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ProTech
United States530 Posts
LoTV gutted the core game-play and isn't fun by any stretch of the imagination, so naturally things were going to implode eventually, meanwhile BroodWar domestically within Korea is far more popular than LoTV has ever been and even will be. LoTV is simply a waiting-room for the next iteration of StarCraft whether that's an RTS or a different Genre altogether. | ||
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Balnazza
Germany1380 Posts
On January 23 2026 21:32 ProTech wrote: Not sure why this comes to a surprise for some people, StarCraft has not felt like StarCraft since the launch of LoTV. LoTV gutted the core game-play and isn't fun by any stretch of the imagination, so naturally things were going to implode eventually, meanwhile BroodWar domestically within Korea is far more popular than LoTV has ever been and even will be. LoTV is simply a waiting-room for the next iteration of StarCraft whether that's an RTS or a different Genre altogether. LotV was released over 10 years ago btw... | ||
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Agh
United States1110 Posts
On January 24 2026 00:49 Balnazza wrote: LotV was released over 10 years ago btw... Even though it's just a vent post a lot of people share the frustrations, just not particularly for the same reasons. Popularity doesn't mean quality, there are a lot of "popular" things that are either straight up objectively bad, or have gaping flaws. WoL launched with mules, forcefields, and multiple free units. (Not to mention the shoebox maps and several other things). These were fundamental flaws that needed to be changed in some way. This isn't hindsight either, myself and others pointed this out and expressed our opinions the second we got our hands on the beta. Many were hopeful for HotS, myself included. Instead we're met with even more free units (swarm hosts), the widow mine (probably the biggest offender in the entirety of the game), and a turbo roll of duct tape called the mothership core in an attempt to band aid some of the issues P faced. Oh let's not forget the warhound.. which thankfully got axed courtesy of yours truly. All of the above snowballed the mass exodus of the playerbase. Which is saying a lot since this is also the point where WCS was starting to throw money around. LotV comes around, all of the above still exists less the mothership core. No changes to curb the frustrating aspects of the game, and instead they just keep piling it on. We get the liberator, lurker, disruptor, and droppable sieged tanks. Can't forget the nuclear speed of the game thanks to the economy changes. (Additional workers and supply increase of town halls). Combine all this with not monetizing the game until it's practically on it's deathbed, a terrible custom game interface, and no social aspect and you get the sad state of RTS, where the most known and recognized title can't even make it to the largest multi tournament event. | ||
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Balnazza
Germany1380 Posts
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TeamMamba
297 Posts
On January 23 2026 10:04 Balnazza wrote: Not really reports, just rumours. That I also never fully bought tbh. Why would Blizzard be the "mimimi"-lord about SC2 when OW2 was and is at EWC, even as part as their official circuit if I recall correctly? Just a random guess it’s might be OW2 still a relative new game and still making money for Blizzard. Whereas SC2 is making close to zero for Blizzard | ||
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ZombieGrub
United States722 Posts
On January 23 2026 10:04 Balnazza wrote: Not really reports, just rumours. That I also never fully bought tbh. Why would Blizzard be the "mimimi"-lord about SC2 when OW2 was and is at EWC, even as part as their official circuit if I recall correctly? They tried to negotiate circuit support from EWC. EWC supports other events outside of the EWC to a degree, but they aren't looking to be the sole backer of any esport. If you wanted, you could give them credit for trying to support our scene more. You could also argue their interference was a net negative, considering they had already been established as frustrating to deal with (I know OW2 is there, but there's a history for TOs and SC2) and SC2 was already hanging by a thread due to its viewership so any amount of extra frustration, even well-intended, was just an "ugh nevermind". Of course, no one who was actually present at these negotiations would shed light on what specifically went down. I only bring up this Blizzard-EWC 2025 clarification because people just assumed it was EWC's fault for the delay. Anything else, like why we aren't back in 2026, is mostly an unknown...except that our viewership wasn't great and developer support is basically non-existent, two things any TO definitely wants. | ||
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mathphyswithvic
33 Posts
Chat interface is not comparable to bw or wc3. Clans are missing clan wars option and some ladder with points and rewards for clan of the month. Maybe two ladders, most active and most powerful. 2v2/3v3 etc, still miss the build on creep of ally option. There are many quick fixes but no developers in the pipeline unfortunately. | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada18005 Posts
On January 22 2026 15:05 BrewKnowURSA wrote: We hope to turn Stellar Fest into an annual Fall event in Ottawa. I know we're not close to replacing the EWC... but I look forward to this era where the independent circuit can grow and collaborate. Here's why: Stellar Fest 1 has given UrsaTV a great audition tape, opening doors at both Ottawa's tourism and entrepreneurial sector support organizations. In the short-term, it will allow us to follow the example of Bellum Gens in Bulgaria, who have successfully used esports and StarCraft II to showcase the Stara Zagora region. My ultimate ambition is opening a place like Germany's TaKeBar, in my city of Ottawa. My first esports event was HSC 22 - A Winter's Dream. The experience was magical... I loved how a crowd of all ages, from all over the world got to mingle with pro-gamers and content creators in an humble, underrated German town. I'm soon returning to Krefeld for more "market research" and pints during HSC 28. Go Pinguines! Avoid the Essacher Luft. Within a few months of HSC 22, I started pursuing the idea seriously, adjusting my life towards entrepreneurship. I'm not sure how close I am to the dream of a venue just yet, but Stellar Fest helps me define the market in Ottawa. This winter, I'll leverage the mentorship program at Invest Ottawa for the first steps towards commercial real estate, defining a financial strategy and timeline for an Ottawa-based esports venue. Meanwhile, my day-to-day is focused on the plans for Stellar Fest 2 for Fall 2026 in Ottawa, which will more than likely be in a rented venue again. In 2026, we hope to secure UrsaTV / Stellar Fest's first sponsors. I'm blown away by this weekend's venue at the Thunderfire StarCraft II All-Star Invitational - the Hangzhou Esports Center looked epic on tv. China's esports infrastructure is clearly world-leading... looks like they're in a great position to grow (and... arguably offer a better product than the EWC). I'm aiming for the future home of UrsaTV to be near LeBreton Flats in Ottawa... the areas of Mechanicsville, Chinatown, Little Italy, Hintonburg. I share this because the area will transform over the next decade as our local NHL team moves from the suburbs to LeBreton Flats. Maybe Stellar Fest 10, 15 or 20 can be in an Arena. Here's the short- medium- and long- term... peak behind the UrsaTV curtain, as we process the news of a changing StarCraft II landscape and EWC's long, quiet, and unceremonious abandonment of StarCraft II. I suggest a model you might want to consider examining is the "Free Play" barcade on college Street in Toronto. The EA NHL '94 esports events their are a blast. They really know how to get people to spend oodles of cash. I'd say the owner is a smart, experienced, hard working bar/restaurant owner who happens to be a video game historian/hobbyist. | ||
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ejozl
Denmark3561 Posts
Glory days could still be ahead if they gave lan, and ppl made their own servers on more fun versions of the game, or mods. Ppl could fix things that they refuse to fix. I think you still cannot upload on eu. That said, I think multiplayer is pretty fun, atm. | ||
Mizenhauer
United States1970 Posts
On January 27 2026 03:30 ejozl wrote: HotS was the worst timeline, I wonder if sc2 would be better if it went directly from wol to lotv. Glory days could still be ahead if they gave lan, and ppl made their own servers on more fun versions of the game, or mods. Ppl could fix things that they refuse to fix. I think you still cannot upload on eu. That said, I think multiplayer is pretty fun, atm. Yeah hots was terrible, what with 2 world championships, 3-6 seasons of KIL's (up to six seasons of wcs too), plus proleague and dozens of weekenders each year. What a bummer............ | ||
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Charoisaur
Germany16103 Posts
On January 27 2026 03:30 ejozl wrote: HotS was the worst timeline, I wonder if sc2 would be better if it went directly from wol to lotv. Glory days could still be ahead if they gave lan, and ppl made their own servers on more fun versions of the game, or mods. Ppl could fix things that they refuse to fix. I think you still cannot upload on eu. That said, I think multiplayer is pretty fun, atm. I mean TvZ was peak in HotS. PvZ I think kinda the same or a bit worse now due to lame Mothership Tempest styles. TvP is definitely better now though. Not sure about the mirrors as I don't watch them much but I guess they're kinda the same too. Don't really get your HotS hate. If it's just because of Swarmhosts I think memory fails you a bit as Swarmhosts weren't really played that much, just the couple hour long games got lots of attention. | ||
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ejozl
Denmark3561 Posts
On the esport side, non-korea dieded and aside from proleague there was only morDuck morrow with 400 viewers on a regular basis, naniwa would occasionally stream with good viewers when he felt like it, which wasn't often. For NA it was even worse, you could pick between mech god avilo, or viewbotter winter. LotV had the sweeping changes because hots didn't work out. Had they both been half innovative, and the patches thereafter just for stabilizing, I think sc2 would be better off now. | ||
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ejozl
Denmark3561 Posts
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Charoisaur
Germany16103 Posts
On January 27 2026 20:37 ejozl wrote: The units and the design philosophy. It could've been a time of great innovative changes like lotv, but went with the esport approach of - the coolest moments are worker harass and high octane speed. This gave us medivac boost, oracle (unit that was never supposed to be harming workers), protoss hater mines, countless move speed increases. Phoenix had to get more range because of muta, and mship core had to be implemented to deal with muta + boost. Hellbats are uninspired and even goofy units, tempests were just always boring. Reapers + medivac boost destroyed tvt, the best matchup. Phoenix v. Phoenix kind of ruined pvp. If that's your take I'm confused why you think LotV is better considering with LotV they tripled down on the speed creep. The economy changes alone made the game progress way faster, and spread out bases makes worker harass much stronger. And all the changes you mentioned bar mship core are still in the game. | ||
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Drahkn
201 Posts
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ETisME
12902 Posts
Even MOBA player base is not growing/falling, and you have the rise of battle royale. more grassroot tournaments, with or without prizepool, for all skill levels would definitely be welcomed. Blizzard should run a promo event to get ex-sc2 playerbase to get back into the game, and give them a special mount for WoW or something. | ||
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Mizenhauer
United States1970 Posts
On January 28 2026 01:39 Charoisaur wrote: If that's your take I'm confused why you think LotV is better considering with LotV they tripled down on the speed creep. The economy changes alone made the game progress way faster, and spread out bases makes worker harass much stronger. And all the changes you mentioned bar mship core are still in the game. It turns out that when you start with more workers, harassment is more impactful since you have a far better economy behind said harassment. Losing a bunch of workers wasn't game over in hots as your opponent has to heavily invest in said harassment. When you don't need to cut corners to send an oracle into someone's mineral line, (effectively ending the game three minutes in), however, it punishes the defending player more than it has in the first two sc2 expansions. | ||
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ejozl
Denmark3561 Posts
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Agh
United States1110 Posts
On January 28 2026 05:52 Drahkn wrote: The only way RTS survives as a "big" ESPORT is if another Brood War comes along that hit the world as hard as that game did. SC3 needs to have the most badass visuals and gameplay that has that back and fourth gameplay that has you on the edge of your seat. But I think it has to reduce the APM requirements and be more about decision making, strategy and army control and less about MACRO that requires crazy apm to be 100% efficient(obviously MACRO should be a huge part of the game). Most people quit RTS games like SC because it is simply just to stressful and not fun to play once you get to higher MMR's because the effort you put in 2 win is so extreme it feels more like a job then a game. ( And this is because the APM required to play is so demanding). When I play games like CS GO or League of Legends I can play at a pretty high level and still just chill and have a laugh. While in SC2 I would be working up an early heart attack to play at the same level. I'd rather not see games neutered because little Timmy doesn't have the mental fortitude to accept his losses. This type of reddit tier participation trophy bullshit mindset is tiresome. Wanting something removed or lowered because you can't do it is selfish. The better approach is offering an alternative, but then again the same issue is just going to pop up: "My opponent does it better", "My opponent breathes air". Jokes aside, If the game is fun people will play it, the only other motivating factor is money. A new RTS only needs to satisfy the fun and engagement check, something apparently nobody has been able to do. If current version of SC2 launched today people would shit on it similarly to how they do Stormgate (which while the overall design is abysmal the QoL features would have been enough to carry it had it not been completely ignored). The micro-macro spectrum that WC3, AoE2, and BW encompass hasn't been improved upon in well over two decades. The recipe is there, just nobody has discovered it yet. | ||
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TeamMamba
297 Posts
On January 27 2026 07:41 Charoisaur wrote: I mean TvZ was peak in HotS. PvZ I think kinda the same or a bit worse now due to lame Mothership Tempest styles. TvP is definitely better now though. Not sure about the mirrors as I don't watch them much but I guess they're kinda the same too. Don't really get your HotS hate. If it's just because of Swarmhosts I think memory fails you a bit as Swarmhosts weren't really played that much, just the couple hour long games got lots of attention. Yes and No Hots literally slowly killed the game for majority of the gamers and fanbase. One of the major things that was frustrating to play against was the widow mines. It seems like people forgot how disgusting OP and Imba that unit was. Ya sure pros can “handle” it but the average player just have a terrible experience playing the game Also as for the fans watching the game, due to its low worker start, the first 5 minutes of each game was a boredfest unless there was cheese involved. LoTV was a breath of fresh air | ||
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EPT
