Jiwoo cast a final glance into the FreecUP Studio. Chills ran down his spine as a wistful smile spread over his face. It really was time. There were only a few chairs, but they were arranged in neat rows. Scattered confetti littered the ground like fresh snowfall, a faded off-white in the glow of the dimmed studio lights. The final was over and he had to admit that despite expectations, the second final between NightMare and DRGLing had been the brawling epic everyone hoped the first would be. The elevator came and he stepped inside. The doors closed and the studio was gone.
He stepped out into a chill September night. People were standing on the steps and the sidewalk, ill dressed for the unseasonably cold weather. Some are crowded together, smiling, laughing and reminiscing. It’s the last one, after all. He dug into his pockets for his cigarettes. His friends couldn’t make it. Too long of a trip. Too many things to do. His heart sank. Who knew if they’d ever see each other again. They’d been watching StarCraft 2 for a decade. They’d grown up with the game. He used to stay up late on school night watching vods as a teen, chatting on sgall and swapping stories of his ladder games with his fellow bronze league warriors. They started going to events while they were in university. His online friends became offline events as they shouted for their favorite player to keep hwaiting until their throats were sore. When he went to military he said goodbye to Mvp and NesTea and, while those legends weren’t there when he returned, new ones had taken their place. The fresh faces became as dear to him as the old. He got a job, started a career. Some of his buddies even got married, but they kept coming to Samseong-Dong every chance they got. The one thing they’d never miss was a GSL finals.
He lit the cigarette, listening to the thrum of traffic from the nearby street as he stared toward the Tancheon. Wisps of smoke trailed from the ember as he held it by his hip. He shook his head and chuckled. GSL meant more to him than a tournament. He remembered the early days, cheering for the fan favorites when the game was still new. He even stanned players like jjakji whose scrappy play resonated with him, even if history hardly remembered. The storylines were realer than his own lives in some ways: soO’s battles against fate, Maru’s long awaited GSL victory, INnoVation’s third title. It was all so much better than days spent going to school and studying. He’d known the scene was declining for some time. They all had. The games were still great though. The crowds were still passionate. The message boards were still active. All of that changed when the pros left. Military service had reared its ugly head and that was it. The day everyone knew was coming had finally arrived. The players and organizers weren’t so optimistic, but Blizzard was supporting GSL and Afreeca was committed to honoring their end of the bargain. It took him awhile to get used to the sixteen man GSL’s of 2019. Nightmare and DRGling were the only ones with any professional experience to sign up for the first one. The rest were amateurs. The play in the final was sloppy and uninspired, but it was good to see someone new enter the spotlight. He remembered how loud the crowds were as the series went to game seven. The fact that all the big names were gone was forgotten in that moment. When Nightmare kissed the trophy everyone was elated. A new champion for a new era.
The second final was the same. The same familiar people in the crowd. The same venue. The same half filled seats. But the mood was tepid and the cheers not so loud. The third one, more of the same. And that meant less. They had another first time champ. This time it was PenguiN, someone who'd stuck around for years, but never had a shot when the real titans were still playing.
Upstairs the light have gone out. The dressing room is dark and silent. Gyuri left after the WCS deal expired in 2018 and everything before the semifinals was played online. Jiwoo remembered how it had felt so familiar and yet so awkward when he had changed the channel to see her interviewing the star pitcher of the Doosan Bears. Park, Gisado and JYP stuck around, but even they sounded drained. He listened avidly, but the casts just weren’t the same. They felt longer even though there were less games. The writing was on the wall.
GSL was reduced to an eight man league in 2020. He was glad to hear that Leenock was back, as was Seed, but they were shadows of their former selves and it hardly seemed to matter. After all, far more people moved on or retired than came back to or stuck with the game. His generation, the ones who had grown up with StarCraft 2 were becoming adults. You can only put life off for so long. It was DRGling vs MMA in the first season of the year. DRGling was an underdog in name only and took things in a five game series, using his trademark leaping ultralisks rush to lift the trophy. Season 2 should have been heartwarming, but PartinG’s long awaited championship felt hollow to him. Yes, PartinG finally getting his title was something Jiwoo never guessed he’d see, but it wouldn’t have happened had things not gone the way they did. His friends were just as surprised as him. No one asked how they felt about it because none of them were sure. This wasn’t how he’d imagined it when PartinG debuted all those years ago.
Someone called his name. He looked towards the last few people lingering by the entrance. They waved him over. Cigarette burning low, he started towards them. They were joking and laughing. Everyone knew the final goodbye was near. When they would shaking hands, bow and part ways, maybe forever. One of them asked if he remembered that soO vs FanTaSy game on King Sejong Station. He couldn’t even hide his grin. Of course he remembered. He had a family event earlier that day, but he was a huge SKT fan and rushed off first chance he got. He barely made the train, but he caught the green line just in time. He was breathing heavy, checking his phone to make sure things hadn’t started yet the whole ride. He started talking. Faster and faster, louder than he intended. You don’t forget seeing a banshee chase down an uprooted spine after all. He brought up the time herO tried to cannon rush sOs in the Round of 8. They all broke out into laughter. They talked about more games, more series, their favorite finals. Mvp vs Squirtle one argued. No, that game on Akilon Wastes made RorO vs Symbol the best hands down. They were all great for their own reasons. He’d never forget how they made him feel. He loved StarCraft. He loved GSL. Just because it was going away didn’t change that. They all fell silent for a moment. The time had come, the trains would stop running soon enough. When he left his apartment, he told himself he was going to pout, ball his fists and curse whatever gods would listen. He had to be sad. After all this wasn’t a happy ending. But, as they parted ways, it wasn’t with a heavy heart. “Nightmare really did it,” one of them remarked with a shrug. "You think if these kept going he could have become a bonjwa?" Jiwoo chuckled. Who knows. They had to be on their way. He said he’d stick around a little longer. He lit another cigarette. The steps were clear and the lobby was vacant. He could just imagine the last lights going out upstairs. The show was over. It was the last GSL. He blinked tears from his eyes. It was time to go home.
This actually made me tear up. Starcraft has been a significant part of my life for almost 7 years and I know for many people, longer. I know I will have to move on eventually, or the scene will someday totally die out, but its become hard to imagine on a personal level. This brought me face to face with that reality and its a hard thing to come to grips with. More than anything, however, this made me realize how infinity thankful I am for the game and the scene and specific people that make it what it is. Starcraft is a family and I am a brother. Thank you so much for this mizenhauer, it touched me.
On November 14 2017 01:23 dswarm wrote: This actually made me tear up. Starcraft has been a significant part of my life for almost 7 years and I know for many people, longer. I know I will have to move on eventually, or the scene will someday totally die out, but its become hard to imagine on a personal level. This brought me face to face with that reality and its a hard thing to come to grips with. More than anything, however, this made me realize how infinity thankful I am for the game and the scene and specific people that make it what it is. Starcraft is a family and I am a brother. Thank you so much for this mizenhauer, it touched me.
Yeah very well said.
I thought about this before because the starcraft scene changed a lot in these 7 years. First the pre kespa era which was so fun and fresh because i just got into esports. Then all this new talent and proleague was added when kespa switched games, probably the highest point in sc2's lifespan. More and more pros retired since that point but we are still here, talking about the likes of soO, Rogue, Innovation, Stats, etc. Yes the scene is slowly getting smaller and smaller but it's still worth being part of
Very melancholic piece mizen, with the hope that the future of this game is still worthwhile, one just has to accept the change. (and change is always scary ofc)
On November 14 2017 01:23 dswarm wrote: This actually made me tear up. Starcraft has been a significant part of my life for almost 7 years and I know for many people, longer. I know I will have to move on eventually, or the scene will someday totally die out, but its become hard to imagine on a personal level. This brought me face to face with that reality and its a hard thing to come to grips with. More than anything, however, this made me realize how infinity thankful I am for the game and the scene and specific people that make it what it is. Starcraft is a family and I am a brother. Thank you so much for this mizenhauer, it touched me.
I don't think SC2 will ever completely die. BW is still doing ok after 20 years. As long as there are people who are passionate about the game there will still be games being played and tournaments being held. It might get smaller but that shouldn't discourage us from investing our time into watching/playing/discussing this game.
I... I had feels. All this while an edgy nostalgia song of a long time crush only mostly moved past played in the background.
Very well written, that spoke to something in me. SC2 has been part of my life for almost 6 years now: you captured a lot of the feeling and sense of that intimately linked past perfectly.
On November 14 2017 01:23 dswarm wrote: This actually made me tear up. Starcraft has been a significant part of my life for almost 7 years and I know for many people, longer. I know I will have to move on eventually, or the scene will someday totally die out, but its become hard to imagine on a personal level. This brought me face to face with that reality and its a hard thing to come to grips with. More than anything, however, this made me realize how infinity thankful I am for the game and the scene and specific people that make it what it is. Starcraft is a family and I am a brother. Thank you so much for this mizenhauer, it touched me.
I think no matter what happens, even if life diffuses the family and we drift apart, as long as we come home for Thanksgiving & Christmas, we'll be alright.
in fact it's really hard nowadays to find any truly dead game, let alone the successful ones
civ1 predates starcraft by almost a decade and there's still a passionate community around it to this very day
starcraft is one of the most successful games in history - my bold prediction is as long as people can play video games under any form, there will be starcraft
On November 14 2017 01:18 nobunobu wrote: The funniest part of this is the assumption that gsl would last until 2020.
User was warned for this post
such thin skin here user gets warned about what is true. most of the pros are gonna retire very soon, viewership is at an all time low. GSL in korea in 2020 is very optimistic.
On November 14 2017 01:18 nobunobu wrote: The funniest part of this is the assumption that gsl would last until 2020.
User was warned for this post
such thin skin here user gets warned about what is true. most of the pros are gonna retire very soon, viewership is at an all time low. GSL in korea in 2020 is very optimistic.
There's still plenty of money in the scene, and I don't think its that optimistic. Do you think after all Blizzard has invested they're just going to stop in 2 years? I don't find that likely.
On November 14 2017 01:18 nobunobu wrote: The funniest part of this is the assumption that gsl would last until 2020.
User was warned for this post
such thin skin here user gets warned about what is true. most of the pros are gonna retire very soon, viewership is at an all time low. GSL in korea in 2020 is very optimistic.
There's still plenty of money in the scene, and I don't think its that optimistic. Do you think after all Blizzard has invested they're just going to stop in 2 years? I don't find that likely.
plenty of money in the scene? low viewership corresponds to less advertising sponsorship which would directly impact prize pool and team salaries. compare to DOTA where the prize pool is in the millions and I'm assuming LOL is similar. you can just look at the size of the LR for blizzcon finals. much smaller now then it was back in 2013
On November 14 2017 01:18 nobunobu wrote: The funniest part of this is the assumption that gsl would last until 2020.
User was warned for this post
such thin skin here user gets warned about what is true. most of the pros are gonna retire very soon, viewership is at an all time low. GSL in korea in 2020 is very optimistic.
There's still plenty of money in the scene, and I don't think its that optimistic. Do you think after all Blizzard has invested they're just going to stop in 2 years? I don't find that likely.
you can just look at the size of the LR for blizzcon finals. much smaller now then it was back in 2013
That has far more to do with IntotheHeart's meddling than you could possibly imagine
Visited TL for the first time in weeks and what do I get but a heart attack. This title.....
Scary title aside, the article hit me right in the feels. Though to be perfectly honest, I expect the GSL will die abruptly instead of gradually. Basically, as soon as Blizzard/Hot6 cuts funding, the GSL is dead and for all intents and purposes, professional Korean SC2 will die with it. We do know it won't be in 2018, but anytime after that is fair game.
There's also the fact that, regardless of funding, the professional Korean scene is living on borrowed time anyway. There had already been difficulty finding new blood for several years, but the loss of KeSPA really put the writing on the wall. The current Korean scene is almost entirely comprised of an elite group of players that spent their formative years on a team during the glory years of SC2. All of these players are within a few years of each other, and all of them will have to join the military sooner or later. Their number is slowly dwindling with players like Dream and Leenock enlisting, and will only accelerate in the years to come.
Already the GSL is slowly degrading–the end of Code A, the sparsely-attended qualifiers that replaced it, the gaping chasm between the best and the rest. The same favorites in the Ro32, the same faces in the quarterfinals, the same names on the trophies. Within this small pool of potential champions, there is at least still enough competition to make a tournament worthy of the name. But once this small group is gone, even if the funding is there for GSL, the tournament will be a rotting corpse of its former self at best.
Without Proleague, the GSL basically singlehandedly holds up the professional Korean scene. Ever since 2010, the GSL has stood as the absolute pinnacle of competitive SC2, the gold standard of players' talent, the foundation-stone to greatness. Obviously SC2 is more than just the professional Korean scene, and the game will survive in other aspects. But after the GSL is gone, SC2 will never again reach that zenith of skill.
On November 14 2017 01:18 nobunobu wrote: The funniest part of this is the assumption that gsl would last until 2020.
User was warned for this post
such thin skin here user gets warned about what is true. most of the pros are gonna retire very soon, viewership is at an all time low. GSL in korea in 2020 is very optimistic.
There's still plenty of money in the scene, and I don't think its that optimistic. Do you think after all Blizzard has invested they're just going to stop in 2 years? I don't find that likely.
plenty of money in the scene? low viewership corresponds to less advertising sponsorship which would directly impact prize pool and team salaries. compare to DOTA where the prize pool is in the millions and I'm assuming LOL is similar. you can just look at the size of the LR for blizzcon finals. much smaller now then it was back in 2013
Those are MOBAs in much much more popular games. RTS is going to be way more niche. We don't have 12 million monthly players like Dota 2, we have 2 million.
There is 4.1 million dollars worth of prize money in the scene this year. That is more prize money than any year in SC2's history besides 2012.
On November 14 2017 05:42 Carminedust wrote: after reading it again the article missed one of the greatest legends of the early days of GSL THE GREAT PoopFeast420 and his questions for Artosis
So true, those where the best and funniest times GSL has ever had. SaggyMidgetBooty had some real good questions as well :
On November 14 2017 01:18 nobunobu wrote: The funniest part of this is the assumption that gsl would last until 2020.
User was warned for this post
such thin skin here user gets warned about what is true. most of the pros are gonna retire very soon, viewership is at an all time low. GSL in korea in 2020 is very optimistic.
There's still plenty of money in the scene, and I don't think its that optimistic. Do you think after all Blizzard has invested they're just going to stop in 2 years? I don't find that likely.
plenty of money in the scene? low viewership corresponds to less advertising sponsorship which would directly impact prize pool and team salaries. compare to DOTA where the prize pool is in the millions and I'm assuming LOL is similar. you can just look at the size of the LR for blizzcon finals. much smaller now then it was back in 2013
Those are MOBAs in much much more popular games. RTS is going to be way more niche. We don't have 12 million monthly players like Dota 2, we have 2 million.
There is 4.1 million dollars worth of prize money in the scene this year. That is more prize money than any year in SC2's history besides 2012.
Compare that to any 1v1 game.
you'll need to source 4.1 million dollars worth of prize money in the scene this year. in the golden age of 2011-2013(?) there was NASL, IGN Proleague, MLG, GSL, TSL, IEM, Dreamhack and other big tournaments going on all the time, and all of them either died (NASL, IGN, TSL), dropped SC2 (MLG and dreamhack although i believe dreamhack picked it up again but reduced in scope). So the only two big ones left are IEM and GSL. So where is this 4.1 million number coming from?
Compare that to fighting games which are alive and kicking and have tons of viewership and are 1v1
On November 14 2017 01:18 nobunobu wrote: The funniest part of this is the assumption that gsl would last until 2020.
User was warned for this post
such thin skin here user gets warned about what is true. most of the pros are gonna retire very soon, viewership is at an all time low. GSL in korea in 2020 is very optimistic.
There's still plenty of money in the scene, and I don't think its that optimistic. Do you think after all Blizzard has invested they're just going to stop in 2 years? I don't find that likely.
plenty of money in the scene? low viewership corresponds to less advertising sponsorship which would directly impact prize pool and team salaries. compare to DOTA where the prize pool is in the millions and I'm assuming LOL is similar. you can just look at the size of the LR for blizzcon finals. much smaller now then it was back in 2013
Those are MOBAs in much much more popular games. RTS is going to be way more niche. We don't have 12 million monthly players like Dota 2, we have 2 million.
There is 4.1 million dollars worth of prize money in the scene this year. That is more prize money than any year in SC2's history besides 2012.
Compare that to any 1v1 game.
you'll need to source 4.1 million dollars worth of prize money in the scene this year. in the golden age of 2011-2013(?) there was NASL, IGN Proleague, MLG, GSL, TSL, IEM, Dreamhack and other big tournaments going on all the time, and all of them either died (NASL, IGN, TSL), dropped SC2 (MLG and dreamhack although i believe dreamhack picked it up again but reduced in scope). So the only two big ones left are IEM and GSL. So where is this 4.1 million number coming from?
Compare that to fighting games which are alive and kicking and have tons of viewership and are 1v1
On November 15 2017 05:29 Ansibled wrote: Fighting games have tons of viewership hahaha ok.
They do have great peaks during EVO, but not for most events throughout the year. The big ticket games at EVO peak at 200k, but events throughout most of the year? Not so much.
On November 14 2017 01:18 nobunobu wrote: The funniest part of this is the assumption that gsl would last until 2020.
User was warned for this post
such thin skin here user gets warned about what is true. most of the pros are gonna retire very soon, viewership is at an all time low. GSL in korea in 2020 is very optimistic.
There's still plenty of money in the scene, and I don't think its that optimistic. Do you think after all Blizzard has invested they're just going to stop in 2 years? I don't find that likely.
plenty of money in the scene? low viewership corresponds to less advertising sponsorship which would directly impact prize pool and team salaries. compare to DOTA where the prize pool is in the millions and I'm assuming LOL is similar. you can just look at the size of the LR for blizzcon finals. much smaller now then it was back in 2013
Those are MOBAs in much much more popular games. RTS is going to be way more niche. We don't have 12 million monthly players like Dota 2, we have 2 million.
There is 4.1 million dollars worth of prize money in the scene this year. That is more prize money than any year in SC2's history besides 2012.
Compare that to any 1v1 game.
you'll need to source 4.1 million dollars worth of prize money in the scene this year. in the golden age of 2011-2013(?) there was NASL, IGN Proleague, MLG, GSL, TSL, IEM, Dreamhack and other big tournaments going on all the time, and all of them either died (NASL, IGN, TSL), dropped SC2 (MLG and dreamhack although i believe dreamhack picked it up again but reduced in scope). So the only two big ones left are IEM and GSL. So where is this 4.1 million number coming from?
Compare that to fighting games which are alive and kicking and have tons of viewership and are 1v1
What fighting games? Fighting games don't even get 1/4th of the yearly prize money SC2 does. Street Fighter V is at 630k, Melee ~500k, Tekken 140k.
Granted SF might get +200k because their biggest tournament is in December, but still my point stands.
prize money is a terrible metric for how big an esports is because a lot of it depends on how much money the company is willing to spend on it. Without blizzard money SC2 prize money wouldn't be very high. Also Dota has by far the highest prize pools but nobody would argue it's a bigger esport than LoL.
On November 14 2017 01:18 nobunobu wrote: The funniest part of this is the assumption that gsl would last until 2020.
User was warned for this post
such thin skin here user gets warned about what is true. most of the pros are gonna retire very soon, viewership is at an all time low. GSL in korea in 2020 is very optimistic.
There's still plenty of money in the scene, and I don't think its that optimistic. Do you think after all Blizzard has invested they're just going to stop in 2 years? I don't find that likely.
plenty of money in the scene? low viewership corresponds to less advertising sponsorship which would directly impact prize pool and team salaries. compare to DOTA where the prize pool is in the millions and I'm assuming LOL is similar. you can just look at the size of the LR for blizzcon finals. much smaller now then it was back in 2013
Those are MOBAs in much much more popular games. RTS is going to be way more niche. We don't have 12 million monthly players like Dota 2, we have 2 million.
There is 4.1 million dollars worth of prize money in the scene this year. That is more prize money than any year in SC2's history besides 2012.
Compare that to any 1v1 game.
you'll need to source 4.1 million dollars worth of prize money in the scene this year. in the golden age of 2011-2013(?) there was NASL, IGN Proleague, MLG, GSL, TSL, IEM, Dreamhack and other big tournaments going on all the time, and all of them either died (NASL, IGN, TSL), dropped SC2 (MLG and dreamhack although i believe dreamhack picked it up again but reduced in scope). So the only two big ones left are IEM and GSL. So where is this 4.1 million number coming from?
Compare that to fighting games which are alive and kicking and have tons of viewership and are 1v1
What fighting games? Fighting games don't even get 1/4th of the yearly prize money SC2 does. Street Fighter V is at 630k, Melee ~500k, Tekken 140k.
Granted SF might get +200k because their biggest tournament is in December, but still my point stands.
prize money is a terrible metric for how big an esports is because a lot of it depends on how much money the company is willing to spend on it. Without blizzard money SC2 prize money wouldn't be very high. Also Dota has by far the highest prize pools but nobody would argue it's a bigger esport than LoL.
It's still be in the 2 million dollar range. I think Blizzard puts in around 2 million , not including the crowdfunding from the battle chests.
It's still a significant metric, I wouldn't consider it terrible.
On November 14 2017 01:18 nobunobu wrote: The funniest part of this is the assumption that gsl would last until 2020.
User was warned for this post
such thin skin here user gets warned about what is true. most of the pros are gonna retire very soon, viewership is at an all time low. GSL in korea in 2020 is very optimistic.
There's still plenty of money in the scene, and I don't think its that optimistic. Do you think after all Blizzard has invested they're just going to stop in 2 years? I don't find that likely.
plenty of money in the scene? low viewership corresponds to less advertising sponsorship which would directly impact prize pool and team salaries. compare to DOTA where the prize pool is in the millions and I'm assuming LOL is similar. you can just look at the size of the LR for blizzcon finals. much smaller now then it was back in 2013
Those are MOBAs in much much more popular games. RTS is going to be way more niche. We don't have 12 million monthly players like Dota 2, we have 2 million.
There is 4.1 million dollars worth of prize money in the scene this year. That is more prize money than any year in SC2's history besides 2012.
Compare that to any 1v1 game.
you'll need to source 4.1 million dollars worth of prize money in the scene this year. in the golden age of 2011-2013(?) there was NASL, IGN Proleague, MLG, GSL, TSL, IEM, Dreamhack and other big tournaments going on all the time, and all of them either died (NASL, IGN, TSL), dropped SC2 (MLG and dreamhack although i believe dreamhack picked it up again but reduced in scope). So the only two big ones left are IEM and GSL. So where is this 4.1 million number coming from?
Compare that to fighting games which are alive and kicking and have tons of viewership and are 1v1
What fighting games? Fighting games don't even get 1/4th of the yearly prize money SC2 does. Street Fighter V is at 630k, Melee ~500k, Tekken 140k.
Granted SF might get +200k because their biggest tournament is in December, but still my point stands.
oh wow that's actually very surprising. cool website. so how is it that there is still that much money available, yet all the podcasts (state of the game, inside the game, meta, etc) all died, kespa and proleague died, all the korean pro sc2 teams died, foreigner teams come and go, EG got rid of their SC2 team, TL SC2 afaik only has a handful of players left, LR threads are ghost towns, guys like day9 husky et all abandoned sc2 altogether, and viewership is at an all time low?
If its blizzard pumping all this money in, then its not sustainable. The other metrics don't lie.
On November 14 2017 01:18 nobunobu wrote: The funniest part of this is the assumption that gsl would last until 2020.
User was warned for this post
such thin skin here user gets warned about what is true. most of the pros are gonna retire very soon, viewership is at an all time low. GSL in korea in 2020 is very optimistic.
There's still plenty of money in the scene, and I don't think its that optimistic. Do you think after all Blizzard has invested they're just going to stop in 2 years? I don't find that likely.
plenty of money in the scene? low viewership corresponds to less advertising sponsorship which would directly impact prize pool and team salaries. compare to DOTA where the prize pool is in the millions and I'm assuming LOL is similar. you can just look at the size of the LR for blizzcon finals. much smaller now then it was back in 2013
Those are MOBAs in much much more popular games. RTS is going to be way more niche. We don't have 12 million monthly players like Dota 2, we have 2 million.
There is 4.1 million dollars worth of prize money in the scene this year. That is more prize money than any year in SC2's history besides 2012.
Compare that to any 1v1 game.
you'll need to source 4.1 million dollars worth of prize money in the scene this year. in the golden age of 2011-2013(?) there was NASL, IGN Proleague, MLG, GSL, TSL, IEM, Dreamhack and other big tournaments going on all the time, and all of them either died (NASL, IGN, TSL), dropped SC2 (MLG and dreamhack although i believe dreamhack picked it up again but reduced in scope). So the only two big ones left are IEM and GSL. So where is this 4.1 million number coming from?
Compare that to fighting games which are alive and kicking and have tons of viewership and are 1v1
What fighting games? Fighting games don't even get 1/4th of the yearly prize money SC2 does. Street Fighter V is at 630k, Melee ~500k, Tekken 140k.
Granted SF might get +200k because their biggest tournament is in December, but still my point stands.
oh wow that's actually very surprising. cool website. so how is it that there is still that much money available, yet all the podcasts (state of the game, inside the game, meta, etc) all died, kespa and proleague died, all the korean pro sc2 teams died, foreigner teams come and go, EG got rid of their SC2 team, TL SC2 afaik only has a handful of players left, LR threads are ghost towns, guys like day9 husky et all abandoned sc2 altogether, and viewership is at an all time low?
If its blizzard pumping all this money in, then its not sustainable. The other metrics don't lie.
Havent pretty much all esports podcasts died? I don't know a single esports podcast from 2012-2014 thats still going to this day. Your other points are solid, there are problems in the scene, especially as the game has gotten older and interest has waned. However, I think the crux of my argument is still solid, there's still plenty of monetary opportunity for players, there's millions of dollars on the table, which is still great.
iicr, esports sponsorships are kinda shitty in korea across the board. The best Korea team in LoL couldn't get a sponsor last year, and CJ entus is disbanding. I don't think its necessarily an SC2 exclusive problem in Korea. Kespa isnt touching anything thats not LoL, with the notable exceptions of JinAir Greenwings in SC2 and MVP in a variety of games.
And why wouldnt it be sustainable? Blizzard covers about 50% of the prize money, the other 2m is from other organizers and their sponsors. That's still a lot of money. There are other esports where the % given out by the developers is much, much higher.
On November 14 2017 01:23 dswarm wrote: This actually made me tear up. Starcraft has been a significant part of my life for almost 7 years and I know for many people, longer. I know I will have to move on eventually, or the scene will someday totally die out, but its become hard to imagine on a personal level. This brought me face to face with that reality and its a hard thing to come to grips with. More than anything, however, this made me realize how infinity thankful I am for the game and the scene and specific people that make it what it is. Starcraft is a family and I am a brother. Thank you so much for this mizenhauer, it touched me.
Is this not the second time the author uses a really clickbait-ish title? Also, what was the point? This was well written, as usual, but I did not enjoy. Would not recommend.
Also, BW lasted eleven years. SC2 making it to 2020 would mean it lasted ten years, give or take. Why did that user get a warning?
On November 14 2017 01:18 nobunobu wrote: The funniest part of this is the assumption that gsl would last until 2020.
User was warned for this post
such thin skin here user gets warned about what is true. most of the pros are gonna retire very soon, viewership is at an all time low. GSL in korea in 2020 is very optimistic.
There's still plenty of money in the scene, and I don't think its that optimistic. Do you think after all Blizzard has invested they're just going to stop in 2 years? I don't find that likely.
plenty of money in the scene? low viewership corresponds to less advertising sponsorship which would directly impact prize pool and team salaries. compare to DOTA where the prize pool is in the millions and I'm assuming LOL is similar. you can just look at the size of the LR for blizzcon finals. much smaller now then it was back in 2013
Those are MOBAs in much much more popular games. RTS is going to be way more niche. We don't have 12 million monthly players like Dota 2, we have 2 million.
There is 4.1 million dollars worth of prize money in the scene this year. That is more prize money than any year in SC2's history besides 2012.
Compare that to any 1v1 game.
you'll need to source 4.1 million dollars worth of prize money in the scene this year. in the golden age of 2011-2013(?) there was NASL, IGN Proleague, MLG, GSL, TSL, IEM, Dreamhack and other big tournaments going on all the time, and all of them either died (NASL, IGN, TSL), dropped SC2 (MLG and dreamhack although i believe dreamhack picked it up again but reduced in scope). So the only two big ones left are IEM and GSL. So where is this 4.1 million number coming from?
Compare that to fighting games which are alive and kicking and have tons of viewership and are 1v1
What fighting games? Fighting games don't even get 1/4th of the yearly prize money SC2 does. Street Fighter V is at 630k, Melee ~500k, Tekken 140k.
Granted SF might get +200k because their biggest tournament is in December, but still my point stands.
prize money is a terrible metric for how big an esports is because a lot of it depends on how much money the company is willing to spend on it. Without blizzard money SC2 prize money wouldn't be very high. Also Dota has by far the highest prize pools but nobody would argue it's a bigger esport than LoL.
It's still be in the 2 million dollar range. I think Blizzard puts in around 2 million , not including the crowdfunding from the battle chests.
It's still a significant metric, I wouldn't consider it terrible.
Yeah if you disregard the money the devs invest into prizepools this metric gets some significance. Also I didn't mean to declare sc2 dead I just explained why this metric you chose is meaningless.
On November 15 2017 18:30 Unreflecting wrote: Is this not the second time the author uses a really clickbait-ish title? Also, what was the point? This was well written, as usual, but I did not enjoy. Would not recommend.
Also, BW lasted eleven years. SC2 making it to 2020 would mean it lasted ten years, give or take. Why did that user get a warning?
Brood War didn't "last" 11 years, it was replaced after 11 years. Brood War is still going despite being pushed out.
On November 15 2017 18:30 Unreflecting wrote: Is this not the second time the author uses a really clickbait-ish title? Also, what was the point? This was well written, as usual, but I did not enjoy. Would not recommend.
Also, BW lasted eleven years. SC2 making it to 2020 would mean it lasted ten years, give or take. Why did that user get a warning?
Brood War didn't "last" 11 years, it was replaced after 11 years. Brood War is still going despite being pushed out.
Doom still sees a plethora of content and players every year, and it was released in 1993. Doesn't mean it's not a niche game.
Of course, finding a great niche is not necessarily a bad thing. Unless there's a huge resurgence of players, SC2 will also eventually shrink, and maybe it will find its own niche.
This is cute and all, but seriously WTF? Why would we want to read someone harp on the death of a game we all come here to celebrate? Is this supposed to prep us for the demise? Is it supposed to be satire? Does the writer think we all realize the 'message' here? Great waste of our time, since none of the above questions are evident.
Once again, another click bait title from this author. After you upset TB with your last post, you would think that the moderators on TL would actually moderator this person.
Lots of doom and gloom in this post, no doubt because of its OP content.
I'm of the opposite mind however. SC2 is free to play now, and whos to say it might not now enjoy a revival? There could be pro-gamers playing it for as long as BW was. It fills a competitive niche that no other game does (except BW of course).
Barring something like a war in Korea, I think the future of SC2 is looking bright. The game is at a better state than it has ever been and prize money is still high.
Games do not die in an instant. It is slow process, steady decline in players' numbers. As I said many years ago Blizzard denied change of SC2. Constant "cries" of "hardcore" part of community made this game stale and as unforgiving for casual as it could be. Also obvious interface shortcomings remained intact (for example, why one does have to jump with eyes all over the screen to watch mineral and supply count and minimap? it is stupid). Also balance changes aimed at the smallest possible group of people (about 20 Korean players) did not help. Thus SC2 instead of gaining widespread appeal is in slow, yet steady, decline. On the contrary games like LoL can be balanced in a way that is aimed for pros as well for casuals. Even in real life established, long exisiting sports change with time to cater to audience (football for example).
And Life will come and save us all in a hollywoodian redemption story ! Well, despite my terrible english, I feel like this is a very poor write up, I am not a fan of miz.
On August 02 2020 05:18 Wombat_NI wrote: What a trash article, DRGling hasn’t even made it into Code S yet, 0/10 would not recommend.
He was in Code S once before the the article was written and never qualified again....
It's interesting how wrong the predictions (not sure they were predictions as much as fantasies) are. We haven't really seen former lower tier players put up any impressive performances; retirements aside, it's still pretty much the same guys battling it out in the top 8. If anything, the notable difference between now and 2017 at the top of Code S is returning players Parting and DRG making it to the highest level. The timeline is also off, I remember thinking that back when this was posted as well. Here in 2020, the league is not all that different from in 2017, it's mostly just the first group stage that got softer. I think GSL has a couple more years in it before it's reduced to the shadow of itself imagined in the article. It is notable how many of the current top players are born in '92-'94 though, when they are gone, things won't be the same.
At least Maru winning was more correct that anyone could have predicted Parting winning S2 this year also wasn't that far from coming true. The idea that it would've felt hollow if that happened is absurd though
On August 02 2020 05:18 Wombat_NI wrote: What a trash article, DRGling hasn’t even made it into Code S yet, 0/10 would not recommend.
He was in Code S once before the the article was written and never qualified again....
It's interesting how wrong the predictions (not sure they were predictions as much as fantasies) are. We haven't really seen former lower tier players put up any impressive performances; retirements aside, it's still pretty much the same guys battling it out in the top 8. If anything, the notable difference between now and 2017 at the top of Code S is returning players Parting and DRG making it to the highest level. The timeline is also off, I remember thinking that back when this was posted as well. Here in 2020, the league is not all that different from in 2017, it's mostly just the first group stage that got softer. I think GSL has a couple more years in it before it's reduced to the shadow of itself imagined in the article. It is notable how many of the current top players are born in '92-'94 though, when they are gone, things won't be the same.
At least Maru winning was more correct that anyone could have predicted Parting winning S2 this year also wasn't that far from coming true. The idea that it would've felt hollow if that happened is absurd though
imagine thinking Miz unironically thought Nighmare and DRGling would be good big think
Lmao at DRGLing vs Nightmare finals. DRG the legend himself is in his way to make it to finals in 2020. If someone dared to say something like that 2-3 years ago... Everyone were like -
On August 02 2020 05:18 Wombat_NI wrote: What a trash article, DRGling hasn’t even made it into Code S yet, 0/10 would not recommend.
He was in Code S once before the the article was written and never qualified again....
It's interesting how wrong the predictions (not sure they were predictions as much as fantasies) are. We haven't really seen former lower tier players put up any impressive performances; retirements aside, it's still pretty much the same guys battling it out in the top 8. If anything, the notable difference between now and 2017 at the top of Code S is returning players Parting and DRG making it to the highest level. The timeline is also off, I remember thinking that back when this was posted as well. Here in 2020, the league is not all that different from in 2017, it's mostly just the first group stage that got softer. I think GSL has a couple more years in it before it's reduced to the shadow of itself imagined in the article. It is notable how many of the current top players are born in '92-'94 though, when they are gone, things won't be the same.
At least Maru winning was more correct that anyone could have predicted Parting winning S2 this year also wasn't that far from coming true. The idea that it would've felt hollow if that happened is absurd though
imagine thinking Miz unironically thought Nighmare and DRGling would be good big think
Yeah that's why I called it a fantasy, although a negative one so maybe more of a Nightmare?
Of course it's not be meant to be taken at face value, it reads as a piece of fiction meant to provoke a sort of anticipation of future nostalgia. Still, if you look at the comments from back then, the people who didn't take it entirely as such don't seem to be all that optimistic
On August 02 2020 05:18 Wombat_NI wrote: What a trash article, DRGling hasn’t even made it into Code S yet, 0/10 would not recommend.
He was in Code S once before the the article was written and never qualified again....
It's interesting how wrong the predictions (not sure they were predictions as much as fantasies) are. We haven't really seen former lower tier players put up any impressive performances; retirements aside, it's still pretty much the same guys battling it out in the top 8. If anything, the notable difference between now and 2017 at the top of Code S is returning players Parting and DRG making it to the highest level. The timeline is also off, I remember thinking that back when this was posted as well. Here in 2020, the league is not all that different from in 2017, it's mostly just the first group stage that got softer. I think GSL has a couple more years in it before it's reduced to the shadow of itself imagined in the article. It is notable how many of the current top players are born in '92-'94 though, when they are gone, things won't be the same.
At least Maru winning was more correct that anyone could have predicted Parting winning S2 this year also wasn't that far from coming true. The idea that it would've felt hollow if that happened is absurd though
imagine thinking Miz unironically thought Nighmare and DRGling would be good big think
Greater minds than Miz have thrown money on the eSports betting markets for those two making deep runs.
Being serious for one second I’m not really sure why people took this as some kind of serious prediction.
Enjoyed the piece, missed it first time around. It’s as much about getting older and not being able to voraciously consume Starcraft with your bros (or sisters) as you once did, which I think an increasing number of us can very much relate to.
On February 24 2023 04:42 Pandain wrote: Necessary read - will be a sad day. Expecting this gsl year to be the last
It will be a sad day when GSL ends, but the point of this story was that no matter the state of the StarCraft II scene, that it gave every one of us incredible memories and moments we'll never forget. Even if this year is the last I'll always be thankful to have been able to watch my favorite players and teams for as long as I did. We were truly blessed to have been able to enjoy this game for more than a decade and I'll always be able to go back, rewatch my favorite games and feel some of the excitement and happiness that they provided.