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Tensai176
Canada2061 Posts
User temp banned for this comment I also disagree with your decision but your tournament, your rules. TSL2 would`ve been better with him being allowed to play but I do understand your reasoning. However, I will go to say that it would be pretty easy to give him an exception just because he would be in Korea at the time of the tournament. | ||
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YaGaMi98
Singapore16 Posts
I dont get this: A player is eligible to play in the TSL if: * He grew up in a location without a professional StarCraft scene; OR * He currently resides in a location without a professional StarCraft scene and is not affiliated with a professional StarCraft team; AND Can any1 explain to me why these rules are set?? | ||
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Gryffindor_us
United States5606 Posts
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Scorcher2k
United States802 Posts
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mdb
Bulgaria4059 Posts
As I mentioned before, the descision to not let nongmin play is absolutely correct, becouse noone can deny that he is considered more like korean amateur, rather than one of the best foreign players. One of the things that will lead if he was included is that the tourney would have been much less interesting, becouse of the apparent skill gap between him and most of the non-kor players. The thing that really I dont like is letting Idra play. If we even put aside that he is in fact in Korea and a pro-gamer, the skill gap between him and the rest of the non-kor players is in the same as nongrinms. This will lead to much less exciting tournament imo (as he`ll be a huuuuge favourite to win it). If you take him and nongmin out of this tournament, I think that noone can point a huge favourite to win it. Unpredicatbility is one of the thing that makes a tourney more interesting. But after all I cant recall a single time tl.net has made wrong descision about anything, so I guess this time will be no exception and I`m pretty sure with or without Idra TSL2 will be kick ass. | ||
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Xeris
Iran17695 Posts
If Nongmin didn't stream, nobody would ever have known who he is. He'd just be another random USA flagged Korean with A rank that people post about in the Who's Who Thread. Nongmin doesn't participate in foreign events. He's not really in a team. He doesn't actually post on TL He rarely interacts even with the people on his stream (aside from typing "gg" when he's done, and SOMETIMES making a random comment or two) So, for all intensive purposes, he really isn't a foreigner, although he has had chances to integrate himself into the foreign community and not wanted to do so. He is a Korean, and I think also the fact that he moved back to Korea sort of indicates that he's really only in this country for education and not really to live. In that sense, he can't really be considered a foreigner. While I agree allowing him to play would make the tournament more interesting, it goes against the very purpose of what TL is trying to achieve. And I also disagree with the manner argument. He's a nice kid, but in my personal experience I can't say his manner is exemplary. And anyways, manner has nothing to do with this O_O;. | ||
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Elite00fm
United States548 Posts
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SonuvBob
Aiur21550 Posts
On November 17 2009 23:57 Scorcher2k wrote: I'm really not posting this to start drama and I'm actually just curious but will Kollsen not be participating in the TSL? Why wouldn't he be? | ||
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TimmyMac
Canada499 Posts
Hey, lets bring the Bulls into the NCAA - I mean, all their players used to be college players and they all have connections still to the college bball community... besides, they're not a 'top' NBA team anyway. Don't really care about the other dude. | ||
Hot_Bid
Braavos36389 Posts
On November 18 2009 13:39 TimmyMac wrote: Lol, no fucking way should idra be in tsl2. He's a progamer! Hey, lets bring the Bulls into the NCAA - I mean, all their players used to be college players and they all have connections still to the college bball community... besides, they're not a 'top' NBA team anyway. Don't really care about the other dude. Your analogy doesn't work because TSL is not an amateur tournament -- its a foreigner tournament. | ||
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LibertyTerran
Vietnam711 Posts
What I find debatable in these rules are especially in two terms: 2a "He grew up in a location without a professional StarCraft scene OR" 2b "He currently resides in a location without a professional StarCraft scene AND is not affiliated with a professional StarCraft team" Rule 2a basically lets foreign pro-gamers like Idra and Ret play this tournament. If you strictly follow rule 2a, Idra and Ret are eligible to play TSL. So there is no controversial decision, bending the rule, nor exemption applies here. It is therefore totally unnecessary for the TSL Staffs to open the can of worm about Idra's contribution to the community here. Rule 2b: some people didn't read rule 2a carefully and thus became angry about why Idra & Ret can play even though they are in Korea and in Proteam. These people should read Rule2a again and with the big OR after it. In this case, rule 2b basically blocks Nongming from playing TSL as he doesn't fit in Rule 2a and the rest of the Korean gamers who are in Korea during the TSL. However, if an A, A+ Korean amateur wants to ruin the "foreign-only" characteristic of this tournament, he can just travel to another country that has good internet connection (Rule 1), slips through Rule 2b and steam-rolls the rest our foreign participants. The term "currently resides" in Rule 2b is defined very loosely (is 30-day tourist visa can be considered as "currently reside"?). I don't disagree with the decision of the TSL admins, but I really hope they take it on board that the set of rules they set out in the opening post does have some problems, as reflected by a 50/50 rate of support/against (check Hot_bid post in page 22) and a lot of misunderstanding/trolling posts in this thread. I hope mine is not one of them :-/. | ||
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samachking
Bahrain4949 Posts
not including nongmin is a good thing, no foreigner can take him out period, Idra may be able to beat him in a bo3 but I dont think he can take him in a bo5 | ||
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Elroi
Sweden5599 Posts
TL does this in a very professional maner imo, good work. | ||
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Scorcher2k
United States802 Posts
I don't know. I just figured that I would have heard someone say something about him in this thread if he was competing and I haven't seen a list of competitors (I might just be dumb in this regard) to see if he was. If he is competing, then I'm not sure why people are complaining about Idra and Ret competing when Koll just 2-0 Idra in WSG... | ||
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TimmyMac
Canada499 Posts
On November 18 2009 15:31 Hot_Bid wrote: Your analogy doesn't work because TSL is not an amateur tournament -- its a foreigner tournament. Semantics, really. 'Foreign' = not where the pro scene is. | ||
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Liquid`Nazgul
22427 Posts
Do you see Korean amateurs participating here? | ||
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TimmyMac
Canada499 Posts
Mhm... look, I just find it ridiculous that blatant ringers are allowed in. Now maybe it would be different if idra moved to Korea recently, but he's been there for a long time, training with pros every day. Doesn't seem in the spirit of the tournament at all to me, even if he probably won't win. | ||
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Ganfei
Taiwan1439 Posts
On November 18 2009 17:34 samachking wrote: Funny how a thread about player eligibility only focuses and is made to only focus on idra/nongmin/ret and doesnt even talk about hackers and ex-hackers and abusers that can play TSL or recovered etc + and abuse policy not including nongmin is a good thing, no foreigner can take him out period, Idra may be able to beat him in a bo3 but I dont think he can take him in a bo5 ...what? blatantly flat out wrong. | ||
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jeddus
United States832 Posts
I am glad that the administration took the time to even consider the matter. | ||
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Foucault
Sweden2826 Posts
Then again there's a big chance that Idra is a notch higher skill-wise than everyone else in the foreign scene due to him being on a korean pro-team, which kind of gives him an "unfair" advantage. I don't think Idra's complaining, there's alot of money on the line. He is very much associated with the foreign scene though, not by contribution per se but from involvement for many years, being on the Media team etc. | ||
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