if you own a Majestouch Tenkeyless by yourself which of the three Switch Types do you can recommend for straight gaming? The Cherry MX Blue, Brown or Black ones?
Geekhack.org is suggesting the Black Switch keyboard for gaming. But most of the Users here on TL are getting Blue or Brown ones anyway. I'm curious why you decided that way and what are your impressions afterwards? How does 'no tactile feedback' feel in RTS games if you got the Black Switches?
It's probably mostly up to personal preference regardless, but I would recommend Brown switches if you also do a lot of typing in addition to gaming (typical college student). I've never been a fan of clicky switches but it wouldn't break my heart or anything if I had to use one.
The 7g uses Cherry Blacks. When I was recently looking to get a keyboard I decided on a Filco with Cherry Brown switches. I didn't have a chance to try any of the switches out before buying though, so I was kind of concerned. Luckily, Brown switches provide (for me anyway) the best experience for both typing and gaming.
Black Switches are probably better if you're prone to accidentally pressing the wrong keys, as there's more resistance with those switches than with browns. The browns that are on my filco provide more resistance than any rubber dome keyboard I've ever used, and is very satisfying for any purpose.
Just like anything else though, it's personal preference. Try to test out the different switches if you can, though since most mechanical keyboards aren't sold in stores you might just have to take the plunge and see what happens. With a FILCO though, you can't return it if you don't like the feel of the keyboard, so choose wisely.
Jeah that's why I'm asking: I can't really check a FILCO without buying theme. They are quite expensive and I really appreciate your opnions therefore.
get blacks, the browns feel a bit slippery for rts, i have an alps filco as well but thats fallen in favour of the topre even though its a bit on the heavy side.
On August 22 2010 03:32 goneim wrote: Generally, blacks for FPS, browns for RTS FTW, I have a Filco brown and a K1 (black) myself, blues are just too noisy for me
This. Which is why I use browns. Blues are for uber typers. Blacks are good for FPS, Browns for basically everything else. I can't see using Blacks for SC2 personally, but everyone is different I guess.
Geekhack is a great site, but I'm not sure why they wouldn't recommend you the Cherry Blue's, there's threads on this same topic all over Geekhack that has answered this topic.
I have a Filco Majestouch "Otaku" tenkeyless I am currently using. It's the best keyboard i've ever typed on and it is perfect for RTS games. The Cherry Blues are by far the most responsive and i've tried Cherry Blacks and Browns as well. You definitely do not want browns as they are linear (not tactile)
I've owned a Filco Majestouch w/ cherry browns for around a year now and I absolutely love it! Like you, I had no prior experience to how the different mechanical keyboard switches would feel. After doing some research for a few days I finally decided against getting the blacks in favor of brown. I've really come to enjoy the ease of which the keys depress.
Either choice is going to be great for gaming, but as someone else already mentioned, I'm a college student so I do a lot of typing as well so browns were kind of the obvious choice for me. Whichever one you choose though I think you'll be highly satisfied, these are really high quality keyboards. Let us know your experiences with it once you decide!
On August 22 2010 04:00 Icarus84 wrote: You definitely do not want browns as they are linear (not tactile)
This isn't true. Browns are not linear, and they do have tactile feedback, it's just not nearly as pronounced as the blues. What browns lack is the auditory feedback that the blues give.
I just checked this and Shivan I stand corrected, Browns are represented as "Soft Tactile." Blacks are linear. However the difference between blues and browns are not noise.
I have a Filco with the blue cherry switches. Its very nice to type and play on. Ive seen people not recommend the blue switches but I like them. Here's mine. Yea I payed extra for the red like a dork.
On August 22 2010 04:23 Jackafur wrote: I have a Filco with the blue cherry switches. Its very nice to type and play on. Ive seen people not recommend the blue switches but I like them. Here's mine. Yea I payed extra for the red like a dork.
On August 22 2010 04:23 Jackafur wrote: I have a Filco with the blue cherry switches. Its very nice to type and play on. Ive seen people not recommend the blue switches but I like them. Here's mine. Yea I payed extra for the red like a dork.
The clicks blues make are really obnoxious, I know some people love the clicks but I think they drive most people up the wall. Also even if you do like them, if you live with anyone else there's a good chance they wont.
If you like the sound though and it doesn't bother anyone then knock yourself out, the blues along with the browns are great for gaming and typing.
Lastly though, I'd be weary to recommend the blacks if you do any decent amount of typing since they're a little awkward for that.
It uses MX browns for switch type. They are nice I guess, but personally I almost think I like the feel of domes better, cause they are kind of quieter, or at least feel softer when you bottom out.
I'm also thinking I might have liked the MX blues because I think they have a more tactile feel to them (I don't think I'd mind the clicky sound). They SUPPOSEDLY aren't as good for gaming though due to hysteresis in the keys caused by the audible and tactile feedback mechanisms, but I think it's a pretty minor hysteresis that doesn't really affect people much. Razer seem to be using MX blues in THEIR gaming keyboard, so it must be decent for gaming.
That said, if you do go for blues, you might actually want to get a razer Black Widow as opposed to the FILCO because you'll probably be getting the same keyboard switches, but at a cheaper price. Well, it won't be tenkeyless though (and even have an extra row on the left), which might not be desireable to you.
On August 22 2010 04:55 Archaics wrote: Just going to throw another opinion into the hat.
The clicks blues make are really obnoxious, I know some people love the clicks but I think they drive most people up the wall. Also even if you do like them, if you live with anyone else there's a good chance they wont.
If you like the sound though and it doesn't bother anyone then knock yourself out, the blues along with the browns are great for gaming and typing.
Lastly though, I'd be weary to recommend the blacks if you do any decent amount of typing since they're a little awkward for that.
yea I can attest to how loud the blues are. They are pretty loud. Whenever I'm on the phone or something and typing people love to comment on how loud my keyboard is. I like the clicks though.
The last hours I've browsed a little bit more and now I'm getting a little bit confused. On overclock.net they strongly recommend Black Switches for gaming, especially for FPS. Why might be Blue or Brown a better choice for RTS? I'd love to hear a comparism between them from people who own both Switch Types based on SC2.
I'm guessing people think Blue/Brown are better for RTS because they provide feedback on when the key actuates (although its inaccurate, in both cases).
This only really holds if you don't bottom out when you press keys while playing, which everyone I know does. Far better, imo, to have keys that have predictable resistance at all points in the keypress, are much easier to spam if you dont completely release the key between presses, and feel glorious to use (even when typing).
Ideally you'd want Red switches but they barely exist anymore :<
Xapti! I love that Cherry keyboard, I got to try that out at one of my jobsites. I might have to get one of those as well
My girlfriend doesn't seem to mind the loud clicks of the blue switches and she was totally against me getting it. If you type correctly on a blue switch keyboard you are touch typing and the keys don't bottom out nearly as much, which means faster response and less loud clacking noises.
...But for the masses MX Cherry Blues are the loudest of the family lol
I didn't know about the Razer Black Widow...just did a bunch of reading up on it. I'm a fan of their mice/mouse(however you want to say it) and I would honestly give that keyboard a shot. It has the Cherry Blues, but also the most modern technology (macros, usb, headphone/mic jack, fancy LEDs) I've seen since the DAS keyboards. I almost bought a DAS, but after reading all the bad reviews I decided to run away. If anyone uses one on here i'd be curious to hear your thoughts!
On August 22 2010 04:00 Icarus84 wrote: Geekhack is a great site, but I'm not sure why they wouldn't recommend you the Cherry Blue's, there's threads on this same topic all over Geekhack that has answered this topic.
I have a Filco Majestouch "Otaku" tenkeyless I am currently using. It's the best keyboard i've ever typed on and it is perfect for RTS games. The Cherry Blues are by far the most responsive and i've tried Cherry Blacks and Browns as well. You definitely do not want browns as they are linear (not tactile)
On August 22 2010 04:00 Icarus84 wrote: Geekhack is a great site, but I'm not sure why they wouldn't recommend you the Cherry Blue's, there's threads on this same topic all over Geekhack that has answered this topic.
I have a Filco Majestouch "Otaku" tenkeyless I am currently using. It's the best keyboard i've ever typed on and it is perfect for RTS games. The Cherry Blues are by far the most responsive and i've tried Cherry Blacks and Browns as well. You definitely do not want browns as they are linear (not tactile)
Cherry Blues are the only way to go my friend!
Here's my Otaku:
Both on geekhack and on elitekeyboard.com they say that browns are tactile while blacks are linear. Do you mean that browns are linear as well or was it just a typo on your behalf? I'm looking into getting a new keyboard, and have almost setteled for browns, and this is just confusing the shit out of me :D
Goneim: Nice! believe it or not I bought that keyboard from iMav, it had those keys on it replaced, but was Never used (he called it his backup lol). The Geekhack key is by far the coolest.
Farbor: If you look a couple minutes after that original post I corrected myself. Let me simplify the switches:
People who are skilled typists will enjoy the Blue switches. I could see how maybe MMO players and FPS players would enjoy a Black or Brown switch keyboard because of the more relaxed feel and lower resistance of the switches (keys being held down for a longer period of time). However us RTS players who hammer away at the keys want the responsiveness and the reassurance that key has registered of the Blue Switches.
Overall if you go Brown or Blue you'll still find that you absolutely Love your mechanical keyboard. I know i'm hooked for life!
I ordered a Steelkeys 7g with Cherry black switches and returned it after a day of trying to play BW.
I found it difficult to tell if a keypress was registered because of the linear feel and ended up with sore fingers because the keys feel like they require so much force.
It might be personal preference but I don't think Cherry blacks are any good for intensive RTS'. In the end I ended up getting The Filco Majestouch with Cherry browns which felt much better.
At last I digged more deeper into the matter and now I really can understand why some people suggest Black Switches and some other Blues or Browns. The perfect answer might be RED Switches, which are hardly ever to come by. They unite the linear advantage of Blacks and the low force required of Blues/Brownes. I'll try to get one of these and keep you guys posted.
Reds are almost impossible to come by unless you live in Asia OR have very deep pockets. My suggestion to you is to get cherry browns, they require very little force (blacks are very tiring especially on the pinky finger), and you get the tactile touch which means you don't have to bottom out just to be sure the click registered. In other words you can get away with pressing a key down 2mm rather than 4mm. read "Which switch do I choose ! ?"
I did a lot of digging around on this subjet, and the general opinion over at geekhack.org (the ultimate keyboardgeek site) is that browns are best for RTS gaming.
Cherry MX Blacks and Reds (though Reds are super mega ultra rare...but you can homebrew some with Brown springs and Black switches) are quietish. Although most mechanicals are noisy, which is part of the allure.
I have a Filco with Cherry Browns, but I only use it for typing. When playing games, I'm used to bottoming-out the keys, so the large "bottom out" distance on the Browns is uncomfortable.
Does anyone have a comparison to how loud Cherry blues are? I consider myself a "skilled typist" and I would love to benefit form that. However, I'm going to college sometime soon, and I don't want my roommate developing a grudge, or for me to not use my $100+ keyboard when I buy one.
EDIT:
On August 22 2010 04:55 Archaics wrote: Just going to throw another opinion into the hat.
The clicks blues make are really obnoxious, I know some people love the clicks but I think they drive most people up the wall. Also even if you do like them, if you live with anyone else there's a good chance they wont.
If you like the sound though and it doesn't bother anyone then knock yourself out, the blues along with the browns are great for gaming and typing.
Lastly though, I'd be weary to recommend the blacks if you do any decent amount of typing since they're a little awkward for that.
I personally us the tenkeyless black switch board. It did feel a little weird at first. But its the best keyboard I've ever used. One of my friends says it lacks response, but it was his first time ever using it. I would recommend it. Its extremely responsive and if you don't mind having to use a little more force to press it, its the board for you. Very rewarding experience though. (Quite honestly I'm sure you can't lose if you get any mechanical keyboard)
Filco with blue LEDs indicate brown switches. And you can even see the brown switch where he's removed a key.
they all have blue leds . be careful theyre bright !! but good eyes you have (:
My Filco with blue switches have green leds. And as far as i know the ones with black switches have red LEDs.
my alps 10keyless has blue leds. my friends brown otaku also has blue leds. but guess we cant forget that filco is pretty big in korea. theres so many rare keyboards there like the pink ones or the asian languages ones. i think theres customisable keys as well and topre have soo many diff keyboard setups as well
i am using a cherry g80-1800 with black switches and really like em. best part is, i got 2 for 2,50EUR each at ebay-germany. would love to try a filco w browns, as soon as they release a german layout.
i watched the artosis gsl footage and love that tester got a nice mech keyboard not that cheap samsung rubber dome thing
Good find! I totally missed that the first time I watched that vid. Good to know the best Korean SC2 player has the same keyboard as me. You gotta admit, the guy knows quality!
I'm thinking of picking up one of these keyboards, most of them are not in stock until September 10th, but they do have the Majestouch Tactile Touch in stock. Since its a pricey investment already, did anyone forgo the NKRO edition for the cheaper one without it? I dont play much games currently besides SC2 so the extra bandwidth of the NKRO is probably not needed for me.
You're not pressing too many keys on SC2 anyway, so I would guess an SC2 gamer wouldn't need NKRO. In fact, how often does a gamer really need NKRO anyway/what type of gamer needs NKRO?
My friend let me borrow an Otaku Tenkeyless Brown and it's absolutely fantastic. I completely disagree with the guy that said not to get browns. Honestly, I stand by Brown and Black Cherry MX Switches for sure.
Found this thread right now just after ordering a Filco Tactile Touch, what coincidence. I feel thrilled but my friends think I'm completely bonkers for ordering a £110 (+ shipping) keyboard. I pity the fools. They know not the power of mechanical switches .
Also about the coresponding Switch/LED colors, it even shows it on their website (http://elitekeyboards.com/products.php?sub=special&filter=fullsize). Brown Switch = Blue; Black Switch = Red; Blue Switch = Green
FPS games are really the only time I've encountered NKRO limitations. Crouching, moving forward, strafing left, jumping, and trying to switch weapons all at the same time would result in one key not registering at all. You will never be holding down 5 keys at once in an RTS.
Any idea how many simultaneous key presses (excluding modifiers) the Tactile Touch (w/o NKRO) supports? I am considering getting one and probably will forgo the NKRO unless someone convinces me otherwise. I have a DT35 now and it supports 4 simultaneous key presses, not exactly sure about modifiers though. I tested this by holding down Q until it repeats, then W until it repeats while still holding Q, then E till it repeats while still holding Q and W, etc. Same works while holding CTRL and CTRL+SHIFT, not sure about three modifiers.
I do play some FPS games occasionally, but I still can't really imagine needing to press more than four keys with modifiers.
I decided to purchase Majestouch Tactile Touch and the only reason I would really want NKRO is for bragging rights. If you look at that video of tester playing on the Filco hes using the Tactile Touch without NKRO(silver Filco symbol). Well I'm excited to get it, there have been like 50+ people on here that just cant say enough good things about them. Coming from my cheap $5 DT35 I'm sure I'll be happy with the quality. I had a Steelseries 6g, and absolutely loved the feel of the mechanical keyboard, but it had a problem where it would randomly turn off during games and I've been using my old DT35 since.
On September 02 2010 05:14 cmh wrote: I decided to purchase Majestouch Tactile Touch and the only reason I would really want NKRO is for bragging rights. If you look at that video of tester playing on the Filco hes using the Tactile Touch without NKRO(silver Filco symbol). Well I'm excited to get it, there have been like 50+ people on here that just cant say enough good things about them. Coming from my cheap $5 DT35 I'm sure I'll be happy with the quality. I had a Steelseries 6g, and absolutely loved the feel of the mechanical keyboard, but it had a problem where it would randomly turn off during games and I've been using my old DT35 since.
the 6g turns itself off ???????
S: thats worrying.. i think many of the mechanical boards like das and some filcos included come from coskey or costar i dunno abt where razer and steelseries get theres from but its bad if these decades old keyboard oems are starting to lose quality from this rennaissance of mechanical keyboards. i think the das keyboard was inferior to the filco cherries because it would bug out as well S:
On September 02 2010 17:45 lynx.oblige wrote: I'm pretty sure his 6g just had something wrong with it.
Yea it does, I took it apart and could tell it was turning off because the connector on the board is very lose. I never attempted to replace it at the time which I should of, but unfortuntaley I just got unlucky with a bad keyboard. I took it out yesterday and gave it to a a family member. I'm sure I'll soder the wire connected to the board if it becomes a problem. Although they dont game and keeping the keyboard in place usually is enough for the 6g to function.
I don't think FILCO features any reds yet but Cherry themselves, and maybe only Cherry, has a few red compatible models.
On October 14 2010 09:28 Duscha wrote: I got my Filco Brown a while ago and I'm totally satisfied with my decision so far. I appreciate you guys input.
There's the Cherry G80-3600. I have no idea where you can get one. I think there might be some keyboards available in Asia with Cherry MX Reds. There may be some specialized POS (point-of-sale, not that other POS) keyboards that use them.
You can make your own "ghetto reds" by taking the spring from a blue or a brown and combining it with the stem from a black (a red is a linear switch like a black but lighter weight like a brown or blue). You can make your own Cherry clears (tactile like browns, but heavier like blacks) in a similar way. But Deck sells some keyboards with clears.
I got my Filco tenkeyless MX Brown a week ago, and it's beautiful and couldn't ask for anything better. the tactical bump is just enough, I really couldn't imagine playing on anything else with more of a bump.
On October 14 2010 11:43 semantics wrote: except to everyone around you.
too bad I got my own apt and live alone unlike most of you who still live in ur parents basement.
Both arguments are silly.
On October 14 2010 11:50 rel wrote: I got my Filco tenkeyless MX Brown a week ago, and it's beautiful and couldn't ask for anything better. the tactical bump is just enough, I really couldn't imagine playing on anything else with more of a bump.
On October 14 2010 11:43 semantics wrote: except to everyone around you.
too bad I got my own apt and live alone unlike most of you who still live in ur parents basement.
Wow you own your own apartment, very mature of you, way to rule the internet with an iron fist.
lol u jealous?
|
This will be my last post in this thread about you, but yeah I'm jealous of your apartment, when I own my own house, because I earned it by slaving away in a boiler room in the military for 5 years. See how silly it is when you compare irrelevant shit over the internet??
On October 14 2010 11:43 semantics wrote: except to everyone around you.
too bad I got my own apt and live alone unlike most of you who still live in ur parents basement.
Wow you own your own apartment, very mature of you, way to rule the internet with an iron fist.
lol u jealous?
|
This will be my last post in this thread about you, but yeah I'm jealous of your apartment, when I own my own house, because I earned it by slaving away in a boiler room in the military for 5 years. See how silly it is when you compare irrelevant shit over the internet??
Good day!
my apt is in manhattan, where is your house? Romania?
On October 14 2010 11:50 rel wrote: I got my Filco tenkeyless MX Brown a week ago, and it's beautiful and couldn't ask for anything better. the tactical bump is just enough, I really couldn't imagine playing on anything else with more of a bump.
You mean Tactile Otherwise I'm happy for you.
you and this retard named rel make a great couple, enjoying sucking each others dicks?
On August 22 2010 04:00 Icarus84 wrote: Geekhack is a great site, but I'm not sure why they wouldn't recommend you the Cherry Blue's, there's threads on this same topic all over Geekhack that has answered this topic.
I have a Filco Majestouch "Otaku" tenkeyless I am currently using. It's the best keyboard i've ever typed on and it is perfect for RTS games. The Cherry Blues are by far the most responsive and i've tried Cherry Blacks and Browns as well. You definitely do not want browns as they are linear (not tactile)
Cherry Blues are the only way to go my friend!
Here's my Otaku:
So the only letters you see are WASD? The rest are just Black or is this something you did for personal preference?
On August 22 2010 04:00 Icarus84 wrote: Geekhack is a great site, but I'm not sure why they wouldn't recommend you the Cherry Blue's, there's threads on this same topic all over Geekhack that has answered this topic.
I have a Filco Majestouch "Otaku" tenkeyless I am currently using. It's the best keyboard i've ever typed on and it is perfect for RTS games. The Cherry Blues are by far the most responsive and i've tried Cherry Blacks and Browns as well. You definitely do not want browns as they are linear (not tactile)
Cherry Blues are the only way to go my friend!
Here's my Otaku:
So the only letters you see are WASD? The rest are just Black or is this something you did for personal preference?
it's a personal preference otaku normally comes without any letters on it. So he changed his escape key and wasd. I think they charge you like 10 bucks in parts lol but w.e
Ok so I didn't know that keyboards went into this much detail. Wtf does "Tactile" and "Linear" mean? What makes these kinds of keyboards so amazing? Someone mentioned the clicking sounds, what's that about?
linear just means pushing it down requires a constant force
tactile gives a bounce depending on the switch you can feel when you engaged it before you bottom it out.
Linear is a compete waste of ones money imo, might as well use a dome switch you can easily find cheap dome switch keyboards that require 60-80g to push down. And it's pretty much the same experience.
tactile gives a bit better experience but it's hardly amazing, it's like audiophiles telling a person that the headset clearly sounds better on this 300 dollar cables vs my 10 dollar radio shack cables.
Is it worth 100 bucks eh not really... I'd give a sold 60 for them but they don't change too much how i type of how well i type or how i enjoy it maybe 100. But not those 170-250 keyboards by then i hope you spend all day on keyboards and this little thing will make enough of a diff to help you.
I already use a ergonomic keyboard that does well for keeping my hand relaxed.
The big diff is sound these are much louder think of something between how you hear your keyboard now and if you ever used on a typewriter. It's why browns are popular. They still are loud compared to a cheap keyboard, probably very loud. Maybe it's not so much loud as a distinctive chatter.
On October 14 2010 13:06 semantics wrote: linear just means pushing it down requires a constant force
tactile gives a bounce depending on the switch you can feel when you engaged it before you bottom it out.
Linear is a compete waste of ones money imo, might as well use a dome switch you can easily find cheap dome switch keyboards that require 60-80g to push down. And it's pretty much the same experience.
tactile gives a bit better experience but it's hardly amazing, it's like audiophiles telling a person that the headset clearly sounds better on this 300 dollar cables vs my 10 dollar radio shack cables.
Is it worth 100 bucks eh not really... I'd give a sold 60 for them but they don't change too much how i type of how well i type or how i enjoy it maybe 100. But not those 170-250 keyboards by then i hope you spend all day on keyboards and this little thing will make enough of a diff to help you.
I already use a ergonomic keyboard that does well for keeping my hand relaxed.
The big diff is sound these are much louder think of something between how you hear your keyboard now and if you ever used on a typewriter. It's why browns are popular. They still are loud compared to a cheap keyboard, probably very loud. Maybe it's not so much loud as a distinctive chatter.
I have a Majestouch 104 NKRO with Cherry Blue switches. I was considering brown, but as I spend a lot of time typing and coding I figured blue would be more fun, and I seriously love it :>
On August 22 2010 04:00 Icarus84 wrote: Geekhack is a great site, but I'm not sure why they wouldn't recommend you the Cherry Blue's, there's threads on this same topic all over Geekhack that has answered this topic.
I have a Filco Majestouch "Otaku" tenkeyless I am currently using. It's the best keyboard i've ever typed on and it is perfect for RTS games. The Cherry Blues are by far the most responsive and i've tried Cherry Blacks and Browns as well. You definitely do not want browns as they are linear (not tactile)
Cherry Blues are the only way to go my friend!
Here's my Otaku:
lol barefoot otaku.
I'd like to try out those keyboards/switches before buying. I have a pretty generic rubber dome keyboard but its tactile feedback is better than that of all the keyboards in computer stores here.
The switches mostly come down to preference. Boxer has been using an MX Blue keyboard in GSL so far. I'm sure all 3 switches are fine for gaming. What matters more is your own personal style.
i recently bought the 6gv2 and i dont know what a lot of the gripe is about the cherry mx black switches. to be quite honest, they are super responsive and great to type on and amazing to play sc2 on. at first when i spammed buttons at the beginning of games it would kind of fatigue my fingers, but the switches are slightly more worn in now and my fingers are used to the amount of force needed to actuate the keys so there is really no more issue.
i chose this switch over the mx blues because i had quite a few people telling me that double pressing buttons on the blues was a bit different than a normal keyboard/other switches.
On August 22 2010 04:00 Icarus84 wrote: Geekhack is a great site, but I'm not sure why they wouldn't recommend you the Cherry Blue's, there's threads on this same topic all over Geekhack that has answered this topic.
I have a Filco Majestouch "Otaku" tenkeyless I am currently using. It's the best keyboard i've ever typed on and it is perfect for RTS games. The Cherry Blues are by far the most responsive and i've tried Cherry Blacks and Browns as well. You definitely do not want browns as they are linear (not tactile)
Cherry Blues are the only way to go my friend!
I think you may have misread the information about mx brown switches. MX Browns are 45g tactile switches, meaning that there is a slight tactile point about halfway down the switch. The reason that people recommend cherry black switches for gaming is that they require more force to activate, which means that you would be less likely to accidentally press a nearby key. The drawback to this is that the greater force required to press individual keys makes typing a more stressful activity.
Das is better quality actually... Esp when you consider they would cost the same at least in US distribution... The only reason why i would get flico is for the numpad less version. But for some reason it cost just as much as a full keyboard in the US.
On October 18 2010 11:34 Watsonator wrote: I'm going with browns.
Ordering a Filco, Das Model, or iRocks.
go for filco, you can't go wrong with them.
After more research, I am definitely going with Filco. I would actually prefer a Topre Realforce, but they are way out of my price range.
What I like most about Filco is that they are plain and simple. It's so hard to buy a basic keyboard these days. I don't want it slim, wireless, with USB slots, with media controllers or quick app openings, and I like having my Insert/Delete key section as well as a number pad.
blacks are actually really annoying to type on. High actuation force + no tactile feedback makes them sooooo awkward. FPS supposedly gets a benefit from linear force, but you just end up bottoming out when typing.
Don't listen to semantics. He doesn't actually know anything about mechanical keyboards and I doubt he's ever owned one (a couple days ago he was trolling keyboard threads trashing people for buying them, now he's trolling them giving out questionable information).
You can read this comparison of the Das vs. Filco to get an idea of which you'd prefer. Personally, I think the glossy finish on the Das would be very annoying, and I prefer the smaller, space-saving bezel on the Filco. They're both manufactured by Costar, so the quality is very similar.
On October 18 2010 11:58 FragKrag wrote: blacks are actually really annoying to type on. High actuation force + no tactile feedback makes them sooooo awkward. FPS supposedly gets a benefit from linear force, but you just end up bottoming out when typing.
Which is why I am going with a brown. Everyone has their own preference and blacks just don't seem to fit me. The browns will provide the tactile bump I like, without the occasional non-registering double tap and annoyance to my roommates of the blues, as well as a lighter force requirement and no "smooth" feeling of the blacks.
Edit: I am also a college student so it's not solely SC2 for me.
On October 18 2010 12:01 CaptainFwiffo wrote: Don't listen to semantics. He doesn't actually know anything about mechanical keyboards and I doubt he's ever owned one (a couple days ago he was trolling keyboard threads trashing people for buying them, now he's trolling them giving out questionable information).
You can read this comparison of the Das vs. Filco to get an idea of which you'd prefer. Personally, I think the glossy finish on the Das would be very annoying, and I prefer the smaller, space-saving bezel on the Filco. They're both manufactured by Costar, so the quality is very similar.
You'd be annoyed by the glossy finish but not the habit of flico boards of getting shiny. You call it trolling i call it common sense spend 20-40 bucks on a keyboard or spend 150 bucks after tax and shipping on a keyboard what would i want. For gaming mechanical keyboards, god the excuses people make are just bull. For typing they are great maybe worth the premium price. But for games they aren't worth anything. People bottom out keys in games so what's the difference from a good rubber dome. Typing i get it. But for games it's just people making shit ton of excuses to spend a lot of money on a keyboard it's like reading the audiophile forums, so much full of crap. And you're hardly going to get an honest response from CaptianFwiffo with his quote being You can call me... Keyboard Otaku.
Does anyone know which Cherry switches feel most similar to the Alps switches of the old Dell AT101 W? I've heard that they are Clicky and Tactile, so I assume they are close to Cherry Blues. Has anyone used both before?
On October 18 2010 12:01 CaptainFwiffo wrote: Don't listen to semantics. He doesn't actually know anything about mechanical keyboards and I doubt he's ever owned one (a couple days ago he was trolling keyboard threads trashing people for buying them, now he's trolling them giving out questionable information).
You can read this comparison of the Das vs. Filco to get an idea of which you'd prefer. Personally, I think the glossy finish on the Das would be very annoying, and I prefer the smaller, space-saving bezel on the Filco. They're both manufactured by Costar, so the quality is very similar.
You'd be annoyed by the glossy finish but not the habit of flico boards of getting shiny. You call it trolling i call it common sense spend 20-40 bucks on a keyboard or spend 150 bucks after tax and shipping on a keyboard what would i want. For gaming mechanical keyboards, god the excuses people make are just bull. For typing they are great maybe worth the premium price. But for games they aren't worth anything. People bottom out keys in games so what's the difference from a good rubber dome. Typing i get it. But for games it's just people making shit ton of excuses to spend a lot of money on a keyboard it's like reading the audiophile forums, so much full of crap. And you're hardly going to get an honest response from CaptianFwiffo with his quote being You can call me... Keyboard Otaku.
Filco keyboards don't turn shiny... where's your source on that?
Maybe on pro-level gaming, it can make a slight difference when using mechanical keyboards as opposed to rubber dome, so I agree with you about the general population of gamers being delusional into thinking that mech keyboards will improve their skill. However looking at your other posts, I think you're mostly upset due to the fact that ppl are buying these keyboards for luxury. You can call it common sense if you want (maybe you're financially challenged or just really cautious with your money, I dunno) but there are ppl who are willing to spend more than the usual amount for preference/luxury/etc. Basically you prefer buying shoes from Wal-mart rather than from a high-end designer because it's "common sense" to buy the cheaper one with almost the same quality... but not everyone is anti-materialistic like you, sadly.
On October 18 2010 12:01 CaptainFwiffo wrote: Don't listen to semantics. He doesn't actually know anything about mechanical keyboards and I doubt he's ever owned one (a couple days ago he was trolling keyboard threads trashing people for buying them, now he's trolling them giving out questionable information).
You can readthis comparison of the Das vs. Filco to get an idea of which you'd prefer. Personally, I think the glossy finish on the Das would be very annoying, and I prefer the smaller, space-saving bezel on the Filco. They're both manufactured by Costar, so the quality is very similar.
You'd be annoyed by the glossy finish but not the habit of flico boards of getting shiny. You call it trolling i call it common sense spend 20-40 bucks on a keyboard or spend 150 bucks after tax and shipping on a keyboard what would i want. For gaming mechanical keyboards, god the excuses people make are just bull. For typing they are great maybe worth the premium price. But for games they aren't worth anything. People bottom out keys in games so what's the difference from a good rubber dome. Typing i get it. But for games it's just people making shit ton of excuses to spend a lot of money on a keyboard it's like reading the audiophile forums, so much full of crap. And you're hardly going to get an honest response from CaptianFwiffo with his quote being You can call me... Keyboard Otaku.
Filco keyboards don't turn shiny... where's your source on that?
Maybe on pro-level gaming, it can make a slight difference when using mechanical keyboards as opposed to rubber dome, so I agree with you about the general population of gamers being delusional into thinking that mech keyboards will improve their skill. However looking at your other posts, I think you're mostly upset due to the fact that ppl are buying these keyboards for luxury. You can call it common sense if you want (maybe you're financially challenged or just really cautious with your money, I dunno) but there are ppl who are willing to spend more than the usual amount for preference/luxury/etc. Basically you prefer buying shoes from Wal-mart rather than from a high-end designer because it's "common sense" to buy the cheaper one with almost the same quality... but not everyone is anti-materialistic like you, sadly.
T_T
The Filcos tend to get shiny after a while - this is primarily because they have a fine matte finish whereas the Das have the more traditional "pebbly" finish.
On October 18 2010 13:08 semantics wrote:...with his quote being You can call me... Keyboard Otaku.
Somebody called me a keyboard otaku after I recognized Fruit Dealer's keyboard and posted a screenshot and then Elite Keyboards sold out of FIlcos. I thought it was funny.
Do you have first hand experience with any of these mechanical keyboards, semantics? If you're giving out advice and recommendations...
The Filcos tend to get shiny after a while - this is primarily because they have a fine matte finish whereas the Das have the more traditional "pebbly" finish.
In the very link of Das vs Flico
This is regarding the keycaps, not the actual keyboard. The other poster was talking about the glossy finish as in the entire Das keyboard, and it would be annoying because of the constant fingerprints and dust-proneness. The shininess of the keycaps on the filco after awhile is so minimal it shouldn't even be considered a con.
On October 18 2010 13:08 semantics wrote:...with his quote being You can call me... Keyboard Otaku.
Somebody called me a keyboard otaku after I recognized Fruit Dealer's keyboard and posted a screenshot and then Elite Keyboards sold out of FIlcos. I thought it was funny.
Do you have first hand experience with any of these mechanical keyboards, semantics? If you're giving out advice and recommendations...
I own a das keyboard II blank keys doesn't look so pretty very loud if you bottom out keys. Feels nice still for typing but i don't use it anymore i just use one of my old MS natural ones. The only Mech keyboard that fancies me right now is http://www.trulyergonomic.com/ that' just because i have a separate num pad and deskspace for me gets limited at times. Granted it is a cherry mech but i'm frankly more interested in the key layout and dimensions of the keyboard then it being a mechanical keyboard.
The Filcos tend to get shiny after a while - this is primarily because they have a fine matte finish whereas the Das have the more traditional "pebbly" finish.
In the very link of Das vs Flico
This is regarding the keycaps, not the actual keyboard. The other poster was talking about the glossy finish as in the entire Das keyboard, and it would be annoying because of the constant fingerprints and dust-proneness. The shininess of the keycaps on the filco after awhile is so minimal it shouldn't even be considered a con.
If you type alot esp with greasy fingers you're whole keycaps will be shiny which will make your keyboard shiny in spots progressing with keys you use the most. All keyboards are prone to dust. And the comment was about ascetics frankly you can clean off dust and fingerprints but you can't remove the little shiny marks all over your flico keyboard short of replacing keys. But honestly who cares besides you who is going to look at your keyboard and why do you see their approval.
I am using filco mx brown tenkeyless. It is very nice Probably going to get a Realforce for xmas to satisfy my curiosity. Don't like DAS. It is too big, also, the keys felt kinda loose (tried it at the JandR store). For around 60, I think the thinkpad keyboard with trackpoint is a good space saving keyboard. I also tried a coworkers compact model m board, it is amazing. Too hard to find though The mx brown feedback doesn't feel sharp enough, after trying the m.
On October 18 2010 15:03 zgl wrote: I am using filco mx brown tenkeyless. It is very nice Probably going to get a Realforce for xmas to satisfy my curiosity. Don't like DAS. It is too big, also, the keys felt kinda loose (tried it at the JandR store). For around 60, I think the thinkpad keyboard with trackpoint is a good space saving keyboard. I also tried a coworkers compact model m board, it is amazing. Too hard to find though The mx brown feedback doesn't feel sharp enough, after trying the m.
good choice on the filco bud, truly the best for its price ! Yes, stay away from Das, it's really not that great:
On October 18 2010 15:03 zgl wrote: I am using filco mx brown tenkeyless. It is very nice Probably going to get a Realforce for xmas to satisfy my curiosity. Don't like DAS. It is too big, also, the keys felt kinda loose (tried it at the JandR store). For around 60, I think the thinkpad keyboard with trackpoint is a good space saving keyboard. I also tried a coworkers compact model m board, it is amazing. Too hard to find though The mx brown feedback doesn't feel sharp enough, after trying the m.
good choice on the filco bud, truly the best for its price ! Yes, stay away from Das, it's really not that great:
Das uses lazer etched keys unless you press really hard when you type and sweat alot you actually can't remove the lettering on it; in short unless you actually are physically wearing down the keys which would make you a bad typer... It's just dirty clean your keys right and it pops right back out.
On August 22 2010 06:09 kzn wrote: I'm guessing people think Blue/Brown are better for RTS because they provide feedback on when the key actuates (although its inaccurate, in both cases).
This only really holds if you don't bottom out when you press keys while playing, which everyone I know does. Far better, imo, to have keys that have predictable resistance at all points in the keypress, are much easier to spam if you dont completely release the key between presses, and feel glorious to use (even when typing).
Ideally you'd want Red switches but they barely exist anymore :<
The feedback is perfectly accurate with my keyboard with blue switches. I tried pushing down various keys with the index finger from both hands while going as slow as I can. The key never actuates before the "click", and I can't make the keys "click" without them producing a letter. This holds true with a handful different keys I tested. It's super-good engineering and seems to work better than it looks like in that actuation force graphic from the Cherry product documents.
On October 18 2010 13:08 semantics wrote: You'd be annoyed by the glossy finish but not the habit of flico boards of getting shiny. You call it trolling i call it common sense spend 20-40 bucks on a keyboard or spend 150 bucks after tax and shipping on a keyboard what would i want.
People shouldn't assume that if you use blues or browns that you'll be bottoming out while gaming anyway. Maybe in an intense situation where you just need to get your actions out as quickly and confidently as possible - but, especially in the early game, in not so intense situations I don't bottom out very much at all.
After using blues and browns for a while you'll probably get used to not bottoming out 100% of the time.
On October 18 2010 13:08 semantics wrote: You'd be annoyed by the glossy finish but not the habit of flico boards of getting shiny. You call it trolling i call it common sense spend 20-40 bucks on a keyboard or spend 150 bucks after tax and shipping on a keyboard what would i want.
$150 is nothing if you work full time
Where is $150 coming from anyway. As RTS players, you really don't need the NKRO versions, which cost more for a feature an RTS player will almost never use (if ever). They also don't appear to be making the Otaku (textless) versions anymore, which again cost more than the standard models. My friend has had a FILCO going on 2 years now and it's STILL as solid as my fresh month old Tactile Touch.
On October 18 2010 20:04 lynx.oblige wrote: People shouldn't assume that if you use blues or browns that you'll be bottoming out while gaming anyway. Maybe in an intense situation where you just need to get your actions out as quickly and confidently as possible - but, especially in the early game, in not so intense situations I don't bottom out very much at all.
After using blues and browns for a while you'll probably get used to not bottoming out 100% of the time.
Pretty much, I've been using my Filco with browns for over a year now and I hardly ever bottom out anymore when playing SC2. Once you get accustomed to the force required to depress the key it becomes a very smooth experience in regards to keystrokes.
On October 18 2010 13:08 semantics wrote: You'd be annoyed by the glossy finish but not the habit of flico boards of getting shiny. You call it trolling i call it common sense spend 20-40 bucks on a keyboard or spend 150 bucks after tax and shipping on a keyboard what would i want.
$150 is nothing if you work full time
Unless you work a minimum wage job, or like a lot of students, part-time (and minimum wage).
Again though, a SC2 player really doesn't need to pay $150. My Tactile Touch was only about like $116 all expenses included. NKRO is not essential for RTS players.
If you haven't tried any of the switches and haven't formed any preferences yet, as an RTS player, chances are you'll like Browns. Blue is slightly harder to acutate, around ~5g, and is clicky. Blacks are about ~15g harder to actuate over Browns and are linear, as in they don't give that tactile bump when you press down a key.
I've got browns for a while now, really like them. Tried blues, but they were way too loud for my taste. If it was only about typing, i would probably prefer blues, but browns seem to be the perfect compromise between the tactile feel and the sound.
I thought I would get a das keyboard. I know destiny uses das keyboard on his stream and they all have blue switches, and the noises it makes are so satisfying. But after reading this thread and others elsewhere, I am torn between blue and brown, and no longer sure whether to get das keyboard or filco.
With das keyboard I can get linux penguin key, which is kind of cool. I think I'm going to go with that. The price seems to be pretty much the same. NKRO is unimportant to me. I do code a lot so blue may be better for that.
I find it weird how everyone is fawning over their keyboards but not their mice or mouse pad or hell the mouse cord thingy (mine is called duct tape and old chock sticks :D). A good keyboard wont make you macro like a pro wont even get your close. SC pro macro and microed on shitty 5 dollar keyboards all this time.
I find it weird how everyone is fawning over their keyboards but not their mice or mouse pad or hell the mouse cord thingy (mine is called duct tape and old chock sticks :D). A good keyboard wont make you macro like a pro wont even get your close. SC pro macro and microed on shitty 5 dollar keyboards all this time.
Weren't most keyboards used mechanical? I thought production stopped on those keyboards because of the advent of non-mechanical technology to make cheaper keyboards.
I find it weird how everyone is fawning over their keyboards but not their mice or mouse pad or hell the mouse cord thingy (mine is called duct tape and old chock sticks :D). A good keyboard wont make you macro like a pro wont even get your close. SC pro macro and microed on shitty 5 dollar keyboards all this time.
Weren't most keyboards used mechanical? I thought production stopped on those keyboards because of the advent of non-mechanical technology to make cheaper keyboards.
Even if you look at SC today they use non mechanical keyboard cheap samsung made ones that they blow though.
On October 19 2010 03:38 semantics wrote: I find it weird how everyone is fawning over their keyboards but not their mice or mouse pad or hell the mouse cord thingy (mine is called duct tape and old chock sticks :D).
Actually, a lot of people were talking about the mouse too, and mice and even mouse pads in general get more attention from gamers and from manufacturers than keyboards do. Most gamers can recognize the mice pros use, and they're widely available, but relatively few know about the keyboards, that's why there's more attention paid.
The keyboard thing is also newsworthy. Everyone knew many progamers used gaming mice, but it was assumed that they all used cheap membrane keyboards. That's changed now that several top pros (including Fruit Dealer, Boxer, Tester...) have been seen using premium mechanical keyboards, in some cases using them in favor of keyboards made by their sponsor!
On October 19 2010 03:38 semantics wrote:A good keyboard wont make you macro like a pro wont even get your close. SC pro macro and microed on shitty 5 dollar keyboards all this time.
I don't think anyone has claimed a keyboard will make you a pro. A mouse won't make you gosu either. People drop $50-80 or more on mice all the time. Razer sells a $60 mouse pad!
(I use a sweet DS9 Rom mouse-pad I got for Christmas like 15 years ago).
I find it weird how everyone is fawning over their keyboards but not their mice or mouse pad or hell the mouse cord thingy (mine is called duct tape and old chock sticks :D). A good keyboard wont make you macro like a pro wont even get your close. SC pro macro and microed on shitty 5 dollar keyboards all this time.
You're definitely reading into it much. Do some people think it's going to make them way better at the game? Maybe. But no decently sensible person actually thinks that. Not only that but as the post above me has stated, there is plenty of hype over other equipment as well. I use the G9x and can vouch for its awesomeness. It's just such a flexible and comfortable mouse.
On this whole issue of people criticizing those thinking a keyboard is going to make them better, I have a few words.
I don't honestly believe that buying a nice keyboard will make me a lot better at playing SC2. I do believe, however, that it is an indirect and contributing factor. Comfort is a big deal when I'm playing SC and if I don't feel good physically and mentally, I can see that projected into my gameplay.
I enjoy having a much better feeling mouse and keyboard and it plays a huge roll on my mental state. Furthermore, when I sit down to play a session, I make sure that all of my peripherals are positioned nicely, the temperature is just right, and my desk area is clean. I want to be as comfortable as I possibly can be, and I don't mind paying extra money to do so.
These things might not make a huge difference, but I do know that I have played my best games when I am feeling great, so I am going to try to always be at that level from now on. This might not be everyone's reasoning, but it's certainly mine.
On October 19 2010 08:06 CaptainFwiffo wrote: You can jury rig something with paper clips or whatever. The trick is to carefully pull straight up, maybe wiggle some. Don't twist or pry.
EDIT: Weird, I was looking at an old version of the thread with a question about how to remove the keycaps.
If you don't have that you can easily just use a flat head screw driver but you have to start at the edges where you can lift the keys up not bend the keys.
You obviously didn't read what i posted. You have to start at the edge of the keyboard at like grave or with alt and windows keys else you will break keys =p You also don't want to use the screwdriver as a seasaw. You want to insert it under the key then turn the screw driver not push down against the keyboard. This lifts the key by the center =p
I think anybody who says anything negative about the filco keyboards has never actually used one. Until you use one you can't understand how much better they feel.
I know many people think a keyboard is a keyboard is a keyboard, but that is just not true. The quality of the materials, feel of the keys, simplicity, and size all make the filco special. I have never heard anybody say they regret the purchase or have gone back to their old keyboard.
Of course a keyboard isn't gonna make you gosu, but the way i see it is that from the one i have now (some logitech standard one) its gonna be a much better feel to what i have now, not to mention this keyboard will stick around about 10+ years or so and for 100bucks thats not a bad investment, where as gfx cards get outdated in months and are like 3 times the price or soemthing.
Also maybe the sound of the keyboard can help increase play, as some click and can be a reminder to keep your APM up or a reminder to keep active during a game. (at least for me coz im p-bad)
They will not work on a Cherry MX board, those are for topre switches.
On October 19 2010 21:42 Archduke wrote: Does FILCO make a tenkeyless otaku board? If they do, it's not listed on elitekeyboards.com.
They have at some points in time, but there aren't any available right now. They also have blank replacement keycap sets sometimes. They work with 104 key or tenkeyless layouts.
On October 19 2010 19:26 FliedLice wrote: only thing bugging me is that it seems to be even more expensive to find a filco with a german-qwertz keyboard layout...
On October 19 2010 18:31 Bosu wrote: I think anybody who says anything negative about the filco keyboards has never actually used one. Until you use one you can't understand how much better they feel.
I know many people think a keyboard is a keyboard is a keyboard, but that is just not true. The quality of the materials, feel of the keys, simplicity, and size all make the filco special. I have never heard anybody say they regret the purchase or have gone back to their old keyboard.
I think your head is too far up your ass. It's like people who own Ferrari and can't stand it when anyone points out the flaws in a Ferrari, Mechanical keyboards are a waste of money for people who strictly just do gaming. They are fine for people who type a ton but a proper ergonomic keyboard would do them better as they can type longer.
The flaws in a Ferrari are that it's not a good transporter. It costs a lot. Suspension is not really comfortable. But for racing, it's a damn fine machine. A ergo keyboard is fine for what it is but for your fingers a mechanical keyboard is still king. Simply feels great once your have gotten used to it. Even if mine is a bit stiff and I will go for a FILCO brown at one point. As in regards to gaming, depends. A Korean pro spends so much time behind his keyboard, it's somewhat important for him. Also, a good mecha feels faster. I kid you not.
I'm certain that not all people can appreciate a good mecha. Well, I couldn't appreciate a Ferrari the way my skills are. But that won't stop me from recognizing it's a fine machine and that it's nice to sit in one next to someone who CAN use it.
question: My G80-3000 has a slighty metallic sound when typing, as if I hear the springs. Is this from the build or do you also hear that with the FILCOs??
the metaphor is people are too busy fawning over their purchase that they wont accept any criticism if all you do is hype up and make shit exciting in the end that's all you perceive. As far as gaming goes people bottom out keyboard when they game so the benefit is so minuscule esp in a fps game the only benefit is that the key springs back faster but due to built in chatter delays and human ability to actually hit keys that fast it's likely not more responsive then a decent dome keyboard.
On October 20 2010 02:55 FoxSpirit wrote: That sounds bs.
The flaws in a Ferrari are that it's not a good transporter. It costs a lot. Suspension is not really comfortable. But for racing, it's a damn fine machine. A ergo keyboard is fine for what it is but for your fingers a mechanical keyboard is still king. Simply feels great once your have gotten used to it. Even if mine is a bit stiff and I will go for a FILCO brown at one point. As in regards to gaming, depends. A Korean pro spends so much time behind his keyboard, it's somewhat important for him. Also, a good mecha feels faster. I kid you not.
I'm certain that not all people can appreciate a good mecha. Well, I couldn't appreciate a Ferrari the way my skills are. But that won't stop me from recognizing it's a fine machine and that it's nice to sit in one next to someone who CAN use it.
question: My G80-3000 has a slighty metallic sound when typing, as if I hear the springs. Is this from the build or do you also hear that with the FILCOs??
if you're bottoming them out you're hearing metal residence sounds like a ding with a little ring to it. Probably be worse on the sides of the keyboard. Bring the keyboard up to your ear and just start hitting keys moving up the keyboard
I'm hearing the sound without bottoming out. Simply happens when I release very fast. So I'm curious if it's due to the non fortified build (fast snapping back making the PCB swing) or a feature of the switches. Clear Cherry's btw.
As for gaming benefits, I wouldn't really count on a speed argument. It's more of a "finger comfort" thing than anything else. If your train yourself to not bottom out you will have nice profit of comfort and a tad of speed. Also feels much nicer than a dome keyboard. For FPS, I just dunno. The rts benefit comes from the typing like action but in an FPS, I think I'd actually prefer a very good dome keyboard with ultra short ways.
Getting my dream dome tomorrow so I'll report back ;-)
You can hear the springs in Cherry MX boards, depending mostly on how much you're paying attention. The spring sound isn't as loud as with something like a Model M. There's a thread on geekhack.org about it.
On October 20 2010 03:03 semantics wrote: I like pie.
Did a keyboard run over your dog? Why is it so important for you that everyone agrees with you about this particular subject? Is it that impossible for you to believe that keyboard preference is subjective?
you do know exactly what you said could be turned on yourself why must you get everyone to believe that mech keyboards are a god send. Did you're keyboard save your life against a bear attack or something?
On October 20 2010 04:02 semantics wrote: you do know exactly what you said could be turned on yourself why must you get everyone to believe that mech keyboards are a god send. Did you're keyboard save your life against a bear attack or something?
I wouldn't be surprised if there are verifiable reports of people using an IBM model M to fend off a wild animal attack...
If you actually look at what I've written, I've never said anything of the kind. In fact, I've repeatedly said that a keyboard or mouse or anything else won't make you a better gamer by itself, but that there are many reasons why they're still a good investment (durability, comfort, longevity, etc.). Mostly I've been answering questions.
Meanwhile you've been accusing people of having their head up their ass just because they prefer using a different kind of keyboard from you. Have I ever called you an idiot for preferring a membrane keyboard?
On October 20 2010 04:15 CaptainFwiffo wrote: If you actually look at what I've written, I've never said anything of the kind. In fact, I've repeatedly said that a keyboard or mouse or anything else won't make you a better gamer by itself, but that there are many reasons why they're still a good investment (durability, comfort, longevity, etc.). Mostly I've been answering questions.
Meanwhile you've been accusing people of having their head up their ass just because they prefer using a different kind of keyboard from you. Have I ever called you an idiot for preferring a membrane keyboard?
except you been inflating durability comfort and longevity. Mechanical keyboards can withstand more key presses this is true. But they are also weak to crumbs dust and hair more so then normal cheap ones. So unless you take good care of them they don't last. If you are going to take good care of the keyboard even a cheap dome one will last a very very long time.
Comfort is completely opinion based mechanical switches benefit strictly depending to how you time if you type with your finger where the finger print would be or if you type straight down with your nails.
Also you may not be the one that tout it will do you better in a game or anything but that is the implied notion that people keep giving out esp in the fruitdealer thread.
But they are also weak to crumbs dust and hair more so then normal cheap ones.
I think the number of old mechanical keyboards still in service after pretty extreme abuse would disagree with you. Remember that one of the primary markets for mechanical keyboards these days are industrial applications, point of sale systems, etc. where keyboards endure a lot of abuse.
But again, why do you feel the need to call people names or accuse them of wasting money because they happen to disagree with you?
Just got my Majestouch NKO (Browns) today and i have to say, it is a dream of a keyboard. Everything about it just screams quality. I was also quite torn on whether to get blues or browns but now that i have it, i'm happy that i went with the latter. The audio feeback is there but not as clickly and high pitched as the blues which is fantastic. Also they feel absolutely wonderful to type/play games with. I'd recommend it to anyone who has some extra money to spend on peripherals.
I also just got my Filco Majestouch Tactile Touch in the mail today. Before I was using a Cherry G80-3000LSCRC2 which has Cherry MX Blue swiches. I love both keyboards to death, and I will never part with my beloved Cherry keyboard.
Some things that I've noticed immediately are: 1. It's somewhat easier to notice a typo on the Cherry keyboard than my Filco. This could be simply because it's a new keyboard. Sometimes the click gives my senses an "additional verification" that I might have hit a wrong key. 2. My WPM is on average about 5% less on the Filco. Again, this could and probably is simply because it's a new keyboard. (My wpm dropped from 105 to 100) 3. The Filco is WAY more comfortable. My Cherry keyboard has additional space on the bottom of the keyboard that I got used to. But once I got rid of it, it feels way more comfortable without it on the Filco. BUT, now that I think about it, you might want to invest in a wrist rest for ergonomics. I think there's serious potential for Carpal Tunnel without it. 4. Obviously the brown switches are WAY quieter than the blue ones. Definitely a plus. 5. Both keyboards are of exceptional quality, and I absolutely recommend them both. I do not own a Filco with Blue switches but I'm assuming, aside from the overall shape of the keyboard, the switches operate and sound very similar to my Cherry keyboard.
Up to you. I think for writing papers, I will switch back to my Cherry. But for gaming, definitely using the Filco.
That's my Otaku (with Cherry MX Blue switches) that FedEx just dropped off today courtesy of Brian and Elite Keyboards. This thing is a beast. By far the most durable feeling and looking keyboard that I have ever owned, and I've had a few in my 22 years. Typing is a dream, and the amount of force it takes to push the keys down is almost nothing. I'm bottoming out most of the keystrokes because of the finger habits of years of shoddy membrane keyboards. My fingers want to move on to the next key once they feel the click, but I'm still trained to bottom everything out. :| It's getting better and better as I type to people about how awesome this thing is, though. The clicking sound really is not very loud at all (probably a bit less than the click of my G9, honestly). I'm so happy that I got this thing, and I can't wait to get on the ladder later tonight and test it out in a game!
I've tried to encounter the "double press" issue that people describe with blues, and I can make it happen, but it's just a matter of letting it reset (which you can feel and hear usually) before pressing the key again. It's actually been repeating the keystroke as if the key was held down when I try and test it out usually. I really can't see it being an issue in-game since you typically let the key rebound a bit anyways (and boy do these things snap back up!!) before pressing it again.
Oh, and it came with the traditional Windows keys (with the circle in the middle) and a black escape key, but the replacements were in baggies packed away with the board. I swapped them out without even having one of those key-puller deals, and it took all of 2 minutes because I was so worried about hurting these (seemingly bulletproof) switches.
Thank you so much to those of you who have contributed to threads like this, as the information has been invaluable in helping my decision process.
That's my Otaku (with Cherry MX Blue switches) that FedEx just dropped off today courtesy of Brian and Elite Keyboards. This thing is a beast. By far the most durable feeling and looking keyboard that I have ever owned, and I've had a few in my 22 years. Typing is a dream, and the amount of force it takes to push the keys down is almost nothing. I'm bottoming out most of the keystrokes because of the finger habits of years of shoddy membrane keyboards. My fingers want to move on to the next key once they feel the click, but I'm still trained to bottom everything out. :| It's getting better and better as I type to people about how awesome this thing is, though. The clicking sound really is not very loud at all (probably a bit less than the click of my G9, honestly). I'm so happy that I got this thing, and I can't wait to get on the ladder later tonight and test it out in a game!
I've tried to encounter the "double press" issue that people describe with blues, and I can make it happen, but it's just a matter of letting it reset (which you can feel and hear usually) before pressing the key again. It's actually been repeating the keystroke as if the key was held down when I try and test it out usually. I really can't see it being an issue in-game since you typically let the key rebound a bit anyways (and boy do these things snap back up!!) before pressing it again.
Oh, and it came with the traditional Windows keys (with the circle in the middle) and a black escape key, but the replacements were in baggies packed away with the board. I swapped them out without even having one of those key-puller deals, and it took all of 2 minutes because I was so worried about hurting these (seemingly bulletproof) switches.
Thank you so much to those of you who have contributed to threads like this, as the information has been invaluable in helping my decision process.
Thanks for this, very insightful. Just wondering, how exactly did you pop the keycaps off? I'm trying to think of a way to do it without damaging the keyboard. :p
It means that at a point in the stroke where the key actuates, there's a feeling of a "bump" and a clicky sound to give you feedback to let you know the key has actuated (Cherry MX Blue switches). There's also an option for Cherry MX Brown switches which have the "bump" but without the extra clicky sound. And there's Cherry MX Black switches which have a higher actuation force and no bump and no clicky sound.
That's my Otaku (with Cherry MX Blue switches) that FedEx just dropped off today courtesy of Brian and Elite Keyboards. This thing is a beast. By far the most durable feeling and looking keyboard that I have ever owned, and I've had a few in my 22 years. Typing is a dream, and the amount of force it takes to push the keys down is almost nothing. I'm bottoming out most of the keystrokes because of the finger habits of years of shoddy membrane keyboards. My fingers want to move on to the next key once they feel the click, but I'm still trained to bottom everything out. :| It's getting better and better as I type to people about how awesome this thing is, though. The clicking sound really is not very loud at all (probably a bit less than the click of my G9, honestly). I'm so happy that I got this thing, and I can't wait to get on the ladder later tonight and test it out in a game!
I've tried to encounter the "double press" issue that people describe with blues, and I can make it happen, but it's just a matter of letting it reset (which you can feel and hear usually) before pressing the key again. It's actually been repeating the keystroke as if the key was held down when I try and test it out usually. I really can't see it being an issue in-game since you typically let the key rebound a bit anyways (and boy do these things snap back up!!) before pressing it again.
Oh, and it came with the traditional Windows keys (with the circle in the middle) and a black escape key, but the replacements were in baggies packed away with the board. I swapped them out without even having one of those key-puller deals, and it took all of 2 minutes because I was so worried about hurting these (seemingly bulletproof) switches.
Thank you so much to those of you who have contributed to threads like this, as the information has been invaluable in helping my decision process.
Thanks for this, very insightful. Just wondering, how exactly did you pop the keycaps off? I'm trying to think of a way to do it without damaging the keyboard. :p
I literally just pulled them out by grabbing them. lol. They ease off a bit tough, but they go back on without much effort. I had to remove the cntrl keys to get access to the Windows keys (they came with the stock ones featuring the circle in the middle, but that's simply because I don't have small fingers. I'm sure if I sought out a female in the house, it could've been easily done. Once you see that it's really just a + shape for the top of the switch and a corresponding + cut out of the key, you realize that you really can't hurt it too much. If the WASD keys were available unprinted for the Majestouch boards, I would've gone with those and had the removal tool. I almost bought just the removal tool to have one, but I don't see myself actually using one much in the future. I do LOVE the red escape key on the solid black board.
Now I'm trying to convince myself to just buy a brand new Filco instead of being a cheap bastard and looking for a used one. Does the red esc key come with the keyboard by default or do you have to buy that? Same question about the blue WASD keys if you know about that.
On October 21 2010 09:01 scottyyy wrote: Thanks dude.
Now I'm trying to convince myself to just buy a brand new Filco instead of being a cheap bastard and looking for a used one. Does the red esc key come with the keyboard by default or do you have to buy that? Same question about the blue WASD keys if you know about that.
Cheers
Red esc key is included with all the majestouch keyboards. You have to buy the blue wasd keys separately.
I can't decide between the Filco Majestouch with brown switches and the Steelseries 6GV2 with black switches. I think I'll be happy with either brown or black switches (never tried a mechanical keyboard before) so the difference there doesn't concern me. Is there a big difference in quality between the two or are they both good enough that I should pick based on small factors like whether or not I want media keys? Oh and that leads to my second question. Is there anyway to bind the function keys on a standard keyboard to volume up/down like the media keys on say the 6GV2?
On October 21 2010 09:24 -Simplicity- wrote: Oh and that leads to my second question. Is there anyway to bind the function keys on a standard keyboard to volume up/down like the media keys on say the 6GV2?
Regarding black vs brown switches - it depends how much force you like to use when pressing a key down. Black switches require a lot more force to press, so most people's fingers get tired when typing for a long period of time with black switches. That's a generalization but one I hear a lot.
On October 21 2010 09:24 -Simplicity- wrote: Oh and that leads to my second question. Is there anyway to bind the function keys on a standard keyboard to volume up/down like the media keys on say the 6GV2?
Regarding black vs brown switches - it depends how much force you like to use when pressing a key down. Black switches require a lot more force to press, so most people's fingers get tired when typing for a long period of time with black switches. That's a generalization but one I hear a lot.
The black switches and brown switches operate very differently, too. The brown ones have a "click" feeling similar to a mouse when you press them 1/2 way. The black ones still actuate (or activate the key press) half way down, but they do not provide feedback or a "bump" of resistance. They're constant (linear) the whole way down.
If you email the sales for elite keyboard, you'll reach Brian. He has a few B-stock boards (with minor cosmetic flaws) for about $20 off the retail price. It's worth consideration if you're looking for something in particular. I played email tag with him for a while before deciding on a new Tactile Click Otaku. You can save yourself a bit if you don't want/need NKRO (which you really don't for SC2), and $10 if you don't need the numpad on the right side of the board. I think the B-Stock boards are about $20 off, but you'd have to email them to check on the specific board you're looking at. I know they're getting a new shipment of everything in around January, so if you can wait a while, you'll have a few more options. The brown switch (Tactile Touch) boards should be in by the end of the month, too.
As the other poster said, the Red Esc. key is included with the purchase. Also, the boards still come with the Windows key that has a circle in the middle (like the old models), however if you buy the Otaku, they send you the flat keys like I showed in my picture.
I just received my blue tenkeyless in the mail, and it sounds and feels like heaven. It is really a crisp feeling, a bit loud, I personally enjoy the satisfying click. I just hope my roommate next door doesn't mind!
On October 21 2010 12:19 Kogut wrote: The black switches and brown switches operate very differently, too. The brown ones have a "click" feeling similar to a mouse when you press them 1/2 way.
Just to make a small correction here, brown has a slight tactual sensation in it and no "click". Blue is the one with both.
OK so my brown filco just arrived. Prior to this I've been using blacks for about 6 years. So far, I think I still really prefer the blacks. The linear force just feels nicer to me.
Of course it's entirely possible that I just need to get used to the brown switches, and this is in fact probable. But at the moment I think blacks are better.
Hey all, I have my full size Filco majestouch keyboard coming in the mail should be here earlie next week. I got it with browns. What are some thoughts on the NKRO, I undesrtand its not need in SC2.
Just got my 104 key non NKRO today with brown switches, so far definitely impressed with the quality.
Just a few brief thoughts based on a few hours of use so far. The keys seems to take very little force to depress, at least compared to what I'm used to. I'm coming from an Apple laptop style keyboard which took significantly more force but didn't seem unusually tough. The other major distance in my case is that the travel distance on the Filco is at least twice as large, the Apple was 2mm max where the Flico seems more like 4mm or 5mm, of course that's really only an issue for people coming from laptop style keyboards. Overall, I'm pretty happy with my purchase so far
Edit: Totally forgot to mention that so far I really don't notice the "bump." Maybe it's related to the fact that I'm used to pressing significantly harder so I sort of just blow by it. Not an issue just thought I would mention it.
NKRO probably doesn't matter at all for RTS. But non-NKRO keyboards are generally 2KRO, which means that some (not all) combinations of three or more keys won't work, which may be a problem for FPS games. For example, you might not be able to throw a grenade while crawling or something.
The USB spec limits keyboards to 6 simultaneous keypresses plus 4 modifier keys so NKRO keyboards are only truly NKRO if hooked up through PS/2 and become 6KRO through USB. But like Repok said, that's only a theoretical problem because you're never going to need to press that many keys at the same time.
On October 23 2010 02:41 AT_Tack wrote: anyone found a good european (german) retailer? amazon is ridiciously overprized at 130€ which is like 180$ and im srsly not that desperate.
tips are appreciated!
Not yet T_T u gotta pay 150€ to get the qwertz layout from UK
Got my Filco Tenkeyless with cherry MX blue switches yesterday and I couldn't be more pleased. I thought they might be to loud originally, but they really aren't. If you are hesitating to spend the extra money I can assure you it is well worth it.
On October 23 2010 05:18 SeekUp wrote: Got my Filco Tenkeyless with cherry MX blue switches yesterday and I couldn't be more pleased. I thought they might be to loud originally, but they really aren't. If you are hesitating to spend the extra money I can assure you it is well worth it.
blue's its not so much volume but rather pitch most people don't care for high pitches noises in general though.
I've had a black and browns and both are fine for gaming. Browns feel lighter than blacks and therefore tire less your hands. I still have to test blues though.
On October 25 2010 15:45 Alpina wrote: I think I am going to order filco with cherry blues, hope they won't be much worse for SC2 than browns
I got the blues too. Still waiting for them to come in though. And Boxer uses blues, so they can't be that bad for sc2. Honestly, I don't think blues and browns have that big of a difference playing sc, I think its more of the noise people are afraid of.
I ordered a long time ago. I'm just recalling when people ordered around the first back order period. It was only a few days off.
Anyone that says blues are bad for gaming is bad themselves. All the switches are fine, it's primarily up to preference. The actuation difference between blues and browns is a mere ~5g. Blacks are far more noticeable though, takes ~10g more than blue and ~15g more than brown.
On October 25 2010 17:48 Carefoot wrote: Tenless keys with brown switches here, typing this very sentence with it. Don't expect to suddenly be a SC2 god.
I played 30 matches today with it and won 11 of them.
What am I supposed to blame now?
it doesnt press the pylons and probes button for you ><
neway i should be getting it tomorrow. - Into Foreign Customs, October 25, 2010, 12:47 pm, AUSTRALIA
On October 25 2010 17:48 Carefoot wrote: Tenless keys with brown switches here, typing this very sentence with it. Don't expect to suddenly be a SC2 god.
I played 30 matches today with it and won 11 of them.
On October 25 2010 17:48 Carefoot wrote: Tenless keys with brown switches here, typing this very sentence with it. Don't expect to suddenly be a SC2 god.
I played 30 matches today with it and won 11 of them.
Anyone tried both blackwidow and this filco one? I ordered the blackwidow but it's on backorder for a long time now and I might just want to order the blue filco one.. Thoughts?
On October 26 2010 01:27 OutlaW- wrote: Anyone tried both blackwidow and this filco one? I ordered the blackwidow but it's on backorder for a long time now and I might just want to order the blue filco one.. Thoughts?
If you hate the wait, the Filco 104 key models with blue switches (both with and without NKRO) are in stock right now. I've never tried the Black Widow, but quite a bit of people seem to absolutely hate any Razer products for some reason or another, so good luck finding an objective recommendation for or against.
I use a FILCO with black switches, I don't know how you guys can stand the blue/brown switches, The LAN center near me uses blue switches and I cant stand them, I have to bring my own keyboard.
So you think people don't want to make profit? Only about 1% of the population would check that.. And even if, sometimes you simply have no choice because you can't order it anywhere else. So yeah, it's kinda a win win situation unless there is some competition, which brings us to how economy works >:
On October 31 2010 20:37 papaz wrote: I have read all pages now in the thread and listened to the sound of the keyboards with different switches through youtube.
One thing I can't figure out:
I own a Razer Lycosa and compared to that keyboard how would compare the sound of a Filco with brown switches?
I tried listening to a razer through youtube but that didn't help.
You have the Razer, why would you need to watch a YouTube video of one to tell what it sounds like??
On October 31 2010 20:37 papaz wrote: I have read all pages now in the thread and listened to the sound of the keyboards with different switches through youtube.
One thing I can't figure out:
I own a Razer Lycosa and compared to that keyboard how would compare the sound of a Filco with brown switches?
I tried listening to a razer through youtube but that didn't help.
You have the Razer, why would you need to watch a YouTube video of one to tell what it sounds like??
It didn't feel accurate to compare the sound of razer "in real life" with a youtube clip/sound of a Filco. So I thought if I can compare a recorded sound of razer vs recorded sound of Filco I'd get a better comparison.
But people in different youtube vids have different settings/mics and all so I couldn't get a feeling at all.
Couldn't find a video where the user compares lycosa vs filco
On October 26 2010 04:30 AT_Tack wrote: i just did a little math:
Ordering Filco Majestouch w/o NKRO brown from elitekeyboards.com: 109$ <> 78€ Shipping to Europ (Germany): 50$ <> 35€
getting one from the us would cost like 113€ german retailers charge 150€
i smell big money here O_o
But there's no German layout with elitekeyboards :-(
Don't forget Tax and Mehrwertssteuer bei Importen, it's over the free limit, this easily adds another 10-20 Euros in Germany. And that's for private, if you order a large stock customs will treat it as "commercial" with different regulations.
I ordered mine the 24th of October but now it says backorder is the 12th of November instead of the 30th of October...So they didn't get them as expected or why is it?
On October 31 2010 20:37 papaz wrote: I own a Razer Lycosa and compared to that keyboard how would compare the sound of a Filco with brown switches?
The Filco will be louder than any membrane keyboard.
Check out recordings here. Put on some headphones and play the mouse clicking recording and adjust the volume so it's about as loud as your actual mouse. Then you can play the different keyboard recordings. The recording of the Logitech rubber dome board is going to be similar in sound to your rubber dome Lycosa.
On October 31 2010 20:37 papaz wrote: I own a Razer Lycosa and compared to that keyboard how would compare the sound of a Filco with brown switches?
The Filco will be louder than any membrane keyboard.
Check out recordings here. Put on some headphones and play the mouse clicking recording and adjust the volume so it's about as loud as your actual mouse. Then you can play the different keyboard recordings. The recording of the Logitech rubber dome board is going to be similar in sound to your rubber dome Lycosa.
Only if you have a pretty light typing style. I'm a pretty heavy typer, so the sound on my last membrane keyboard was pretty loud regardless. I guess what you mean is that if u deliberately displace the key using as little force as possible, the the membrane is definitely not as loud as the filco. Also, would you happen to know that if i constantly bottom out my keyboard, if that does any damage to the keyboard? I'm trying not to bottom out so much when I type but I guess I'm still getting use to it.
I was surprised when I saw this thread. I own a Filco tenkeyless with blue switches. I've had it for a while. I didn't know it was a "gaming" keyboard however.
The reason I own this keyboard is because typing on it is better than a blowjob. The feel and sound are superb. But I fail to see how it's going to give you any kind of "edge" while playing video games. This is not to say it's bad for playing video games. Rather, the idea that keyboard is going to make you play better is absurd.
That said, these keyboards, whether you're using blue, brown or black switches are awesome. You shouldn't buy one just to play video games. But as an investment in your overall "computing" experience, you can't go wrong.
To answer the OP's question specifically: My personal opinion is that none of them are "better" for gaming. All will perform the same. The difference is a matter of personal aesthetics. Go with what feels better for yourself. Personally I love the crunchy sound of blues.
And two the poster 2 posts above this one: "Bottoming out" on a keyboard is not going to hurt it, mechanical or plastic (unless there is a serious serious fault with it).
Its not a gaming keyboard; but since one of the pro players was using it, the filco browns sold out like right away, because the pro was using that keyboard. If you've been looking around recently, since 3-4 weeks ago, tons of new mechanical keyboard threads ave popped up. I agree that getting the filco did not make me play better, but it has made my typing experience better. Reality check, a mechanical keyboard will not make you pro!! That goes for any of you thinking that this keyboard helps you game. It doesn't.
Edit: That's assuming your current keyboard doesn't suck something awful. Edit 2: Can we start a mechanical keyboard club? =)
It's been stated several times by now. Getting a mechanical keyboard won't make you better at Starcraft 2 by its lonesome. It can make you feel super comfortable though.
I'm still getting used to mine, I still feeling like I'm typing way to hard on them. I'm bottoming out on almost every keystroke. Nonetheless, I love my blue cherry Majestouch soo much. Honestly, to anyone that is considering one of these, you will not disappointed.
Bottoming out is totally fine, though probably not necessary. I've been using FILCOs for kind of a while now and still bottom out. I don't know if you should stop really, if you have to use another keyboard it might feel super retarded.
ive been thinking about buying a filco keyboard and decided that the cherry blues is what appeals to me most. on the elitekeyboards site, i have failed to understand what 87-key and 104-key are.
On October 31 2010 20:37 papaz wrote: I own a Razer Lycosa and compared to that keyboard how would compare the sound of a Filco with brown switches?
The Filco will be louder than any membrane keyboard.
Check out recordings here. Put on some headphones and play the mouse clicking recording and adjust the volume so it's about as loud as your actual mouse. Then you can play the different keyboard recordings. The recording of the Logitech rubber dome board is going to be similar in sound to your rubber dome Lycosa.
Thanks, that was a good site to get a feel for the sound!
On November 01 2010 17:48 AUTA wrote: ive been thinking about buying a filco keyboard and decided that the cherry blues is what appeals to me most. on the elitekeyboards site, i have failed to understand what 87-key and 104-key are.
104-key keyboards are basically the standard versions with the extra numbers on the right side of the keyboard, whereas the tenkeyless versions are the ones w/o them.
lynx.oblige has it right. That's always a confusing thing when you first look at them. For example, at EliteKeyboards, Filcos with brown switches are $109 with no NKRO and $134 with it and $125 for a Tenkeyless with it.
Unfortunately, I've had my Apple Wireless Keyboard for 45 days and am beyond the point of being able to return it. I think I'm willing to just take the hit and get a Tenkeyless with brown switches anyways, though, since I think I'd absolutely love it.
im tryin to figure out if i should try to find a mech with reds in it. i know if i had to choose i go for browns but ive heard a lot of up talk on the reds. idc if they're more expensive or harder to find, i just wanna know if the reds are really that much better or what the difference is? thx
EDIT: Also, Does anybody know where to get Filco boards that arent painted black? Im looking for somethin unique.Thx
On November 02 2010 11:08 SirDuke wrote: im tryin to figure out if i should try to find a mech with reds in it. i know if i had to choose i go for browns but ive heard a lot of up talk on the reds. idc if they're more expensive or harder to find, i just wanna know if the reds are really that much better or what the difference is? thx
I think the reds are linear like blacks but require a lesser actuation force. I think they are also extremely hard to find in North America, which is why people don't have those that often here.
I only recently really found out a lot about mechanical keyboards. I've read a ton of forum postings and a goodly amount of intro guides. Mechanical keyboards aren't really something that you can discuss without having at least a knowledge of some of the more common boards and knowing at least the three or four most common Cherry MX switches (but I'm sure GeekHack folks would be horrified if you didn't acknowledge Alps, Buckling Springs, etc.; Cherries are usually what's most relevant on TL and for SC2). I'm not trying to look like an elitist dick (after all, I don't have a mechanical keyboard and still a relative journeyman), but I'd strongly suggest running a Google search or two before posting here, especially considering that the whole topic was about telling someone what switch is the best.
Sorry, for going a little offtopic but for anyone who has already bought a FILCO from elitekeyboards. Do you know how to track the shipment? Do I just go onto the USPS site and enter into the code I was given? Currently it just says "there is no record of this item". I know the keyboard I ordered was out of stock so it would be backordered but is there another way to see if/when it will be coming?
On November 03 2010 18:43 omgCRAZY wrote: Sorry, for going a little offtopic but for anyone who has already bought a FILCO from elitekeyboards. Do you know how to track the shipment? Do I just go onto the USPS site and enter into the code I was given? Currently it just says "there is no record of this item". I know the keyboard I ordered was out of stock so it would be backordered but is there another way to see if/when it will be coming?
Thanks
The code will work eventually USPS is a little slow and if you read the USPS page you got it explains why it doesnt show up right away even though you have the code.
Why Are You Receiving This Message?
1. Event information may not be available if your item was mailed recently. Please try again later.
2. The number was entered incorrectly. Be sure to enter all of the letters and numbers as they appear on your mailing label or receipt.
EDIT: My tracking number didnt work yesterday but it works today.
On November 02 2010 11:08 SirDuke wrote: im tryin to figure out if i should try to find a mech with reds in it. i know if i had to choose i go for browns but ive heard a lot of up talk on the reds. idc if they're more expensive or harder to find, i just wanna know if the reds are really that much better or what the difference is? thx
EDIT: Also, Does anybody know where to get Filco boards that arent painted black? Im looking for somethin unique.Thx
That same keyboard is available in white too, you could contact the seller and ask. Obvious problem is shipping is $$$$$$. If you go to China or Taiwan though I hear these have insanely good prices. Should be same quality as Filco but cheaper. Although it should come out similar with shipping + cost if you get it there.
If I were getting a keyboard with Cherry switches I like that one the best, but I think I'll get a Unicomp.
On November 02 2010 11:08 SirDuke wrote: im tryin to figure out if i should try to find a mech with reds in it. i know if i had to choose i go for browns but ive heard a lot of up talk on the reds. idc if they're more expensive or harder to find, i just wanna know if the reds are really that much better or what the difference is? thx
EDIT: Also, Does anybody know where to get Filco boards that arent painted black? Im looking for somethin unique.Thx
They also have a white filco, but only with the MX Black switches, the brown switches are out of stock, it seems the white filcos were a one of a kind thing so probably won't get more in stock.
What's wrong with 10 keyless, not everyone uses a num pad, and some people but it separately i find not having a num pad allows me to to adjust where my keyboard and mouse are more freely because i don't need to accommodate for extra space.
On November 04 2010 12:27 Karthane wrote: Go for browns, I have a regular Majestouch with browns and they are amazing. Very clicky feel, but not too loud like the blues are.
Just to clarify for everyone who doesn't know, browns have the same tactile bump that blues do but without the extra, high-pitched "click" you probably associate with a typewriter. They are also ~5g lighter to press down.
after lookin at it for a while i think i might go for the white tenkeyless.. anyone know where to get a black keyset for a filco tenkeyless? and thx for everyones help!!
On November 04 2010 13:42 SirDuke wrote: after lookin at it for a while i think i might go for the white tenkeyless.. anyone know where to get a black keyset for a filco tenkeyless? and thx for everyones help!!
On November 04 2010 13:42 SirDuke wrote: after lookin at it for a while i think i might go for the white tenkeyless.. anyone know where to get a black keyset for a filco tenkeyless? and thx for everyones help!!
elitekeyboards sells blank keycaps, but theyre sold out. keyboardco.com has them, although i dont know how much shipping would be if youre in the us
if youre not looking for otaku, i dont think you can buy a keyset without just buying another keyboard :/
So, my regular German FILCO with MX browns just arrived with TNT (in less than 24 hours after ordering from http://www.keyboardco.com/, all the way from the UK to Slovenia!!). I also ordered the red ESC and the new red WASD keys, but I just can't get the WASD to fit properly (they stick out by a milimeter or so no matter how hard I press them in), so that at least was a waste. As to the actual typing, the feeling is definitely a novelty, but already growing on me. Repeated keypresses register faster (which is good for erasing whole lines), and the sound is calming. Still louder than the archaic rubber keyboard I had before, though, which makes me wonder how roaringly loud the blues must be.
If anyone has any advice on how to make the red WASD replacements fit, please share it.
Here's two pics I just took, notice the excavated keys on the old clacker (fingernails!). It was about time for a new one anyway, I'd say.
On November 04 2010 23:20 alpskomleko wrote: So, my regular German FILCO with MX browns just arrived with TNT (in less than 24 hours after ordering from http://www.keyboardco.com/, all the way from the UK to Slovenia!!). I also ordered the red ESC and the new red WASD keys, but I just can't get the WASD to fit properly (they stick out by a milimeter or so no matter how hard I press them in), so that at least was a waste. As to the actual typing, the feeling is definitely a novelty, but already growing on me. Repeated keypresses register faster (which is good for erasing whole lines), and the sound is calming. Still louder than the archaic rubber keyboard I had before, though, which makes me wonder how roaringly loud the blues must be.
If anyone has any advice on how to make the red WASD replacements fit, please share it.
Here's two pics I just took, notice the excavated keys on the old clacker (fingernails!). It was about time for a new one anyway, I'd say.
Im pretty sure that's how they're supposed to be "sticking out" because those are the main keys for FPS
I can't wait to get my 87 keyless FILCO with cherry browns! Will let everyone know my thoughts on it (so sick of typing and using the microsoft 4000 wireless mouse, such junk).....
On November 04 2010 12:27 Karthane wrote: Go for browns, I have a regular Majestouch with browns and they are amazing. Very clicky feel, but not too loud like the blues are.
Just to clarify for everyone who doesn't know, browns have the same tactile bump that blues do but without the extra, high-pitched "click" you probably associate with a typewriter. They are also ~5g lighter to press down.
Blurs are 5g lighter than browns, not the other way around.
So frustrating that the UK 105key Filco (blue switch) is out of stock until late december, I had the American one on order by mistake until I realized, it wouldn't be a problem but I couldn't deal with a small enter key.
Guess it'll just have to wait and end up as a christmas present instead!
On November 05 2010 05:18 FragKrag wrote: IIRC Blues are 50g and Browns are 45g...
I'll just quote the reply I got from thekeyboardco when I asked why the MX browns were declared as 55g on their site:
me: I'm also a bit confused about the required key force your website mentions for the browns (55g); isn't the force of the browns more along the line of 45g?
their answer: About the switch, it is standard MX Brown. Someone else spotted this recently. I think there are two figures, one known as activation force and one known as peak force and there is some 10g difference.
Don't sweat about it, in either case the keys are surprisingly easy to actuate and it's quite a feat to not have them bottom out constantly.
On November 05 2010 08:53 FragKrag wrote: I've never actually used a Brown, but the Cherry MX Blues were already pretty light imo.
I've heard people who are new to them saying that they can tell, but, at the same time, I imagine that you have to know what to look for to really tell. I mean, people can't tell the difference between different types of crappier keyboards. I know that I've only recently started noticing differences between some of the mid-level ones that I've tried.
I had to chance to test the Black switches (steeleries 7g) yesterday.
I played Bad Company 2 (fps) and SC2 with it. I can say that for FPS the linear force was really nice since you always have some buttons (WASD) pressed and switch fast between keypresses in WASD.
However I thought they are a bit awkard for sc2. I missed the tactile feedback (is that what the "bump" is called?!). It felt awkard when you press keys alot instead of having them pressed all the time (WASD in FPS).
But overall damn mechanical keyboards feel a lot more quality.
On November 06 2010 00:49 papaz wrote: I had to chance to test the Black switches (steeleries 7g) yesterday.
I played Bad Company 2 (fps) and SC2 with it. I can say that for FPS the linear force was really nice since you always have some buttons (WASD) pressed and switch fast between keypresses in WASD.
However I thought they are a bit awkard for sc2. I missed the tactile feedback (is that what the "bump" is called?!). It felt awkard when you press keys alot instead of having them pressed all the time (WASD in FPS).
But overall damn mechanical keyboards feel a lot more quality.
So if you had to pick just one, brown or black switches, for fps and rts, which would you take?
On November 06 2010 00:49 papaz wrote: I had to chance to test the Black switches (steeleries 7g) yesterday.
I played Bad Company 2 (fps) and SC2 with it. I can say that for FPS the linear force was really nice since you always have some buttons (WASD) pressed and switch fast between keypresses in WASD.
However I thought they are a bit awkard for sc2. I missed the tactile feedback (is that what the "bump" is called?!). It felt awkard when you press keys alot instead of having them pressed all the time (WASD in FPS).
But overall damn mechanical keyboards feel a lot more quality.
So if you had to pick just one, brown or black switches, for fps and rts, which would you take?
I would definetely take brown (and I am taking brown =) ). Brown works just fine for FPS, no problem there. Brown imo is definetely "better" for rts. And by "better" I mean it's good to have the key giving you feedback that it has been pressed since you don't, like FPS, keep the key pressed down all the time (WASD) but instead need to press one key and quickly jump to the other one.
I felt it was a bit annoying to not have the feedback when I played SC2. I felt the need to press hard just so that I bottom the key and know that it was pressed.
In the end like all other posters say, it's just a matter of preference. But I do believe that it's more intuitive for people to get the response back from the key saying it has been pressed, hence brown.
On November 06 2010 00:49 papaz wrote: I had to chance to test the Black switches (steeleries 7g) yesterday.
I played Bad Company 2 (fps) and SC2 with it. I can say that for FPS the linear force was really nice since you always have some buttons (WASD) pressed and switch fast between keypresses in WASD.
However I thought they are a bit awkard for sc2. I missed the tactile feedback (is that what the "bump" is called?!). It felt awkard when you press keys alot instead of having them pressed all the time (WASD in FPS).
But overall damn mechanical keyboards feel a lot more quality.
So if you had to pick just one, brown or black switches, for fps and rts, which would you take?
I would definetely take brown (and I am taking brown =) ). Brown works just fine for FPS, no problem there. Brown imo is definetely "better" for rts. And by "better" I mean it's good to have the key giving you feedback that it has been pressed since you don't, like FPS, keep the key pressed down all the time (WASD) but instead need to press one key and quickly jump to the other one.
I felt it was a bit annoying to not have the feedback when I played SC2. I felt the need to press hard just so that I bottom the key and know that it was pressed.
In the end like all other posters say, it's just a matter of preference. But I do believe that it's more intuitive for people to get the response back from the key saying it has been pressed, hence brown.
Thank you very much, testimonies like that are what everybody wants.
Black switches really defeat the purpose of mechanical switches imho. Relatively high activation force and no tactile feedback doesn't make sense to me at all :/
On November 06 2010 04:17 FragKrag wrote: Black switches really defeat the purpose of mechanical switches imho. Relatively high activation force and no tactile feedback doesn't make sense to me at all :/
dont they still feel much more solid than rubber domes? ill try one out next time i go to a lan, unless no one brings a steeleries D: really my biggest gripe is the large l-shaped enter key. id like to know if i could buy the steelseries windows keys though~
i just got a daskeyboard ultimate silent (brown switches), mostly because the filco tenkeyless otakus are out of stock and probably wont come back for a very long time. loving it so far, havent given them a run through on an fps yet though.
I think that browns are the common consensus for people that are doing any gaming on top of normal typing. Purist typers can go for blues and someone who sticks to one type of game can find their perfect one (like blacks for FPS), but browns seem to be the ones that everyone likes and seem to do everything pretty well.
Again, yes, personal preference, etc. Example: BoxeR has blues in his keyboard. On the other hand, almost every other one I've seen from clips like those from Artosis (so mainly Koreans and all at GSL) show browns (Tester and at least four others just from half the vids since I didn't watch them all -- sorry that I can't remember other specific players, I'm really tired right now).
Disclaimer: after much research I've decided to get browns when I buy a new keyboard. Considering that, at least a few days ago, GeekHack had browns tied for the lead in their most current "favorite switch" poll, though, I'd say this is a very accurate conclusion.
I'm really thinking of switching over from my Razer Tarantula to the FILCO Majestouch Cherry MX Brown. Did anyone made this switch? How did it felt?
Anyways, I'll try typing a little on the Majestouch next week when I will go to the capital, if I buy it, I will let you guys know and post my review in this topic.
On November 06 2010 22:24 zeroISM wrote: I'm really thinking of switching over from my Razer Tarantula to the FILCO Majestouch Cherry MX Brown. Did anyone made this switch? How did it felt?
Anyways, I'll try typing a little on the Majestouch next week when I will go to the capital, if I buy it, I will let you guys know and post my review in this topic.
pretty much any mechanical keyboard fanboy will say that all of those $5 razer keyboards feel like mushy crap once you've used a mechanical.
except for the new razer blackwidow (which is actually amazingly priced at $80 for a mechanical with cherry blues) all gaming keyboards focus on looks and macro capabilities over a superior keystroke. and while im not saying razer/logitech/ms products are bad, they are overpriced simply by having the 'gaming' label and advertising.
I have no want or need for macro keys, which is one thing that lets me rule out most "gaming keyboards." The one thing that I don't like about the Filco is that it doesn't have any USB ports on it, which would help on my USB port-starved early 2008 MacBook Pro. I'm looking at getting a desktop PC soon, though, so that hopefully won't be much of a problem for very longer.
I'm really hoping that Steelseries branches out from the black switches, since they also have a great price point and I would like to try the raised key style over the flatter Razer boards. Get some brown switches, please, Razer and Steelseries!
I just got my majestouch with brown switches, and it feels amazing. When you first start using it it may feel a bit off but now it completely outclasses rubber-dome keyboards. Seal of approval here.
Got this awesome chinese mechanical with cherry blacks yesterday in beijing for 500 RMB ($70) It's the exact same as the Steelseries compact keyboard but much cheaper. I pulled the black keys off my cherry keyboard and now i have black and white chequered like my dt-35 except on cherry blacks!!! my favorite keyboard yet.
On November 07 2010 14:07 iEchoic wrote: I just got my majestouch with brown switches, and it feels amazing. When you first start using it it may feel a bit off but now it completely outclasses rubber-dome keyboards. Seal of approval here.
I can't wait to get mine. Still no update from USPS! Its been like 2 and a half weeks! Any chance they forgot about me?
After reading all these threads about how much better it is than a rubber membrane keyboard on typing and RTS games, I took a deep breath and backordered a Filco Cherry MX Brown keyboard.
I hope it's worth it guys or I'll be $135 down the drain.
On November 08 2010 15:10 Babaganoush wrote: After reading all these threads about how much better it is than a rubber membrane keyboard on typing and RTS games, I took a deep breath and backordered a Filco Cherry MX Brown keyboard.
I hope it's worth it guys or I'll be $135 down the drain.
Let us know how it goes! I'm in rather the same boat as you, but I'm waiting for another month or so before getting it (partially so I don't feel too bad about having just bought my $75 Apple Wireless Keyboard around 50 days ago, lol).
On November 08 2010 15:10 Babaganoush wrote: After reading all these threads about how much better it is than a rubber membrane keyboard on typing and RTS games, I took a deep breath and backordered a Filco Cherry MX Brown keyboard.
I hope it's worth it guys or I'll be $135 down the drain.
I don't think anyone yet that's bought one based on this forum's recommendation has regretted it. You'll definitely be pleasantly surprised when it arrives.
I just ordered a Filco Majestouch with Cherry MX Brown switches. I'm not sure if this would be of any interest to you guys but you can get Filco keyboards for considerably lower prices on the Japanese amazon site (amazon.co.jp) and they do ship internationally, although I'm not sure at what cost. For reference though a standard Majestouch is under $100 USD and a tenkeyless is $102 USD even with the absolutely abysmal exchange rate. Links:
And if you want to be really cool you can actually get one with Japanese kana for even less. **Note: I don't recommend this if you're just trying to be cool, the location of the apostrophe key will annoy you to no end.
If anyone is interested and needs help using the japanese site just send me a message.
edit: also found this thing with the infamous Cherry Red switches. You can also get the Majestouches with black switches but I can only seem to find the tenkeyless version with blue switches.
On November 08 2010 15:10 Babaganoush wrote: After reading all these threads about how much better it is than a rubber membrane keyboard on typing and RTS games, I took a deep breath and backordered a Filco Cherry MX Brown keyboard.
I hope it's worth it guys or I'll be $135 down the drain.
You wont regret it. The quality feeling is amazing really.
After I switched to mechanical keyboard I can't believe I have had so many plastic/membran crap keyboards.
It's like going from Skoda car to Ferrari =)
Not that it makes you a better driver but it sure as hell feels better :D
On November 09 2010 17:59 cmp wrote: I just ordered a Filco Majestouch with Cherry MX Brown switches. I'm not sure if this would be of any interest to you guys but you can get Filco keyboards for considerably lower prices on the Japanese amazon site (amazon.co.jp) and they do ship internationally, although I'm not sure at what cost. For reference though a standard Majestouch is under $100 USD and a tenkeyless is $102 USD even with the absolutely abysmal exchange rate. Links:
And if you want to be really cool you can actually get one with Japanese kana for even less. **Note: I don't recommend this if you're just trying to be cool, the location of the apostrophe key will annoy you to no end.
If anyone is interested and needs help using the japanese site just send me a message.
edit: also found this thing with the infamous Cherry Red switches. You can also get the Majestouches with black switches but I can only seem to find the tenkeyless version with blue switches.
On November 09 2010 17:59 cmp wrote: I just ordered a Filco Majestouch with Cherry MX Brown switches. I'm not sure if this would be of any interest to you guys but you can get Filco keyboards for considerably lower prices on the Japanese amazon site (amazon.co.jp) and they do ship internationally, although I'm not sure at what cost. For reference though a standard Majestouch is under $100 USD and a tenkeyless is $102 USD even with the absolutely abysmal exchange rate. Links:
And if you want to be really cool you can actually get one with Japanese kana for even less. **Note: I don't recommend this if you're just trying to be cool, the location of the apostrophe key will annoy you to no end.
If anyone is interested and needs help using the japanese site just send me a message.
edit: also found this thing with the infamous Cherry Red switches. You can also get the Majestouches with black switches but I can only seem to find the tenkeyless version with blue switches.
My apologies, I just tried checking out with an international address and it turns out you're right. I guess I could be the middle man if someone is really hard up for one but it'd mean more waiting and probably higher shipping cost.
On November 08 2010 09:13 hkfosho wrote: Here's a Pink Filco for those interested in how the colour looks like (cherry browns btw) I took the pics with a phone so it's a bit blurry
where did you buy your pink filco from? and the lights seem pretty bright or is it the just the pic?
On November 09 2010 17:59 cmp wrote: I just ordered a Filco Majestouch with Cherry MX Brown switches. I'm not sure if this would be of any interest to you guys but you can get Filco keyboards for considerably lower prices on the Japanese amazon site (amazon.co.jp) and they do ship internationally, although I'm not sure at what cost. For reference though a standard Majestouch is under $100 USD and a tenkeyless is $102 USD even with the absolutely abysmal exchange rate. Links:
And if you want to be really cool you can actually get one with Japanese kana for even less. **Note: I don't recommend this if you're just trying to be cool, the location of the apostrophe key will annoy you to no end.
If anyone is interested and needs help using the japanese site just send me a message.
edit: also found this thing with the infamous Cherry Red switches. You can also get the Majestouches with black switches but I can only seem to find the tenkeyless version with blue switches.
My apologies, I just tried checking out with an international address and it turns out you're right. I guess I could be the middle man if someone is really hard up for one but it'd mean more waiting and probably higher shipping cost.
From what I see, the shipping to the US would be around $37.
Depends on which keys. There are some combinations where you can only press two, but others where you can press six or more. Because of the way the key matrix works, you can probably press an unlimited number of keys as long as they were in the same row*, but you're likely to run into blocking when you're holding three keys that form the corners of a rectangle on the key matrix (read this to understand why and what combinations might cause problems).
Keyboards are classified by the minimum though, and almost all keyboards that aren't NKRO are considered two-key-rollover.
None of this will affect RTS play, but if you play FPS games at a high level it's probably a good idea to splurge for NKRO.
* Of course, you are limited to 6 plus 4 modifier keys under USB. PS/2 is required for more than that, although there are very, very few situations where you need to be holding more than 6+4.
The non-NKRO Filco is, most likely, going to hit near the top of that 6+4 range (I actually thought it was 2, not 4, but CaptainFwiffo seems really knowledgable about this stuff, so go with him). You would probably be okay playing a FPS with it, but it's always good to look it up to be sure. At the very least, considering Filco's general quality and how it's held in such reverence (I haven't heard about any ghosting problems), you shouldn't have to worry.
On November 10 2010 23:40 AnodyneSea wrote: I just got my majestouch filo with blacks and it feels great, it does however hurt my hand after a short while of playing since i have over 200+ apm.
this is pretty much why blacks are considered to be optimized for "gaming", and by that they really mean fps, since rts gaming has almost the same strain as typing. its just only on one hand :O
if wherever you got your filco doesnt have a return policy, im pretty sure it would be pretty easy to sell over at geekhack.org if you find the blacks to be too hard after a while.
On November 10 2010 23:40 AnodyneSea wrote: I just got my majestouch filo with blacks and it feels great, it does however hurt my hand after a short while of playing since i have over 200+ apm.
this is pretty much why blacks are considered to be optimized for "gaming", and by that they really mean fps, since rts gaming has almost the same strain as typing. its just only on one hand :O
if wherever you got your filco doesnt have a return policy, im pretty sure it would be pretty easy to sell over at geekhack.org if you find the blacks to be too hard after a while.
I have thought about selling it and getting browns, but I'm hoping this will only strengthen my left hand for long games so that I'll be able to keep my 200 apm on another keyboard. Might serve as a useful training tool, i dunno just a thought.
That's like training with weights so you can be a better runner. Just hop into it.
This is typed on Cherry Blue btw, feel great. It's more like pressing a switch than pecking at a key. Only a tad noisy, will get browns later down but this one was inexpensive :-)
Just got my Majestouch with Cherry Brown switches in today. The key pressure required is a little lower than what I expected (compared to my laptop with a gunked up keyboard) but after playing a few games on it I already can't go back to the laptop I was playing on before. I love it and the build quality seems excellent. Very hefty and solid, plus the minimalistic look is beautiful.
On November 15 2010 20:16 vol_ wrote: Anyone know where I can buy different colour keys without having to buy a whole new keyboard?
Some folk on geekhack.org are ordering replacement keysets from signature plastics. You could either jump on geekhack's next shipment or try giving signature plastics a ring. I'm not sure if they sell individual keysets, however.
On November 15 2010 20:16 vol_ wrote: Anyone know where I can buy different colour keys without having to buy a whole new keyboard?
Some folk on geekhack.org are ordering replacement keysets from signature plastics. You could either jump on geekhack's next shipment or try giving signature plastics a ring. I'm not sure if they sell individual keysets, however.
On November 15 2010 20:16 vol_ wrote: Anyone know where I can buy different colour keys without having to buy a whole new keyboard?
Some folk on geekhack.org are ordering replacement keysets from signature plastics. You could either jump on geekhack's next shipment or try giving signature plastics a ring. I'm not sure if they sell individual keysets, however.
It's tempting, but since I already busted a financial nut ordering my filco, I'll probably have to wait a while before I consider ordering custom keys for it.
Is it just me or did the prices of filcos go up? I'm not sure about the tenkeyless, but the 104 key ones, I'm pretty sure that the prices are higher than when I bought it a month ago.
Is it because the prices are actually going up, or he decided he could make more money because everyone suddenly started wanting one, and christmas is the prime time for these folks to purchase one of these.
On November 16 2010 15:53 Monoxide wrote: Is it because the prices are actually going up, or he decided he could make more money because everyone suddenly started wanting one, and christmas is the prime time for these folks to purchase one of these.
Could be both... I'd think it's more of a currency exchange though, if he does purchase these from Japan. If you check the USD/JPY, you can see that the USD has been dropping a lot compared to the yen.
A ~7% increase is justified though.
And those NKRO browns sold out fast!
I purchased a non-NKRO brown... it was just shipped out today. I wish it could arrive tomorrow.
Just got my Filcos in, I ordered a white one from Keyboardco.com since I wanted 1 for home (gaming) and one for work (Programmer). The white one had black switches and the black one has brown switches. I really enjoy typing on both of them, but it felt a little bit more solid on the brown switch, so I took that one to work. Since I had both a black and white one, I took the opportunity to mix up the keys a bit .
On November 16 2010 16:46 Erectum wrote: Little off topic but since for europe it's quite expensive to get a Filco does someone already tried the Razer black widow ?
The BlackWidow is still not out yet. Didnt find any Store to buy/order it. And Razer Homepage says 11/30 shipping. So, i don't know what is up with that Keyboard actually? Hmm.
But the 2 Videos on YouTube it looks nice, but damn the keys are so annoying loud.
On November 16 2010 16:46 Erectum wrote: Little off topic but since for europe it's quite expensive to get a Filco does someone already tried the Razer black widow ?
its 138.89 Euro when you are paying by PayPal (inc all payments around it)
On November 16 2010 16:46 Erectum wrote: Little off topic but since for europe it's quite expensive to get a Filco does someone already tried the Razer black widow ?
its 138.89 Euro when you are paying by PayPal (inc all payments around it)
Its even more if you wanna get a Filco with German Layout. Then its around 160 EUR. I love the Filcos, but TBH, thats to expensive for a Keyboard.
On November 16 2010 16:46 Erectum wrote: Little off topic but since for europe it's quite expensive to get a Filco does someone already tried the Razer black widow ?
The BlackWidow is still not out yet. Didnt find any Store to buy/order it. And Razer Homepage says 11/30 shipping. So, i don't know what is up with that Keyboard actually? Hmm.
But the 2 Videos on YouTube it looks nice, but damn the keys are so annoying loud.
A few people have their hands on the blackwidow already. Razer has sent out at least one shipment to folk who pre-ordered.
You can check out the blackwidow thread for more info and reviews:
I just got my Filco brown in today. It felt a bit weird typing at first but it's pretty good now. Definitely noiser than my G15, but I don't mind that at all. Also if you purchase from EKB, it states that a Red Esc key is included. I checked in my box and there wasn't one.
I didnt mind that either - just for people who really want that Red Esc key.
Edit: Never mind I did find it where the following poster said it. Thanks.
My red esc key was under one of the little compartments at the top of the box, where the ps2 adapter is lying on top. The one to the right actually and in a little plastic bag. Hope you find it.
On November 18 2010 06:08 Babaganoush wrote: I just got my Filco brown in today. It felt a bit weird typing at first but it's pretty good now. Definitely noiser than my G15, but I don't mind that at all. Also if you purchase from EKB, it states that a Red Esc key is included. I checked in my box and there wasn't one.
I didnt mind that either - just for people who really want that Red Esc key.
Edit: Never mind I did find it where the following poster said it. Thanks.
Errr im so jelous! After looking into mechanical keyboards i definitly want a heavy duty mechanical keyboard thats nice and small (tenkeyless) compared to my g15, grats on getting it. But i thought brown was suppose to be quite, and blue was the loud one.
And i hope when i order mine i get a red esc key, it looks cool
On November 18 2010 06:08 Babaganoush wrote: I just got my Filco brown in today. It felt a bit weird typing at first but it's pretty good now. Definitely noiser than my G15, but I don't mind that at all. Also if you purchase from EKB, it states that a Red Esc key is included. I checked in my box and there wasn't one.
I didnt mind that either - just for people who really want that Red Esc key.
Edit: Never mind I did find it where the following poster said it. Thanks.
Errr im so jelous! After looking into mechanical keyboards i definitly want a heavy duty mechanical keyboard thats nice and small (tenkeyless) compared to my g15, grats on getting it. But i thought brown was suppose to be quite, and blue was the loud one.
And i hope when i order mine i get a red esc key, it looks cool
It is quiet, it's just that pretty much any mechanical keyboard is likely to be louder than a membrane one just by virtue of the materials used: hitting a squishy pad versus a solid contact.
Just got mine with blues 2 days ago and now that I am used to it I can't imagine using anything else. I can't describe how great playing SC2 and typing feels.
I have a filco with brown switches. Does anyone NOT bottom out? the 45g actuation force or activation force (whatever its called) required to send the keystroke is so light that I have to type slower to avoid bottoming out. If I type normally I bottom out nearly all the time.
My point is that typing without bottoming out is very hard.
I got my Filco Browns a week ago and I bottom out a lot too. I don't think there's a way around it until you get used how light these keys are. I don't mind the sound it makes so it's not much of an issue for me.
The differences are subjective, so it depends on what you want.
Construction/quality of the keyboards is very similar, and they both use high-quality plate-mounted Cherry MX switches. The Steelseries only comes with black switches, so if you want brown or blue you'd have to go with the Filco. The key texture is different, but which is better is a matter of preference. There are some other cosmetic differences.
The Filco has a pretty standard layout, the Steelseries goes with a large enter key and smaller right-shift -- which is better depends on preference. The Filco is available in tenkeyless in addition to a standard 104-key layout. The Steelseries is only full-size. The Steelseries has no left side Windows key and instead has a function key for multimedia controls. The Filco does not have multimedia keys (although you could easily create software mapping for that).
Both keyboards are available with full-NKRO and include a PS/2 adapter. There is a less expensive version of the Filco without NKRO.
I got mine almost a month ago (i think) and i'm still bottoming out almost every keystroke. Maybe I'm just used to typing very hard, but i find its hard for me to not bottom out every keystroke that I am making. This is going to take a while to get used to...
Not bottoming out is not important. It doesn't hurt anything. Best not to think about it and just type relaxed. You'll gradually get used to the weight of the keys and bottom out less over time.
On November 19 2010 03:16 CaptainFwiffo wrote: The differences are subjective, so it depends on what you want.
Construction/quality of the keyboards is very similar, and they both use high-quality plate-mounted Cherry MX switches. The Steelseries only comes with black switches, so if you want brown or blue you'd have to go with the Filco. The key texture is different, but which is better is a matter of preference. There are some other cosmetic differences.
The Filco has a pretty standard layout, the Steelseries goes with a large enter key and smaller right-shift -- which is better depends on preference. The Filco is available in tenkeyless in addition to a standard 104-key layout. The Steelseries is only full-size. The Steelseries has no left side Windows key and instead has a function key for multimedia controls. The Filco does not have multimedia keys (although you could easily create software mapping for that).
Both keyboards are available with full-NKRO and include a PS/2 adapter. There is a less expensive version of the Filco without NKRO.
Also / resides underneath return instead of above it on like most standard keyboards. This was a dealbreaker for me (as a programmer) so I ended up returning my 6gv2.
The noise issue is exaggerated. All mechanical keyboards are noisier than rubber dome boards, but it's not like they sound like a typewriter or anything, and even cherry blues are not as loud as old buckling spring keyboards like a Model M. It also depends on your typing style. If you really hammer on them, they're louder.
I've read a lot of the thread and some of the other links to help learn what a mechanical keyboard is.
It sounds like I'd want one with brown switches. I like keys to click and then spring back, and still have an audible report. So, if I can feel that I've pressed the key and I can hear it, I'm happy.
On November 23 2010 05:31 LazyMacro wrote: I've read a lot of the thread and some of the other links to help learn what a mechanical keyboard is.
It sounds like I'd want one with brown switches. I like keys to click and then spring back, and still have an audible report. So, if I can feel that I've pressed the key and I can hear it, I'm happy.
This is what the brown keys do, right?
go back to geekhack.org and look again
brown switches do not have an audible report at actuation, the sound you hear with brown switches is you bottoming out (they keycap hitting the plastic at the bottom of the stroke, you can avoid it if you dont press the key all the way down). you're looking for blues, or old school buckling springs, or some less common switches.
Yeah, I literally just started taking notes because I kept getting so damn confused.
So the Tactile Click/Blue switches make an audible click, and have tactile feedback. The Tactile Touch/Brown are quieter, but still have tactile feedback. The Linear Force/Black don't have either. Eww.
Hm, now I guess I just have to decide between the Blue or Brown. :\
I've considered preordering the Razer BlackWidow Ultimate, but lately I've been underwhelmed by their stuff. (I had to return an Imperator because it couldn't track on the z-axis. My Lycosa is a bit too easy to...lock up. My DeathAdder, which I love, don't get me wrong, gets dirty easily.)
I think I'll get a Tenkeyless and try a new mouse and a new mousepad.
Anyone in Europe looking for their first mecha should simply get a Cherry G80-3000 with blue switches (black also available). This can be gotten for below €50!! If you like it you can always branch out from there but after it, laying down the €140 for a brown FILCO won't feel much less severe since you already know what you pay for. Or maybe you like the clickyness of the blues and have suddenly got an awesome, inexpensive mecha keyboard :-D
P.S:. I want to go for a German tenkeyless brown Filco when they become available in spring but so far I'm loving my Cherry blues. Just a tad too noisy. Still 50 Euro very well spent :-)
Just received my FILCO Tenkeyless Cherry Brown's and I'm loving the feel of the keyboard. The smaller size is awesome, as I can keep my mouse closer to my body and I have a more natural feel in holding my left hand over the left side of the board. The Cherry Brown's are awesome!!
On November 23 2010 01:52 Erectum wrote: Maybe someone already answered.
I'am looking for a filco but i am quite afraid of the noise.
Does the borwn switches make as much noise then the blue or they are less noisy ?
I feel that there is variation in noise depending on how you type.
Me, I bottom out HARD. And the noise is audible to the person I am talking to via phone. With the way I type, the filco with browns is louder than the membrane. The pitch of a brown switch is a little lower, with a thunk thunk, while blue is higher and more annoying, cha click cha click.
My ideal switch would be a filco blue, without the noise. But my brown is ok, though it requires slightly less force to actuate.
Got my Filco brown NKRO yesterday, then played with a Steelseries 7g and Razer Blackwidow at Fry's today. Honestly, in terms of switch feel alone, all three are awesome. You won't be disappointed with any of them (all will likely take some time to get used to).
I like the standard layout on the Filco (not a fan of the large Enter key and smaller backspace on the Steelseries). On the other hand, the keycaps on the Steelseries felt a bit nicer to me. Meh, give and take, they are all great keyboards.
So I'm thinking about getting a Filco or the Razer BlackWidow. I've been reading reviews for some time now, but I've never actually touched a keyboard with mechanik switches. First question to all you german TL users out there: Do you know any big electronic sellers that exhibit any keyboard with blue or brown switches? Second but the more important one: Since I didn't find any information on that, are there Majestouch keyboards with a german layout? Some posts above someone said there'll be a Tenkeyless in spring, but I can't find more info an anything ^^. Same for the Blackwidow. It'd kinda suck to learn the new layout and I kinda need ß Ä Ö Ü and all that german jazz
I have decided that my next buy will definitely be a mechanical keyboard and after spending a lot of time here, Geekhack and OC have narrowed down the list to a few options.
Filco Majestouch Tactile Touch (Brown Switches) - My first choice will be this one but I am seriously wondering whether the purchase will be worth it. I am serious about being a semipro where I can take part in weekly tournaments and all that jazz. So, I think it will be good but the cost of the keyboard plus shipping will kill my pockets. I looked at the Tenkeyless version hoping that it would cheaper but it is not that cheap.
I also heard somewhere that there are places that sell the Filcos without NKRO and that they're considerably cheaper than those with NKRO. Can anyone confirm or deny this? I emailed EliteKeyboards regarding this but haven't gotten any response yet.
Steelseries 6gV2 - If my mind tells me that the Filcos are too expensive for me, then I will most definitely be buying this one. The major cons on this one are the non-standard layout which I definitely can get used it and that in all reviews it is mentioned that the Black Linear Force switches are not the best for RTS Gaming/Typing whereas they are best suited for FPS. Random searching also led me to places where they said typing for longer periods of time can be difficult on the Black switches or is it absolute bollocks.
If anybody can tell me whether for a general person, I wouldn't notice much difference between the Blacks and the Browns, my opinion could be swayed towards this one as it is considerably cheaper compared to the Filcos.
Razer Blackwidow - This is my last choice and one I have out of necessity. The Blues I feel destory anyone's ears who are even close. And I saw Blackwidow videos and I definitely did not like the amount of noise they made. So, yeah I will only go with the Blackwidow or similar Cherry Blue switches only if I have no other choice.
So, what do you guys feel - no major difference between the 6gV2 and Filco Browns or is there a significant difference that justifies the considerably higher price tag?
Steelseries 6gV2 - If my mind tells me that the Filcos are too expensive for me, then I will most definitely be buying this one. The major cons on this one are the non-standard layout which I definitely can get used it and that in all reviews it is mentioned that the Black Linear Force switches are not the best for RTS Gaming/Typing whereas they are best suited for FPS. Random searching also led me to places where they said typing for longer periods of time can be difficult on the Black switches or is it absolute bollocks.
As someone who recently got a SteelSeries 6gV2 I can tell you from personal experience that the blacks will feel tough at first, but after a day or so you really do get used to them. I've typed a few papers for class on this keyboard and it's not as tiring as people like to make it out to be.
Ya honestly, I don't think the black are as tough as people make it out to be. Can you go to a local store to try one out? if you can I'd definately do that before buying it just to see whether the switches put a strain on your fingers (just because they hurt someone else doesn't mean it'll hurt you). I noticed that elitekeyboards removed all their keyboards from their page so they might be having some shipping issues or ordering issues from China. Don't really worry too much on which switch is the "best", focus more on which switch feels the best for you to type on.
Thanks for the responses guys! The problem here is that you cannot go to stores and actually test out keyboards. They are just packed and sold to you and that has always been the case here. I would guess if I can get my hands on the Tenkeyless keyboard without NKRO, I can strike a great deal on the Filco ones, otherwise my best bet is the SS 6gV2 and it will have to a blind purchase unfortunately. Your thoughts on the Black keys definitely help a lot. I know one thing for sure, I am not buying the Cherry blue ones, the noise is definitely not to my linking for sure.
On November 30 2010 17:35 BlazingInferno wrote: Thanks for the responses guys! The problem here is that you cannot go to stores and actually test out keyboards. They are just packed and sold to you and that has always been the case here. I would guess if I can get my hands on the Tenkeyless keyboard without NKRO, I can strike a great deal on the Filco ones, otherwise my best bet is the SS 6gV2 and it will have to a blind purchase unfortunately. Your thoughts on the Black keys definitely help a lot. I know one thing for sure, I am not buying the Cherry blue ones, the noise is definitely not to my linking for sure.
The Filco tenkeyless ONLY comes in NKRO, which is why it is so expensive. The non NKRO full-sized Filco is around $115 when it's in stock.
I own the Filco brown and I tried both the Steelseries and the Blackwidow at the store yesterday and both felt fantastic (although the shiny finish on the 'widow is a total dealbreaker IMO).
You can't go wrong with ANY mechanical keyboard. Actually, now that I've had experience on the three primary switch types, I'd worry more about price, features, looks, etc. All feel great.
So, unless you are super-specific about definitely wanting the brown ones and having a specific type of feel and specific bottoming out area, my guess from what you (and most others for that matter) say is that any mechanical keyboard is good in general. Thanks for the feedback and geekhack link also, it helped tons.
On November 30 2010 03:45 xlep wrote: So I'm thinking about getting a Filco or the Razer BlackWidow. I've been reading reviews for some time now, but I've never actually touched a keyboard with mechanik switches. First question to all you german TL users out there: Do you know any big electronic sellers that exhibit any keyboard with blue or brown switches? Second but the more important one: Since I didn't find any information on that, are there Majestouch keyboards with a german layout? Some posts above someone said there'll be a Tenkeyless in spring, but I can't find more info an anything ^^. Same for the Blackwidow. It'd kinda suck to learn the new layout and I kinda need ß Ä Ö Ü and all that german jazz
posted this in another thread but I realized now it more suitable here
Those still interested in good mechs http://global.pchome.com.tw/ is having a sale and you can get some good duckys (very similar build to filcos) with brown black or blue cherry key switches
note I used google chrome's translator made the transaction flawless
Mine will be here this week ^^ checkout geekhack for more info great community
They are linear like black switches. That means you don't feel any change in the key's resistance for the point where it is activated. This is being recommended for FPS players, but for me a daily dose of Quake (quakeworld to be precise) felt as important as food a few years back, and I really don't see the point in the linear switches. Why would I not want to feel something in my fingers when the key is being activated and only see it on my screen?
The blue switch keyboard I have now is by the way perfect and has that click and the feel in the fingers at exactly the point where the key sends its signal. With membrane keyboards I used, there would be a point where the resistance of the keys would fall off because the rubber dome of the key collapsed, but this didn't mean that the key also activates. That's the best feature of my Cherry switch keyboard: every key feels exactly the same, and if a key produces the "click", the resistance in the fingers falls away a little and the key will have produced a character. There's no possibility for a typing error from the hardware angle.
The graph for actuation force on the page you linked to, doesn't show how good the keyboard here works: it's 100 % impossible to produce the key's "click" without the key switch also actuating (and the other way around, too), so the points in the graph for "tactile feel" and "operating position" are linked despite them drawn in different positions.
They are linear like black switches. That means you don't feel any change in the key's resistance for the point where it is activated. This is being recommended for FPS players, but for me a daily dose of Quake (quakeworld to be precise) felt as important as food a few years back, and I really don't see the point in the linear switches. Why would I not want to feel something in my fingers when the key is being activated and only see it on my screen?
The blue switch keyboard I have now is by the way perfect and has that click and the feel in the fingers at exactly the point where the key sends its signal. With membrane keyboards I used, there would be a point where the resistance of the keys would fall off because the rubber dome of the key collapsed, but this didn't mean that the key also activates. That's the best feature of my Cherry switch keyboard: every key feels exactly the same, and if a key produces the "click", the resistance in the fingers falls away a little and the key will have produced a character. There's no possibility for a typing error from the hardware angle.
The graph for actuation force on the page you linked to, doesn't show how good the keyboard here works: it's 100 % impossible to produce the key's "click" without the key switch also actuating (and the other way around, too), so the points in the graph for "tactile feel" and "operating position" are linked despite them drawn in different positions.
I'm glad that Cherry MX Blue works for you.
Now back to Cherry MX Red. Who's tried them that prefers Browns over Blues? What make/model/manufacturer was it? Where'd you get it?
They are linear like black switches. That means you don't feel any change in the key's resistance for the point where it is activated. This is being recommended for FPS players, but for me a daily dose of Quake (quakeworld to be precise) felt as important as food a few years back, and I really don't see the point in the linear switches. Why would I not want to feel something in my fingers when the key is being activated and only see it on my screen?
The blue switch keyboard I have now is by the way perfect and has that click and the feel in the fingers at exactly the point where the key sends its signal. With membrane keyboards I used, there would be a point where the resistance of the keys would fall off because the rubber dome of the key collapsed, but this didn't mean that the key also activates. That's the best feature of my Cherry switch keyboard: every key feels exactly the same, and if a key produces the "click", the resistance in the fingers falls away a little and the key will have produced a character. There's no possibility for a typing error from the hardware angle.
The graph for actuation force on the page you linked to, doesn't show how good the keyboard here works: it's 100 % impossible to produce the key's "click" without the key switch also actuating (and the other way around, too), so the points in the graph for "tactile feel" and "operating position" are linked despite them drawn in different positions.
I'm glad that Cherry MX Blue works for you.
Now back to Cherry MX Red. Who's tried them that prefers Browns over Blues? What make/model/manufacturer was it? Where'd you get it?
I'm sorry I got into a rambling mood there. I should have stopped after the first paragraph. The point of that first paragraph was that I honestly thought you missed the fact that there's no physical feedback for the actuation and reset points in the red switches. Also the recommendation for gamers is from the geekhack.org guys and seemed like hearsay coming from them, because they are not actually hardcore Quake, CS, CoD, UT (etc.) gamers. They are keyboard enthusiasts and are simply interested in typing and never seem to choose linear switches for themselves.
I have access to blue and black switch keyboards and feel quite a bit lost and uncomfortable at the black switch keyboard because of the missing tactile feel. My opinion of the red switch won't be better.
About where to get the red switches: from lurking on the geekhack.org forums over the years, I only remember reports of Cherry G80-3xxx (I don't remember the exact number, but it wasn't 3000) keyboards for the Japanese market and other products from Hongkong or China. There was some Hongkong online shop with a variety of Cherry stuff and worldwide shipping.
Those still interested in good mechs http://global.pchome.com.tw/ is having a sale and you can get some good duckys (very similar build to filcos) with brown black or blue cherry key switches
note I used google chrome's translator made the transaction flawless
Mine will be here this week ^^ checkout geekhack for more info great community
Thanks for that link. It just made my day. However, I would like to really know what you feel about the Duckys once you get your hands on them. Since they cost significantly lower than the Filcos, I would imagine there should be some difference that matters. Whether it is a design decision that makes the Filcos better or merely something cosmetic that would matter only for purists. If someone who has their hands on a Ducky (since Google search did not yield me great results) can tell me what the differences are, I would be grateful for that.
You'll find it almost impossible to find a board with red switches for sale to the US. Atleast that's what I've always read from geekhack and some other places. From what I hear unless you have someone from Japan that can buy a keyboard with red switches and then ship it for you, you're not going to get it. You're better off just deciding between brown/blue/blacks.
They are linear like black switches. That means you don't feel any change in the key's resistance for the point where it is activated. This is being recommended for FPS players, but for me a daily dose of Quake (quakeworld to be precise) felt as important as food a few years back, and I really don't see the point in the linear switches. Why would I not want to feel something in my fingers when the key is being activated and only see it on my screen?
The blue switch keyboard I have now is by the way perfect and has that click and the feel in the fingers at exactly the point where the key sends its signal. With membrane keyboards I used, there would be a point where the resistance of the keys would fall off because the rubber dome of the key collapsed, but this didn't mean that the key also activates. That's the best feature of my Cherry switch keyboard: every key feels exactly the same, and if a key produces the "click", the resistance in the fingers falls away a little and the key will have produced a character. There's no possibility for a typing error from the hardware angle.
The graph for actuation force on the page you linked to, doesn't show how good the keyboard here works: it's 100 % impossible to produce the key's "click" without the key switch also actuating (and the other way around, too), so the points in the graph for "tactile feel" and "operating position" are linked despite them drawn in different positions.
I'm glad that Cherry MX Blue works for you.
Now back to Cherry MX Red. Who's tried them that prefers Browns over Blues? What make/model/manufacturer was it? Where'd you get it?
I'm sorry I got into a rambling mood there. I should have stopped after the first paragraph. The point of that first paragraph was that I honestly thought you missed the fact that there's no physical feedback for the actuation and reset points in the red switches. Also the recommendation for gamers is from the geekhack.org guys and seemed like hearsay coming from them, because they are not actually hardcore Quake, CS, CoD, UT (etc.) gamers. They are keyboard enthusiasts and are simply interested in typing and never seem to choose linear switches for themselves.
I have access to blue and black switch keyboards and feel quite a bit lost and uncomfortable at the black switch keyboard because of the missing tactile feel. My opinion of the red switch won't be better.
About where to get the red switches: from lurking on the geekhack.org forums over the years, I only remember reports of Cherry G80-3xxx (I don't remember the exact number, but it wasn't 3000) keyboards for the Japanese market and other products from Hongkong or China. There was some Hongkong online shop with a variety of Cherry stuff and worldwide shipping.
No biggie. I have both Brown/Blue. Was curious on Red. Haven't tried a linear non-clicky yet:D
You'll find it almost impossible to find a board with red switches for sale to the US. Atleast that's what I've always read from geekhack and some other places. From what I hear unless you have someone from Japan that can buy a keyboard with red switches and then ship it for you, you're not going to get it. You're better off just deciding between brown/blue/blacks.
Also, anyone who is interested in the Duckys should check out the following links. Ducky 1087 and Ducky 9008 on GeekHack.
Apparently, there a few issues with the build quality of the Duckys but these were mostly noticed after ripping them apart and they maybe issues only if you are total purists like those on GH. I am sure no regular joe would notice them given they are priced nearly 40% less than the Filcos. But still something worth keeping in mind if you are in for the Duckys.
@Inverted, What model did you order, BTW? The DK-10XX or the DK-90XX. Not sure what the difference between them is but the DK-90XX I am pretty sure use Laser-engraved keys and on first look, the DK-10XX look like they use Dye which look better to the eye. I maybe pretty wrong here also, but that's how it looks to me.
@BlazingInferno I decided upon this one link I kinda wish I got the TenKeyless, but if I end up really liking this one Ill get another maybe a brown cherry to add to my collection
On November 06 2010 22:24 zeroISM wrote: I'm really thinking of switching over from my Razer Tarantula to the FILCO Majestouch Cherry MX Brown. Did anyone made this switch? How did it felt?
Anyways, I'll try typing a little on the Majestouch next week when I will go to the capital, if I buy it, I will let you guys know and post my review in this topic.
Well, after one month I can finally say this is the perfect keyboard. I've bought a FILCO Majestouch KB w/ CherryMX Browns with numpad. My wife liked it very much so I took another shot and bought the tenkeyless version and some red keys.
This thing is so beautiful. Typing on it seems like touching fluffly marshmallows. The tactile feedback is really impressive and it takes a while until you get used to the flow and smoothness of the keypresses.
I'm really busy at work at the moment, so I'm not playing too much lately :/ If I get to play more and my APM eventually increases after some time I will let you know.
I highly recommend this keyboard to every one out there with a non-mechanical keyboard, or for those who are considering buying one.
I have tested the BLACK cherry aswell, but I missed the Tactile feedback. So my recommendation is the BROWN switches keyboard.
Got mine this week and cost me a shitton (shipping from USA to netherlands etc). I got the black switches after reading a lot on the forums i thought those would suit me best. Though i love the keyboard, with hindsight i would've chosen the brown ones after i been able to test them (wasnt able to test any switches before i ordered).
Overall great keyboard, but i wouldnt order one again simply because of the price rofl (200euros it cost me).
On December 05 2010 06:01 Mithriel wrote: Got mine this week and cost me a shitton (shipping from USA to netherlands etc). I got the black switches after reading a lot on the forums i thought those would suit me best. Though i love the keyboard, with hindsight i would've chosen the brown ones after i been able to test them (wasnt able to test any switches before i ordered).
Overall great keyboard, but i wouldnt order one again simply because of the price rofl (200euros it cost me).
OMG are you serious? 200 euro is almost $300, that's way too expensive man
On December 05 2010 06:01 Mithriel wrote: Got mine this week and cost me a shitton (shipping from USA to netherlands etc). I got the black switches after reading a lot on the forums i thought those would suit me best. Though i love the keyboard, with hindsight i would've chosen the brown ones after i been able to test them (wasnt able to test any switches before i ordered).
Overall great keyboard, but i wouldnt order one again simply because of the price rofl (200euros it cost me).
OMG are you serious? 200 euro is almost $300, that's way too expensive man
haha and i am not even kidding. 142 dollar for board, 50dollar shipping, and for some reason had to pay 50euro's tax to dutch customs. 192dollar is like 140euro which is was completely fine with, logitech g15 is like 120-130 orso, but yeh the extra 50 brought it up to 190 which was a bit meh (Not 200, but close )
On December 01 2010 18:16 Kokujin wrote: just picked up one of these with cherry blue switches
$110 from sidewinder computers
That seems like a pretty nice deal actually. How is Das compared to Filco? Definately considering getting a Das considering elitekeyboards has been out of stock for a while now, plus they're selling for about $30 less.
i have a filco majestouch - black switches b/c thats all they had. was using a $20 piece of trash before. keys definitely feel extremely good, dunno what browns/blues feel like but mechanical in general is just an amazing feel...
I guess I must have lucked out. I ordered my filco, right before gsl 1 started. Then there was some shot of Fruitdealer using it. BAM no more filcos. I highly recommend trying to find a cherry brown filco. Best peripheral purchase i have made yet.
On December 05 2010 19:10 Zzoram wrote: How the heck do I buy a Filco Majestouch Tenkeyless Tactile Click or Tactile Touch? They're out of stock and nobody else sells them.
$20 shipping and they all hover around $102-115 USD
Elitekeyboards aren't going to carry Filco anymore. He hasn't announced what keyboard he's going to be supplying but it's about 99% likely that it will be Ducky. But it's still probably going to be cheaper from PChome while the shipping is only $20
Is it at all possile to get a mechanical cherry mx blue korean/english keyboard? The only one I've found was on Ebay and custom made from real wood for $999 lol.
The only reason I wouldn't get a Daskeyboard is because of their gloss issue. If they made it full matte finish, I would be all over it, but it's still glossy.
On December 06 2010 08:35 Zzoram wrote: Is it at all possile to get a mechanical cherry mx blue korean/english keyboard? The only one I've found was on Ebay and custom made from real wood for $999 lol.
On December 06 2010 08:35 Zzoram wrote: Is it at all possile to get a mechanical cherry mx blue korean/english keyboard? The only one I've found was on Ebay and custom made from real wood for $999 lol.
Skydigital nKeyboard mechanic. Made promptly after the win of Fruitdealer. I kid you not :-P
Awesome. I'd prefer a tenkeyless with cherry mx blue though. Is that going to be an option? When will this keyboard be for sale? Is Fruitdealer getting sponsored by them now?
I highly recommend this keyboard as a substitute to the Das Keyboard. I could not find the actual specs on the website, however from the above link, it appears that this keyboard does indeed use Cherry MX Blue switches. From my personal experience, this is an excellent keyboard for the price ($70), compared to the Das Keyboard being over $100.
Give it a try, I don't think you guys will regret it :-)
On December 05 2010 19:10 Zzoram wrote: How the heck do I buy a Filco Majestouch Tenkeyless Tactile Click or Tactile Touch? They're out of stock and nobody else sells them.
$20 shipping and they all hover around $102-115 USD
Elitekeyboards aren't going to carry Filco anymore. He hasn't announced what keyboard he's going to be supplying but it's about 99% likely that it will be Ducky. But it's still probably going to be cheaper from PChome while the shipping is only $20
Leopold is what geeckhack says, apparently they're pretty sure.
I had been waiting for the Filcos to come back in stock so that I could get a Tenkeyless with Cherry Browns!
I honestly don't know what I'm going to do now. I had only really planned on getting such an expensive keyboard if it was the much lauded, durable Filco, but I'm clearly going to have to do some more research and figure out what is next best. Anyone in a similar situation found anything yet? I briefly tapped on a Razer BlackWidow when I was last at Fry's and the Cherry Blues didn't seem as loud as I had heard, so I've been considering them again a little.
I don't know if this has been posted already, but EliteKeyboards are replacing their Filcos for another mechanical keyboard due to supplying issues.
Greetings from EK!
Note: If you're receiving this message, you're either an EliteKeyboards newsletter subscriber, or you've recently inquired about a FILCO keyboard. If you've made a recent inquiry, but are not a subscriber, please read the "important message" below the new announcements. **
THE NEW:
We're proud to announce the availability of keycaps from the Clack Factory! Clack Factory keycaps are unique pieces of art for your favorite keyboard
These are limited to 2 per person in the initial run, but more are coming!
FILCO products have been in short supply recently, and this has been due to our supplier not being able to meet market demand. We're very sorry for this inconvenience; particularly at this time of the year!
Unfortunately, despite our recent efforts, our supply of FILCO products will not be improving, so we have taken this turn of events as an opportunity to search for alternative products which can meet our customers' demands.
So without beating around the bush too much, in Jan/Feb 2011 EK will offer a new keyboard line-up with Cherry MX switches!
These boards will replace all FILCO products (and then some. We've selected them with much discretion, and believe they will meet or exceed the quality and functionality of FILCO products and provide a better value in a very competitive market!
Further details to follow on our website soon. We appreciate your continued support!
** If you're one of the overwhelming number of recent FILCO inquiries we've received, we've sent you this newsletter as a courtesy. If you are not on the EK mailing list, you will not receive further e-mails from us. If you'd like to subscribe, you may do so on our homepage
On December 01 2010 18:16 Kokujin wrote: just picked up one of these with cherry blue switches
$110 from sidewinder computers
That seems like a pretty nice deal actually. How is Das compared to Filco? Definately considering getting a Das considering elitekeyboards has been out of stock for a while now, plus they're selling for about $30 less.
For the german folks out there: getdigital is selling some of those in their ebay shop. The keyboards seem to be returned items, but the auctions say if there are any technical errors. I got an "Das Keyboard Model S Ultimate EU" (blue switches, layout fitting all EU keyboard layouts, non printed keys) for 55€. The packaging was opened previously but the keyboard is in flawless condition.
Well Filco lovers, I think this is a thread that you guys should look at: Fruit Dealer's Keyboard.
If you look at the last few pages, you'll see some posts, mainly by CaptainFwiffo and I, about the keyboard that EliteKeyboards is going to replace the Filco with. It's a brand called Leopold, and many of the people working there are the ones that originally designed the Filco. According to the trusty gurus at GeekHack, the Leopold is going to be very much like the Filco but actually has many improvements. So far we only know about the Tenkeyless version, and the only possible drawback that there is (beside not being a "Filco" if you're into that "designer brand" type of thing) is that the tenkeyless board is one inch wider than the Filco one. No one is really sure why at the moment, but we're all optimistic, especially since the Leopold is supposed to be sold at EliteKeyboards for a bit cheaper than the Filco.
Hope this gets everyone else feeling as optimistic as it did me!
Just found it in a shop for around 50€ and it seems like a cheap alternative to the other more expensive mechanical keyboards. Also i'm not sure yet which version has which kind of switches. I guess the LQC versions have the mx brown switches, but i'm still not sure.
Maybe someone can help me with my decision which keyboard to buy ... i would appreciate that
Just found it in a shop for around 50€ and it seems like a cheap alternative to the other more expensive mechanical keyboards. Also i'm not sure yet which version has which kind of switches. I guess the LQC versions have the mx brown switches, but i'm still not sure.
Maybe someone can help me with my decision which keyboard to buy ... i would appreciate that
The clicky version uses blue switches, the linear version black switches. The "soft pressure point" uses clear switches. These are switches built with plastic parts shaped like the brown switches, but with the spring from black switches. This makes the keys feel stiffer than brown switches. Search for posts from "FoxSpirit": he tried the clear switches and brown switches, and did not like the clear ones.
I have a G80-3000 with blue switches. The 2KRO circuitry (or whatever it has) is enough for Quake3 movement with W+A+Space or W+D+Space and one additional key around the W-A-S-D for weapon changes or push-to-talk with Ventrilo/Teamspeak, or RtCW movement with W+A+Space+Shift (the Shift for sprinting) plus one additional keypress. Movement with E-S-D-F also worked, if I remember right.
The keyboard has a lot of wasted space mainly at the top, but also at the sides. It weighs a lot less than the mechanical keyboards I remember from the last century from Nixdorf and IBM. When I got it, I remember being annoyed about a high pitched ringing when hammering the keys hard and fast enough to hit the bottom, though I do not notice that problem anymore (I got used to it, I guess).
I have a black colored version and not a gray one. The white writing on the black keys is super bad. You can feel the white lettering on the keycaps, which I find annoying, and it wears off. Next time I will buy a gray one for the laser etching.
Instead of bumps, the F and J key have a more pronounced curvature, which I find neat.
Personally, I do not regret the buy because of the price. I'm pretty happy with the keyboard compared to the various membrane keyboards I used before, and also content enough to not buy a Filco Tenkeyless (the shorter width of the Tenkeyless is the only thing that I would want to have in a new keyboard compared to the G80-3000).
On December 15 2010 05:27 FragKrag wrote: I believe mOnion has that model with Cherry blues. The G80 is a very solid keyboard.
Yes, he does. I always play on it when we have LANs, love that keyboard. It was the main reason I went out and bought a mechanical. My keyboard just didn't feel the same after using his.
I own a Ducky 1087 (tenkeyless) with Cherry MX brown switches. I went with what most people said and got brown, and it is absolutely amazing. I can't believe i've been playing pc games for 10 years on membrane keyboards..
I'm sure blue is basically the same thing but with a louder, more "clicky" sound - but I really like the sound that brown makes when you bottom out with it.
On December 06 2010 08:35 Zzoram wrote: Is it at all possile to get a mechanical cherry mx blue korean/english keyboard? The only one I've found was on Ebay and custom made from real wood for $999 lol.
I have a blue tenkeyless. I suppose browns could be more to my taste (given my experience with a Compaq-branded Cherry G80-11800 kinda keyboard with a trackball), though I'm not sure. Matter of fact, I didn't exactly hate blacks for typing, though that was on a different keyboard, a Cherry-branded Cherry, the G80-11800 with a touchpad.It feels greatto type on and even lighter than the blues, which in reality are objectively lighter. In fact, it's easier for me to avoid bottoming out with the blacks than with the blues and I think the overall subjective feel of typing is more pleasant. But I still keep using the blues for now. There's something in them I like, though it doesn't translate to (or from) a subjectively more pleasant feeling. Heh, I'm even having the impression the blacks tire my fingers less than the blues do.
I just got my Majestouch tenkeyless with black switches, and I have to say I find it quite amazing. It's my first mech besides the model M, and it just feels so smooth to me. I had planned to buy a Deck Legend with clears, but I don't think I miss the clickiness as much as I thought I would.
For typing: people really overstate how uncomfortable blacks are for typing. I disagree. These keys feel light to me already, I can't imagine all the errors I would make on browns.
For gaming: world of difference from membrane. I admit I was skeptical, but my APM really has increased. It's just much easier to tap the keys now. Again, I'm sure browns would have a similar effect.
Most importantly for me, this is a tenkeyless model, which counts for a LOT.I am now typing dead center in front of me, rather than 4-5 inches to the left. It's much more comfortable.
Cherry blues all the freaking way! if you have tried the black switches, it kinda feels awkward cause theres no click at all, even though i think it actuates half way.
blue keys are nice cause they click really nicely to tell you if the key has actuated so no fear, you know if you pressed a key or not.
I've been using a 105 key Filco Majestouch with Brown switches for a few days now and it's absolutely amazing compared to any and all keyboards I've previously used.
On January 23 2011 08:27 Ruthless wrote: Filco keyboards have been discontinued. What are alternative options that people have looked at?
Filco has not been discontinued, if you check with geekhack.org they will provide you with places where you can purchase them, if I remember correctly the keyboard co website has just restocked them in. But if you want to wait for elite keyboard, they said they will replace the Filcos with Leopold in February, which is just right around the corner. (the owner of elite keyboard mentioned this on the geekhack forum 2 weeks ago). Anyways check out geekhack.org, they are more updated with the mechanical keyboard scene.
I got my Filco Majestouch 104-key with Browns. This is my first mechanical keyboard and it is amazing. First, I was bit disappointed that there is almost no tactile bump as stated (very little), but few days later I started pressing keys lightly and I can feel it (but still not much). Sound is okay - if you press bit more heavily an bottom out, you can hear it, but it is not that loud to be annoying.
I recommend you MX Cherry Browns, they are good all-around switches and I cant find any function in which they aren´t good. FPS, RTS, typing...Browns can do this! However, it doesnt matter which switch you pick, you will never want to return to cheap rubbers again.
BTW, for EU users, I got my board few weeks ago from keyboardco and I think they have some Filcos still in stock!
Got the tenkeyless. types silky smooth and i love it. although to be perfectly honest it does nothing for my sc2 gameplay... just my sc2 theory crafting lol
On January 23 2011 08:27 Ruthless wrote: Filco keyboards have been discontinued. What are alternative options that people have looked at?
Filco has not been discontinued, if you check with geekhack.org they will provide you with places where you can purchase them, if I remember correctly the keyboard co website has just restocked them in. But if you want to wait for elite keyboard, they said they will replace the Filcos with Leopold in February, which is just right around the corner. (the owner of elite keyboard mentioned this on the geekhack forum 2 weeks ago). Anyways check out geekhack.org, they are more updated with the mechanical keyboard scene.
Yes I did a bit more looking, I was under the impression that because I googled "filco keyboard" and the first result was the elitekeyboard site that they were possibly the manufacturer. Does anyone know where these sites are getting them.
are any of these things still available in america? my friend has his heart set on a filco with black switches, and he's one of those guys who can't be convinced that there are any good mechanical keyboards outside of the filco brand.
After hearing rumours that Elitekeyboard would have tentative stock of the Leopolds at the end of February, I caved and ordered a Filco browns tenkeyless from armygroup, as it ended up being cheaper than importing an Archiss from Japan.
Damn my impatience.
Anyways, I should get them by the end of the week, and I'm psyched. Never used anything but rubber domes. I'm kind of worried though that I've overhyped my expectations for mechanical keyboards.
@hideo i just got my filco brown majestouch today, first time ever using a mechanical keyboard
to me it sounds like a type writer but it does feel different. not omg absolutly amazing different but different non the less... everyone says u need to get accustomed to a mechanical keyboard so i guess thats what i need to do :D i think i keep bottoming out on each keypress so im trying to stop that.
i do like the sound the keys make tho :D and the keyboard itself is solid. weighs like 3 times my previous membrane keyboard and looks amazing aswell :D but just dont expect TOO much
On January 24 2011 03:42 universalwill wrote: are any of these things still available in america? my friend has his heart set on a filco with black switches, and he's one of those guys who can't be convinced that there are any good mechanical keyboards outside of the filco brand.
did you know the switches filco uses are from cherry? i just found out! And it is a keyboard brand! Well they produce keyboards with those black switches. Your friend could risk a try.
On January 24 2011 03:42 universalwill wrote: are any of these things still available in america? my friend has his heart set on a filco with black switches, and he's one of those guys who can't be convinced that there are any good mechanical keyboards outside of the filco brand.
filcos are now sold in america by The Keyboard Co. through Amazon
additionally, anyone interested in a blue or brown tenkeyless should be on the lookout at Elite Keyboards as theyll be releasing the line of Leopolds shortly (supposedly with several improvements in quality.)
Once EK gets their Leopolds in, there will be no reason for people stateside to order a Filco other than name value.
The Leopolds are comparable in quality, and considering the price point is 100USD no shipping, 120USD including shipping, it's a much wiser option to just get a Leopold. This way, users won't need to bother with the hassle of translating their purchase, waiting for customs to clear items, or having a pay a strong premium for the Filco name.
On March 04 2011 11:47 sawedust wrote: Once EK gets their Leopolds in, there will be no reason for people stateside to order a Filco other than name value.
The Leopolds are comparable in quality, and considering the price point is 100USD no shipping, 120USD including shipping, it's a much wiser option to just get a Leopold. This way, users won't need to bother with the hassle of translating their purchase, waiting for customs to clear items, or having a pay a strong premium for the Filco name.
Get a original cherry. 20 bucks. industrial standard rocksolid mechanical mx(blue,brown,black whatever) or ml. available everywhere in any localisation.
oh and sorry that is no filco, but if you want quality, maybe just try the german crafted producer and inventor, not the reseller. and spare 80% O_o
Just got my Majestouch Tenkeyless from Amazon ( Keyboard CO.) and am loving it so far. Went with Cherry Browns as I tend to do alot of stuff on my keyboard, not solely gaming etc...
Had no clue with the Leopolds would become available and in past week saw that some more Filcos went up on Amazon and had to take advantage of it...
Noorgrin Germany. March 05 2011 07:35. Posts 11 PM Profile Quote # can't find any Filco Majestouch with blue Switches and German Layout anywhere T_T Q(-_-Q)
They say estimated time of arrival one week from order for the blue and the black tenkeyless, whatever thats supposed to exactly mean. The 105 Key version is estimated to arrive end of april. http://www.keyboardco.com/keyboard_details.asp?PRODUCT=768
I´ve ordered a brown tenkeyless 2 weeks ago. It seems to had arrived at their shop today,since browns are in stock now, and i am now eagerly awaiting its arrival at my home.
Overall cost for my Majestouch tenkeyless with brown switches including shipping and payment via PayPal was roughly 145 €.
Might i ask if there is any way you can get one of this keyboards (or atleast a good keyboard whit brown or black switches) on latin america? because to be honest the best thing ive seen arround here are the razer keyboards and those are hella expensive.
Just received my filco today from the keyboard co. with cherry brown switches. It took just over two weeks with the shipping. I havent got to play on it much yet (frickin finals!), but it feels like it'll be quite nice for starcraft and cant wait to break it in over spring break!
sorry to answer the first post after 22 pages, but i think someone could still find this useful. After using the black widow for a three months I got my FILCO Majestouch with browns two days ago. Though the build quality is definitely better, I am still using the BW as i really miss the bounce and clicky sound of the black widow (blues). personally, i think i like blues much more.
I have a filco majestouch with browns waiting for me at home when I get off work. 1 day shipping through amazon = win.
I can't wait!!!! Birthdays are awesome.
I tried a 7g and razer blackwidow (so blacks/blues) before making up my mind. I haven't personally tried browns but everything i read is it's some where in between so it sounds perfect.
home: unpacked - tested - I'm in love!!! One of if not the best peripheral computer purchase i've ever made! the sound and feel is amazing.
i own a 7G with blacks, anf i feel like the no tactile feedback makes me easily make typos or accidentaly pressing the key next to it by just slighty touching it wich is really annoying me. i want a zowie/filco
Hey there, don't wanna push up old threads and don't wanna open a new mechanical keyboard-thread, but I HAVE to ask this:
what is the cheapest mechanical keyboard on the market? and in specific which one is the cheapest in germany with german keycaps??? I'm thinking of the ss g6v2 but if there is a cheaper version of mechanical keyboard, I would be very happy, because I have no money ^^ please help.
On May 03 2011 00:31 wshm wrote: look up for cherry g80-3000's in germany, they are cheap and with different switches.
can't find them for less than the steelseries 6gv2 and if I have to choose I would prefere the 6g. where did u see the cheep cherrys? Its all 61 € + ...
-___- man I am getting frustrated because of all the mechanical keyboard stuff,...
On April 02 2011 18:10 TooN wrote: has anyone experience anything from XArmor U9? I am looking at it and was wondering if anyone has any news about it.
I purchased this keyboard a few days ago because of the low price point and I'm hoping it can live up to be a good bang-for-the-buck model. From the looks of it, it looks to be the same as the XArmor U9BL-S (~$140) except without the USB/audio ports and backlighting, which is all pretty useless to me. There are some reviews of the U9BL-S on youtube right now.
Once I get the U9 I'll play around with it for a few days and post a review in comparison to my Filco Majestouch Cherry Brown.
On May 03 2011 00:31 wshm wrote: look up for cherry g80-3000's in germany, they are cheap and with different switches.
can't find them for less than the steelseries 6gv2 and if I have to choose I would prefere the 6g. where did u see the cheep cherrys? Its all 61 € + ...
-___- man I am getting frustrated because of all the mechanical keyboard stuff,...
What I'm really wondering is where could I find a brick-and-mortar store that has mechanical keyboards on display? I'm really not sure if I want a tactile bump or not (Black or Brown) and I feel like the only good way to find out is to bang on a keyboard for a minute or so.
EPT![[image loading]](http://i359.photobucket.com/albums/oo31/drinkmixer8484/001-7.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i34.tinypic.com/25takjk.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/n9KIb.jpg)
Otherwise I'm happy for you.
The mx brown feedback doesn't feel sharp enough, after trying the m. ![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/mDaph.png)
![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/64vH7.png)
![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/fZo14.jpg)
looks good though ![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/E1fSP.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/nSfNz.jpg)
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![[image loading]](http://img602.imageshack.us/i/20101104204810.jpg/)
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![[image loading]](http://ec2.images-amazon.com/images/I/41HU6PRAqrL.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/7079/img0370j.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://www.daskeyboard.com/images/products/1.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://img339.imageshack.us/i/img0252ie.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://img819.imageshack.us/i/img023901.jpg)
![[image loading]](http://img714.imageshack.us/i/img0244cz.jpg)
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![[image loading]](http://i826.photobucket.com/albums/zz186/awol2oslo/IMG_0766.jpg)
