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On June 26 2011 06:28 RedJustice wrote:Show nested quote +On June 26 2011 06:06 imareaver3 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Server: NA Your Name: Retep Hacker Name: Apples Replay: http://drop.sc/16175Description: This guy didn't look like he was hacking to win (Although he gets a really odd BO win; who 10-pools on TDA blindly?), but still--look at what he says a few seconds into the game. It's my sc2ranks profile--wins/losses, and points, accurate to when the game was played. He had APM while saying it; the message was somehow automatically generated. Weird. SC2ranks:http://sc2ranks.com/us/463388/Retep His APM actually drops to 0 at the time, but it is a little weird. Not sure it's really possible to tell if he's doing anything questionable with that. I think he could have looked you up on the loading screen, and then copy-pasted into chat. Even so, it doesn't affect the game itself at all. Watched the whole thing from his POV, and can't see there was any suggestion whatsoever of maphacking. He never looked at you through FOW, and sent out overlords and a drone scout. He scouted you right after his lings popped and was able to send them to your base. As for the 10 pool, people do builds like that on the map, simply because it's so large, it allows you to put on some early pressure hopefully without taking horrible damage if it doesn't go well. Certainly not a reason to think someone is hacking. I would say definitely no proof.
That's why I said that I didn't think he was maphacking. I'm just interested in how he managed to pull my stats. He couldn't have just copy-pasted that info; it's not on sc2ranks word-for-word. He'd have to have compiled it in notepad, and there wasn't enough time. Unless I'm missing something, it looks like a third-party program. Probably not malicious, but still really odd.
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On June 26 2011 06:06 imareaver3 wrote:Server: NA Your Name: Retep Hacker Name: Apples Replay: http://drop.sc/16175Description: This guy didn't look like he was hacking to win (Although he gets a really odd BO win; who 10-pools on TDA blindly?), but still--look at what he says a few seconds into the game. It's my sc2ranks profile--wins/losses, and points, accurate to when the game was played. He had APM while saying it; the message was somehow automatically generated. Weird. SC2ranks:http://sc2ranks.com/us/463388/Retep Ok watched the rep. First I notice no FOW looks at all. The only thing that's suspicious is what he says at the beginning. However, text can be editied and he might've just looked at your stats on scranks, so that means nothing by itself. Also, 10pool isn't really so rare on TDA. The idea is that if your opponent is really greedy you can punish him and come out ahead in economy or just outright win. Obviously this isn't enough to confirm him of hacking, but it isn't enough to disprove him solely because of what he says at the beginning. NEED MORE REPLAYS! PS nice ragequit Edit: damn got ninja'd
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On June 26 2011 06:37 imareaver3 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 26 2011 06:28 RedJustice wrote:On June 26 2011 06:06 imareaver3 wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Server: NA Your Name: Retep Hacker Name: Apples Replay: http://drop.sc/16175Description: This guy didn't look like he was hacking to win (Although he gets a really odd BO win; who 10-pools on TDA blindly?), but still--look at what he says a few seconds into the game. It's my sc2ranks profile--wins/losses, and points, accurate to when the game was played. He had APM while saying it; the message was somehow automatically generated. Weird. SC2ranks:http://sc2ranks.com/us/463388/Retep His APM actually drops to 0 at the time, but it is a little weird. Not sure it's really possible to tell if he's doing anything questionable with that. I think he could have looked you up on the loading screen, and then copy-pasted into chat. Even so, it doesn't affect the game itself at all. Watched the whole thing from his POV, and can't see there was any suggestion whatsoever of maphacking. He never looked at you through FOW, and sent out overlords and a drone scout. He scouted you right after his lings popped and was able to send them to your base. As for the 10 pool, people do builds like that on the map, simply because it's so large, it allows you to put on some early pressure hopefully without taking horrible damage if it doesn't go well. Certainly not a reason to think someone is hacking. I would say definitely no proof. That's why I said that I didn't think he was maphacking. I'm just interested in how he managed to pull my stats. He couldn't have just copy-pasted that info; it's not on sc2ranks word-for-word. He'd have to have compiled it in notepad, and there wasn't enough time. Unless I'm missing something, it looks like a third-party program. Probably not malicious, but still really odd.
Dual monitors perhaps? His APM does drop to 0 for a short time at that point. If he types very quickly (legit assumption for a sc2 player), he could have written it out. Perhaps an add-on. However, impossible to say for sure I think. Checking other replays would be a good option, but still inconclusive.
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Server: NA Your Name: Maetl Hacker Name: Wsuppp Replay: http://drop.sc/16360 & http://drop.sc/16361 Description: First replay: Constant FoW looking, perfect counter builds, suspicious spotting of a hidden expo. Second replay: more FoW looking.
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Server: North America Your Name: vGdave Hacker Name: RAWTALENt Replay: http://replayfu.com/download/6G9fLt Description: Reacting blindly and perfectly to my rush. Sends probe to cannon my natural blindly without vision or scouting of my base. Dodges my lings with probe around the map. Very obvious low skilled player with maphacks. I watched the replay twice, once from Everyone POV and once from his POV, very obvious.
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On June 26 2011 18:18 Maetl wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Server: NA Your Name: Maetl Hacker Name: Wsuppp Replay: http://drop.sc/16360 & http://drop.sc/16361Description: First replay: Constant FoW looking, perfect counter builds, suspicious spotting of a hidden expo. Second replay: more FoW looking.
Notes from Wsupp's POV: + Show Spoiler + 1st replay -
0:08 - Looks at your base through FOW, then your teammate's. 0:24 - Looks at your base again. 0:52 - Looks at your base again... 1:19 - Base peek... 1:56 - Base peek... 2:53 - Looks at the lings headed to his base. 3:46 - Looks at lings headed back into his base. 4:30 - Looks at the lings outside his base. 4:32 - Base peek... 5:04 - Looks at lings again. 5:15 - Base peek... 5:19 - Base peek... 5:53 - Looks at the lings outside your bases. 6:23 - Base peek... 7:27 - Looks at your armies and base. 8:22 - Looks at armies. 8:29 - Base peek... 10:09 - Base peek... 10:54 - Sends void to secret expo. 13:32 - Looks at armies. 14:25 - Looks at army moving out. 14:35 - Looks at armies.
Blatant and terribad map hax.
His teammate Wonhee doesn't appear to be using any hacks, but it seems likely that Wsupp is communicating with him about what he sees (two fast spine crawlers to hold off ling rush).
On June 26 2011 23:53 DavasiaN wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Server: North America Your Name: vGdave Hacker Name: RAWTALENt Replay: http://replayfu.com/download/6G9fLtDescription: Reacting blindly and perfectly to my rush. Sends probe to cannon my natural blindly without vision or scouting of my base. Dodges my lings with probe around the map. Very obvious low skilled player with maphacks. I watched the replay twice, once from Everyone POV and once from his POV, very obvious.
Absolutely no evidence of hacking at all. Plenty of people open with a forge because they are turtley. The cannon in your natural was suspicious at best. He put down one, so if it turns out that was not your base, he has a proxy pylon with a cannon to protect it. Not really a wasted investment, and hardly grounds for a hacking accusation. He only puts down the second once he sees the hatch there, and then sends the probe to scout up top (possibly not sure if that is your third, or if perhaps you are taking the third since he has cannons there). There is never once any suspicious FOW activity. As for the nydus, your overlord is in his vision. He selects the stalker to go and attack it, and THEN sees the nydus and sends his probes and zealot. Don't know how you came to the conclusion it was 'very obvious'.
Notes from KwiiMnChll's POV:
1:40 - Seems to check the probes on the ramp (possibly afraid of having the proxy scouted?) 1:50 - Peeks at top of your ramp? 3:02 - Peeks up ramp again?
Seems... really questionable and suspicious. Personal opinion is that he is map hacking. Replay doesn't have any obvious FOW looks. With the proxy gates though, all he really needs to know is your spawn location via mini-map. Needs more input, I think.
Your replay link is bad. Please update?
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On June 26 2011 23:53 DavasiaN wrote:Server: North America Your Name: vGdave Hacker Name: RAWTALENt Replay: http://replayfu.com/download/6G9fLtDescription: Reacting blindly and perfectly to my rush. Sends probe to cannon my natural blindly without vision or scouting of my base. Dodges my lings with probe around the map. Very obvious low skilled player with maphacks. I watched the replay twice, once from Everyone POV and once from his POV, very obvious.
Write-up
+ Show Spoiler + 3:30 - Scouts cross position Shakuras first then blindly puts down pylon + cannon at natural with no knowledge zerg is at that base 4:45 - Probe blindly moves away from where lings are closing in with no vision (suspicious but not clearly cheating ofc) 8:35 - Reacts blindly and instantly to nydus in a FOW'd corner of his base
Clearly map hacks imo
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Write-up + Show Spoiler + :55 - Blindly moves to players natural and throws down hidden pylon with no info of where players base is 1:35 - Peers into fog looking at probe as it goes down ramp from the players main into the natural 1:50 Once again looks blindly into fog as probe moves down ramp and gateway is put down at top of ramp 3:05 Once again looks blindly into fog at forge being placed at top of ramp
Very clearly a map hacker imo
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FORMAT Server: EU Your Name: Phil Hacker Name: zSpinnin Replay: Metalopolis Drop Hacker
Description: Well, it is quite obvious. I win against him, he turns on his hacks, and i suddenly get dropped. I never had Problems with dropping, so yeah. Also looked up his Matchhistory, lots of wins with Games going between 2-3 minutes. I also asked some of the guys who played him before me, they all suddenly got dropped. So i guess, case closed? Reports have been made ingame, still think this should be here too.
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On June 27 2011 15:33 Carthac wrote:Write-up + Show Spoiler + :55 - Blindly moves to players natural and throws down hidden pylon with no info of where players base is 1:35 - Peers into fog looking at probe as it goes down ramp from the players main into the natural 1:50 Once again looks blindly into fog as probe moves down ramp and gateway is put down at top of ramp 3:05 Once again looks blindly into fog at forge being placed at top of ramp
Very clearly a map hacker imo
He is DEFINITELY hacking. he probably uses one of the hacks that locks the screen whenever you look into fog of war because I didn't see him look at your base. That, or he's minimap hacking.
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Posting for friend
Server: NA Hacker Name: Theory Replay:http://replayfu.com/r/chQsGj Description: Look in the last 10 seconds of the replay, crashhacker. The replay lagged, then dropped the terran.
Obvious Obvious
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On June 20 2011 05:48 Probe1 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 20 2011 05:03 infinix wrote:Server: North America Your Name: iNfiniX Hacker Name: BtoYeuGbe Replay: http://www.sc2replayed.com/replay-videos/6343Description: I normally wouldn't care too much about this, but this guy was increasingly BM in chat as well. I was suspicious in game when he had an overseer ready at his base for my DTs as well as he moved a baneling right as my dts came to his base. he did not scout my base at all. After watching the replay there are 2 instances where are incredibly suspicious. He a moved his zerglings across the map directly to where my proxy pylon was, completely unscouted by him. In addition to this, he pulls off 2 lings to find a hidden probe which he again did not scout at all. The replay shows that he moved both times almost on top of my probe/pylon again without any vision, this occurs at abotu 5:20 in the replay. The replay also confirms the super blind dt counter and his response to the dts is also very suspicious. Thank you for your time. This isn't going be an easy one. I suspect he was locking his camera for replays. I need a lot of different reviews on this one. Write up coming soon. + Show Spoiler [First Edit] + First Edit: Or not soon. I don't want to be presumptious but I think he was hacking. That baneling move was a cherry on top of an already extremely lucky/well played game. But without any obvious FOW peeks I can't just point to a time and say "look at this!".
I think he was looking at his main base hatch way too damn much while not doing anything then reacting to what you are doing with only intuition. I think he was locking his camera. But I can't prove that by myself.
I'm going to write down all of my suspicions and rely on everyone that reads this to disprove or agree with me.
Report BtoYeuGbe never stares through the FOW suspiciously once during the game. The game starts off normally. BtoYeuGbe drops a rush pool and is scouted, leading to a sealed wall from Protoss. He attempts to bane bust (with too few banelings to kill a pylon) and is denied. The suspicious activity starts here. 5:35 he attack moves the zerglings/baneling outside of Protosses main base twice, once close to a undiscovered proxy pylon and again directly above it. Not near or around. He attack moves directly above it. It's in Johns Common Knowledge hallway and any good player would scout there so this action alone isn't suspicious. 5:36 BtoYeuGbe attack moves a set of zerglings to a hidden probe at the 3oclock base. Again, he has incredibly good scouting intuition. I could be convinced that he saw a pylon in Johns hallway and figured the probe could still be around someplace nearby. Add to this the fact that he guessed right that the scouting probe didn't return to the main before the wall was built. So far very good, master league scouting. 6:09 Protoss puts down a Dark Templar shrine. BtoYeuGbe is looking at his main. . . . 6:20 a lair starts. Pretty big coincidence. Possible though. Then immediately upon lair completion he morphs in an overseer. For the rest of the game he only stays on hatchery army units. The sole purpose of making a lair at that timing was to get an overseer out. So, it is with little doubt that he suspected or he knew that DTs were coming. He could have suspected it, based on sheer intuition and gut alone. I say that because the only time the entire game he scouted the main was with his baneling bust. No drone scout, no overlord sac, not even a ling to poke up the wall. Whole game- only scouting done were attack move orders directly on top of hidden units. In the 9th minute he does something nothing short of miraculous. 9:18 attack moves a baneling to the top of his ramp 9:20 the first shimmer of a DT within his vision 9:21 overseer detects 9:22 two DTs reach top of the ramp and the baneling explodes. He moved a baneling to the top of his ramp, not altogether weird in and of itself. But he did it as soon as DTs entered his natural expansion (having no vision of his natural at the time, and still 0 confirmation that a dark shrine was made) That's some pretty epic star sense. DTs then kill his lings at the watch towers. He immediately moves out with an army+overseer to kill the DTs. 10:04 the DT moves away from the incoming overseer/army approaching the xel naga tower 10:07 the army veers away from the first tower and heads to the farther one to snipe the other DT. Then around 10:30 the DTs, having survived and looped around the side of the map, all the while under FOW start heading directly toward BtoYeuGbe's main base. Upon their course becoming obvious (if you could see them) BtoYeuGbe makes a second overseer in his main and retreats his army. He thwarts the attack again. Now I see things that make me very suspicious. I don't have times yet but this is what I see. BtoYeuGbe stares at his main hatchery. A lot. Way more than I do or any VOD or replay I've seen. Just sits there and watches his drones mine making a few more drones. It leads me to believe that during those times and during the entire match he has been toggling a function on his map hack to lock the camera for the replay. During those seconds he doesn't appear to be doing anything he's actually scouting with his camera everything that's going on in the FOW. I'll update this with the times he went idle but I must say, I'm convinced that there are suspicious circumstances related to his actions. I don't see how I can prove it but it's a little too perfect. Maybe his mechanical/strategic skill ARE far behind his brilliant intuition. Maybe he was just having an off day and played badly but still knew how to read a ZvP beautifully. But I don't think so. I think he was locking his camera and map hacking like all hell. The timings and actions are just too damn cute. I can't prove any of this and I wouldn't be surprised if everyone else echoed that exact sentiment. But I won't say it's indeterminable. Needs review
I believe GtoYeuGbe is hacking also. Obviously these players aren't the best so oddities happen.
To add to what the above poster has: -When he first moves up with lings he pulls back before the cannon shoots even though he didn't have vision. I could see this if he was a very good player, but that was just to quick/lucky. -Though he never looked into the fog of war he did do one strange thing that could explain how he got all the information. If you look at the times his apm drops to 0 and the times buildings are constructed by the protoss they match up 9 out of 10 times. And he almost always stayed above at least 60 apm.
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On June 28 2011 13:26 PowerDes wrote:Posting for friend Server: NA Hacker Name: Theory Replay:http://replayfu.com/r/chQsGj Description: Look in the last 10 seconds of the replay, crashhacker. The replay lagged, then dropped the terran. Obvious Obvious ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/xkfqL.jpg)
They might need your friend's BNet ID and character code to use his match history to find Theory's history.
I'm not an official member of their team here, but I think they're going to ask for that to verify.
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On June 27 2011 14:09 RedJustice wrote:Show nested quote +On June 26 2011 23:53 DavasiaN wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Server: North America Your Name: vGdave Hacker Name: RAWTALENt Replay: http://replayfu.com/download/6G9fLtDescription: Reacting blindly and perfectly to my rush. Sends probe to cannon my natural blindly without vision or scouting of my base. Dodges my lings with probe around the map. Very obvious low skilled player with maphacks. I watched the replay twice, once from Everyone POV and once from his POV, very obvious. Absolutely no evidence of hacking at all. Plenty of people open with a forge because they are turtley. The cannon in your natural was suspicious at best. He put down one, so if it turns out that was not your base, he has a proxy pylon with a cannon to protect it. Not really a wasted investment, and hardly grounds for a hacking accusation. He only puts down the second once he sees the hatch there, and then sends the probe to scout up top (possibly not sure if that is your third, or if perhaps you are taking the third since he has cannons there). There is never once any suspicious FOW activity. As for the nydus, your overlord is in his vision. He selects the stalker to go and attack it, and THEN sees the nydus and sends his probes and zealot. Don't know how you came to the conclusion it was 'very obvious'.
I'm not trying to act or sound cocky, but this game was an "Even Match" at a high MMR. I play GM players and top 100 masters players on ladder almost exclusively. High level players do not build blind hidden pylons with a cannon to defend. In fact, high level players don't build blind cannons at the ramp to defend their base without having some kind of information. If you watch his POV, his control is extremely poor, his build orders are less than optimal at best, his timings are random, and his building placement makes no sense. And he somehow manages to be a top top Masters player? The chances of that are orders of magnitude less than the chance that he hacks. Lack of FOW movement does not vindicate anyone of hacks. As others have mentioned, there are hacks to conceal FOW movement in replays. I appreciate you taking the time to review the replays and to do your writeups, but your defense for this player is weak at best.
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Server: NA My Name: GiR Hacker Name: Verzino Replay: http://drop.sc/16534 Description: Apparently a win hack that lags everyone until everyone from the other team desyncs. Right after we killed his base, he starts lagging himself. Things clear up and then all of a sudden everyone else starts lagging. After I got dropped, my remaining teammates did as well.
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On June 28 2011 16:56 DavasiaN wrote:Show nested quote +On June 27 2011 14:09 RedJustice wrote:On June 26 2011 23:53 DavasiaN wrote:+ Show Spoiler +Server: North America Your Name: vGdave Hacker Name: RAWTALENt Replay: http://replayfu.com/download/6G9fLtDescription: Reacting blindly and perfectly to my rush. Sends probe to cannon my natural blindly without vision or scouting of my base. Dodges my lings with probe around the map. Very obvious low skilled player with maphacks. I watched the replay twice, once from Everyone POV and once from his POV, very obvious. Absolutely no evidence of hacking at all. Plenty of people open with a forge because they are turtley. The cannon in your natural was suspicious at best. He put down one, so if it turns out that was not your base, he has a proxy pylon with a cannon to protect it. Not really a wasted investment, and hardly grounds for a hacking accusation. He only puts down the second once he sees the hatch there, and then sends the probe to scout up top (possibly not sure if that is your third, or if perhaps you are taking the third since he has cannons there). There is never once any suspicious FOW activity. As for the nydus, your overlord is in his vision. He selects the stalker to go and attack it, and THEN sees the nydus and sends his probes and zealot. Don't know how you came to the conclusion it was 'very obvious'. I'm not trying to act or sound cocky, but this game was an "Even Match" at a high MMR. I play GM players and top 100 masters players on ladder almost exclusively. High level players do not build blind hidden pylons with a cannon to defend. In fact, high level players don't build blind cannons at the ramp to defend their base without having some kind of information. If you watch his POV, his control is extremely poor, his build orders are less than optimal at best, his timings are random, and his building placement makes no sense. And he somehow manages to be a top top Masters player? The chances of that are orders of magnitude less than the chance that he hacks. Lack of FOW movement does not vindicate anyone of hacks. As others have mentioned, there are hacks to conceal FOW movement in replays. I appreciate you taking the time to review the replays and to do your writeups, but your defense for this player is weak at best.
I generally feel it's not a good idea to accuse someone of hacking with out evidence. If you can point out suspicious moments that might be camera locking, great. If we can get more replays that show some clear map hacking evidence, also great. However strongly you feel about it though, based on that replay alone, you shouldn't accuse someone of hacking. Poor control, less than optimal build orders, random timing, nonsensical building placement, and somehow getting matched with you with all of that is not evidence enough for hacking either.
All I am saying is based on that replay alone, there is no clear evidence he is hacking.
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On June 28 2011 15:02 mkfuba07 wrote:Show nested quote +On June 28 2011 13:26 PowerDes wrote:Posting for friend Server: NA Hacker Name: Theory Replay:http://replayfu.com/r/chQsGj Description: Look in the last 10 seconds of the replay, crashhacker. The replay lagged, then dropped the terran. Obvious Obvious ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/xkfqL.jpg) They might need your friend's BNet ID and character code to use his match history to find Theory's history. I'm not an official member of their team here, but I think they're going to ask for that to verify. Marty.122, says the char code on the replay.
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Thank you to everyone that's been keeping up lately.
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