Townie we can set up a Town circlejerk. | ||
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I agree with your idea of lynching jaybrundage though layabout but could you give your reasoning behind it? | ||
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Hide Flip: Can this be used on lynch targets? Is there a period of time in which the target must die after use of the ability in order for his flip to be hidden or, once designated, does the target, regardless of whatever time they die, have their flip hidden no matter what? | ||
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Curu
Canada2817 Posts
Take a look at how Town Jackal posts: + Show Spoiler [Town Jackal] + On February 21 2012 11:42 Jackal58 wrote: Dear redFF and WBG You both suck. Sincerely, Jackal58 On February 22 2012 04:19 Jackal58 wrote: People expect me to tunnel on day 1. So why not through some shit against the wall and see what sticks? And I made no attempt to start any thing. I called Toad scum and gave no reasons for it. I never voted him. I never made a case on him. I threw some shit against the wall. Some stuck to redFF. On March 02 2012 09:33 Jackal58 wrote: Didn't realize this had started. I rarely agree with Decon but when I do we lynch scum. On March 02 2012 10:14 Jackal58 wrote: He's picking a fight over an issue that really has no bearing on the game. I've seen other scum do that before. Choose a side on a LaL or lurker argument and beat it to death. Oh wait, that was you! I'd have no problem lynching either of them. On August 18 2011 04:06 Jackal58 wrote: My vote is on you Nisani and it's not coming off this time. You can fucking claim to be the goddamned Pope if you want to. On August 18 2011 21:14 Jackal58 wrote: No mystery at all. The only thing you'll be checking is your shorts. On September 08 2011 10:11 Jackal58 wrote: We're trying to read the last 2 pages without having our brains fall out. I have never seen a game start like this before. The first 5 posts contained a vote. The next 10 were a pissing contest between a bunch of 13 year old brats. And it went down hill from there. I wish I was as good as you guys. My first post with any substance to it will be made after I've had another 12 beers. You guys won't make any sense to me until I'm damn near unconscious. On August 14 2011 03:37 Jackal58 wrote: I have no specific wincon. I win with town. I'm simply compelled to spend all my efforts into getting BM killed. I have no idea what BMs alignment is or what if any wincon he has. He must die though. I had hoped it would be quite some time before he made himself apparent. I don't like this any more than you guys do. But BM must die. Lynch him now. Compare that to how scum Jackal posts: + Show Spoiler [Scum Jackal] + On August 24 2011 02:27 Jackal58 wrote: I never believe Palmar is a townie. At least not on day 1 or 2. Unless he starts quoting Shakespeare. So ya Palmar made a joke at my expense. I wouldn't use that as a basis to get him killed. At least not yet anyways. On August 24 2011 06:06 Jackal58 wrote: If it wasn't Wiggles I'd say you're spot on. But Wiggles is the only one here that I'm aware of that has won a game as the SK before. But I also used this rationale to talk myself into believing Wiggles couldn't be scum once when the scum team was playing like 2 year old kids on Valium. I don't believe Wiggles to be the 3rd party atm. I would say Palmar has more likelihood of that but that isn't saying much right now either. If you're right kudos to you. I'd rather wait a bit and see what develops. If Mr. Wiggles is town he is probably the best player we have. On August 25 2011 08:46 Jackal58 wrote: If anybody ever accuses me of tunneling again I'm going to bitch slap them. Ferryman we get it. You think Wiggles is the EH. You may very well be right. Guess what? Right now I don't care about the EH. But you sure as hell do. You are either the psych or scum. I know you have a very good grasp on how this game works. You are also on the opposite end of the brilliance spectrum from Cyber_cheese. Put your efforts into something other than tunneling your EH suspect. Please. I'm filtering all of you from most to least interesting so I'm going to be a while. On December 04 2011 23:57 Jackal58 wrote: Good morning. Role confirmed. Game on. Random lynch on day 1 seems counterproductive to me. On day anything really. What would you perceive as a benefit to doing that Palmar? Posting lists right out of the box about players who are likely on the scum team due to the hosts balancing reminds me a bit of Zodiac lists that have been posted in previous games. More often than not those lists were posted by scum. At least in the games I've seen them used in. You scum Palmar? The only way to 100% establish your innocence is to die. On December 06 2011 09:14 Jackal58 wrote: V7 asked and I'm going to answer. Without having played in at least a dozen or more games with Palmar to date, without using meta as a tool for analysis, I would call Palmar's play so far at best - terrible. But ya I'd see him as scum. I have a history of seeing Palmar as scum. Seems like most games if I'm not busy calling him scum he's busy calling me scum. But his ploy with you today he pulled on me just a couple games ago. However instead of killing some random person I blew him up. So ya I've seen him do this exact same thing before as town. So it is hard for me to call him scum. Of course that was until he told us he has a vote rigging role. That's a scum role. Palmar,why does a townie have a scum role? It's a complete difference in tone and style of posting when Jackal is Town vs when he is scum. When he's Town his posts are blindly aggressive, calling out everyone and everything he latches onto as scum whereas when he's scum his posts are much more reasonable, mild, gently probing sort of posts. The sample size is still very small this game but the cat's out of the bag essentially. It's small things in Jackal's posts that tip it off but things such as "You have my vote sir" really read like scum Jackal. | ||
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Curu
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##Vote Jackal58 | ||
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Curu
Canada2817 Posts
I haven't talked to anyone in PMs yet, no. This is something I've had on Jackal for a while. My posts that I made in the endgame of a scum Jackal game played in December 2011: On December 19 2011 09:57 Curu wrote: @Jackal Your opening posts were so cautious and careful (whereas you are like super kamikaze man when you are Town) that I was screaming at syllo that you were scum as soon as the game started. I was going to ask him to shoot you but he went with annul instead. On December 19 2011 13:22 Curu wrote: Yes lol. Do you remember Werewolves? I was so sure you were scum because you had rabid blind aggression towards Nisani who was quite obviously Town. You flipping Town blew my mind. Likewise in Kurumi's game, you were attacking people and pushing them hard. After seeing you attack Palmar so mildly and so timidly in this game I was sure after your first post in this game you were scum. I wasn't in this game but I talked to syllo (a Vig in the game) and kept telling him to shoot Jackal from his first post. I don't have quite the same level of confidence in the read this game but it's close. | ||
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On March 12 2012 09:41 Jitsu wrote: Hmmm, looking at it again, I think prphlz's reason to vote for Jackal is a much larger amount of bullshit then Caller's. For instance, you point out that he is using things such as That yells sarcasm to me a lot more then it screams scum. Wiggles brings up a good point. prphlz is a player that wouldn't just happen to miss the name of someone that posted. It's almost like prphlz was waiting for Curu to post something, realized he fucked up, then tried to cover it. It's not surprising that prphlz mistakes Curu for Caller, and then 10 minutes later, Curu ACTUALLY comes out with a small little case against Jackal as well. Shit reeks. ##vote prphlz Also, LayAbout, are you still looking at jaybrundage? Yeah great thinking there captain. The whole Mafia team decided we need to kill Jackal so we all posted about it. Go read Werewolves I (Jackal Town), Storm Mafia (Jackal Town), then Cosmic Horror (Jackal Mafia) and TL Mafia XLVIII (Jackal Mafia). Compare the posting style between Jackal in those games. If you look at all his games actually this same style is consistent through every game without fail depending on if he rolled Town or Mafia. I tried to illustrate this with random quotes I took from a bunch of his games. In the last game especially, using the exact same standard that's set in this game I was able to identify Jackal as Mafia from day 1. Here's the link: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=291212 It is an argument purely based on meta but on day 1 meta is one of the best indicators. If you read this game: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=266305 We also used meta to establish Palmar as scum on day 1 and get him lynched. | ||
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Curu
Canada2817 Posts
Sentinel's vote is even worse, there are different merits and failures for sharing/not sharing who you are PMing. Neither option is inherently pro Town or pro Mafia, wanting a lynch on him because he advised sharing who you PM with is absurd. That said Mattchew you on board with the Jackal case? You advocated strong meta reads on day 1. This is a strong meta read on day 1 with precedents. Take a look at Jackal's games/posts and tell us what you think. | ||
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Curu
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1. Jackal Town Jitsu Mafia = why protect Jackal with something dumb right now, should just go with it and let us case formers take the fall after flip 2. Jackal Town Jitsu Town = can explain his actions 3. Jackal Mafia Jitsu Town = can explain his actions 4. Jackal Mafia Jitsu Mafia = can explain his actions There's also the possibility that Jitsu is softly setting us up for the fall afterwards but still intending a Jackal lynch to happen, which would fall under scenario 1, but that's like Ace-level scum planning so I think pretty unlikely. It does look weird that we all came to the conclusion so simultaneously but I've provided links to posts in post-game discussion where I came to the same conclusion in a game from 4 months ago. Since the get-go I've drawn the same feeling from Jackal this game but I wanted to wait a bit to see him post more. When I saw Caller had already thrown down a case, though, I thought time was good to add in my thoughts. prplhz is someone who has also played many games with Jackal. There are two people I would say I have played enough with enough/recognize enough signs from to call Mafia based on meta tells and those are Jackal and Palmar. I also don't buy this "don't lynch him yet, he's a good player etc etc" there is only one person I would extend this rule to and that is Mig because he is a crushing Town player and an awful scum player. You lynch based on who you think has the highest probability to flip scum, way back in the day when I was on the scumteam we were able to pull out a dominating victory because people kept pushing "don't lynch Curu/chaoser/Mig/etc yet because they are good players (we were all scum)," ended up constantly lynching newbies and Palmar, who was the one pushing pretty hard for all 3 of us. was then killed. Palmar's cases faded from memory and we cruised through the rest of the game. | ||
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This is a normal game. Dreamflower does not belong in a normal game. It's a themed role. HMMMM | ||
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Original Message From Foolishness: Hey, you're next in line to be hosting a normal game. This is a reminder to get your setup balanced and to get a cohost. There are two games that will be posted before yours so don't make a thread yet, I'll let you know when to do so. Also, in case you weren't aware, I'm being very strict on what constitutes a "normal" game. Since your game is listed as normal all the roles in your game must be standard, and your game rules must be standard as well (1 or maybe 2 gimmicks is okay though). If you have any questions about what is allowed and what isn't just let me know. If it turns out your game is themed and not normal we will put you at the head of the themed queue and get your game going asap (so do not fret too much). Let me know if you got any questions. I'm also incredibly busy over the next week so I will go ahead and pass on balancing your game if you were thinking about asking me. PM I got from Foolishness. 1-2 gimmicks, I would say the Mafia role system is a special gimmick but my understanding of normal games is that all roles must be normal iterations with nothing too crazy. Dreamflower has been used by the hosts in every game hosted by them so far that was themed but in their normal games Vigilantes have always been the basic version of the role without this special gimmick. | ||
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I don't think there's any possibility of suicidal Vigilante in a normal game. Let's kill Jackal. | ||
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If we leave Jackal alive he is going to have to shoot tonight and claim his shot right before the deadline. I'll re-read the thread to see if there's anything else that sticks out but I doubt I would like a lynch better than Jackal. Even in the offchance he is Town losing the role is not a huge loss because it's such a double sided sword. Especially given the circumstances since a rushed shot is far more likely to hit a Town (resulting in 2 anti Town KP). | ||
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