EPTWell, all good things come to an end
GSL 2023: Significant contraction announced - Page 2
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Charoisaur
Germany15972 Posts
Well, all good things come to an end | ||
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JimmyJRaynor
Canada16747 Posts
On February 24 2023 05:24 Vindicare605 wrote: Wardii's tournaments work because they are very small in cost and scale compared to the relatively gigantic operations that GSL and ESL are. If you want a peek at what "sustainable" Starcraft 2 looks like then yea he's a good one to look at. But without larger funding for the more fun events that draw in the big viewers, smaller scale stuff like Wardii's is all we're going to eventually be left with. And I hate to break this to you, but none of the players that play in Wardii's tournaments see it as a form of sustainable income for them. His tournaments are a nice side addition to have while the big tournaments provide the main course for everyone. I can guarantee you that this sort of negative impact on the scene WILL roll downhill. If the top events that keep the fans engaged are no longer around or are drastically reduced in scope, the drop in engagement from the community that will result will impact tournaments like Wardii's too eventually. you make some good points. No need to hit the panic button. However , if you are deeply concerned I suggest donating the equivalent of an SC2 skin-pack to whoever you think puts on the best SC2 competitive events. If you're spending 10+ hours a month watching competitive events put on by Streamer XYZ ... then do the right thing and give XYZ some $$$ for the entertainment he/she provides. If you want to take it even further start a funding drive. That will help keep the scene going. Fan driven competitive scenes can last almost forever. Super Tecmo Bowl, made in 1991, still has an active competitive scene culminating the "Tundra Bowl" in Wisconsin, USA. EA NHL '94 also still has an active competitive scene. Both of these games are not RTS games in the purest sence... but they are action//strategy games with assymetrical factions. ]Well made Action//Strategy competitive games last almost forever. | ||
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Edpayasugo
United Kingdom2215 Posts
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geokilla
Canada8240 Posts
On February 24 2023 05:24 Vindicare605 wrote: Wardii's tournaments work because they are very small in cost and scale compared to the relatively gigantic operations that GSL and ESL are. If you want a peek at what "sustainable" Starcraft 2 looks like then yea he's a good one to look at. But without larger funding for the more fun events that draw in the big viewers, smaller scale stuff like Wardii's is all we're going to eventually be left with. And I hate to break this to you, but none of the players that play in Wardii's tournaments see it as a form of sustainable income for them. His tournaments are a nice side addition to have while the big tournaments provide the main course for everyone. I can guarantee you that this sort of negative impact on the scene WILL roll downhill. If the top events that keep the fans engaged are no longer around or are drastically reduced in scope, the drop in engagement from the community that will result will impact tournaments like Wardii's too eventually. We did have something like WardiTV. It was called Olimoleague and that had to shut down due to costs and lack of sponsors I think. Let's not forget more Koreans are supported by the Chinese teams and we know the state of Chinese SC2. It's time to admit that professional SC2 in Korea is coming to an end. League of Legends is where it's at. | ||
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dysenterymd
1238 Posts
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BluemoonSC
SoCal8910 Posts
On February 24 2023 05:06 Vindicare605 wrote: Activision isn't interested in putting together anything just to better their game. They need a direct profit motive and there's none to be had for SC2. Even if SC2 esports keeps drawing players to the game, where is there money to be made from it? That's their logic. It's just a waste of resources to keep investing in something just because the fans and players love it. That's how modern Activision/Blizzard thinks. this is true but they only have themselves to blame for the monetization model they went with throughout the majority of the game's lifespan. i hate to say it but if you want continued support for your game in current year, you have to expect the developer to inject some form of battle pass or MTX shop for a continuous source of income to keep the development going. if a company (not just activision/blizz) isn't making money off a product, they can't justify spending money on the product. gotta remember that despite our passion for the game and esports that there's a company behind the production of the game and they have bills to pay - just like the teams that are falling apart do. On February 24 2023 05:15 Riquiz wrote: Hate to see the deadgame-meme become a reality. what is dead may never die | ||
Waxangel
United States33425 Posts
If the timeline is longer, I think we'll see a lot of players just rush to get their military service done now, and then scope the RTS esports scene out when they're back. | ||
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Durnuu
13320 Posts
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argonautdice
Canada2719 Posts
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MyLovelyLurker
France756 Posts
On February 24 2023 06:22 Waxangel wrote: I think the short-term future of Korean scene depends on the information we get about Stormgate. If there's enough info to believe that they'll have meaningful esports within a year, a surprising # of players might stick around the SC2 scene to make sure they're in active shape. If the timeline is longer, I think we'll see a lot of players just rush to get their military service done now, and then scope the RTS esports scene out when they're back. This is basically the game theory of it. Another outside possibility would be to note there were roughly 50k viewers at Katowice peak. That's an established hard-core of fans for 10 years+. Everyone giving $20 would be $1mill a year, enough to self-fund the scene if things were well managed. The key part here is IF. Such an effort would need a figure with authority, possibly private sector experience, and mostly integrity; so I'm not holding my breath. | ||
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Howard_Kao
China261 Posts
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Die4Ever
United States17677 Posts
On February 24 2023 06:27 MyLovelyLurker wrote: This is basically the game theory of it. Another outside possibility would be to note there were roughly 50k viewers at Katowice peak. That's an established hard-core of fans for 10 years+. Everyone giving $20 would be $1mill a year, enough to self-fund the scene if things were well managed. The key part here is IF. Such an effort would need a figure with authority, possibly private sector experience, and mostly integrity; so I'm not holding my breath. you will never get 100% of viewers to pay $20 lol, you'd be lucky to convince even 5% of them to pay that much | ||
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argonautdice
Canada2719 Posts
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MyLovelyLurker
France756 Posts
On February 24 2023 06:31 Die4Ever wrote: you will never get 100% of viewers to pay $20 lol, you'd be lucky to convince even 5% of them to pay that much On the one hand chances are slim. On the other, $2 a month for something potentially better than last year's GSL, and keeping the scene alive ? That's a bargain to me - like a quarter of a Twitch sub lol. The importance is the dynamics and the signalling value, you could always index real prize pool to donations up to a low floor - extend another couple years at least. | ||
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Waxangel
United States33425 Posts
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MyLovelyLurker
France756 Posts
On February 24 2023 06:38 Waxangel wrote: In a world where Stormgate doesn't exist or flops as a competitive game, then Korean SC2 will prolly end up like War3 or pre-esports fighting games. Maybe 2~5 players can compete full-time due to all the sponsorship/team support concentrating into them, and they focus on playing at various international events. Yeah and in that world path dependency would matter, a lot. Such a scene would be so dull compared to our salad days that I doubt even this shrunken state would last long, audience-wise. | ||
[Phantom]
Mexico2170 Posts
Lets just thank GSL for the effort they are making in running another year of sc2 after the developer abandoned the game. Thank esl for another year for sc2 as well. And kiss the game goodbye. There will always be a competitive scene, but sc2 as we knew it is dead. Expect korean pros to retire/go to other regions. Players like TY might fully focus on BW now. A lot will do their military service. To be honest, I think season 3 of the gsl this year will be very different from season 1. | ||
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zalem95
Peru184 Posts
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Zergiica
Croatia125 Posts
On February 24 2023 05:18 JimmyJRaynor wrote: This is just polemics. Do like Wardi and create your own events. That'll be tough though because Wardi does an abolutely spectacular job. A more practical thing would be to just donate $$$ to his events. Red Alert 3 and C&C 4 came out around the same time as SC2. How is EA's esports support for those titles? How are the Relic//Sega CoH2 live events doing? What is up with AoE esports these days? It is great to have all these pie-in-the-sky theories about what you expect from a publisher. The reality is... if you are thoroughly dissatisfied then play an RTS that has better esports support. Over the past 15 years, Activision has done a better job supporting their RTS's than any major publisher. As a consumer all I can do is pick my best option... ATVI's RTS games are it. I am thankful to ATVI that we have another year of SC2 esports to watch. During the down time between major events I anticipate watching Wardi's events. career transitions out of the "SC2-only" niche have been a smart move for a long long time. many years ago Incontrol made the smart move of rebranding himself as the "Strategy Game" guy. This allowed him to get involved in C&C and other big strategy titles. starcraft carried activision/blizzard and as a symbol of an esport, of course there is a responsibility to push it and polish that esport RTS champion aura. it can't be compared with AoE, RA or C&C. | ||
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Nakajin
Canada8989 Posts
The last 5 or 6 years have been good for Korean progamers. They had a stable payday, the competition was organically getting easier as the retirement piled on and everyone got a chance to have their moment in the spotlight. Now the little band of brothers that remain have one last year with a little support while they get their things in order before heading into the world. There are very little esport scenes that end in such an harmonious way. I just hope Afreeca can get through the whole year to finish it on their own term and not colapse midway to the year. | ||
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