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Replays and Observer mode - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
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Cascade
Profile Blog Joined March 2006
Australia5405 Posts
Last Edited: 2007-05-20 07:46:55
May 20 2007 07:43 GMT
#21
One thing I stil miss REALLY much from the short BWTV period was the minerals per minute (MPM) statistics for the different players.
Cascade
Profile Blog Joined March 2006
Australia5405 Posts
May 20 2007 07:45 GMT
#22
On May 20 2007 16:41 Zironic wrote:
It would have to be all that information, FOR EVERY FRAME, with 60 FPS that means even if the information just takes one kb per frame it would still eat up 3.6MB per minute, and I think the information would take more then one kb per frame.


you could save the complete game-data every 10 seconds or so. You could only reverse/fast forward to even 10 seconds, but that would be enough, and it shouldn't take TOO much memory (hopefully).
Zironic
Profile Joined May 2007
Sweden341 Posts
May 20 2007 07:48 GMT
#23
The gamestate data would be as big as a savegame, I don't know how big those are (Doesn't have any saves), feel free to make a save game in WC3 or Starcraft and look at the filesize. You could probably add somekind of autosave feature when playing a replay with a toggle for how often. Every minute or so would probably be the most reasonable.
Cascade
Profile Blog Joined March 2006
Australia5405 Posts
May 20 2007 08:00 GMT
#24
If you need fewer you could make dynamic times based on "hotpoints" or something like that. Like save before major battles etc.

Or you could make the replay to play at like 100x speed without drawing any graphics. So when you place the seeker at a time maybe 2 minutes after the latest stored time-point, you could make the replay go back to the closest stored point and play the game on it's own without drawing any graphics. probably it could do that pretty fast. You would have to wait a second or two every time you use the time-seeker, but that shouldn't be a big problem.
God, I should have become a game-developer instead of stupid physics!!
Zironic
Profile Joined May 2007
Sweden341 Posts
May 20 2007 08:01 GMT
#25
Without any graphics the game should be able to play as fast as the CPU allows and if you got a fancy quad core cpu or whatever is the best when SC2 is released you can probably fast forward damn fast.
mel_ee
Profile Blog Joined August 2003
2450 Posts
May 20 2007 08:01 GMT
#26
On May 20 2007 16:18 thedeadhaji wrote:
I will be sad if communal replay watching ceases to exist, much like in war3


this is so true. Watching wc3 replays by your self = boring fest.
Behold the bold soldier, control the globe slowly proceeds to blow swingin swords like Shinobi
Zironic
Profile Joined May 2007
Sweden341 Posts
May 20 2007 08:08 GMT
#27
Audioreplays are fairly interesting, I've never actually done any communal replay watching so I suppose my opinion is null and void.
DrainX
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
Sweden3187 Posts
May 20 2007 08:21 GMT
#28
One thing ive been thinking about... if the replays only contain the players commands then the game has to be completly deterministic for the replay to always be the same as the game. But say you fire with a tank against higher ground and there is a set chance that you miss... how is this handled in replays? Or do they just use something like milliseconds into the game as seed for the randomizer so it always turns out the same way ?
Zironic
Profile Joined May 2007
Sweden341 Posts
May 20 2007 08:23 GMT
#29
Since computers don't actually do random, they do a calculation based on what's known as a "seed". The seed is a number generated when the game is started and is then saved into the replay so random rolls will always become the same.
Zanno
Profile Blog Joined February 2007
United States1484 Posts
May 20 2007 08:30 GMT
#30
you should be able to see where a player's mouse is, would definitely be helpful for specs if they were aware whether or not a player has missed an attack
aaaaa
LuMiX
Profile Blog Joined October 2006
China5758 Posts
May 20 2007 08:42 GMT
#31
On May 20 2007 15:36 Manifesto7 wrote:
i dont think replay size is really too much of an issue anyways in the era of broadband and 200gb harddrives


200 GB huh...My desktop at home is rockin w/ the 20 GB
Liquid`Jinro
Profile Blog Joined September 2002
Sweden33719 Posts
May 20 2007 09:15 GMT
#32
On May 20 2007 17:08 Zironic wrote:
Audioreplays are fairly interesting, I've never actually done any communal replay watching so I suppose my opinion is null and void.

Realllllly? One of the most enjoyable things in SC for me has always been kicking back late night with some nice replays and a bunch of friends/friend.

Also nice for teaching or showing someone something.
Moderatortell the guy that interplanatar interaction is pivotal to terrans variety of optionitudals in the pre-midgame preperatories as well as the protosstinal deterriggation of elite zergling strikes - Stimey n | Formerly FrozenArbiter
Eeeegor
Profile Joined April 2005
Australia809 Posts
May 20 2007 12:07 GMT
#33
Really hope they keep more of a SC replay system than the WC3 one
Day9 Made Me Do It
XDawn
Profile Blog Joined February 2004
Canada4040 Posts
May 20 2007 12:11 GMT
#34
Lets keep things so that they can still run on non-suped up computers.
Use it or lose it
PaeZ
Profile Joined April 2005
Mexico1627 Posts
May 20 2007 12:11 GMT
#35
I like most of your ideas, however reps would be like so big, but maybe blizzard could think of something, i like your thoughts
Bully-Cdn
Profile Joined May 2007
Peru58 Posts
May 20 2007 12:12 GMT
#36
-rewind
-zoom/change angle

those are 2 features which stick out to me
The Trap
.kaz
Profile Blog Joined January 2007
1963 Posts
May 20 2007 12:18 GMT
#37
On May 20 2007 21:11 XDawn wrote:
Lets keep things so that they can still run on non-suped up computers.


I bought my computer two years ago for $800

It has a 300 gb hd
Radeon x1300 512 mb graphics card
2 GB of ram

And it's a factory made gateway -_-
Just use your tax refund if you get one to buy something like this for about 500$ now.
Pressure - "rock is the defender of justice" 이병민 / 박영민 Hwaiting~
DeCoup
Profile Joined September 2006
Australia1933 Posts
May 20 2007 12:18 GMT
#38
Time to add my 2 cents...(as a programming/amature game designer)

1) It would not increase the file size of the replays. Take for example a microsoft word document. You can see at all times the number of words in the document. You think that this information is stored in a .doc file? No its not. It is calculated at runtime. Same thing for no of kills etc in a replay. BWChart etc calculate how many marines have been built and display it. Adding any stats about a replay would not increase its filesize.

2) Computers perform well over 8 million actions per second. That was a stastic from like 5 years ago. You really think a hud displaying numebr of kills etc would struggle? Not 1 bit.

RTS games are not very cpu intensive. In fact the only part of a RTS that is intensive is the AI. and replays don't run ai.. all the enemys 'moves' are stored just like yourown. Because their is no AI script running their is a massive ammount of unused potential which would be put to good use displaying this kind of information.

And as for Observer mode, every time a unit dies all players are updates with this information. So far as code goes its player1kills=player1kills+1 kinda stuff.

Their is no chance that any stats or extra ingame hud information would slow the game down.

(BTW.. has blizz confirmed replay features? Also are their replays in WC3? never really played it)
"Poor guy. I really did not deserve that win. So this is what it's like to play Protoss..." - IdrA
evanthebouncy!
Profile Blog Joined June 2006
United States12815 Posts
May 20 2007 12:41 GMT
#39
On May 20 2007 15:37 Zeenix wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 20 2007 15:36 Manifesto7 wrote:
i dont think replay size is really too much of an issue anyways in the era of broadband and 200gb harddrives


Amen. I just bought one yesterday ;D Feels good to move from 40 GB to 200.


Oh darnit My comp only has what... 12G? Lol I'm so behind...
Life is run, it is dance, it is fast, passionate and BAM!, you dance and sing and booze while you can for now is the time and time is mine. Smile and laugh when still can for now is the time and soon you die!
DrainX
Profile Blog Joined December 2006
Sweden3187 Posts
Last Edited: 2007-05-20 19:37:30
May 20 2007 19:34 GMT
#40
On May 20 2007 17:23 Zironic wrote:
Since computers don't actually do random, they do a calculation based on what's known as a "seed". The seed is a number generated when the game is started and is then saved into the replay so random rolls will always become the same.


If they use the same seed during the entire game then each random-roll would turn out the same (If one unit misses vs higher ground then all do etc.). Have blizzard ever made any statements about what they use as seed? or how can you be so sure?
You either need a seed that varies over time or you need one seperate seed for every "die-roll". I think its much more likely that they use the "gametime played so far" as seed since it varies throughout the game but is always the same each time you replay it. Another option would be creating a high number of seeds at the start of the game and then using them in some set order... but that would just be stupid...
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