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Situation report 1 posted!

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
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DarQraven
Profile Joined January 2010
Netherlands553 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-27 17:07:26
August 27 2010 17:05 GMT
#1
http://eu.battle.net/sc2/en/blog/554901

Posted right here, sorry if it's a dupe. Don't really have a lot of time to devote to this post (empty battery...) but I'm hoping this helps someone out!

Balance Changes

We have several balance changes in store. One general change we're making is that friendly units will no longer provide vision after being killed. Enemy units previously revealed will no longer be targetable. Now let's break down the additional balance changes we're implementing.



Maps

We're going to be adding destructible rocks to the Desert Oasis map to make natural expansions easier to protect. In addition, the center map watchtower area is being narrowed.

Protoss

We have two key changes in mind for the zealot: the build time is being increased from 33 to 38 seconds, and the warpgate cooldown is being increased from 23 to 28 seconds. Zealot rushes are currently too powerful at various skill levels, particularly those that rely on rapidly assaulting an enemy base from nearby "proxy" gateways. We feel the window players have to scout for and fend off this rush is too small. We also want to address the problem of protoss being able to dump minerals a bit too quickly with the combination of warpgates and Chrono Boost.

Terran

There are several changes in the works for terrans. Reapers against zerg are stronger than expected. Due to the zealot build time increase, reapers would be a bit problematic in combination with proxy barracks, bunkers, and/or marauders against protoss. Therefore, we have decided to increase the build time of reapers as well from 40 to 45 seconds. Fast reaper + bunker, or fast marine + bunker rushes are problematic against zerg. Although this rush would never outright destroy the zerg player, we feel zerg suffers too much of a disadvantage from either having to cancel the fast expansion, or getting trapped inside the main base for too long, so we are also increasing the bunker build time from 30 to 35 seconds.

Siege tanks in large numbers are performing too well in all matchups. In the mid- to late-game, siege tanks are too dominant against all ground units. We want a small set of light and unarmored ground units to perform better against siege tanks. With this in mind, we're changing the Siege Mode damage of the siege tank from 50 to 35, +15 vs. armored; to correspond with this, damage upgrades will be changed from +5 to +3, +2 vs. armored. This change reduces the base damage of the siege tank against light and unarmored units, as well as the splash damage.

Battlecruisers currently lack good counters from the ground and still perform very well against a wide array of unit types. We're aware that it is not easy to get battlecruisers out for the cost, but at the same time, it is possible in both 1v1s and team games to create stalemate situations to bring them out. Overall, we feel that battlecruisers are too strong for their cost, and the terran-forced stalemate situations are causing less interesting gameplay. We will be lowering their damage against ground units from 10 to 8.

Zerg

Ultralisk damage is being decreased from 15, +25 vs. armored to 15, +20 vs. armored. This reduction is comparable to the changes being made to the battlecruiser and siege tank. Like the battlecruiser, ultralisks are simply too powerful for the cost, even though they are difficult to muster. Also, in combination with other units, ultralisks are difficult to counter from the ground. The ultralisk building attack (Ram) is being removed because the damage rate is too similar to its normal attack, which will be used against buildings instead. When ultralisks target tightly packed smaller buildings such as supply depots, the Ram attack is actually outputting considerably less overall damage than its normal attack, as Ram only hits a single target.



And Beyond...

We are reading your posts on the forums and creating lists of features and bugs to address in future patches. We have mid- to long-term plans to further evolve the Custom Game experience, and soon, enhance our social features with the addition of chat channels. We will be sharing more specific information in the coming weeks. As with all of our previous games, we will support StarCraft II for many years to come. Your feedback and participation is critical in making this not only the best game it can be, but also the most engaged gaming community in the world. We look forward to the implementation of patch 1.1, as well as sharing our plans for our future gameplay and Battle.net features.

We'll see you online!
chocoed
Profile Joined June 2007
United States398 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-27 17:14:23
August 27 2010 17:08 GMT
#2
This looks to be an amazing patch, although the protoss nerf seems unwarranted. I don't think it's going to change the popularity of 2gate proxy in PvP.

And WOOOO for chat channels! Finally we get it.
My life for Aiur!
s.a.y
Profile Blog Joined October 2007
Croatia3840 Posts
August 27 2010 17:09 GMT
#3
Nice.

All the problematic stuff is being resolved, and chat channels are back :D
I am not good with quotes
koppik
Profile Joined April 2010
United States676 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-27 17:12:46
August 27 2010 17:10 GMT
#4
Pretty good changes, except for Protoss. The race needs a buff, if zealots are being nerfed.

Oh, but I really don't understand the battlecruiser nerf. They do a lot of damage, sure, but they're just so easily kited by units that it doesn't matter.
Intricate
Profile Joined August 2010
Canada127 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-27 17:12:05
August 27 2010 17:10 GMT
#5
those nerfs sound like early game aggression is going to decrease from both P and T

edit: oh and CHAT CHANNELS <3
"We all live inside of NesTea's dream" - Artosis
Kpyolysis32
Profile Joined April 2010
553 Posts
August 27 2010 17:10 GMT
#6
This looks legit, wow. I honestly hope it's not, though, because nerfs are not really the way to make a better game..

I would much prefer to see some Zerg buff.
Man, do I not keep this up to date, or what?
NuKedUFirst
Profile Blog Joined March 2010
Canada3139 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-27 17:14:15
August 27 2010 17:10 GMT
#7
Edit:
Lol.. No zerg buffs, just nerfs for terran, zerg and protoss.
FrostedMiniWeet wrote: I like winning because it validates all the bloody time I waste playing SC2.
EoR
Profile Joined July 2010
Ireland127 Posts
August 27 2010 17:11 GMT
#8
These all seem like pretty solid changes. Their reasoning for the zealot change is a bit odd though. Were proxy gateways particularly hard to hold off as Terran? They seemed pretty ineffective against Zerg, from my experience, at least.
SiegeFlank
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
United States410 Posts
August 27 2010 17:12 GMT
#9
I can't really comment much on the ultralisk changes, but the terran and protoss changes are excellent, and actually exactly along the lines of what the community has been asking for.

The change to desert oasis should hopefully be good too. Curious to see what else they might have in store for map changes and race changes.
Bird up
Spawkuring
Profile Joined July 2008
United States755 Posts
August 27 2010 17:12 GMT
#10
Terran nerfs seem reasonable. Not sure why zealots and ultralisks need nerfs though.
TMTurtle
Profile Joined August 2010
183 Posts
August 27 2010 17:12 GMT
#11
I don't like the zealot change vs 6pool.
KingRajesh
Profile Joined July 2010
United States927 Posts
August 27 2010 17:13 GMT
#12
Blizzard being Blizzard unfortunately, it's not the fact that siege tanks hit REALLY hard, it's the fact that you can make a line of them, and the corresponding splash damage plus them all firing at the same time destroys units. And also, what set of light, unarmored units do Zerg have to "perform better against siege tanks"? The Zergling?

Bunker build time needs to be 40 seconds IMO.
"Zerg are the absolute worst thing that can happen to your day" - Dustin Browder
Laggy
Profile Blog Joined May 2010
United States385 Posts
August 27 2010 17:13 GMT
#13
I think the ultralisk just needs a size adjustment, I lost a game because 1 ultra was on the ramp with 6 others wanting to get down. I still want to see how these effects will affect gameplay, seems the tank damage will make a gigantic change but who knows!
D on iccup stands for diamond in SC2
koppik
Profile Joined April 2010
United States676 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-27 17:16:38
August 27 2010 17:14 GMT
#14
The removal of the "ram" attack against buildings is actually sizable buff for ultralisks. It'll be much, much easier for them to kill a PF now, since the splash will usually be hitting some scvs.

The main difference for tanks against zerg is that they're significantly worse against hydras. They're a bit worse against lings too, but it's not a huge deal.
Slayer91
Profile Joined February 2006
Ireland23335 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-27 17:16:43
August 27 2010 17:14 GMT
#15
Looks like they took Jinro's advice from state of the game when the destructible rock "yes, dat would be perfect actually" (what I remember from it)
Ultra nerf reasonable, they're basically only good against tanks anyway. Let's look:
Bio: Ghost snipe is good. Marines with marauders behind are very good against them. Marauders with stim are faster off creep (if no fungal)
Mech: Thors used to be the counter, and with 250 mm cannon they are still good counters. Hellions die really slow to ultras because of low damage to light. They are not "natural enemies" and hellions will go after lings/drones while ultras will focus on tanks.

2 gate pressure seemed too strong against zerg like idra said, not sure about being possible to get roaches and then ling speed to hold off stalkers, and korean 4 warpgate is good against Z/P

Terrans will need like 6 rax reaper now to be able to get the same amount ^_^
Double bunker at the ramp slightly nerfed.

Tanks were way too good against zealots anyway. It should be more like sc1.
BCs: Needing 6 hydras to kill a BC and probably a 4-5 stalkers did seem unreasonable.
Ram was cool but totally useless.

Perhaps we will see the reemergence of hydralisks in ZvT? With marauder/tank heavy compositions often showing up hydras are starting to become very, very powerful if they aren't owned hard by tanks.
it takes 3 hits to kill hydra now, up from 2. Not to mention splash. So they last as long as roaches now (!)
+1 armour lings survive +0 attack tanks (!)
Zealots last about as long as BW zealots vs siege tanks.
Very interesting. Just after my post about hydralisks sucking too. Nice.
ltortoise
Profile Joined August 2010
633 Posts
August 27 2010 17:14 GMT
#16
All the changes seem pretty fair to me (I'm a terran).

I particularly like the zealot change. Good lord are proxy zealot rushes strong on 2 player maps...Just good lord! Zealots eat marines for breakfast.
Mikami_
Profile Blog Joined July 2009
Estonia274 Posts
August 27 2010 17:15 GMT
#17
All these toss nerfs since beginning of the beta makes me a saaad panda T__T
Archas
Profile Blog Joined July 2010
United States6531 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-27 17:17:06
August 27 2010 17:15 GMT
#18
These all look pretty nice. The Zealot and Reaper changes will be helpful in defending against rushes, and might even discourage the constant 4-gate rushes and such that are plaguing the ladder.

I don't see much of a problem with the nerf to Siege Tanks; smartfire makes them far more dangerous than in Brood War, so I feel the change is warranted. However, I'm torn on the Battlecruiser nerf. I feel that if you manage to get Battlecruisers out, your foe should be punished for not being able to deter their construction. Capital ships are meant to be powerful, after all, so if you're willing to invest the time and resources into making them, you should be getting a lot more bang for your buck than if you massed, say, Hellions.

The Ultralisk nerf is also confusing me. Admittedly, I don't play Zerg, but I would imagine that this nerf leaves Ultralisks far less potent, especially concerning their secondary role as building killers. It's mentioned in the report that Ultralisks deal less damage with Ram against Supply Depots and other small buildings than their normal attack... but small buildings have fewer HP anyway. Against larger targets like Planetary Fortresses and Nexi, Ram is a huge benefit...

Oh, well. At least we got some stuff to look forward to in a few weeks. =)

EDIT: Chat channels! Woo!

Also, reading the previous posts on the Ultralisk nerf made me realize how little I know about Zerg. Disregard my babble. = /
The room is ripe with the stench of bitches!
Archerofaiur
Profile Joined August 2008
United States4101 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-08-27 17:16:49
August 27 2010 17:15 GMT
#19
Hmmmm. Dont know how i feel about all this. Hesitant but slightly optomistic about most of the changes. Sad about the ram attack going I hope they keep the animation.
http://sclegacy.com/news/28-scl/250-starcraftlegacy-macro-theorycrafting-contest-winners
Altsa
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
Finland990 Posts
August 27 2010 17:16 GMT
#20
Seems ultra nerf isn´t "that" bad but I still dont like it . I personally hoped that they would reduce the range of reapers by 1 instead of build time increase. Zealot change makes PvP a bit less "korean4gate" heavy but zerg early pool cheese got better in PvZ..
AoD
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